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Iwanchek
31-05-2015, 11:30
In this game its only about the set up , simple is that. If you wanna be competitive (high to middle high level) in those Online events set up is everything. Im driving the Hockenheim with that horrible Mercedes (on ps4 controller), and ive realized thats all about the set up. Driving it stock, theres no way coming through the first right hander without spinning the car. Setting this car on "my way", put car higher, suspenssion softer, lsd on 90; ive tried wirth moving balast on the middle of the car, then the front car wount turn, even tho with lsd on 90 and de-acceleration around 35/40, still backend goes wild and car spins on exits. absolutely horrible to drive; add on that, every damn spin ends in a wall directly with your front end and it stays so..!!!
Im in the 31 time, cant do better, just cant, did fgre changes to the car and the car just slides, spins etc.. :confused:

Conclusion, if u can set up your car youre a winner, simple is that. Im an average racer, i m not into like massive set up the car, but definitely in this game theres wayyyyyyy tooooo much in this game. For me very confusing and frustrating


Add on that the idiotic way to set up the car, exit the event, wait a minute to get out enter the set up menu, set up ur car, save all that, again exit the set up menue, enter the event again, again wait almost a damn minute then drive..i mean, with all due respect, why easy when we can do complicated way!!


Frustration :acne::culpability::culpability::(

(btw the tittle should be"pCars IS for pro drivers", ive messed this one, sry)

Daynja
31-05-2015, 11:43
Indeed this is a racing game so naturally decent set ups are going to help you be a winner. Far too many have come from games where set ups make little to no difference which is no fault of their own.

Use default setups to learn the car and track, but never to compete at the highest levels.The default set ups aren't set to be comfy and never changed, they are set to encourage player adjustment.

Iwanchek
31-05-2015, 11:46
Indeed this is a racing game so naturally decent set ups are going to help you be a winner. Far too many have come from games where set ups make little to no difference which is no fault of their own.

Use default setups to learn the car and track, but never to compete at the highest levels.The default set ups aren't set to be comfy and never changed, they are set to encourage player adjustment.

"never compete at the highest levels"?? why?? i didnt buy the game for be last on the scorerboard freidn. now im around 115th but my knowledge about how to set up the car and be quick...

miagi
31-05-2015, 11:47
Yeah there is an idiotic way to edit the setup by going in and out a mp session, and there is the normal way where you change the setup in the pits.

However what you say is not true, I drove a few MP races and mostly the guys in that lobbies are by far not that quick that I would need to a super fine tuned setup to beat them. Standards of race craft are even lower, those guys make way too many mistakes for how short the races are.

To really compete with top drivers some setup tweaks will be needed, but that's how motorracing is. All you complain about is that pCARS is realistic, do you realize that?!

And even if someone couldn't read, there is still the possibility of going try and error and test out what those setup options do.

mire2
31-05-2015, 11:48
I must say they should really add "tips" for the set up...i dont understand most of this things...means so i dont use it, just the tires i change......and not everybody is a pro race driver or ca expert! They must add more helps for the set ups.....this game is not only for racer which know all about it........this is a really bad thing in project cars......

Roger Prynne
31-05-2015, 11:49
OP.... Why don't you setup your car in FP first before you go to an event.

Daynja
31-05-2015, 11:49
"never compete at the highest levels"?? why?? i didnt buy the game for be last on the scorerboard freidn. now im around 115th but my knowledge about how to set up the car and be quick...

You cant compete at the highest levels without learning how to set up the car better, thats the point of this game. It isnt a Codemasters game where you can pick up & play. Its more than that.If you want to go faster you have to learn to adapt and change.

If you struggle to understand what set ups do to the car there are guides here on this forum, and plenty on fan sites that can help you

mire2
31-05-2015, 11:50
And to say it is for pro drivers, absolute bullshit...it is a game for everyone on the world which love real race games....and all of you had to learn about the cars and the set ups (real life) so dont do like you are the master of knowing.......it is for everyone!....and 4o say it is horrible to do something with the set up is absolute correct, because in the game is not much help for that....

Sloskimo
31-05-2015, 11:51
While I understand your frustration -I'm no good at setting up cars myself- I find that in general, the really fast drivers out there will drive circles around me even if you put them in the titanic after downing a bottle of hard liquor.

It might benefit the game if some mechanic was put in place for people to share tunes or for SMS to create some events where the stock tune is forced (oh noes forza!!!)

Would be easier if could tune without having to go back to the menu, that's true, but a minute loading? Did you put your old HD from your amiga in your pc? :)

Iwanchek
31-05-2015, 11:55
OP.... Why don't you setup your car in FP first before you go to an event.

why should I?? In the event theres a option"pit box"which is grayed out, so, why not enable this"feature", not to mention all those setting, its easier to set up an airplane tho..!

Ripgroove
31-05-2015, 11:56
http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?24927-Separate-leaderboards-for-custom-amp-locked-setups-for-Time-Trial&highlight=separate+leaderboards

miagi
31-05-2015, 11:56
I must say they should really add "tips" for the set up...i dont understand most of this things...means so i dont use it, just the tires i change......and not everybody is a pro race driver or ca expert! They must add more helps for the set ups.....this game is not only for racer which know all about it........this is a really bad thing in project cars......
There are books and many infos about car suspension and setup on the internet. No need to wait for a game to improve it's "tips" ...

Iwanchek
31-05-2015, 11:58
While I understand your frustration -I'm no good at setting up cars myself- I find that in general, the really fast drivers out there will drive circles around me even if you put them in the titanic after downing a bottle of hard liquor.

It might benefit the game if some mechanic was put in place for people to share tunes or for SMS to create some events where the stock tune is forced (oh noes forza!!!)

Would be easier if could tune without having to go back to the menu, that's true, but a minute loading? Did you put your old HD from your amiga in your pc? :)

If u read my first post im on ps4 console, and for change like one options u need like 2-3 minutes to do that...instead in 25-30 secs!

Iwanchek
31-05-2015, 12:01
There are books and many infos about car suspension and setup on the internet. No need to wait for a game to improve it's "tips" ...

sou, your thought is that the game it self should give us morte infos about"how to set up a car"?

Daynja
31-05-2015, 12:02
If u read my first post im on ps4 console, and for change like one options u need like 2-3 minutes to do that...instead in 25-30 secs!
Well sorry thats just the way it is. If you want to get into a time trial fast with little to no effort on your part to change the set up, then you can do that right now. Just dont expect to be able to beat the guys on the top times, that did put time and effort into setting their cars up to be the fastest.

miagi
31-05-2015, 12:04
sou, your thought is that the game it self should give us morte infos about"how to set up a car"?

What? Sorry but please phrase your posts in a way that other ppl can comprehend it. I have no idea what you are trying to ask or say.

To rewrite my earlier post for you, I said, there is a lot information about car suspension and setup in books and internet, no need to stuff the game with texts.

Iwanchek
31-05-2015, 12:05
Well sorry thats just the way it is. If you want to get into a time trial fast with little to no effort on your part to change the set up, then you can do that right now. Just dont expect to be able to beat the guys on the top times, that did put time and effort into setting their cars up to be the fastest.

It not only thew TT its he online events like the current one, it takes just to much long to exit the event-tune it-enetr the evet again..etc....reading my first post you should realize what is my main ponit of this thread m8!

Daynja
31-05-2015, 12:06
What? Sorry but please phrase your posts in a way that other ppl can comprehend it. I have no idea what you are trying to ask or say. I think hes trying to say that you think the game needs more player help with car setup information

Daynja
31-05-2015, 12:08
It not only thew TT its he online events like the current one, it takes just to much long to exit the event-tune it-enetr the evet again..etc....reading my first post you should realize what is my main ponit of this thread m8!

No we totally realise what you mean. You want to go fast in TT we get that, but to adapt the car you need to come out of TT and go to car set ups in a different menu. Frustrating? For sure. You would have served your post better by asking " Please give me the option to setup my car, whilst in TT mode, and not having to leave to go elsewhere to setup the car"

miagi
31-05-2015, 12:08
It not only thew TT its he online events like the current one, it takes just to much long to exit the event-tune it-enetr the evet again..etc....reading my first post you should realize what is my main ponit of this thread m8!

Yes your main point is that you want all with no effort.

Daynja
31-05-2015, 12:10
Yes your main point is that you want all with no effort. Good luck with the mindset.
I think the language break down has caused confusion I think he means " Please give me the option to setup my car, whilst in TT mode, and not having to leave to go elsewhere to setup the car"

Iwanchek
31-05-2015, 12:11
What? Sorry but please phrase your posts in a way that other ppl can comprehend it. I have no idea what you are trying to ask or say.

you wanna say that the set up menu is fine as its now?? mine opinion thats NOT the case here!! They need more Infos, maybe put a grapich content for better understanding how actually the set up works. Im 30, ive played Gran Turismo since first release and from gt5 and gt6 ive always been in online events in top 30-40-50 with a damn ds3 controller, tuning those car is just amazingly easy....i wount compare pCars and GT, but both are sim racing games, but in GT everything it simple where here is everything is complicated.

Iwanchek
31-05-2015, 12:14
Yes your main point is that you want all with no effort.

this is idiotic from u!! Ive never say that! My point is that the set up should be bit easy to understand, how it works etc...top 20-30 are diving on wheel, few of them on ds4 controllers (the leaderboard say it so), some understand this way of setting the car up and some not as I dont undesratnd...

Umer Ahmad
31-05-2015, 12:16
Let us speak respectfully here please. (No "idotic" words please)

The setup works like the setup any in other sim racing games: Asseto Corsa, iRacing

You can google any "setup guide" and the meanings are the same in this game

Daynja
31-05-2015, 12:16
you wanna say that the set up menu is fine as its now?? mine opinion thats NOT the case here!! They need more Infos, maybe put a grapich content for better understanding how actually the set up works. Im 30, ive played Gran Turismo since first release and from gt5 and gt6 ive always been in online events in top 30-40-50 with a damn ds3 controller, tuning those car is just amazingly easy....i wount compare pCars and GT, but both are sim racing games, but in GT everything it simple where here is everything is complicated. Then you can find out what the settings mean. The names of the components you see, read the descriptions on the right. If you need more detail there are sources all over the internet. I was once a set up novice, but I learnt what they did really easily. I learnt because I practised the car on a track for many laps, and undertstood where things were wrong. Then I changed set ups based on what I experienced. The mistake everyone makes is not putting in the laps needed to understand the car.

You cant expect the game to hold your hand and do all the work for you, those games that do that are GT Grid Forza. Here you need to learn,and once you do you will spend little time thinking.You will adapt and drive faster, but it requires effort from you first.

If you cannot be bothered, well then there isnt much anyone can do. Study & improve, or just pick up and play. Your choice

Roger Prynne
31-05-2015, 12:17
If he is talking about TT then as I said before use FP to set up your car and practice and then practice some more until you are happy with it, then go do the TT.

danowat
31-05-2015, 12:20
Sorry, bit that's rubbish.

It's more than possible to be competitive using the default setups.

miagi
31-05-2015, 12:21
you wanna say that the set up menu is fine as its now?? mine opinion thats NOT the case here!! They need more Infos, maybe put a grapich content for better understanding how actually the set up works. Im 30, ive played Gran Turismo since first release and from gt5 and gt6 ive always been in online events in top 30-40-50 with a damn ds3 controller, tuning those car is just amazingly easy....i wount compare pCars and GT, but both are sim racing games, but in GT everything it simple where here is everything is complicated.

You have no idea, in iRacing it is complicated because there you need an engineer and data from the car you will not get to calculate a setup and then you still need a mechanic that knows the car to finally set it up... Compared to that pCARS is very convincing to set up. Could be still better as I'd rather set natural body frequency than some spring stiffness but well. Also iRacing offers way more setup options that 90% of motorsport fans don't even know what it does. pCARS surely is NOT unnecessary complicated! I'd even would want some more detailed setting options, settings for helper springs as I saw that even GT3 cars have them just to mention on example.

However you have entered a new level of realism here, there are two ways to react to that. Work on it, gather some knowledge, move up to the level and enjoy it. Or complain about thinks being to difficult.

If you want to know how car suspension and tires works I can recommend the book "Rennwagentechnik" it's in german, will give you a good base knowledge to do any kind of setup work you need.

Daynja
31-05-2015, 12:22
Sorry, bit that's rubbish.

It's more than possible to be competitive using the default setups. To some degree, but against someone who is in perfect harmony with their choice of input/controller and has mastered a fast setup they will always be faster. Cornering speeds and acceleration differences will be the first thing vastly superior to a defaulter.

wraithsrike
31-05-2015, 12:22
I use mainly default tuning and I can get into the top 100's ok that might not be great but it shows the default tunes do work.

Umer Ahmad
31-05-2015, 12:24
Here, some nice guys already have links to "setup guides"
http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?23371-Car-setup-guides
Read them now! If you are "waiting for game to suggest to me setup ideas" then my friends you will be waiting a long time. Use the knowledge in these guides and solve the "knowledge problem" YOURSELF.

wraithsrike
31-05-2015, 12:24
To some degree, but against someone who is in perfect harmony with their choice of input/controller and has mastered a fast setup they will always be faster. Cornering speeds and acceleration differences will be the first thing vastly superior to a defaulter.

Depends, if a default tune suits your driving style your do well with.

wraithsrike
31-05-2015, 12:25
Sorry, bit that's rubbish.

It's more than possible to be competitive using the default setups.

Agree

KK78
31-05-2015, 12:27
What? Sorry but please phrase your posts in a way that other ppl can comprehend it. I have no idea what you are trying to ask or say.

To rewrite my earlier post for you, I said, there is a lot information about car suspension and setup in books and internet, no need to stuff the game with texts.

While I don't agree with the original poster I think this is a silly statement to make, 'read books and the internet'? That could take a while :rolleyes: For a start people would need to know where to look, the information out there is both complicated and not universal. Project Cars is a mass marketed driving game first and foremost, not a super intricate sim purely for boffins of the motorsport industry.

So if you put the game out to the masses it is pretty obvious you should provide an experience which both the expert and the novice can enjoy. While the game generally makes a great job of appealing to all types of racers it's not hard to argue the information given for set ups/tuning is sparse at best- case in point games such as Gran Turismo and Forza have more information IN GAME, and they are not considered as sim like.

Arkymedes
31-05-2015, 12:28
Well, to be fair, the game is also designed to custom setups with same weight as to racing in general. In your Driver Profile it even shows how much time you spent "Engineering", together with "Racing" and "Qualifying".

So the OP is not so wrong in his assumption.

Daynja
31-05-2015, 12:28
I use mainly default tuning and I can get into the top 100's ok that might not be great but it shows the default tunes do work. Thats probably because the aliens that are sublime with car control and set up creation arent participating. That isnt to take away the score achieved already by those that dont put masterful setups into their race craft but its simply not possible to go as fast as the types pf racers that are very good at driving with superb well set car set ups. The only type of games where set ups make little difference are games like GRid. You absolutely cannot go as fast with defaults in games like this or iRacing & others like rFactor, that simply negates the laws of physics if you could.

mire2
31-05-2015, 12:31
I dont must read books or something like that!!!, it is a f* game!!,.....who play games where a man must go to school and learn how it works??. This is absolutely intolerant of you....not all got that knowing and a game must have help for that! ?..when bandai namco really produced this game for real driver of races, then i must say they should sold the game in a car shop! And not for everyone who is 3 years old!!!!!....there must be help otherwise on the disc must be " for 18 years old which got an car mechanic apprenticeship"........your talking is bullshit.......sure my dad got an car mechanic apprenticeship (master) but he also didnt know how it works to set up a car for car race.....

Daynja
31-05-2015, 12:33
Depends, if a default tune suits your driving style your do well with.
Yes I can agree with that but setup adjusting help is more than just pure speed differenced. There are many cases where some tracks have odd deviations, such as a bump mid corner (Imola last turn 2 x lefts) A fast driver could possibly adjust bump stops or car balances to allow the car to keep the throttle on mid corner and over that bump where as a defaulter would have to off throttle otherwise the car would lose grip and spin, losing vital seconds/tenths compared to the pro tuner. Thats just one exmple of differences to car behaviour set ups can help conquer.

mire2
31-05-2015, 12:34
I swear if someone like you DIDNT has the knowing about that, i swear you would be the first who is annoying about no help with set ups in the game....so please stop thinking you are great...

