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holdin09
15-07-2015, 22:15
Please can we have some information on how you are going to solve the multiplayer crisis? I.e. The ramming?

There are some good suggestions on numerous threads but some clear information would be nice.

jason
15-07-2015, 22:33
I don't think they have any plans on fixing that issue , the main answer for that is find a group of people that you enjoy playing with and play against them.

The random online lobby side of things is pretty much a redundant part of the game I guess.

MMM1978
15-07-2015, 22:35
Seriously! Far mOre important things to be worried about than this, at present.

jason
15-07-2015, 22:45
Seriously! Far mOre important things to be worried about than this, at present.

That may be the only issue he is having with the game MMM1978...... So it may well be important to him .

Neil Bateman
15-07-2015, 22:49
Even if the host had the abilty to boot drivers out the ramming will still happen as you can only eject someone after the crime has been commited.

I was an admin with Openspeedway on NR2003, we sat out races to watch them and eject troublemakers, then providing it was on or before lap 3 restart the race, if it happened any later we still ejected them but the race went on minus all the innocent drivers who got wrecked.

You can reduce but never stop deliberate wreckers in open servers, someone will always be a victim whatever you do.

jason
15-07-2015, 22:52
Even if the host had the abilty to boot drivers out the ramming will still happen as you can only eject someone after the crime has been commited.

I was an admin with Openspeedway on NR2003, we sat out races to watch them and eject troublemakers, then providing it was on or before lap 3 restart the race, if it happened any later we still ejected them but the race went on minus all the innocent drivers who got wrecked.

You can reduce but never stop deliberate wreckers in open servers, someone will always be a victim whatever you do.

I agree

nono782
15-07-2015, 23:34
A simple rule should be : you hit someone you get a penalty.
And if you are hit by someone, you don't get any penalty for 10 seconds. Because when you lose control after a crash, you may go off track or into someone else. (and all the guys hitting you during this time don't get penalties either)

Apply this and in a few weeks the MP races will be a lot safer.

RacingTopsy
16-07-2015, 00:35
The thing is that it's not that easy for a game to determind whose fault it is and if someone crashed deliberately or not.
Lets say player B wants to ruin player As race and the game punishes people for running into others, then player B simply has to brake hard infront of player A so that A gets a penalty.

If the game detects that you lost control and couldn't help causing a pile, up then all player B has to do is lose control 'at the right moment'.

It'd be near impossible to get right I fear. If a crasher wants to ruin a race he'll find a way to do it.

Stocky
16-07-2015, 01:49
Yeh, that's not a good idea nono.
What if the guy in front of you slams on his brakes while you're hot on his tail.
Or what if he over brakes and doesn't give you the line to pass? Who's fault is it then?
There is a huge difference from the top drivers on down, and it's not easy if you're stuck behind a slower driver who won't move over, and brakes much more than the way you do. You may brake at a certain turn, but the faster drivers don't, and it's an accident waiting to happen.

The best fix for the MP problems, is a simple, 1-5 rating system, which you can move up in rank finishing before people your rank or higher, and lose rank points by finishing behind people lower rank than yourself. The crashers and problem people won't get past rank 1 or 2, and if they do, and start wrecking people, their rank will drop right back down again. So figure rank 3 & 4 the better drivers, and rank 4 & 5 will be the top drivers. Make it so you can create a race, for ranks 1-5, or 2-5, 4-5, or just rank 5's if you want. Or just rank 3's. Creators choice.

FoxMulder
16-07-2015, 02:22
Host kick option and a functioning rating system as promised would be a good start.

Stocky
16-07-2015, 03:09
The host kick option would be good, but that refers back to my other post about not being able to read the opponent names well. Every time we want to boot someone who is sitting in the middle of the track, it's always the same answer. Who was that? Did anyone get the name? It's rare when we do get an answer.

skrusinbin
16-07-2015, 03:28
Either find a private league/lobby, or subscribe to iRacing, if you want enjoyable multiplayer racing lasting more than 15 minutes long or 7+ opponents.

jason
16-07-2015, 03:55
hmmmmmm Iracing maybe the go .

nono782
16-07-2015, 09:13
You guys often refer to "wreckers on purpose".
They exist but are not that many fortunately.
In most cases, crashes happen because the players are not careful enough.

I often followed cars slower than I was, and very rarely hit them, hardly never crashed them.

As to the wreckers in purpose, the host should be able to kick them.

Fong74
16-07-2015, 09:23
An option to disable collisions in a lobby would help solving the rammers issue imho.

madmax2069
16-07-2015, 09:25
An option to disable collisions in a lobby would help solving the rammers issue imho.

No, just no.