Daynja
31-05-2015, 12:35
I dont must read books or something like that!!!, it is a f* game!!,.....who play games where a man must go to school and learn how it works??. This is absolutely intolerant of you....not all got that knowing and a game must have help for that! ?..when bandai namco really produced this game for real driver of races, then i must say they should sold the game in a car shop! And not for everyone who is 3 years old!!!!!....there must be help otherwise on the disc must be " for 18 years old which got an car mechanic apprenticeship"........your talking is bullshit.......sure my dad got an car mechanic apprenticeship (master) but he also didnt know how it works to set up a car for car race.....

Your expecting this game to be just like a typical arcade racer. Thats where this game differers from a typical Codemasters/EA game. If you dont want to learn, you don't have to. Just don't expect to be as fast as those that do put the effort in.

miagi
31-05-2015, 12:42
While I don't agree with the original poster I think this is a stupid statement to make, 'read books and the internet'? That could take a while :rolleyes: For a start people would need to know where to look, the information out there is both complicated and not universal. Project Cars is a mass marketed driving game first and foremost, not a super intricate sim purely for boffins of the motorsport industry.
You say it as if the default setups on the car were undrivable. Yes the quality may vary a bit, on some car they may be better than other and some may be faster the others, still as a get go it'S good enough. No one needs to study automotive engineering to play this game, so don't be silly.



So if you put the game out to the masses it is pretty obvious you should provide an experience which both the expert and the novice can enjoy. While the game generally makes a great job of appealing to all types of racers it's not hard to argue the information given for set ups/tuning is sparse at best- case in point games such as Gran Turismo and Forza have more information IN GAME, and they are not considered as sim like.
Maybe those other game are just simpler in their physics. Car setup in real life is quite complex, you change on thing and something else changes with it. And one suspension setup change always has at least to effects. When tire heat comes into play results can become quite confusing even for experts.
For example, changing just the camber on a car will (most likely) change the ride height, pCARS is very convenient, as the virtual mechanic that sets up the car readjusts the ride height to the earlier value after he changed the camber.
If you expect detail information about every setup option, you will end up with a book either way. So let's go back to my earlier suggestion, >> If you want to understand everything about the setup options in depth, read a book <<



I dont must read books or something like that!!!, it is a f* game!!,.....who play games where a man must go to school and learn how it works??. This is absolutely intolerant of you....not all got that knowing and a game must have help for that! ?..when bandai namco really produced this game for real driver of races, then i must say they should sold the game in a car shop! And not for everyone who is 3 years old!!!!!....there must be help otherwise on the disc must be " for 18 years old which got an car mechanic apprenticeship"........your talking is bullshit.......
You are embarrassing yourself here. You don't need any knowledge to play the game, a 3 year old can play it. To get the very deepest experience in a sim some knowledge is needed. Luckily today there is a lot of knowledge gathered very continent, on the internet, no one has to die dumb. If you don't want to learn, okay, but don't complain that your missing something out, still you can, without doubt, play the game!



sure my dad got an car mechanic apprenticeship (master) but he also didnt know how it works to set up a car for car race.....
Because mechanics don't learn how to calculate suspension geometry, wheel load on cornering, tire slip angle... and how all that plays together. Engineers do.
To set up a car in pCARS you don't a mechanic, unlike iRacing. That's because pCARS has a virtual mechanic build in that knows the car perfectly and does everything you tell him thru the setup screen. So if anything you are looking for an engineer not a mechanic.

Iwanchek
31-05-2015, 12:44
Sorry, bit that's rubbish.

It's more than possible to be competitive using the default setups.

yeah? lol, tell me then on which position r u right now on hockenheim??

Umer Ahmad
31-05-2015, 12:47
<snip>..



1. Calm down
2. There is help "on the disc", did u check the Help pages?
3. If you want more help then use external sources, those ideas also apply to this game


Sorry guys, you purchased THE MOST SERIOUS SIMULATOR to hit consoles probably in the last 10 years. This IS complicated game, it simulates almost everything. You will appreciate some areas today and more things tomorrow. You DO NOT have to learn everything today, we will be playing this game for many years.

Maybe later in the project SMS will have additional guide information in the game but t is a low priority RIGH NOW compared to the problems right now. Who knows, maybe they include a little Kimi or Adrian Newy characte and he just analyzes all your data and computes a perfect set up for you:
1. This will very expensive to code
2. Majority of you will shift your blaming to this guy

Ultmately if you want to unlock the FULL POTENTIAL of these cars in the game you must sit down, study, practice, spend time in the garage. There's no shortcut. Also there is no one single PERFECT setup, every driver is little different. We can rely on each other for advice/guidance and ourselves.

Revvin
31-05-2015, 12:50
In this game its only about the set up , simple is that. If you wanna be competitive (high to middle high level) in those Online events set up is everything. Im driving the Hockenheim with that horrible Mercedes (on ps4 controller), and ive realized thats all about the set up. Driving it stock, theres no way coming through the first right hander without spinning the car. Setting this car on "my way", put car higher, suspenssion softer, lsd on 90; ive tried wirth moving balast on the middle of the car, then the front car wount turn, even tho with lsd on 90 and de-acceleration around 35/40, still backend goes wild and car spins on exits. absolutely horrible to drive; add on that, every damn spin ends in a wall directly with your front end and it stays so..!!!
Im in the 31 time, cant do better, just cant, did fgre changes to the car and the car just slides, spins etc.. :confused:

Conclusion, if u can set up your car youre a winner, simple is that. Im an average racer, i m not into like massive set up the car, but definitely in this game theres wayyyyyyy tooooo much in this game. For me very confusing and frustrating


Add on that the idiotic way to set up the car, exit the event, wait a minute to get out enter the set up menu, set up ur car, save all that, again exit the set up menue, enter the event again, again wait almost a damn minute then drive..i mean, with all due respect, why easy when we can do complicated way!!


Frustration :acne::culpability::culpability::(

(btw the tittle should be"pCars IS for pro drivers", ive messed this one, sry)

In one of your first threads you blamed your lack of ability to climb the leaderboards as being down to you using a controller and everyone else using a wheel, now you say your lack of ability to climb the leaderboard is because people put time into learning how to tweak their car setup, when are you just going to admit your lack of ability to climb the leaderboards is just a lack of ability and not that you lack the hardware or a good setup? If you don't want to have to worry about what controller or car setup others are using might I suggest you try Mario Kart instead

Daynja
31-05-2015, 12:56
1. Calm down
2. There is help "on the disc", did u check the Help pages?
3. If you want more help then use external sources, those ideas also apply to this game


Sorry guys, you purchased THE MOST SERIOUS SIMULATOR to hit consoles probably in the last 10 years. This IS complicated game, it simulates almost everything. You will appreciate some areas today and more things tomorrow. You DO NOT have to learn everything today, we will be playing this game for many years.

Maybe later in the project SMS will have additional guide information in the game but t is a low priority RIGH NOW compared to the problems right now. Who knows, maybe they include a little Kimi or Adrian Newy characte and he just analyzes all your data and computes a perfect set up for you:
1. This will very expensive to code
2. Majority of you will shift your blaming to this guy

Ultmately if you want to unlock the FULL POTENTIAL of these cars in the game you must sit down, study, practice, spend time in the garage. There's no shortcut. Also there is no one single PERFECT setup, every driver is little different. We can rely on each other for advice/guidance and ourselves.

This is what I have been trying to say this entire thread, you put it so much more eloquently than I did. I hope the OP understands more now.If not he's trolling just to be annoying, rather than seeking genuine assistance.

Iwanchek
31-05-2015, 13:00
In one of your first threads you blamed your lack of ability to climb the leaderboards as being down to you using a controller and everyone else using a wheel, now you say your lack of ability to climb the leaderboard is because people put time into learning how to tweak their car setup, when are you just going to admit your lack of ability to climb the leaderboards is just a lack of ability and not that you lack the hardware or a good setup? If you don't want to have to worry about what controller or car setup others are using might I suggest you try Mario Kart instead

tell me who knew that were gonna drive hockenheim in thes community event?? and who drove .28 on this track in how much, two days?? dont be and idiot please and spare me this shit of your!! my lack of not fully understand the set up funktions is keeping me bit far from leader on the board.

dont vorry i would whipe ur ass all over almost every track in the world with equal cars, so, put ur balls back in ur pants boy!

Daynja
31-05-2015, 13:03
tell me who knew that were gonna drive hockenheim in thes community event?? and who drove .28 on this track in how much, two days?? dont be and idiot please and spare me this shit of your!! my lack of not fully understand the set up funktions is keeping me bit far from leader on the board.

dont vorry i would whipe ur ass all over almost every track in the world with equal cars, so, put ur balls back in ur pants boy!

Wel there we have it.The Troll has exposed himself. You dont deserve any help with your issue any longer now that you have turned to insults.

IMO /thread

Elmo
31-05-2015, 13:09
We don't allow for verbal abuse here.

wraithsrike
31-05-2015, 13:11
yeah? lol, tell me then on which position r u right now on hockenheim??............
Self removed

ROTTEN
31-05-2015, 13:12
ive realized thats all about the set up.

It's a racing sim. What did you expect?? There should be a disclaimer on the front cover that reads "NOT FOR THE CLUELESS"

KK78
31-05-2015, 13:17
You say it as if the default setups on the car were undrivable. Yes the quality may vary a bit, on some car they may be better than other and some may be faster the others, still as a get go it'S good enough. No one needs to study automotive engineering to play this game, so don't be silly.


Maybe those other game are just simpler in their physics. Car setup in real life is quite complex, you change on thing and something else changes with it. When tire heat comes into play results can become quite confusing even for experts.
For example, changing just the camber on a car will (most likely) change the ride height, pCARS is very convenient, as the virtual mechanic that sets up the car readjusts the ride height to the earlier value after he changed the camber.
If you expect detail information about every setup option, you will end up with a book either way. So let's go back to my earlier suggestion, >> If you want to understand everything about the setup options in depth, read a book <<

With respect you are not really getting my point mate, I simply suggested that it is ludicrous to have so little information about tuning, set-ups, technical tweaking in a game the professes to be the ultimate sim (it's very good but let's not get carried away) It's all very well to say read a book but do you suppose those who really struggle with the more technical aspects of the game will be running off to read books or simply ditching the game? The fact other 'lesser' driving games have more information in them is a sad indictment on PCars.

There does not need to be information about every single element you can tweak but some relevant information would be good in game, you don't buy a phone, a car or a washing machine to then have to go online or read books to learn about what it does.

I personally have reasonable knowledge of cars and motorsport, I have raced (amateur rally & track days) and worked in the car industry for 7 years but I still find tweaking difficult because of poor information, not to mention laborious to test out set ups because there is no real time testing option.

Daynja
31-05-2015, 13:17
It's a racing sim. What did you expect?? There should be a disclaimer on the front cover that reads "NOT FOR THE CLUELESS" Do yourself a favour, don't lower yourself to his troll level. I understand what you mean I have been thinking it this entire thread. I facepalm so much these days at blind ignorance shown by so many when asking for help, or secretly asking for help but actually trying to aggravate other users, but I avoid stooping to these web trolls and throw insults despite being funny to do so.

Iwanchek
31-05-2015, 13:17
It's a racing sim. What did you expect?? There should be a disclaimer on the front cover that reads "NOT FOR THE CLUELESS"

what did u expect?

can u beat the first on lewaderboard? NO
can u beat the AI on expert- NO (maybr)..

so, if ure into the career, ok, have fun, but if u wanna be competitive then dont post post like this one! Im ok with the fact that u dont have the fire for to be competitive, but dont blame my desire to be competitive and frustrated on some things in the ganme that are just wrong and not understandable

dyr_gl
31-05-2015, 13:17
It isnt a Codemasters game where you can pick up & play.

Fixed;)

It isnt a Codemasters game where you can set wings to minimum, ride height to minimum, stiffness to maximum, camber to maximum and gain a free 1.5 seconds.

Rompin Donkey
31-05-2015, 13:19
First rule of sim racing .......leave a controller for call of duty and buy a wheel !!!!!!

KK78
31-05-2015, 13:22
First rule of sim racing .......leave a controller for call of duty and buy a wheel !!!!!!

2nd rule of sim racing, play the game how you like and don't be put off by elitists who think they know everything :rolleyes:

danowat
31-05-2015, 13:22
yeah? lol, tell me then on which position r u right now on hockenheim??

I didn't say "I" was, but I know a number of tops drivers who use default setups.

Don't fall into the trap of blaming the setup, the reality is, even though it does make a difference, the difference is nowhere near enough to make up for a lack of talent.

Daynja
31-05-2015, 13:22
in the other "ultimate sims" the in game help for set ups is little to non existant. AC has generic tips to the right of the the part you can adjust,iRacing has hover over tooltips. There hasn't been any sim I have experienced that tells you absolutely everything.

The reason why is because your suposed to learn it yourself. The games i listed as well as pcars starts you out on the road to your own development, but the rest is up to you

Iwanchek
31-05-2015, 13:22
First rule of sim racing .......leave a controller for call of duty and buy a wheel !!!!!!

i know, grrrrrrr, but i dont have much space for the wheel and chair grrrrrrrrr

NVI0U5
31-05-2015, 13:23
First rule of sim racing .......leave a controller for call of duty and buy a wheel !!!!!!

Exactly what I have to do lol
This is a tuners game, your in game engineer isnt going to setup the car for you, but having an edge on your competitor comes down to your setup and driving skills just like real life

ROTTEN
31-05-2015, 13:23
First rule of sim racing .......leave a controller for call of duty and buy a wheel !!!!!!

What does it have to do with a controller? I use a controller and get along great! It has to do with people thinking this is a casual racing game ...... a little bit of research before hand would save a lot of whining and crying. It doesn't take long to learn how to tune a few key components and make a huge difference in your times.

Daynja
31-05-2015, 13:23
Fixed;)

It isnt a Codemasters game where you can set wings to minimum, ride height to minimum, stiffness to maximum, camber to maximum and gain a free 1.5 seconds. That is so annoying with Codemasters games

**f1 2011 cough**

Pervasive
31-05-2015, 13:31
Sorry, bit that's rubbish.

It's more than possible to be competitive using the default setups.
I'm not the best driver. And I've not seen PS leaderboards for GT.
IF OP is a top driver then default will get him on first page of most of the TT. The SMS community events. Is another story though. Lots of top drivers came out for those so and setups are pretty much a must. But should be with 1 to 2 seconds pending on track.

I'm usually 2-4 sec behind top drivers like Greeksniper and such and I'm in default settings.

That said tuning is a pain. Got to go to garage. Save for a track. And then half the time it doesn't load in career and I'm running in default anyway. So I figured might as well just get use to it

RetroNooB
31-05-2015, 13:41
2nd rule of sim racing, play the game how you like and don't be put off by elitists who think they know everything :rolleyes:

3rd rule of sim racing, drive a fast, clean, consecutive race, and laugh with abundance as you lap those who consider you an "elitist" :glee:

Daynja
31-05-2015, 13:43
I'm usually 2-4 sec behind top drivers like Greeksniper and such and I'm in default settings.

In racing that is a huge margin. When racers that are good at both driving and setting up a car compete the gaps are tenths of seconds.

bmanic
31-05-2015, 13:46
Sorry, bit that's rubbish.

It's more than possible to be competitive using the default setups.

This. Perhaps not in the top 10 or top 20 but I can easily manage a sub 1:32:xxx time with the stock setup and that was without any serious practice at all.. and I know I am missing at least 2 seconds due to my bad breaking habits. So basically if I absolutely 100% nail a lap, then I'd be in top 20 with the stock setup.

It's the same old, same old from the OP as in every other game. "I can't compete because bla bla bla <external cause> bla bla bla". Instead he should invest some time in actually learning to drive and maximize the potential of the car.

KK78
31-05-2015, 13:49
This. Perhaps not in the top 10 or top 20 but I can easily manage a sub 1:32:xxx time with the stock setup and that was without any serious practice at all.. and I know I am missing at least 2 seconds due to my bad breaking habits. So basically if I absolutely 100% nail a lap, then I'd be in top 20 with the stock setup.

It's the same old, same old from the OP as in every other game. "I can't compete because bla bla bla <external cause> bla bla bla". Instead he should invest some time in actually learning to drive and maximize the potential of the car.

Or he is saying it would have been nice for the game to educate him on the more technical aspects and thus he could develop and enjoy the game more.

Just a thought.

o Mike V o
31-05-2015, 13:50
fast people will be fast, default tune or not. I love the complexity of this game.

bmanic
31-05-2015, 13:50
what did u expect?

can u beat the first on lewaderboard? NO
can u beat the AI on expert- NO (maybr)..

so, if ure into the career, ok, have fun, but if u wanna be competitive then dont post post like this one! Im ok with the fact that u dont have the fire for to be competitive, but dont blame my desire to be competitive and frustrated on some things in the ganme that are just wrong and not understandable

You seriously have this kind of attitude? That you should simply be "the best" without any work? Without any understanding?

Do you think I am crying because I can't be Global Elite in Counter Strike GO after 100 hours of playing? Do you think I'm blaming it all on "setup" (pro mouse + keyboard + computer setup)?

Seriously, get a grip on reality. If you want to be the best, you NEED to put the work down.. and it helps if you were born with extra talent when it comes to becoming "the best" in something (usually this means being born with ridiculously good self-control and discipline).

bmanic
31-05-2015, 13:52
Or he is saying it would have been nice for the game to educate him on the more technical aspects and thus he could develop and enjoy the game more.

Just a thought.

So yeah, basically he is saying: "I am of the entitled generation that needs everything to be spoon fed to me. I am aware of google and hundreds of racing books and engineering books but lol.. work.. lol why bother. I should just have it all handed to me on a silver platter. lol rofl <more teen speak>". That's how it looks to me.

KK78
31-05-2015, 13:52
fast people will be fast, default tune or not. I love the complexity of this game.

That is true, I've always been very fast with driving games and I never use a wheel either, it's about personal preference but basic skills are a key element.

KK78
31-05-2015, 13:55
So yeah, basically he is saying: "I am of the entitled generation that needs everything to be spoon fed to me. I am aware of google and hundreds of racing books and engineering books but lol.. work.. lol why bother. I should just have it all handed to me on a silver platter. lol rofl <more teen speak>". That's how it looks to me.

Well lets hope that SMS don't share your naive view otherwise it won't be selling as many copies next time round because I'd wager that 'entitled' generation as you call them just bought the majority of the copies sold.

It will be interesting to see if future patches will add information on settings/setups/tweaking and tuning and perhaps then you can explain how stupid a move that is.

bmanic
31-05-2015, 13:57
fast people will be fast, default tune or not. I love the complexity of this game.

This.

Joni Varis, if you read this. Mind doing a few laps around Hockenheim National with the stock setup of the Mercedes 190E? :)

Daynja
31-05-2015, 13:57
Or he is saying it would have been nice for the game to educate him on the more technical aspects and thus he could develop and enjoy the game more.

Just a thought. We all thought that for a while,then the insults began negating that entirely

bmanic
31-05-2015, 13:59
Well lets hope that SMS don't share your naive view otherwise it won't be selling as many copies next time round because I'd wager that 'entitled' generation as you call them just bought the majority of the copies sold.

It will be interesting to see if future patches will add information on settings/setups/tweaking and tuning and perhaps then you can explain how stupid a move that is.

Duh.. the point is: He is expecting results NOW. RIGHT NOW. With a "gimme gimme gimme!" attitude.

A racing school of some kind and more thorough explanations of car setup and such are probably planned for the future as DLC, or the next iteration of Project CARS. That still doesn't help the guy at this very moment. Also, it takes literally a few minutes of googling to find exceptionally good material to learn setting up a car and tons of good video tutorials on how to learn to drive in racing simulators. The information is already available!

KK78
31-05-2015, 14:00
We all thought that for a while,then the insults began negating that entirely

True, some need to read books perhaps on how to act in public forums :)

KK78
31-05-2015, 14:01
Duh.. the point is: He is expecting results NOW. RIGHT NOW. With a "gimme gimme gimme!" attitude.

A racing school of some kind and more thorough explanations of car setup and such are probably planned for the future as DLC, or the next iteration of Project CARS. That still doesn't help the guy at this very moment. Also, it takes literally a few minutes of googling to find exceptionally good material to learn setting up a car and tons of good video tutorials on how to learn to drive in racing simulators. The information is already available!

Er I think it is information he is after, results come later.

MiZtErNiCe
31-05-2015, 14:02
im so glad the game is how it is, it should be a challenge to set up a race car in a simulator, this aint an arcade game so maybe all the complainers should try arcade driving games and leaving this fine racing simulator to the people who can and will get the best from it.
as an example i was playing with some randoms and 1 guy kept moaning the car was hard to drive so i asked him if he had changed the setup and done some practice in the free practice mode, was not surprised when he said no. also if you read the advice in the setup section it tells you what everything does when you change it, its not rocket science its just a case of reading, understanding and then implememnting. Some setup advice from an in game engineer on ps4 would maybe help the novices. it annoys the bejeezus out of me when i spend hours fine tuning so im really fast in multiplayer and you get mail demanding the setup.

bmanic
31-05-2015, 14:05
We all thought that for a while,then the insults began negating that entirely

Did none of you guys actually read his posts? The replies are as a direct result of his own words and posts. If you want polite responses then perhaps write more polite posts? How is this so hard to understand? He demanded stuff/changes with complete disregard of reality.. I mean, look at what he writes:


Im ok with the fact that u dont have the fire for to be competitive, but dont blame my desire to be competitive and frustrated on some things in the ganme that are just wrong and not understandable

He blames the game for his own lack of competitiveness.. basically showing a big fat middle finger to SMS. Heck, he is basically showing a big fat middle finger to everybody else who DO take the time to research, practice hundreds of hours and work their way up.

So yeah, you may think I'm harsh with the words but they are what he deserves.

miagi
31-05-2015, 14:08
With respect you are not really getting my point mate, I simply suggested that it is ludicrous to have so little information about tuning, set-ups, technical tweaking in a game the professes to be the ultimate sim (it's very good but let's not get carried away) It's all very well to say read a book but do you suppose those who really struggle with the more technical aspects of the game will be running off to read books or simply ditching the game? The fact other 'lesser' driving games have more information in them is a sad indictment on PCars.


First of all I havn't seen pCARs on PS4 but on PC in the setup screen there is a text to many of the setup tweaks. So I'm a bit confused what you are talking about as I don't agree that there is "so little" information. Information that may be enough for one person might not be enough for another, but you need to stop somewhere or you end up with Milliken Race Car Vehicle Dynamics in the UI.

That is not so much pointed at you, but I get the impression some ppl here seem to expact the Devs to write a short book about Car Setup for them into the UI, while the Devs are not here for writing a book, they want to create a realistic driving/racing sim. Please understand the other side too while your demanding. Yes it can be always more information, but no one defined how much is enough so what's the standard?!

Let me shortly explain why I suggested to read a book. Yes it's not to play the game, it's to get a deep understanding of tire and car suspension. Unfortunatly it is quite a complex subject. Trying to go with a short cut will only lead to dangerous half-knowledge.



There does not need to be information about every single element you can tweak but some relevant information would be good in game, you don't buy a phone, a car or a washing machine to then have to go online or read books to learn about what it does.
What have you bought a (smart)phone recently, there is as good as none info about how a smartphone works while it's an extremely powerful device... or am I wrong? I went online to learn about it even BEFORE I bought my first smartphone :>
The car is a good example, now cars today actually have quite thick BOOKS as a guide to all the options and stuff they offer. Then again there surely is no info that comes with the car on how to change the camber, or ARB (unless it's a Cayman GT4 or 911 GT3 RS maybe ;)) you need to get the information yourself. So in all honesty pCARS is just realistic, it gives you a car and that car has setup options if they are build in, that's it. Same as in real life.
But I do see your concern that pCARS could do better on elevating ppl from arcade or simcade to a sim with all the sim options. That is an interesting topic and we might have a fruitful discussion about that details, but surely not in a thread with the name "pCars are for pro drivers"

However, pCARS is more than just a game, it's a community too since the beginning, and that community actually offers knowledge and help too, if someone asks the right questions.


I personally have reasonable knowledge of cars and motorsport, I have raced (amateur rally & track days) and worked in the car industry for 7 years but I still find tweaking difficult because of poor information, not to mention laborious to test out set ups because there is no real time testing option.
Cool, I would invite you to our TGC events and races, we talk in team speak too, also about setup options, setup hints, driving technics and so on. But we are based on PC and race on PC and I see you're on PS4 :( So at least we can't race together.



A few final thoughts on "topic" by me.
It is not okay to claim that other are better because of their knowledge and complain about that. Do you see ppl that have the knowledge but not the talent complaining about being slow?! If you have the talent but not the knowledge, get your brain up and learn something, it is surely the shorter way to the top than for the guys that have the knowledge but not the talent!

bmanic
31-05-2015, 14:09
True, some need to read books perhaps on how to act in public forums :)

Advice for the original poster perhaps? If I go into a shopping mall and act like an entitled ass, how do you think the reactions will be? Will you be there to calm people down and remind them to be "polite"? How do you think entitled disrupting people ever learn to behave and interact in society if they never get a natural counter reaction? You are polite, I am polite. You ask nicely, I answer nicely. etc. Cause and effect.

wraithsrike
31-05-2015, 14:09
Some people really need a cuppa.

Daynja
31-05-2015, 14:11
Some people really need a cuppa.

1 sugar please, milk in afterwards ffs!



Got any biscuits?

KK78
31-05-2015, 14:12
Advice for the original poster perhaps? You guys need to read some books on psychology, eh? If I go into a shopping mall and act like an entitled ass, how do you think the reactions will be? Will you be there to calm people down and remind them to be "polite"? How do you think entitled disrupting people ever learn to behave and interact in society if they never get a natural counter reaction? You are polite, I am polite. You ask nicely, I answer nicely. etc. Cause and effect.

Are you talking to me? I think if you read through the thread I've been perfectly reasoned so do us both a favour and don't tar me with the same brush to make your broad-brush statements.

RetroNooB
31-05-2015, 14:16
Some people really need a cuppa.

Tea no sugar, n not too much butter on the toast, the egg might slide off into the beans :D

Daynja
31-05-2015, 14:23
Tea no sugar, n not too much butter on the toast, the egg might slide off into the beans :D

You forgot the sausages and black pudding. How can you not have those with your brekky!!!

You are fired, get out!!



:P

bmanic
31-05-2015, 14:25
Anyways, on topic. Like I said before, there are tons of good videos for learning car setup. Here's one from Yorkie (it's for Assetto Corsa but the general topics discussed work equally well for Project CARS)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAZNJIgnpnY

.. and here are some other links:

http://www.racelinecentral.com/RacingSetupGuide.html

http://www.speedhunters.com/2011/11/the_101_race_car_set_up_basics_edward_sandstrom_team_nfs_schubert_z4_gt3/
http://www.speedhunters.com/2011/11/the_101_gt_gt_race_car_set_up_basics_pt_2/
http://www.speedhunters.com/2011/11/the_101_gt_gt_race_car_set_up_basics_pt_3/

(the above series is a great read but may not be all that helpful without prior basic knowledge of the various terms used.. but these basics are kind of explained within pCars itself in the short descriptions)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racing_setup (very basic but can be used as a "cheat sheet" style help)

EDIT: oh and this is a classic! http://autopedia.com/stuttgart-west/StuttPhysics.html

RetroNooB
31-05-2015, 14:26
You forgot the sausages and black pudding. How can you not have those with your brekky!!!

You are fired, get out!!



:P

Brekkie was 7hrs ago lol, im hungry n you already called dibs on the biscuits! :frown-new:

o Mike V o
31-05-2015, 14:27
too bad most people dont want to take the time to read and learn any of that.

mcarver2000
31-05-2015, 14:38
Odd in My Garage I see tips for the settings. While they may not be in much detail, they are certainly tips. Take small steps in learning how to setup/tune your car. 1st look at tire temps/pressure, camber, brake balance, sway bar ... save the detailed stuff for later.

For the basics check out http://www.speedsims.org/tutorials/setup_guide_LFS.html

Check out the sub-forum http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/forumdisplay.php?117-The-Garage-Car-Setup-Talk




I must say they should really add "tips" for the set up...i dont understand most of this things...means so i dont use it, just the tires i change......and not everybody is a pro race driver or ca expert! They must add more helps for the set ups.....this game is not only for racer which know all about it........this is a really bad thing in project cars......

Daynja
31-05-2015, 14:40
Odd in My Garage I see tips for the settings. While they may not be in much detail, they are certainly tips. Take small steps in learning how to setup/tune your car. 1st look at tire temps/pressure, camber, brake balance, sway bar ... save the detailed stuff for later.

For the basics check out http://www.speedsims.org/tutorials/setup_guide_LFS.html

Check out the sub-forum http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/forumdisplay.php?117-The-Garage-Car-Setup-Talk

Indeed, we have all said there is basic info to be read, but its info none the less. The point is that is starts you off the rest is up to the player.
As im sure you will agree :)

RetroNooB
31-05-2015, 14:45
Odd in My Garage I see tips for the settings. While they may not be in much detail, they are certainly tips. Take small steps in learning how to setup/tune your car. 1st look at tire temps/pressure, camber, brake balance, sway bar ... save the detailed stuff for later.

For the basics check out http://www.speedsims.org/tutorials/setup_guide_LFS.html

Check out the sub-forum http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/forumdisplay.php?117-The-Garage-Car-Setup-Talk

Someone really needs to write a guidebook n get it on sale in gamerstores, id write it myself but im busy reading "a dummies guide to writing guidebooks" atm :dejection:

bmanic
31-05-2015, 14:50
Just did a 1:30:975 in the community event with the bog standard setup. Keep in mind that I'm not even remotely a "fast" driver. Just did a couple of laps for fun to see how "bad" the setup is. It's actually pretty damn decent. As a tip though, I highly recommend setting the break bias a lot more backwards because the default setup has 90 liters of fuel while the community event is a time trial and thus has only 5 liters of fuel. I set it 6 clicks backwards and that greatly reduced my breaking distance.

I'm still taking a lot of corners really stupidly so there's most likely at least 6 or 7 tenths for me to gain by actually learning to drive the track and taking correct lines. Then another 1 or 2 tenths doing a "perfect" lap. So that'd bring me me to a sub 1:30 time which in turn would make me top 10.

.. and I ain't cutting any corners unlike some of the top times.

EDIT: I'd also like to add that the Mercedes 190E is extremely easy to overdrive.. constantly going balls out in the corners is a surefire way of setting a bad laptime. It seems to be quite a "precision" machine where you need to be at the "correct" steering lock + correct throttle at all times to maximize laptimes.

Iwanchek
31-05-2015, 14:53
Did none of you guys actually read his posts? The replies are as a direct result of his own words and posts. If you want polite responses then perhaps write more polite posts? How is this so hard to understand? He demanded stuff/changes with complete disregard of reality.. I mean, look at what he writes:



He blames the game for his own lack of competitiveness.. basically showing a big fat middle finger to SMS. Heck, he is basically showing a big fat middle finger to everybody else who DO take the time to research, practice hundreds of hours and work their way up.

So yeah, you may think I'm harsh with the words but they are what he deserves.


please show me where i say that i blame the game for my lack of "how to set up a car"??? Im blaming only one thing the way that youve to set up ur car, from entering menue, entering set up menue and again back to event and yes-to many set up options are available which unfortunately every single adjustment is showing on a car and I dont have the knowledge for all those setting options...add on that that this car is difficult to drive on wheel not to mention on ds4 controller which Im using, so...dont be like that and spam me and trying to convince others in false words that i never wrote here!!!!!

Roger Prynne
31-05-2015, 15:00
My 8 year old Grandson asked me the other day if he could have a go on pCARS, so I set everything up for him regarding pedals etc
Then I set up a TT with the BMW M3 GT at Dubai International with a default setup , after about half an hour he was in the top 50 with a big grin on his face.
Just goes to show that you can achieve great times with no experience at all.
All he has done in the past is watch me.

bmanic
31-05-2015, 15:02
please show me where i say that i blame the game for my lack of "how to set up a car"??? Im blaming only one thing the way that youve to set up ur car, from entering menue, entering set up menue and again back to event and yes-to many set up options are available which unfortunately every single adjustment is showing on a car and I dont have the knowledge for all those setting options...add on that that this car is difficult to drive on wheel not to mention on ds4 controller which Im using, so...dont be like that and spam me and trying to convince others in false words that i never wrote here!!!!!

Eh? I quoted you directly on the first page. About middle of the first page.

Perhaps there is a language barrier but the quote is your words and they are pretty clear. If you indeed did not mean what you wrote then I'll give you the benefit of the doubt but seriously, please read your own writing before posting. If you do not want to come out all aggressive and whiny then it's time to learn to post with different words and a different tone.

Anyhow, once more, to make it perfectly clear: The car setup is not hindering you from achieving better laptimes. I am living proof of it. You can go to the event and download my ghost. I'll now spend some time and see if I can actually improve on it but the point remains, it is not down to car setup to get a sub 1:31 time. I'm 100% certain an alien driver can make it into top 10 with the default setup.

bmanic
31-05-2015, 15:40
Some more practice and I am now down to a 1:30:288 lap (which makes me 8th in the rankings), with the default setup. Unfortunately I cut the first corner a tiny bit with my right tires so technically this lap would be disqualified if the track cutting was working properly.. not sure I gained all that much though, I just turned too early and messed up the apex.

Daynja
31-05-2015, 17:12
Some more practice and I am now down to a 1:30:288 lap (which makes me 8th in the rankings), with the default setup. Unfortunately I cut the first corner a tiny bit with my right tires so technically this lap would be disqualified if the track cutting was working properly.. not sure I gained all that much though, I just turned too early and messed up the apex.

Cant say the same for the guy in the #2 slot. He cut the corner a lot. Completely on the coloured surface (all four wheels beyond the white line).
The #1 slot is a bugged time. I followed the ghost around the track and it does a 1.38 as i followed it then matched its speed as we crossed the finish line.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugR6XgaJl4A&feature=youtu.be

Revvin
31-05-2015, 18:17
All that's needed is a bit of patience to learn how to set up a car and practice, practice, practice.

spinkick
31-05-2015, 18:22
My 8 year old Grandson asked me the other day if he could have a go on pCARS, so I set everything up for him regarding pedals etc
Then I set up a TT with the BMW M3 GT at Dubai International with a default setup , after about half an hour he was in the top 50 with a big grin on his face.
Just goes to show that you can achieve great times with no experience at all.
All he has done in the past is watch me.

Get that kid in shifter karts! (real)


I think the key is to learn how to drive consistent. You cant go 10/10ths of ability in a race and expect to be consitent. You want your 9/10ths to be fast, so you are smooth and then fast. Once you are consistent, you can make changes to the car and see the outcome.

Another interesting tuning issue that you wouldn't run into in real life, is that force feedback. I firmly believe this is also a part of tuning your car.

Setups are about fitting the car to the track AND your drive style. My setup may not be good for you.

Daynja
31-05-2015, 18:26
Get that kid in shifter karts! (real) If the family can spare the expense. Its not cheap to start a race career ( a very unfortunate reality), I wish (in the UK) we had government funding(scholarship?) like the Spanish do for their young motorbike riders (must be why so many win motogp races)

Roger Prynne
31-05-2015, 18:43
If the family can spare the expense. Its not cheap to start a race career ( a very unfortunate reality), I wish (in the UK) we had government funding(scholarship?) like the Spanish do for their young motorbike riders (must be why so many win motogp races)
He's actually been scouted by the Plymouth Argyle football team and his training is already costing a fortune... but that's another story.
I do agree with your post though... bloody british government.

DayGlow
31-05-2015, 18:52
Isn't there a whole sub forum on setup Q&A and tips?

Daynja
31-05-2015, 18:57
Isn't there a whole sub forum on setup Q&A and tips? You could probably directly link to some of the greatest setup info available online, spend some hours recording video guides that are easy to use, join them online and give them one to one help ,yet they would still find a reason to complain that things take too many button presses or that difficult things take too long.

Iwanchek
31-05-2015, 18:58
Eh? I quoted you directly on the first page. About middle of the first page.

Perhaps there is a language barrier but the quote is your words and they are pretty clear. If you indeed did not mean what you wrote then I'll give you the benefit of the doubt but seriously, please read your own writing before posting. If you do not want to come out all aggressive and whiny then it's time to learn to post with different words and a different tone.

Anyhow, once more, to make it perfectly clear: The car setup is not hindering you from achieving better laptimes. I am living proof of it. You can go to the event and download my ghost. I'll now spend some time and see if I can actually improve on it but the point remains, it is not down to car setup to get a sub 1:31 time. I'm 100% certain an alien driver can make it into top 10 with the default setup.

went on first page-cant see nothing from u, so....

If u better i wrote that my lack of knowledge how to set up the car is keeping me from getting better times-those are my word. In this thread I NEVER blame the game for my "bad"lap time, i just said that the game have to much settings to adjust, all wierd and not easy to understand and all that put together in one lap, nothing more nothing less...

My first post says everything....

BTW i did a solid lap, down do 31.8, still time to find in the right hander be4 the left hander hairpin and the last three right hander, the car trends to lift a bit and its verry unstable....i hope ill get it better!

Daynja
31-05-2015, 19:02
went on first page-cant see nothing from u, so....

If u better i wrote that my lack of knowledge how to set up the car is keeping me from getting better times-those are my word. In this thread I NEVER blame the game for my "bad"lap time, i just said that the game have to much settings to adjust, all wierd and not easy to understand and all that put together in one lap, nothing more nothing less...

My first post says everything....

BTW i did a solid lap, down do 31.8, still time to find in the right hander be4 the left hander hairpin and the last three right hander, the car trends to lift a bit and its verry unstable....i hope ill get it better!

Keep at it and you will improve, no doubt. Also , pay no attention to the top of the leaderboard.The 1.23 is a bugged time (real time is 1.38) and the guy in second place is cutting the first corner. I didnt check any other times.

Here i followed the 1.23 guy (i go slow to keep behind him i get a 1.33 my best atm)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugR6XgaJl4A

Roger Prynne
31-05-2015, 19:03
(btw the tittle should be"pCars IS for pro drivers", ive messed this one, sry)

You can edit the title by going to Edit Post and then Advanced.

Iwanchek
31-05-2015, 19:08
Keep at it and you will improve, no doubt. Also , pay no attention to the top of the leaderboard.The 1.23 is a bugged time (real time is 1.38) and the guy in second place is cutting the first corner. I didnt check any other times.

Here i followed the 1.23 guy (i go slow to keep behind him i get a 1.33 my best atm)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugR6XgaJl4A

I know, hade today good runs, that showed me good lines and better exits without sliding to much even tho i never shift to 2nd gear otherwise by by....will try tomorrow improve suspenssion, soften rear and stiffen front a bit and toe as well..

cheaters were present in the firs commnitiy race, so its bad to see that the devs didnt do nothing about that!

Iwanchek
31-05-2015, 19:09
thnx m8

hkraft300
31-05-2015, 21:25
My 8 year old Grandson asked me the other day if he could have a go on pCARS, so I set everything up for him regarding pedals etc
Then I set up a TT with the BMW M3 GT at Dubai International with a default setup , after about half an hour he was in the top 50 with a big grin on his face.
Just goes to show that you can achieve great times with no experience at all.
All he has done in the past is watch me.

Future champion. Kid has skills.

My sister (same age) can barely get a kart around a corner in gran turismo -.-

Roger Prynne
31-05-2015, 21:31
Yeah it's all in the Genes.... :friendly_wink:

Haiden
31-05-2015, 21:41
"never compete at the highest levels"?? why?? i didnt buy the game for be last on the scorerboard freidn. now im around 115th but my knowledge about how to set up the car and be quick...

So basically, you want to be able to hop in the game, make zero effort to tune your car, and still be able to compete with drivers who have spent a good deal of time testing and tuning their cars to their personal perfection. Is that what you're really saying? You want all the glory, but don't want to do the work? Maybe you should find some other arcade style drivers to party up with. That might ease some of your frustration.

Also, the default tunes aren't as bad as you make them out to be. I race with guys that make zero changes to their cars and play with a controller, and they are highly competitive.

Topsie
31-05-2015, 21:45
Hmm. Yes, It is about the set up of course, but its also down to the driver.

I thought I was good at racing games. That is until I join TGC. Some of these guys just jump into default set up and knock 2-3 seconds of my times even though I have been practicing for a few hours!!

Yes, its frustrating, but I'm hoping to learn from these player who really know what they are doing...whether that be set ups or knowing how to drive!

Enjoy and learn!

CustomInternals
31-05-2015, 21:57
I only tune the car when I go for LB times. In SP and MP races I run the stock tune and do decent. I've won a few online with the stock tunes but also have some #1 times on the LB's when I tune them. I don't know much about the Events but I know in the "Hotlap" LB mode, you can have certain settings to get fast times that you just can't run in real races. Certain things are going to cause the car to get damaged if running in a real race but if it's in the LB "Hotlap" mode you can run with no issues. I don't think a lot of people know this. That's why there are usually a few guys with a second or more advantage in the top few spots on the LB's. Eventually these settings will come to light for people that don't know. I personally haven't said anything because I need the advantage. Hahaha!!!

bmanic
31-05-2015, 22:24
BTW i did a solid lap, down do 31.8, still time to find in the right hander be4 the left hander hairpin and the last three right hander, the car trends to lift a bit and its verry unstable....i hope ill get it better!

You are still missing a lot of time somewhere. Download my ghost if you need to see the lines I took for a 1:30:288. |Maggot Brain| is the steam name in the list.

Also, did you shift the break bias backwards?

MABlosfeld
01-06-2015, 00:19
the problem is not in the game
the problem is also not the players
the problem is the possibility of running together
two different types of players: ARCADE and SIMULATOR
this possibility will never work

Iwanchek
01-06-2015, 09:32
You are still missing a lot of time somewhere. Download my ghost if you need to see the lines I took for a 1:30:288. |Maggot Brain| is the steam name in the list.

Also, did you shift the break bias backwards?

I didn't see that I can see other ghosts on PS4?!?

My brake bias is one click to the left from the middle. I've tried also put the brake bias to back but car on braking was insane + on fast turns car is under steering allot!

bmanic
03-06-2015, 20:57
This car doesn't respond well to turning + breaking (aka trail breaking) at the same time. Break in an arrow-straight line before turning in.. or at least make sure you do 95% of your breaking in a completely straight line (do not turn the wheel at all!) then turn in for the corner. It's also possible that you are simply breaking way too hard.. on the default setup, if you have your break all the way down (100%) you are doing it wrong. You may momentarily, at high speed, hit the full break but just for a split second.. then you need to bleed off the break to stay at proper breaking threshold (even with ABS turned on this is important!).

I set my break bias 6 clicks backwards (while driving.. some corners I have it a bit more front but most corners I leave it at 39 Front) at the start of the event. You can configure dedicated buttons on the controller to be break bias forward/back and I highly recommend doing this. Especially if you will be driving modern high-tech cars like the Formula B and A, GT3 series, Prototypes etc, you'll have to use different break bias for each corner to fully maximize breaking ability and entry.. just like they do in real life.

MULTIVITZ
04-06-2015, 21:59
the problem is not in the game
the problem is also not the players
the problem is the possibility of running together
two different types of players: ARCADE and SIMULATOR
this possibility will never work

Go and have a drive of my DTM and cheer up mate. This game is involving, it makes me concentrate and pay attention. Tunings about observation, have a look at my ARB post, in there I explain how to set the slow rebound to control the transfere, it gives the car stability beyond the default setup and is a great starting place to go from. Never work:rolleyes:

Bkim
04-06-2015, 22:20
I don't believe in fast lap setups, i believe in endurance consistency.

TheLethalDose
04-06-2015, 22:28
I don't believe in fast lap setups, i believe in endurance consistency.

Ok you make no sense, you do realise in real life race teams set the car up differently for "fast lapping" too right?

You can take a fast lap setup and make a few small tweaks to make it last an entire race.

TheLethalDose
04-06-2015, 22:32
Also I cannot believe the amount of whinging over "waaaaah stock setup unfair waaaah!"

The fastest guys are still going to be much faster than you complainers even on a stock setup. Tuning a car isn't going to magically make you 5 seconds faster, they are for improving fractions of a second.

Some leaderboard times are achievable on a stock setup, but a setup isn't going to improve your shoddy driving.

I guess some people will blame anything when they realise they aren't going to be the next Michael Schumacher.

JimStick1
04-06-2015, 23:25
^ facts hurt sometimes, I guess.

People should learn to practice. If you want to get better at something, study it. Learn how to get better, then do it.

Johnnypenso1
04-06-2015, 23:32
Racing is about driving and tuning in real life. PCars is supposed to be simulating real life. Setups do matter in this game, so if you want to be one of the elite you need to be able to tune cars to suit your driving style. If you just want to be faster, you can focus on technique but the cars are limited by the stock tunes on many tracks so tuning will always help. If you don't want to tune or want to be fast without tuning...simples...you bought the wrong game:beguiled:

MULTIVITZ
04-06-2015, 23:38
I don't believe in fast lap setups, i believe in endurance consistency.

Staying power eh?

I don't think the majority of people playing pCars realise the cars tyres potential. They really don't.
When things settle down with the patch I think evertone is going to have a massive leap in thier skills and enjoyment. These fast guys are fast, don't doubt em. We use to have on going club battles with the sweaty hot lappers for months, every day, hunting some other poor member down and clearing their times.
With a good margin of track to play with, it should really push everyone to throw thier cars down the road. Players have not really experienced throwing their cars down the road yet, I feel. Not yet, but soon!

Boyu Liu
04-06-2015, 23:59
Driving is more important than the setup imo, there are people (and plenty of them) who are gonna kick your ass with the default setup.

MULTIVITZ
05-06-2015, 00:03
Ummm................no.

I'm not a fast player. But theres been plenty of times in the past in a default lobby I've raced the best players in the world on Forza and if I like the default car they don't get away and I will win or be in the front battling.Driving is complicated so is a car, getting them working together is what I do for fun.

Bouyo
05-06-2015, 01:55
It's interesting though; you can be really really quick with a stock setup on a lot of tracks, but some tracks are very specific on how the car NEEDS to be set up in order to be competitive. I'm talking about bumps on certain critical sections, the aero on certain cars with very fast tracks, gearing on really tight tracks, three lap sprints, endurance, and simply: the 'ring! Setting your car up in these cases MAKES the difference between winning and losing, knowing how to race well is a prerequisite.

That's what I love about this game, it's really demanding!

feloney_x
05-06-2015, 05:58
it has some to do with the fact you are using a controller too.im saving up some money now to try and get a wheel since im disabled its going to take me a little while to do.

there are some cars that more friendly to the controller than others,by that i mean at least for me there are cars i just can not drive like the lotus turbo no matter how i set this car up i get a wheel spin and harsh tug to the rite at the rear every gear change and the only thing left to try would be to dumb my paddles sensitivity way down witch would throw me off on all the other cars but some are super friendly to the paddle like the Audi GT3 car little tuning needed

idk why it is like this in shift 2 unleashed i played only with controller and no issues setting up every car to handle perfect for me,F1 was ok , grid was ok but like iracing and acr where a pain in the rump

edit:to be fair though i have to admit i am using the same paddle i used in shift so it is a bit wore out lol

bringmetheapex
05-06-2015, 07:14
Driver is probably about 10% of the package in F1 they say, as you head down the list of racing to club motorsport it gets larger. Not forgetting those cases where people are bending the rules to out and out cheating.....
Its an very interesting subject indeed. Some fanboys want to believe that say Lewis Hamiltion is the "bestest ever driver init!", when in reality were he still a McLaren driver he'd not be 2014 WDC and defiantly not be 2015 WDC.....

Having taken 2-3 years (off and on) to finaly master Shift 2 tuning (defaults are bust) i do question why SMS seem intent of giving such bad default set ups as under Shift 2 is a game that shows how great SMS have it, they nailed it but didnt show it off in the best way. There are loads of people out there that still think Shift 2 stinks but i really got into it again when they delayed PCars and its so good i am playing it more than PCars!! (i invested alot into it and not yet ready to let go)

For anyone into Shift 2 still... key element, steering lock in tunning..

road cars 18-22
mid range tuned cars 16-18
race cars 12-16
works cars and GT3-GT1 8-12

Even that makes a world of difference before you go tuning other things....

Same as PCars, some real ODD defaults that need sorting....

mermoid
05-06-2015, 07:35
Setup alone will not bridge the gap between the fastest times on the leaderboards and being outside the top 100. I can usually find my way into the top 15-20 or so on most tracks with default setups, and the top 5 with a few minor tweaks (I have a few #1s but only on car/track combos that aren't very popular so I won't pretend to be amazing!). I rarely change much more than aero, gear ratios and the differential. These aren't particularly complicated.

Also, perhaps some folks just don't realise the huge gap between different tiers of players. The average player can feel good and consistent on their own or against AI only to be blown away by good players, who are themselves still slow compared to "aliens." I've run races in public lobbies with 20+ players and qualified as much as 5 seconds ahead of 2nd place at times, and yet I also race private lobbies with friends who routinely thrash me.

PJ Dunham
05-06-2015, 08:01
HAHA Read the title and first thought was " yep another Console racer gets a realism slap in the face" LOL

Biggest thing I see online and in forums is newbe racers reguardless of how long they played NFS, Forza, Gran Turismo for many years when you jump into any kind of realistic Motorsport Sim it takes time, Practice, Training, laps, trial and error, and sadly not many have the patience or dedication to see it through and just call the game crap and move on.
So weather it be Project Cars, iRacing , Race Room , RFactor, Assetto Corsa it takes time to learn to actual craft of racing learning the real feel of cars, and the Team even gives newbies a driving line and enough assists to sink a ship not to mention all the unrealistic driving views arm chair racers like to watch from on TV..

My Advise, Drive drive and Drive some more learn each style of car, how it brakes, how the power goes down. I love the fact you can drive PCars on the Throttle like I do in my race car making it closer to the actual feel over Iracing ( bank account drainer ).
Then Download a setup guide, doesn't matter which ones really the princibles are the same and make small changes test, make more changes, Test Repeat. Ive raced with many "Aliens" back in Grand Prix Legends days and it seriously took 10 to 30 hours a week training to be competitive and finally win a couple of online league titles.

LADY GEMMA JANE
05-06-2015, 08:04
I wouldn't say pCars is for pro drivers
I'm a hairdresser and don't find it that hard to play

Gloomy
05-06-2015, 10:06
I'm definitely at the rookie level. I do enjoy reading up on all the tuning aspects and look forward to getting into it at some point in this game, it'll be a long while before I can even come close to any top times. However I think tuning the cars isn't going to do me much good until I really learn a track and car first. Once I've reached my maximum potential with the default setups consistently on a track, then I might be able to start messing with the setups to improve my times and actually see what individual things actually do to my driving. Which will take alot of practice, that I'm looking forward to. It would be nice not having to back out of a session to adjust things though. I think it'd be easier to learn the nuances if I could run a few laps, tune the car, run a few more laps and so on. If anything it'd save me alot of time waiting for loading screens.


This is the first sim that I'm really enjoying since I've always been on console and I'm enjoying the experience alot, specially coming from the grid and dirt games. I never cared for the gran turismo games much.

KonsolerroR
05-06-2015, 10:34
When my son, who is 7 years old and already win races online, it is not intended for professionals, more for the casual gamer, i think.

The setup is not so important. You have to learn to drive the fastest line of a track, without mistakes, then you will easy finish in the top 5 online :)

Psychomatrix
05-06-2015, 10:43
It's not easy to say because some cars feel great and are a real challenge. But when I drive the gt3 class I feel some hidden ads. The cars have launch control even when I deactivate all ads. Its' easy to see when you look at the telemetry. I miss a bit the power of the car. In gtr 2 or gtr evolution you always now that you sit in a hell of a car. Okay the gt1 cars are maybe a class of it's own. Im drove this cars with wet hands. A bit to much throttle and you're lost. But thats a very subjective sight of the things. And with diff settings you can make the cars bit more agil outside of turns. Real race car driver say very often that the cars in real not so hard to handle like in some simulation. But I think pccars have cars for casual drivers and for pro drivers. With all driving ads on is the entry not so hard for newbies.

creepyd
05-06-2015, 12:39
While I suck at setting up a car, there are often some small obvious changes that can be made.
Only obvious example I can think of is Imola - Lots of fast straights with a few chicanes.
A really obvious change is to reduce downforce and anything relating to making you faster in a straight line. You're barely moving on the chicanes anyway so downforce wouldn't help on those corners.

On the other side my Maclaren GT3 time on Nordschleife is pretty nice, but it's still a full 30 seconds off the lead.
I think that's down to setup. It's such a massive difference though when I felt like it was a really good time, just to show how much difference setup can make.

bringmetheapex
05-06-2015, 13:26
Racing games are good for learning tracks, lines etc and for learning race craft etc. Problem is there is a lot of mythical rubbish about racing drivers and the vast amount of them are just spoilt little rich kids whose Daddy pays for them to be racing (watch F3 at Monza other day). You do get the stand outs and there are aliens to a degree in car racing but i see far to many people only there due to Daddy's cash or there own, pay drivers.
Clearly not every racing driver is a pro so quite how a game you can play sat in your lounge with a cup of tea and a controller can be for only professionals is quite laughable.... whats a professional race driver exactly?
Just enjoy the game stop suggesting its better than other similar games, stop being negative about Forza players or GT players, if you love motorsport why cant you be into loads of motoring games? Did i miss someone making a rule that you can only like one racing game at a time?

bizzare.

Lagoa
05-06-2015, 14:02
Forza's abbility to upload other peoples tunes was a good thing. They should add that!

Umer Ahmad
05-06-2015, 14:07
It's an idea I mentioned to Ian a while back and he was in favor of it at that time but couldn't be done in time for launch. We're getting something together (outside the game) to help out and share the setup knowledge.

Bkim
07-06-2015, 06:17
Ok you make no sense, you do realise in real life race teams set the car up differently for "fast lapping" too right?

You can take a fast lap setup and make a few small tweaks to make it last an entire race.

What i meant was that practising a circuit (say doing 100 - 200 laps), with standard setup makes you faster than doing 10 laps of practice and gong into a race with a fast setup.
During several MP races i finished in the top 5, while being about half a second slower each lap because i setup my car to be stable instead of twitchy and fast, while the fast guys made mistakes. Hopefully i make some sense now ;)

feloney_x
07-06-2015, 06:48
Driver is probably about 10% of the package in F1 they say, as you head down the list of racing to club motorsport it gets larger. Not forgetting those cases where people are bending the rules to out and out cheating.....
Its an very interesting subject indeed. Some fanboys want to believe that say Lewis Hamiltion is the "bestest ever driver init!", when in reality were he still a McLaren driver he'd not be 2014 WDC and defiantly not be 2015 WDC.....

Having taken 2-3 years (off and on) to finaly master Shift 2 tuning (defaults are bust) i do question why SMS seem intent of giving such bad default set ups as under Shift 2 is a game that shows how great SMS have it, they nailed it but didnt show it off in the best way. There are loads of people out there that still think Shift 2 stinks but i really got into it again when they delayed PCars and its so good i am playing it more than PCars!! (i invested alot into it and not yet ready to let go)

For anyone into Shift 2 still... key element, steering lock in tunning..

road cars 18-22
mid range tuned cars 16-18
race cars 12-16
works cars and GT3-GT1 8-12

Even that makes a world of difference before you go tuning other things....

Same as PCars, some real ODD defaults that need sorting....


ya i had friends who came over from NFS the games like hot pursut most wanted and when we hit shift they just cried the whole time and turned to grip mods witch i was completly against drove me mad i finally just stopped racing them all.

i had the mod pack installed to add cars to the game but had no other mods installed to be honest i founde the drift aspect of the game a thrill and used it to my advantage always i have tried in here but when i start getting a car set up to drift good it goes horribly wrong lol ill wind up drifting only half the needed distance or spin out of control i think it will be easier when i get a wheel

also in shift i could tune my car and have it perfected for me in a day or two where so far in pcars i have been tuning all my formula cars and have got them close but still tweeking and i have probly spent 3 or 4 days per car so far i just cant find that sweet spot yet

but i got time just gatta do it :)

RobMUFC1987
07-06-2015, 08:05
I guess I'm 1 of the few that's comfy with default set ups. All I change is Brake Pressure, Tyre Pressure, Brake Ducts, Ride Height depending on track and Toe and Camber if it's in the extremes Audi R8 LMS being an example. Just them few simple changes make me 2 seconds faster at Dubai with no more time to be found I believe without extreme corner cutting. For reference in the Audi R8 LMS GT3 at Dubai, I can do 1:56.2, 1:56.0 would be a perfect lap for me. On a DS4 too

Roger Prynne
07-06-2015, 11:07
I guess I'm 1 of the few that's comfy with default set ups. All I change is Brake Pressure, Tyre Pressure, Brake Ducts, Ride Height depending on track and Toe and Camber if it's in the extremes Audi R8 LMS being an example. Just them few simple changes make me 2 seconds faster at Dubai with no more time to be found I believe without extreme corner cutting. For reference in the Audi R8 LMS GT3 at Dubai, I can do 1:56.2, 1:56.0 would be a perfect lap for me. On a DS4 too

But to be fair that's not the default setups is it... :friendly_wink:

ROTTEN
07-06-2015, 13:06
I guess I'm 1 of the few that's comfy with default set ups. All I change is Brake Pressure, Tyre Pressure, Brake Ducts, Ride Height depending on track and Toe and Camber if it's in the extremes Audi R8 LMS being an example.

This is the post of the year.

Blvd69
07-06-2015, 19:43
Yeah this game is a different animal and Project cars really requires the player to get involved in the fine tuning of each car and track.
So based on the type of racing & tracks you like best and events...this is the key you need to know about.
Once you tweak a few things as you keep racing in time you will gain the right set up....Mess with say two things then test it out.
Keep doing this on all cars and tracks you enjoy to race on.
Maybe do some web searching too.

Stryker44
08-06-2015, 02:34
Setting a car up is not that hard. I've been doing it successfully for a while with other sims. The problem is that starting with a car like the Audi R8 (which is supposed to be a high end car) that drives like a damn boat in the game is messed up. You can only get so much from a good tune on something like that. That car can't really drive like that. Hell I've got a crappy eclipse with K-Sport coilovers and good street tires that will at least hang a curve at 65 mph but not the R8. It just pushes right through the curve at 65. A slight curve mind you. It doesn't float around like a boat either. Even after setting spring rates and ride height etc. How do you tune stuff like this in the game? Actually there's ALOT of cars like this in the game until you start getting to the LMP and some GT type cars. I quit trying to tune anyway because it just scrambles it anyway when I save it and start a race. That's Extremely frustrating. I'm personally thinking of uninstalling it so I can have the hard drive space. It's a shame too because the graphis are really good and if the cars handled right the FFB with a wheel could be great. They should have called it "Shift 3". It was released with a zillion bugs and it's evident (to me anyway) that this game was created on the same platform.

I've never posted anything until now but after playing, getting frustrated and abandoning my carrer because of this..... I had to vent

RobMUFC1987
08-06-2015, 08:05
But to be fair that's not the default setups is it... :friendly_wink:

No, but they're just slight changes. Nothing gets changed on suspension, Gears, LSD and whatever else. The settings I change are very minimal for the cars behavior, especially considering the random set up changes the game gives between sessions

Tyre Pressures go from 2.15/2.05 to 1.90/1.85, Brake Duct from 75 to 70, Brake Pressure from 100 to 90, Camber from something stupid like 2.9/2.2 to 1.7/1.2 and Toe from -0.1/0.2 to -0.3/-0.1

Gooners
08-06-2015, 11:43
Tbh i thought this was a racing game, lots and lots of tuning options is all well and good for realism but IRL you have a TEAM of ENGINEERS that do most of this work for you. I dont want to read countless guides go to college/university to learn the ins and outs of racing setups to be able to compete at the high end of a GAME. I bought this game to race otherwise i would have bought that mechanic sim if thats what i was interested in.




Ps
we need to start drawing the line somewhere when it comes to realism in games, it is correct that race teams have a wide range of options to them when it comes to tuning. But its not realistic for a single gamer to know anywhere near as much as 1 quilified engineer let alone a full team of them. Maybe if it was my day job like it is theirs then i wouldn't have this problem!

Pss
If we really wanted to go full realism then i guess like most drivers, they would relay info back to the engineer's ie oversteer in turn 1 etc for the engineer to sort it, because yes you guessed it he is the engineer and i am the driver...

Voxen
08-06-2015, 11:56
Tbh i thought this was a racing game, lots and lots of tuning options is all well and good for realism but IRL you have a TEAM of ENGINEERS that do most of this work for you. I dont want to read countless guides go to college/university to learn the ins and outs of racing setups to be able to compete at the high end of a GAME. I bought this game to race otherwise i would have bought that mechanic sim if thats what i was interested in.


You obviously don't understand what racing means. Racing is not just driving. Its a lot more.

Imagine if a true beginner bought Flight Simulator and asked to be able to fly an Airbus A380 just after installing the game.

Bealdor
08-06-2015, 12:07
Tbh i thought this was a racing game, lots and lots of tuning options is all well and good for realism but IRL you have a TEAM of ENGINEERS that do most of this work for you. I dont want to read countless guides go to college/university to learn the ins and outs of racing setups to be able to compete at the high end of a GAME. I bought this game to race otherwise i would have bought that mechanic sim if thats what i was interested in.




Ps
we need to start drawing the line somewhere when it comes to realism in games, it is correct that race teams have a wide range of options to them when it comes to tuning. But its not realistic for a single gamer to know anywhere near as much as 1 quilified engineer let alone a full team of them. Maybe if it was my day job like it is theirs then i wouldn't have this problem!

Pss
If we really wanted to go full realism then i guess like most drivers, they would relay info back to the engineer's ie oversteer in turn 1 etc for the engineer to sort it, because yes you guessed it he is the engineer and i am the driver...

I don't don't understand the problem here. You can have tons of fun with the game driving on default setups only.

But as with every competition, if you want to be competitive, you have to work hard. If you're not willing to do this then the community events or TT leaderboards are most likely not your gamemode.

Gooners
08-06-2015, 12:08
You obviously don't understand what racing means. Racing is not just driving. Its a lot more.

Imagine if a true beginner bought Flight Simulator and asked to be able to fly an Airbus A380 just after installing the game.

I know what racing is mate, its getting in a car are trying to drive faster then your competition, i think you are the one getting confused with racing and engineering. Just imagine an F1 team which only has 1 member, the driver who is then expected to do ALL the engineering. How competetative would you expect this team of 1 person to be?

Yea kind of takes the realism away don't it.

Bealdor
08-06-2015, 12:12
I know what racing is mate, its getting in a car are trying to drive faster then your competition, i think you are the one getting confused with racing and engineering. Just imagine an F1 team which only has 1 member, the driver who is then expected to do ALL the engineering. How competetative would you expect this team of 1 person to be?

Yea kind of takes the realism away don't it.

Well, you can do both in this game if you want to. But (as I already posted) you don't need to. Default setups are great on most cars (good enough to have fun with them).

Gooners
08-06-2015, 12:13
I don't don't understand the problem here. You can have tons of fun with the game driving on default setups only.

But as with every competition, if you want to be competitive, you have to work hard. If you're not willing to do this then the community events or TT leaderboards are most likely not your gamemode.

See again you get me wrong, i'm all for working hard when it comes to the driving side of things, learning race lines, breaking zones, ;earning to overtake safely at high speeds etc etc over the MANY tracks the game kindley gives us to race on. I expect this as this is a race game, but tbh with the pages of options that P cars gives us, i would place a bet that even the majority of workers in kwick fit would have no clue what all these pages of options mean let alone your everyday estate agent that just likes to race.

Roger Prynne
08-06-2015, 12:13
I know what racing is mate, its getting in a car are trying to drive faster then your competition, i think you are the one getting confused with racing and engineering. Just imagine an F1 team which only has 1 member, the driver who is then expected to do ALL the engineering. How competetative would you expect this team of 1 person to be?

Yea kind of takes the realism away don't it.
Well do just that then... no one is forcing you to tune the setups.... it's an option.
It looks like this isn't the type of game for you maybe.

Also there are a lot of people that absolutely love the tuning side of the game.

RobMUFC1987
08-06-2015, 12:17
I know what racing is mate, its getting in a car are trying to drive faster then your competition, i think you are the one getting confused with racing and engineering. Just imagine an F1 team which only has 1 member, the driver who is then expected to do ALL the engineering. How competetative would you expect this team of 1 person to be?

Yea kind of takes the realism away don't it.

How do you suppose you'd be able to tell an engineer what's wrong in game? Pro Drivers know the basics of setting up cars and can tell an engineer in most cases what needs adjusting. The team is there to make quick work of any changes. Can you imagine Hamilton pitting mid race, getting out and adjusting his front wing?

Bealdor
08-06-2015, 12:18
See again you get me wrong, i'm all for working hard when it comes to the driving side of things, learning race lines, breaking zones, ;earning to overtake safely at high speeds etc etc over the MANY tracks the game kindley gives us to race on. I expect this as this is a race game, but tbh with the pages of options that P cars gives us, i would place a bet that even the majority of workers in kwick fit would have no clue what all these pages of options mean let alone your everyday estate agent that just likes to race.

No I'm not getting you wrong. You don't want to work on your setup (playing the engineering game) because you're not interested in it or don't have the time to learn it. That's perfectly fine.
But tuning setups are an essential part of every racing sim out there and if you're not willing to work on it you'll not be competitive. What's the problem with this?

Gooners
08-06-2015, 12:25
Well, you can do both in this game if you want to. But (as I already posted) you don't need to. Default setups are great on most cars (good enough to have fun with them).

This is not exactly true, say for instance i have the exact same driving ability as driver B but driver B has better knowledge of engineering then i do, then for me this is not fun because who wants to lose all the time right? And yes you could say again that i could learn like he did. But to me racing and engineering although yes they live side by side when it comes to racing but they are 2 completelty different skills. Because people enjoy racing it don't mean they enjoy engineering so why should i feel forced (if i want to be competative) to have to spend hours/days/weeks learning a trade in which i do enjoy, just to enjoy playing a racing game.


Not even Luis Hamilton has this this hard and he gets paid more then i do :D

Ps
I'm pleased you compared this to a flying sim because tell me at which point in a flying sim do you get to mess the the planes engineering??

F2kSel
08-06-2015, 12:26
In fairness most other sims have a half decent way to import export setups some have an in game feature to enable this.
However an awful lot of very fast times have been set using the default setups so it can be done.

Bealdor
08-06-2015, 12:30
This is not exactly true, say for instance i have the exact same driving ability as driver B but driver B has better knowledge of engineering then i do, then for me this is not fun because who wants to lose all the time right? And yes you could say again that i could learn like he did. But to me racing and engineering although yes they live side by side when it comes to racing but they are 2 completelty different skills. Because people enjoy racing it don't mean they enjoy engineering so why should i feel forced (if i want to be competative) to have to spend hours/days/weeks learning a trade in which i do enjoy, just to enjoy playing a racing game.


Not even Luis Hamilton has this this hard and he gets paid more then i do :D

Well, the best solution for you would be a "force default setup" option for MP races. This feature seems to be very popular and was often suggested in the Feature Request subforum. So let's hope the devs can implement it.

RobMUFC1987
08-06-2015, 12:32
This is not exactly true, say for instance i have the exact same driving ability as driver B but driver B has better knowledge of engineering then i do, then for me this is not fun because who wants to lose all the time right? And yes you could say again that i could learn like he did. But to me racing and engineering although yes they live side by side when it comes to racing but they are 2 completelty different skills. Because people enjoy racing it don't mean they enjoy engineering so why should i feel forced (if i want to be competative) to have to spend hours/days/weeks learning a trade in which i do enjoy, just to enjoy playing a racing game.


Not even Luis Hamilton has this this hard and he gets paid more then i do :D

Time you've spent complaining, could have been time practicing. Do you think I know what Camber does or Fast Bump Stop? All I know is, changing them a little bit at a time will make a car better or worse. Eventually you'll have a rough idea where you want everything without knowing anything about a single thing

Roger Prynne
08-06-2015, 12:33
This is not exactly true, say for instance i have the exact same driving ability as driver B but driver B has better knowledge of engineering then i do, then for me this is not fun because who wants to lose all the time right? And yes you could say again that i could learn like he did. But to me racing and engineering although yes they live side by side when it comes to racing but they are 2 completelty different skills. Because people enjoy racing it don't mean they enjoy engineering so why should i feel forced (if i want to be competative) to have to spend hours/days/weeks learning a trade in which i do enjoy, just to enjoy playing a racing game.


Not even Luis Hamilton has this this hard and he gets paid more then i do :D

Ps
I'm pleased you compared this to a flying sim because tell me at which point in a flying sim do you get to mess the the planes engineering??

How many other racing/sim games have you played?

Bealdor
08-06-2015, 12:35
However, if you change your mind, here's a great guide (the pdf attachment) that will help you understand what setting does what:

http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?23371-Car-setup-guides

If you enjoy watching videos more: http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?22501-Project-Cars-Tuning-Guide-Gearing-%283E%29-is-Now-live!


Ps
I'm pleased you compared this to a flying sim because tell me at which point in a flying sim do you get to mess the the planes engineering??

Wher did I compare PCARS to a flying sim?

Gooners
08-06-2015, 12:36
Well do just that then... no one is forcing you to tune the setups.... it's an option.
It looks like this isn't the type of game for you maybe.

Also there are a lot of people that absolutely love the tuning side of the game.


And this is why i am here, because atm clearly i do feel like im being forced to remain competative. Yet the best drivers in RL don't necessarily have to be the best tuners because like i said they have a team behind them that has put years into studying the enginnering aspects of racing to allow the driver to concentrate on the driving side of racing. It's not entierly realistic as it stands so because all other sims allow it it dont mean its a realisistic sim.

I mean god forbid we where all on an eqaul playing feild to allow us to RACE in a race game fairly.

Bealdor
08-06-2015, 12:39
And this is why i am here, because atm clearly i do feel like im being forced to remain competative. Yet the best drivers in RL don't necessarily have to be the best tuners because like i said they have a team behind them that has put years into studying the enginnering aspects of racing to allow the driver to concentrate on the driving side of racing. It's not entierly realistic as it stands so because all other sims allow it it dont mean its a realisistic sim.

Could you imagine the outcry of the community if we removed/left out tuning setups?


I mean god forbid we where all on an eqaul playing feild to allow us to RACE in a race game fairly.

That's why I suggested the "Default setup" option in my last post.

Gooners
08-06-2015, 12:43
Time you've spent complaining, could have been time practicing. Do you think I know what Camber does or Fast Bump Stop? All I know is, changing them a little bit at a time will make a car better or worse. Eventually you'll have a rough idea where you want everything without knowing anything about a single thing

Please don't take this as me complaining, all im doing is trying to get my opinion across, because you seem to not agree with me it don't mean im complaining. I just have a different view in which to me makes more sense then your's and seems more realistic but then im not trying to shoot you down.

And yes ofc doing what you say works and yes i have tried it which again brings me here. Because after trying to dabble (after doing some reading up) i then soon realised how much time this would take away from me doing the thing i bought this game for, to race. No one can say a really good tune would not take many hours (maybe more) to get right especially for someone who has no knowledge where to start in the 1st place.

Gooners
08-06-2015, 12:45
Could you imagine the outcry of the community if we removed/left out tuning setups?



That's why I suggested the "Default setup" option in my last post.

So me using defaut when the other guys have a finely tuned car is an equal playing ground ?

I'm pleased we are discussing this btw Bealdor please dont take it as an argument but rather a discussion.

And yes you are 100% right removing tuning entirely will upset more people then it pleases, but all i'm saying is just to chill it down a bit to make it fair for both sides because the more tuning options there is the more it takes time out of the racing side. I would also hazard to guess not 1 of us here has a full race team by his side giving him tips etc, so then why should we expect to know most of the options these racing teams have to them, when most of us class ouselves as the driver in a racing game not the engineer.

Roger Prynne
08-06-2015, 12:50
So OK we are not arguing... that's great.

How would you make a sim in your honest opinion?

Bealdor
08-06-2015, 12:50
So me using defaut when the other guys have a fined tuned car is an equal playing ground ?


No of course not. I was referring to my former post/suggestion:


Well, the best solution for you would be a "force default setup" option for MP races. This feature seems to be very popular and was often suggested in the Feature Request subforum. So let's hope the devs can implement it.

That would be the perfect solution for those who don't want to cope with car setups but still can be competitive in an online race. :)


I'm pleased we are discussing this btw Bealdor please dont take it as an argument but rather a discussion.

It's all good mate. Just a regular discussion. Please don't feel intimidated just because I'm having a mod tag. ;)

RobMUFC1987
08-06-2015, 12:57
I get your point, but set ups are essential, especially with some of the weird default set ups on some cars. Even then, having a good set up doesn't make you faster, you'll still need to practice a lot. They should have an equal cars option in a set up sense though. I'm not any faster with a set up, my set ups just make the car easier to drive so I can be consistent. In some cases, my set ups make me slower but over a race I'll be faster

Gooners
08-06-2015, 13:01
Well, the best solution for you would be a "force default setup" option for MP races. This feature seems to be very popular and was often suggested in the Feature Request subforum. So let's hope the devs can implement it.

Sorry i just read this, this would be a great option if implemented.

Gooners
08-06-2015, 13:10
So OK we are not arguing... that's great.

How would you make a sim in your honest opinion?

Roger the sim is there now so no need to make a new one, but people seem to keep swerving past my point when i mention that Luis Hamilton does not go to his engineer and say i need 0.234 added to the springs, i would like -2 air pressure in my front left tyre, put the back left/right bump stop to 2.34 etc etc u see where im going. What hamilton would say is that the car has some oversteer in turn 1 and understeer turn 6 and im hitting the rev limiter on the straight. And then it is the engineers job to decide if bump stops go to 3.23 or 3.26 etc. So i understand when people say it is part of racing but they do not seem to understand that although it is part of racing it is not the drivers job. So why should we be expected to do the job of many when most of us are nowhere near quilified. All we want to do is race and racing is not racing unless it is fair.


So maybe what i would add to the sim would be an enginner for the driver where the driver gives the engineer feedback as the drivers does irl so the engineer can go to work for the driver to retest. To take this even further i would add to in career mode, the higher you go up the ladder the better the engineers get (they dont have to be perfect from the start). To me this would be a better sim as it is more true to life.

Gooners
08-06-2015, 13:23
You obviously don't understand what racing means. Racing is not just driving. Its a lot more.

Imagine if a true beginner bought Flight Simulator and asked to be able to fly an Airbus A380 just after installing the game.

it was a reply to this Bealdor not you.

RobMUFC1987
08-06-2015, 13:29
Roger the sim is there now so no need to make a new one, but people seem to keep swerving past my point when i mention that Luis Hamilton does not go to his engineer and say i need 0.234 added to the springs, i would like -2 air pressure in my front left tyre, put the back left/right bump stop to 2.34 etc etc u see where im going. What hamilton would say is that the car has some oversteer in turn 1 and understeer turn 6 and im hitting the rev limiter on the straight. And then it is the engineers job to decide if bump stops go to 3.23 or 3.26 etc. So i understand when people say it is part of racing but they do not seem to understand that although it is part of racing it is not the drivers job. So why should we be expected to do the job of many when most of us are nowhere near quilified. All we want to do is race and racing is not racing unless it is fair.


So maybe what i would add to the sim would be an enginner for the driver where the driver gives the engineer feedback as the drivers does irl so the engineer can go to work for the driver to retest. To take this even further i would add to in career mode, the higher you go up the ladder the better the engineers get (they dont have to be perfect from the start). To me this would be a better sim as it is more true to life.

Hamilton knows what needs changing. There's been a few times hes come over the radio saying he wants the front wing adjusted a certain amount like 1 or 2 turns. Not sure how much the drivers have a say to the whole set up but in the 60s and 70s the drivers set up the cars themselves pretty much, the engineer just fixed things

Edit - if you have a PS3, play F1 Championship Edition. It had something similar to what you're asking. I can't remember exactly what you did, but in practice, you'll ask the engineer to set up the car. You'd do 2 or 3 laps, then the engineer would adjust things, you go back out. If it helped, you'd ask to tweak more until you're happy. If it didn't help, he'd go the other way in the set up

Gooners
08-06-2015, 13:34
Hamilton knows what needs changing. There's been a few times hes come over the radio saying he wants the front wing adjusted a certain amount like 1 or 2 turns. Not sure how much the drivers have a say to the whole set up but in the 60s and 70s the drivers set up the cars themselves pretty much, the engineer just fixed things

In the 60s and 70s driver did the setups themselves probably because the cars back then where a hell of lot less complex then the cars of today, Heck even i wouldn't mind it if the tunings options they had where the only ones we where allowed to change ourselves today because it would be what im asking for, to tone down the option's. Maybe the reason racing teams have grown larger over the years is because the cars have become more complex hence needing more "specialists"?

Roger Prynne
08-06-2015, 13:40
The other thing is that there is already a hell of a lot of things going on in this sim and a lot more than most out there, to implement the sort of tuning that you want would take a lot of programing and a lot of time.... but I do get your point.

RobMUFC1987
08-06-2015, 13:43
In the 60s and 70s driver did the setups themselves probably because the cars back then where a hell of lot less complex then the cars of today, Heck even i wouldn't mind it if the tunings options they had where the only ones we where allowed to change ourselves today because it would be what im asking for, to tone down the option's. Maybe the reason racing teams have grown larger over the years is because the cars have become more complex hence needing more "specialists"?

Read my edit in last post

TrevorAustin
08-06-2015, 13:45
Is there any thoughts on modifying some of the default tunes, or existing cars characteristics. Some of the cars in here do not in real life handle as badly as they do in the game. They have a lot more grip even on normal tyres, so putting wets on should give a comparison.

I tried a test on 3 cars I have driven in real life over the years last night, trying them round a track I know OK, Silverstone, the GT40, the R8 road car and the Maclaren F1 are nowhere near as hard to take round a track at a slow pace as this.

The higher end race cars and the formula cars seem how I expected them, Not that I've driven any of those, it's more the road cars, on standard tune they are not fun to drive round at even a moderate pace. I thought it might be not getting slicks up to speed as I've only driven them on road tyres, but on wets they were the same.

And it wasn't the "you wouldn't drive them round that fast in real life" problem games often get, it was going round curves at 50-80, A Maclaren F1 would not be losing traction at those speeds and sliding round the bends, or the ditches of Surrey would be full of them, as would the ditches of Northamptonshire be full of RS500s:)

These are cars that lots of people have driven on track days, and they aren't as hard to drive as in the game.

Not that it really bothers me as I'm only driving the Formula A and the LMP2 cars at the moment and they are bloody awesome.

Gooners
08-06-2015, 13:53
Read my edit in last post

Im liking that edit :)

Im just thinking of a simple gui of the circut where u have sections of the track with 2 options inside each section, oveersteer/understeer and u select one of the options inside the corners which are giving you the problem so the engineer can get to work. But then again this all sounds to easy because will the engineer take track/tyre temps camber/surface changes etc etc into account. The sort of complicated things we have to think about at the moment :p

Tbh its not as much as a problem now, im still enjying my races but the problem has been slowly growing since release and i only see it getting worse the more people get time to refine their tunes, hence the feeling that soon i will be forced to start dabbling myself in which i know it is going to take an age to 1st learn the meaning/consquences of each setting and then learning to implement them and test them on each and every track for each car. That is a very long time taken away from driving :/

And atm to me its not even worth it because each setup depends on fuel load/weather conditions and as it stands u can only have 1 save per car/track. Which means you have to retune the car before each race instead of being able to load 1 u did before. Although i think i read somewhere that this will change in an upcoming patch, which then might make me more interested as then i can do it once and be done with it rather then having to mess with the sliders before each race that has a different amount of laps/weather.

Stryker44
08-06-2015, 14:25
Is there any thoughts on modifying some of the default tunes, or existing cars characteristics. Some of the cars in here do not in real life handle as badly as they do in the game. They have a lot more grip even on normal tyres, so putting wets on should give a comparison.


A little more grip on the tires to make the cars more realistic would make the game ALLOT better for me. That is .. after a patch that fixes the tune from being scrambled is released so I can then get deeper into testing. With realistic grip gameplay would be somuch better because then you could actually feel the car stick to the track as your tune gets better.

Roger Prynne
08-06-2015, 14:35
A little more grip on the tires to make the cars more realistic
The tyres are very realistic, I don't know where that assumption came from... have you driven a real race car?
The guys that spent 1000's of hours making these tyres as realistic as possible have.

And please don't say anything about me being a fanboy please.... I'm just being realistic.. ;)

mcarver2000
08-06-2015, 14:36
I agree, this would be a great option. I fondly recall the good ole International Race of Champions (IROC) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Race_of_Champions). I would love to see this return as it was fun to see drivers from different disciplines compete on a level playing field. This is also why I enjoy online racing with the lesser class cars (as they are more of a level playing field even with different setups).


Well, the best solution for you would be a "force default setup" option for MP races. This feature seems to be very popular and was often suggested in the Feature Request subforum. So let's hope the devs can implement it.

RobMUFC1987
08-06-2015, 14:40
The tyres are very realistic, I don't know where that assumption came from... have you driven a real race car?
The guys that spent 1000's of hours making these tyres as realistic as possible have.

And please don't say anything about me being a fanboy please.... I'm just being realistic.. ;)

Road cars and the Ford GT40 MK4 are really difficult to drive. It's like driving in rain on slicks. I've learnt to drive them, but they are really slow, especially the GT40 which uses slicks

TrevorAustin
08-06-2015, 14:44
The tyres are very realistic, I don't know where that assumption came from... have you driven a real race car?
The guys that spent 1000's of hours making these tyres as realistic as possible have.

And please don't say anything about me being a fanboy please.... I'm just being realistic.. ;)

Never driven a racecar, sadly:) but I have driven the cars I mention and they don't feel realistic, the racecars feel like I expected them to, but that's all just IMO.

Voxen
08-06-2015, 15:12
I know what racing is mate, its getting in a car are trying to drive faster then your competition, i think you are the one getting confused with racing and engineering. Just imagine an F1 team which only has 1 member, the driver who is then expected to do ALL the engineering. How competetative would you expect this team of 1 person to be?


pCars is a RACING SIMULATION game. How can you simulate real life racing if you can't put your hands into engine and electronics?
This game is about investing time and efforts setting your car to be fast and efficient. The race itself is just the final step, where you enjoy finishing first because you used your brain to solve problems and used your driving skills on the track. If its not what you want to achieve, this game is just not for you. Simple huh?

Voxen
08-06-2015, 15:16
Roger the sim is there now so no need to make a new one, but people seem to keep swerving past my point when i mention that Luis Hamilton does not go to his engineer and say i need 0.234 added to the springs, i would like -2 air pressure in my front left tyre, put the back left/right bump stop to 2.34 etc etc u see where im going.

Lewis Hamilton is working for a F1 team that has many engineers.
What a video game can do about it? Do you want the distributor to hire a dozen of engineers for each copy sold and pack them with the box?

Your idea of having some magic "virtual engineers" is not a good idea, because it would annihilate the reason of this game being a racing simulation. It would turn it into an arcade game where everything is cooked for you in the background. What the point?

Again if you don't like the tuning part of this game you can either not do it and race vs low to average AI, or move to a much more arcade game.

Mad Al
08-06-2015, 15:21
Road cars and the Ford GT40 MK4 are really difficult to drive. It's like driving in rain on slicks. I've learnt to drive them, but they are really slow, especially the GT40 which uses slicks

Funny, I thought the GT 1968 tyre was supposed to be a treaded tyre..... all the pre 1972 tyres were...

hmm has it got the wrong texture ?

Gooners
08-06-2015, 15:21
Mate, if you want an easy game where you just have to drive, there a plenty out there.
You can also activate god mode and finish first even when driving like a drunk pig.

pCars is a RACING SIMULATION game. How can you simulate real life racing if you can't put your hands into engine and electronics?
This game is about investing time and efforts setting your car to be fast and efficient. The race itself is just the final step, where you enjoy finishing first because you used your brain to solve problems and used your driving skills on the track. If its not what you want to achieve, this game is just not for you. Simple huh?


Because you enjoy the tuning side of things that is good for you, but really if you can't race because you can't get your hands on the engine makes this less of a racing game? well let me reverse that for you then, if you can't handle the car as it is then you aren't a great driver! I bought this to race as it is a racing game. There are options for mechanics out there too like mechanics sims where u dont race so maybe u go there eh?

Btw racing teams dont go to such lentgh's because it's "fun", they will do anything they can to get a win tweak/cheat bend rules not because they enjoy it, it is because they get PAID huge amounts if they win through sponsorship deals etc. But i bet that if you ask any REAL racer that would they mind racing in equal cars so it is purely down to skill would they mind (if money/pressure was not involved) im sure they wouldn't mind one single bit maybe they would even prefer it that way themselves.

Racing is racing whether with tunes or without!

What makes formula 1 boring today is the difference in the pace of the car's, what makes this fun for you?

Stryker44
08-06-2015, 15:25
The tyres are very realistic, I don't know where that assumption came from... have you driven a real race car?
The guys that spent 1000's of hours making these tyres as realistic as possible have.

And please don't say anything about me being a fanboy please.... I'm just being realistic.. ;)


To answer your question ... Yes, I have ... I have a tunable suspension on my own car. All I'm saying is like others I saw posted is that the grip level is a little low compared to a real track car. In some cases modified street cars. The McLaren and R8 are good examples. They push through the corners even at low speeds like the road is wet or something when they should be sticking. I'm not the only one who feels this way..Surely. Some grip added would be nice so you could actually feel the car sticking like in real life would be great. That's some of what I love about racing my car. The feeling of being on the edge of the grip as you make a curve is awsome in real life.

RobMUFC1987
08-06-2015, 15:25
Funny, I thought the GT 1968 tyre was supposed to be a treaded tyre..... all the pre 1972 tyres were...

hmm has it got the wrong texture ?

I think it shows as 80s Slicks in the menu, not sure, may just be used to the 98T. But in game the GT40 on track shows Goodyear Slicks

Bkim
08-06-2015, 15:29
In my opinion, 200 laps on a track with default setup and after doing so you will notice that you only need to make small corrections like gear ratios, brake - bias and strength. With a so called "fast setup" (dont know what that is), does not learn you the race the corners, doing 200 laps does (for me).

Voxen
08-06-2015, 15:31
Because you enjoy the tuning side of things that is good for you, but really if you can't race because you can't get your hands on the engine makes this less of a racing game? well let me reverse that for you then, if you can't handle the car as it is then you aren't a great driver! I bought this to race as it is a racing game. There are options for mechanics out there too like mechanics sims where u dont race so maybe u go there eh?

Once again why do you want to change this game from what it is? Its a racing simulation game which involves tuning AND racing.
If you don't like the tuning part you can avoid it (to a certain level) or move to a game where tuning is not important.

TrevorAustin
08-06-2015, 15:45
To answer your question ... Yes, I have ... I have a tunable suspension on my own car. All I'm saying is like others I saw posted is that the grip level is a little low compared to a real track car. In some cases modified street cars. The McLaren and R8 are good examples. They push through the corners even at low speeds like the road is wet or something when they should be sticking. I'm not the only one who feels this way..Surely. Some grip added would be nice so you could actually feel the car sticking like in real life would be great. That's some of what I love about racing my car. The feeling of being on the edge of the grip as you make a curve is awsome in real life.

This is the point I made, the few road cars I have driven in real life, that are in this game, just aren't like this, my old FTO would significantly outcorner the R8 and Mclaren on part worns at this rate:) They also wouldn't lose traction coming out of a bend with real assists turned on, or certainly the R8 wouldn't.

The R8 is an amazing, fun car to drive straight out of the showroom, not a slippery sliding beast like in the game! Is it possible that road cars have different models applied than they should, or some of them maybe?

Gooners
08-06-2015, 15:47
Once again why do you want to change this game from what it is? Its a racing simulation game which involves tuning AND racing.
If you don't like the tuning part you can avoid it (to a certain level) or move to a game where tuning is not important.

If it helps to make the game better for many people then why not? Its a discussion forum after all. And i know not that many people are that into tuning because when they are given the option to import someone else's tried and tested setups they usually jump right to it. And that is on more (supposedly) hardcore sim then this.

Btw seems people need to chill down a little, because someone comes here not full of praise and offers a suggestion please dont let it seem like its destroying your whole world. You can not deny that driving and mechanics are not 2 different things and like me there are many people that enjoy driving but do not enjoy the mechanic side of things. So maybe for the good of the game (sales wise) it would benefit to listen to suggestions rather then telling people to basically pee off and play another game if you dont like.

Mad Al
08-06-2015, 15:51
I think it shows as 80s Slicks in the menu, not sure, may just be used to the 98T. But in game the GT40 on track shows Goodyear Slicks

Or maybe not... the only available tyre is the 68 GT tyre and it's treaded

206725

RobMUFC1987
08-06-2015, 15:54
Or maybe not... the only available tyre is the 68 GT tyre and it's treaded

206725

Must have been a visual glitch then. Mine was definitely on Slicks. I'll try replicate it tomorrow and find a way to post from my PS4. It was on Multiplayer as well

Phishfinger
08-06-2015, 16:50
I used one of the setup guides (http://www.speedsims.org/tutorials/setup_guide_LFS.html) posted in here to tune the Zonda GT. It really made a difference and I took 2.5 seconds off my time on Silverstone International, the only problem is I had the bug where you crash coming out of TT and it didn't save :frown-new:

I'll be able to set the same time or better later when I'm not frustrated, I need some time out for now though arrrgh! Anyway, the point is these tuning guides are quite simple but they do work and you don't need to read an entire book to improve your times, even though that would give you a much deeper understanding.

hkraft300
13-06-2015, 16:27
But to me racing and engineering although yes they live side by side when it comes to racing but they are 2 completelty different skills.

You know it yourself.


Because people enjoy racing it don't mean they enjoy engineering so why should i feel forced (if i want to be competative) to have to spend hours/days/weeks learning a trade in which i do enjoy, just to enjoy playing a racing game.

Not even Luis Hamilton has this this hard and he gets paid more then i do :D


You don't have to spend the time learning the engineering involved in the setup. It's why we have the GARAGE section of this forum. So you can request setups and get custom setups to suit your driving style. There are plenty of engineers, mechanics by trade, sim racing veterans and General car nerds like myself who love to geek out in our virtual garages (like myself).
At the top tiers of racing the most successful drivers are the ones most involved in the development, setup and understanding of their cars, race strategy etc because they want the most information available to themselves to make the best decisions, give themselves the best chance to win while they're on the track.

Cialfi
13-06-2015, 17:00
You buy a sim and you are complaining about setup importance? It's like you play WOW and start complaining about leveling up. Leveling up is all, there's no way to murder an Orc on lvl99 without leveling up. Common guys.
Fernando would say: "this is ridiculous..."

Revvin
13-06-2015, 17:32
Its all part of the learning curve of playing something with a bit more depth than Forza or Gran Turismo - or Mario Kart. This is a racing simulator and a big part of being successful in racing is having a good setup.

Hlspwn
13-06-2015, 18:29
Its all part of the learning curve of playing something with a bit more depth than Forza or Gran Turismo - or Mario Kart. This is a racing simulator and a big part of being successful in racing is having a good setup.
Agree, but have any of the elitist played forza? It has tuning, gear ratios, wheel toe, camber, suspension etc that changed how the car drove. The physics may not match project cars for realism, but they were physics. I think what people fail to see is that it took skill to master that game, and it took setups to be competitive. I know because I spent 4 generations playing it. It also had far more players, and a bigger community than pcars.
Really think people in project cars need to pull together a bit, people are hear as they want a realistic road and race simulator, and we all love cars and motorsports. If they have played simcade before they should not be crucified for saying so.
Forza has the same principles as project cars, so let's embrace our community, not constantly be slagging everything else off. In forza I was used to racing against at least 20,000 to 400,000 people in time trials or community events. Some tracks had much higher figures. On the time trials I have tried so far in pcars it's lucky if there are 50 people!

Helmethead1031
13-06-2015, 19:39
In this game its only about the set up , simple is that. If you wanna be competitive (high to middle high level) in those Online events set up is everything. Im driving the Hockenheim with that horrible Mercedes (on ps4 controller), and ive realized thats all about the set up. Driving it stock, theres no way coming through the first right hander without spinning the car. Setting this car on "my way", put car higher, suspenssion softer, lsd on 90; ive tried wirth moving balast on the middle of the car, then the front car wount turn, even tho with lsd on 90 and de-acceleration around 35/40, still backend goes wild and car spins on exits. absolutely horrible to drive; add on that, every damn spin ends in a wall directly with your front end and it stays so..!!!
Im in the 31 time, cant do better, just cant, did fgre changes to the car and the car just slides, spins etc.. :confused:

Conclusion, if u can set up your car youre a winner, simple is that. Im an average racer, i m not into like massive set up the car, but definitely in this game theres wayyyyyyy tooooo much in this game. For me very confusing and frustrating


Add on that the idiotic way to set up the car, exit the event, wait a minute to get out enter the set up menu, set up ur car, save all that, again exit the set up menue, enter the event again, again wait almost a damn minute then drive..i mean, with all due respect, why easy when we can do complicated way!!


Frustration :acne::culpability::culpability::(

(btw the tittle should be"pCars IS for pro drivers", ive messed this one, sry)
Respectfully disagree. Once you learn the track and establish good lines, a great setup will only gain 1-2secs per lap.

o Mike V o
13-06-2015, 21:20
Only 1-2 seconds? I would say more but that is still a lot of time lost.

JeyD02
13-06-2015, 21:53
Respectfully disagree. Once you learn the track and establish good lines, a great setup will only gain 1-2secs per lap.

Not really. Definitively more than that depending on tracks.

hkraft300
13-06-2015, 21:55
Only 1-2 seconds? I would say more but that is still a lot of time lost.
Law of diminishing returns.
With a familiar track, car and practice I can get within 5 seconds of the fast guys. As I practice I tune the car to my liking. That gets me within 2-3 seconds of the fast guys - can't quantify what part of it is practice and what part setup. Either way, it's only a couple of seconds. At the same time I've beaten countless guys faster than me who spin crash blow up and quit races because although they qualified 5 sec faster they couldn't keep it together over 10+ laps (I've also been one of them, but I'll take a chance at a podium (thanks to quitters) and see the race to the end.

ak1504
13-06-2015, 22:17
Its for Pros because the default setups of some cars are complete crap.

JeyD02
13-06-2015, 22:19
Law of diminishing returns.
With a familiar track, car and practice I can get within 5 seconds of the fast guys. As I practice I tune the car to my liking. That gets me within 2-3 seconds of the fast guys - can't quantify what part of it is practice and what part setup. Either way, it's only a couple of seconds. At the same time I've beaten countless guys faster than me who spin crash blow up and quit races because although they qualified 5 sec faster they couldn't keep it together over 10+ laps (I've also been one of them, but I'll take a chance at a podium (thanks to quitters) and see the race to the end.

The thing is, you just don't stop at one tune. Once you have successfully tune your car you'll shrink time and adapt your best racing onto that tune, and while you are just about squeezing every inch of the track you notice more tunes could be adjust and therefore more time will be shorten and little by little you start to gain more time. Tune it's about how much more potential you can get out of the car and as you go you'll keep adapting and discerning several tunes that can get you faster.

And to agree with some of your point. Yes people completely disregard the stability and endurance performance on an actual race. A tune for qualifying could be quite different than a race one.and like you said, many people tune to be "fast" for 1 lap or 3 but after that, the tire, stability, temp, wear, drag will just make it undriveable.

DUST2DEATH
13-06-2015, 22:22
Agree, but have any of the elitist played forza? It has tuning, gear ratios, wheel toe, camber, suspension etc that changed how the car drove. The physics may not match project cars for realism, but they were physics. I think what people fail to see is that it took skill to master that game, and it took setups to be competitive. I know because I spent 4 generations playing it. It also had far more players, and a bigger community than pcars.
Really think people in project cars need to pull together a bit, people are hear as they want a realistic road and race simulator, and we all love cars and motorsports. If they have played simcade before they should not be crucified for saying so.
Forza has the same principles as project cars, so let's embrace our community, not constantly be slagging everything else off. In forza I was used to racing against at least 20,000 to 400,000 people in time trials or community events. Some tracks had much higher figures. On the time trials I have tried so far in pcars it's lucky if there are 50 people!

A lot of people here have played forza to death.

Forza, once you know the 'game' within the game, all the cars built in the same round about way to be competitive, and you tuned them all in essentially what was the same set of base values. 99% of forza's cars are entirely irrelevent if all you do is race, unless you purposely gimp yourself for all the slow hoppers.

Forza's principles are (now) vastly different from pcars. Pcars is all about the racing. thats it. Forza is the pokemon car collection game, with a secondary focus on racing. This is the flip value of FM1 and 2. "car lovers into gamers" means the game has to be forgiving. And forza is far more forgiving then pcars. Harder doesnt always equal more realistic however.

The FFB in forza is dead in comparison. Nor does it do wheels properly.

20K - 400K was nothing for forza, in FM2, it was millions across most boards.

Regarding the above, it appears you are playing on PC. Pcars on PC's leaderboards are per car/per class/per track. The consoles insist of only per class / per track. This leads to more users being 'lumped' onto the one board, in comparison to each car having their own boards per track.

Perspective is a funny thing.



It takes skill to be good at any game.

JeyD02
13-06-2015, 22:44
Now that I am seeing the post, many people have it so wrong here between stock and customed, driver, fast, slow. So many misconception and geez

Helmethead1031
14-06-2015, 00:02
Not really. Definitively more than that depending on tracks.
My point is a good setup coupled with track knowledge and practice will produce relatively fast consistent laps. Once that's achieved, a great setup will help gain an additional second per lap. Further more, a great setup for one driver will not be a great setup for someone else. The OP is saying the game is only about setups and I respectfully disagree. A great driver with a bad setup is still going to be consistently faster than a middle of the pack driver on a great setup. This game is more than just setups. I agree a good setup is essential, but it's only one part.

JeyD02
14-06-2015, 02:05
My point is a good setup coupled with track knowledge and practice will produce relatively fast consistent laps. Once that's achieved, a great setup will help gain an additional second per lap. Further more, a great setup for one driver will not be a great setup for someone else. The OP is saying the game is only about setups and I respectfully disagree. A great driver with a bad setup is still going to be consistently faster than a middle of the pack driver on a great setup. This game is more than just setups. I agree a good setup is essential, but it's only one part.

Oh well ya, in the that aspect yes, of course lol. It's all about driver, then setup will only complement more to the driver. I disagree with him. Like I have said, many people have many misconception about the stupid In game. But a good setup a it's good driver will shrink many secs not only limited to 1-2 sec I wanted to clarify.

Helmethead1031
14-06-2015, 02:38
I do understand the OP's perspective though. The amount of options regarding tuning can be daunting. I'm not an expert and have leaned heavily on those more versed in tuning on these forums. I will say many in these forums are very helpful and most times questions are answered quickly and with respect. My suggestion to anyone new to "sim" style racing is to pick a car class you like, pick one car you like, then go drive it. Search these forums if you're looking for a particular setup. Use the setup and see how it fits your driving style. Then tweak it where needed. The easiest way to figure out tuning is to take a car out for practice. Move one slider in tuning to an extreme and then do a few laps. It will become apparent quickly how each tweak affects the car.

hkraft300
14-06-2015, 06:38
The thing is, you just don't stop at one tune. Once you have successfully tune your car you'll shrink time and adapt your best racing onto that tune, and while you are just about squeezing every inch of the track you notice more tunes could be adjust and therefore more time will be shorten and little by little you start to gain more time. Tune it's about how much more potential you can get out of the car and as you go you'll keep adapting and discerning several tunes that can get you faster.


agreed and I think its an interesting phenomenon and question whether one is faster because setup or practice.
said it before and i'll say it again - one can enjoy pCars for its racing, then just ask the community "need help tuning car x on track y, getting oversteer on corner z" like any driver/racer without an engineering background, and believe me your thread will be full of helpful hints, if not complete setups!

So to enjoy this game you don't have to be a "pro" or an engineer and anyone can enjoy the game for its racing but, to be competitive in ANYTHING in life, practice makes perfect therefore one must spend the time and effort, as has been said so many times already.

you wanna be fast on Mario kart - practice. NFS - practice. hell even being quick in armoured vehicles on BF4 takes practice lol

CCM
14-06-2015, 06:47
I agree with the OP. Coming from iracing we have a fixed series and a open series. I only ran the fixed series due to not having time to make a setup. When a open wheel driver dominates in the open series and sucks in the fixed series then it's the set up not the driver. I have seen it many many time in the fix series when all the cars a equal you have to earn your win and the majority of the time the great open wheel drivers can't hang with the regular fixed series drivers. The driver does help but the set is what makes the driver not the other way around. You think Jimmy Johns will win races if he ran for BK racing or some one car know funded team? I doubt he would even cracke the top 10.

hkraft300
14-06-2015, 07:03
the open series driver wouldn't have the seat time on the fixed setups, so the car would be almost unfamiliar to him, or just not suit it. there are fine variables involved - I think it's a more complex question than to be answered by the scenario you describe.

I've participated in a fixed series - failed on some tracks because the setup didn't suit my style and dominated on some tracks.

EvoM3
14-06-2015, 13:25
OP is simply wrong.

I play online every night and other than FUEL I run a stock setup.. I'm always competitive and in the top few cars with a stock setup...

You will go much faster by practicing driving rather than working on setup.. when you're maxing out the stock setup, then you can start to change things.. most people I see online are a long way from maxing out the stock setup.

Revvin
14-06-2015, 15:22
Agree, but have any of the elitist played forza? It has tuning, gear ratios, wheel toe, camber, suspension etc that changed how the car drove. The physics may not match project cars for realism, but they were physics. I think what people fail to see is that it took skill to master that game, and it took setups to be competitive. I know because I spent 4 generations playing it. It also had far more players, and a bigger community than pcars.

I've played every version of Forza extensively and Gran Turismo. They are not racing sims they are car collector games with simplified physics compared to PCars or any number of PC based racing games. Forza is less about setup and more about what upgrades you can fit in without going over the class limit, it's a fun game, I still enjoy playing it though but for different reasons, it's an easy pick up and play game for when I get home from work and want to veg out on the sofa without having to think too much about what I'm doing.

Rogerslack
14-06-2015, 15:59
I kind of agree that setting up is too complicated. The average bloke wouldn't know half of what there is. Yes, you can learn about setting up but it should be easier to alter set up without reloading all the time and why can't we save multi set ups for a particular car. I try something, if it doesn't work I have to remember my previous set up, it should be easier. I want to race. I love set ups but too much time spent away from racing or practicing altering set up.
I don't think the game, very good as it is, is very user friendly.

hkraft300
14-06-2015, 16:43
Well your gripes are with the UI and not the setup aspect of the game the hey?
Again.. Everyone complaining about the setting up of cars... You realise there's a garage section of this forum, Ye?
Should I post a link?

PzR Slim
14-06-2015, 16:49
I'm not very good at tuning, never really spent the time to get good at it. And as a result I tend to run pretty much everything stock but that really doesn't hold me back against the competition. Sure setup helps, but understanding what you are trying to do with the car and having the skill to do it are far more important in my opinion.

cloakdeath
26-06-2015, 21:21
Somebody on a controller in a default setup car will seriously struggle against someone with a wheel and pedals in a tuned setup. Can't compete.

3800racingfool
26-06-2015, 21:25
Somebody on a controller in a default setup car will seriously struggle against someone with a wheel and pedals in a tuned setup. Can't compete.

I dunno, I've raced plenty of guys with controllers who blow me away. Whether or not they're on a default setup I wouldn't know but I do know I'm not most of the time.

wraithsrike
26-06-2015, 21:28
I dunno, I've raced plenty of guys with controllers who blow me away. Whether or not they're on a default setup I wouldn't know but I do know I'm not most of the time.

Agree some of these guys using controllers are awesome, one quick look at the LB's tells you that.

Photonenbert
28-06-2015, 11:23
I always look at the setup tips ingame with mixed feelings. well its very very difficult and takes hundreds of pages to explain how you should and can setup a car so that isnt so easy.
therefore its good to have those small tips for people who dont like to read (or spend time).

but if you really want to dive in deep its not very helpful. cause when it says "make this harder to reduce oversteer" or "decrease this to make the car more responsive" you wont get what is actually happening.

you need specific understanding of the technical stuff that is going on. What does this part do and why is it doing it?

for example: make the front softer then you will decrease understeer. Sounds easy and really isnt.

cause you have many choices to dial out or correct certain misbehavior in a completely different way. And you need to be way more specific than you might think. "the car understeers" is not a complaint. You are not able to adjust the setup when saying "the car just understeers"

is it on corner entry? is it on corner exit? is it mid corner? is it during brake lift of? is it in fast or in slow turns? are your tires up to heat? what heat is the optimum for tires? is it a certain range? is it the same for all cars? it says green from 80-90...am I fine? its over 100 celsius in that hard left turn.
is that too much or do I look at it only at the same point on the circuit every new lap ?


Different example:
I never knew how a differential is actually working. And therefore logically I am not really able to set it up correctly as I dont know how it will affect my car. I just read "it does this or that if you increase or decrease".
So by using those tips its just trial and error and you will be having a hard time to actual get what has changed and why it has changed and also when it changes.
Yes, if you know what it does its still a bit of trial and errror, but that is how you test setups. There is no other way really.

I started reading about differentials...and didnt get shit. Reading doesnt help at all. Watch a video! Its that much more easy do understand.

like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SOgoejxzF8c

or this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WeLm7wHvdxQ

now it gets really weird.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEiSTzK-A2A

Besides, they are really fun to watch.


And that is with every part on the car and in the setup menu.

But there are some baseline things you need to know that are mostly true with any race car in any condition when trying to set it up properly:



The most important thing is TIRES.

Anything you change on your car, be it brakes, suspension, sway bars, engine, downforce. The tires are the things that connect your car to the road! So that is the very first thing you need to adjust. Tires brake, tires give grip in corners and tires help you get of the line and they get grippier with more downforce. Tirestirestires.

Tire pressure:
You need to find out the optimum tire temp. Easiest to do so with the help of the telemetry HUD. If it says green then your temps are good and up.
Mostly its around 80-100 Celsuis but that depends on the tire (soft mid hard rain etc. and the car: race tire road tire etc.)

you will then have to test it on the track. And you really need to get temps to race pace so I recommend driving around 10 laps.
And it is very important that you know the track and car first !

If you dont then your pace differs so much that your tire temps are changing and your setup is wrong again before you got to know your way around the corners.

So knowing the car/track combo with default setup is the first thing to do. If you increase your time by 2 seconds after adjusting the tire pressure you will probably need to adjust it once again. As I said, you need to go for some laps so you are at race pace. After 2 laps your tires might be up to temps but they will change with the upcoming laps (a bit). You also might overdrive the tires and then they overheat so try clean laps but as fast as possible of course.

the tire pressures can differ quite a bit. (bar) 1.65 front left and 1.35 rear right isnt unusual to do. BUT! With anything you change there will always be a peak. And if you step over the line you will make it worse rather than better. And that is also why I dont like those small tipps.
If you got to much pressure the tire will get round. and then the the left and right side of the tire have less contact with the road. its over inflated. Same with under inflated tires. not enough pressure makes the tire mid loose contact due to the way a tire is build. so everything in moderation at first.

Also all tires dont have the same amount of pressure. On a track all tires are driving different lines and cope with less or more load under braking or accelerating or during corners. So the pressure setup is very often unsymmetrical. like: Front left 1.60 // Front Right 1.53 // Rear Left 1.42 // Rear right 1.52. It looks weird but the temps will eventually sort them selves out once you drove a few laps and reached race pace ! It doesnt matter that your tires are all uneven at the beginning. Drive a few laps and look at the temps.

Tips dont tell you that. It always depends on the starting point. "increase camber" well if you say increase it gets positive. Camber ist mostly lower than 0 (exceptions are oval racing where one side is setup differently than the other) and has a negative value. so increasing camber means more negative but increasing camber value is more positiv? Dont argue with yourself on this. Read about camber and know what it does and why it does it! This is way better than being confused by the tips.

And if you change one thing, another thing changes as well. So only adjust one at a time and then test it ! it takes time but otherwise you wont see what adjustment caused a certain behavior.
And remember that many settings can help with one specific behavior.

MonoBarrientos
28-06-2015, 14:51
Respectfully disagree. Once you learn the track and establish good lines, a great setup will only gain 1-2secs per lap.

Hi, man that is not true
Some cars in default status are OK and competitive (example, LMP1 ) but others in same condition simply are imposible (example lotus 67)
I spend various days in find correct setup for lotus, and the difference is dramatic: default setup---> impossible, finish last or simply imposible to finish without launch the controler for the window //// but with days and days of try-error after setup----> the car became competitive and finish first

For this reason, some guys claims for "no tune option" (i am agree with that idea)
:http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?31156-Please-where-is-the-No-car-Tune-options!

;)

hkraft300
28-06-2015, 16:36
what if you just learned to drive the car, around a particular track, while you were tuning?
Lotus 72 (if that's the one you're referring to) is known to have a bad default setup, therefore it's a bad example to use for your argument. It's probably the only car. cant use one isolated case to prove a point.

It's a difficult thing to distinguish - is it the setup that has improved your lap time, or the practice you've put in where lap after lap you learn the car and track better?
The older cars require a different driving technique.

Photonenbert
28-06-2015, 17:01
It's a difficult thing to distinguish - is it the setup that has improved your lap time, or the practice you've put in where lap after lap you learn the car and track better?
The older cars require a different driving technique.


this is why I mentioned above that you first need to know the track. Otherwise you cannot say if a certain setup change is affecting your lap times or if it is due to your improved driving, yes.

jumping in a new car and driving 5 laps and then doing a setup doesnt work. yes, if you DO know your way around setups then you cant start maybe a little bit earlier on but in that case you already know how to do it ;)

hoodi4cars
28-06-2015, 17:18
I think you can very well assess a setup without having practiced much or having consistency in your laps, maybe not super precisely, but well enough for starters. Just observing the real time delta through the lap will often times tell you obvious changes to acceleration or top speed, that are always reproducable no matter how exactly you take the corner or at what exact time you shift etc. You don't need to do consistent driving to see this. And I guess when you enable the telemetry HUD, it will tell you some things as well that you can make something out of very quick. And imo too much practice will even backfire when it comes to assesing a setup, because when you have done 1000 laps on a certain setup, then you will probably be slower with any other setup for the next couple of hundred laps even when the setup is in fact faster.

MonoBarrientos
28-06-2015, 17:23
what if you just learned to drive the car, around a particular track, while you were tuning?
Lotus 72 (if that's the one you're referring to) is known to have a bad default setup, therefore it's a bad example to use for your argument. It's probably the only car. cant use one isolated case to prove a point.

It's a difficult thing to distinguish - is it the setup that has improved your lap time, or the practice you've put in where lap after lap you learn the car and track better?
The older cars require a different driving technique.

Happens with a mercedes too (i don't remember the model in this moment ) when is in default setup

bodyshop
29-06-2015, 19:52
Have you ever considered that your just learning how to play this game the same way you learn to be great at COD but if you were chucked into a Warzone with a machine gun you'd die within moments... or do people also thing they are great soldiers? Its nuts, its a game, its all gaming man... just enjoy it....there's 10 year olds out there playing these games and drunk blokes having a laugh with a controller and still doing good races and times..lolz....

Theres connections like learning race craft and tracks and maybe reaction times etc but after that.. nope.

hkraft300
29-06-2015, 20:15
Happens with a mercedes too (i don't remember the model in this moment ) when is in default setup

And that's why there's a garage section of this (and one on GTplanet I've seen) forum for you to search and request setups and engage with tuners to help make your e-vehicle of choice enjoyable to drive. Doesn't take a pro to do that.