Fong74
16-07-2015, 09:54
:D :rolleyes:

"Option" means you can use it, but dont have to. If you dont want it, leave it be...

Me, I race with fellow racers only, so we dont have any issue with the discipline on track. We use private lobbies anyway. In public lobbies, the host could just use the named option if things get too ugly. I do understand that the racing will change a lot, but what is worse? Having to leave the lobby (as you cant kick ppl) or turn off collisions until all the nasty ppl have left the room because they can not harm anyone anymore? After the natural cleansing has taken place, you can switch collisions back on...

holdin09
16-07-2015, 11:13
This is my only gripe with the game. I don't have the time to join a league as I am on at different times. I just want to clear information about what is being proposed or going to be done. I love this game just a shame this is ruining it for everyone

holdin09
16-07-2015, 12:00
Someone on another thread reminded me about GT 5 online. Didn't have the most strict rules but somehow managed to have many many clean races. Maybe have the option to have shuffle races (which were fun at times) made all the rammers join them lobbies leaving the clean races be. It had temporarily ghosting too which helped.

joking_aura
16-07-2015, 12:36
You guys often refer to "wreckers on purpose".
They exist but are not that many fortunately.
In most cases, crashes happen because the players are not careful enough.

I often followed cars slower than I was, and very rarely hit them, hardly never crashed them.

As to the wreckers in purpose, the host should be able to kick them.

^^ This is the right way to look at the issue in my opinion. We need to assume that most people in the lobby are reasonable and want a good race. Most of the incidents I have been involved in were due to carelessness more so than someone intentionally trying to ruin my race. Sure, I have run across folks stopped on the track at corners or waiting to bash someone at the start finish line, but these people are in the minority and no penalty system will nullify them. A penalty system as others have described where careless and impatient racers would get a penalty for bashing into your rear end would solve many issues that I regularly face when in random lobbies.

I do have a better time when racing with others I can trust. I would like to see SMS provide a filtering system that will allow PSN friends to find each other more easily without having to resort to constantly sending invites. Maybe give us a filter to show only lobbies with our friends already in them.

I just want to understand the direction the developer wants to take this game from an online racing perspective. If they were to lay out a roadmap of features they are working on, it would alleviate a lot of the angst people are feeling about the game's current state in multiplayer. I would love to see a stickied locked post that says "We have been listening and here is what we plan on doing to make your experience better. Over the next 2 months we endeaver to add x, y, and z. Thank you for your suggestions and continued support in this community"

ccvampyre
16-07-2015, 12:46
it is ridiculous and somewhat defeatist to just accept the current state of mp, or just play iracing.

this game has huge potential. but currently is just potential for multiplayer racers like myself.


there have been many suggestions,

collision/mile count
host kick
temporary ghosting
reverse driving ghosting
stationary car DQing
high speed collision penalties (where faster car is penalised)
shunting penalties
side swipe penalties (faster moving L/R car penalised)
flashbacks

(many of which are in ps3 racers)


i would like to +1 the original post and ask for some kind of confirmation of plans for the future.

i want to play this game but still can't for longer than 15 mins.

holdin09
16-07-2015, 15:09
^^ This is the right way to look at the issue in my opinion. We need to assume that most people in the lobby are reasonable and want a good race. Most of the incidents I have been involved in were due to carelessness more so than someone intentionally trying to ruin my race. Sure, I have run across folks stopped on the track at corners or waiting to bash someone at the start finish line, but these people are in the minority and no penalty system will nullify them. A penalty system as others have described where careless and impatient racers would get a penalty for bashing into your rear end would solve many issues that I regularly face when in random lobbies.

I do have a better time when racing with others I can trust. I would like to see SMS provide a filtering system that will allow PSN friends to find each other more easily without having to resort to constantly sending invites. Maybe give us a filter to show only lobbies with our friends already in them.

I just want to understand the direction the developer wants to take this game from an online racing perspective. If they were to lay out a roadmap of features they are working on, it would alleviate a lot of the angst people are feeling about the game's current state in multiplayer. I would love to see a stickied locked post that says "We have been listening and here is what we plan on doing to make your experience better. Over the next 2 months we endeaver to add x, y, and z. Thank you for your suggestions and continued support in this community"

I think a lot of people want to know that's why I asked for clear information.

smithdan78
16-07-2015, 15:34
You could give the host the option to rate drivers after the race. With a list of incidents and replays to hand. If you get marked down after the race, future hosts can see your rating and kick you out before their race starts.

kjay
16-07-2015, 15:39
An option to disable collisions in a lobby would help solving the rammers issue imho.
With that option I no longer have to work to get into position to make the pass. I can just drive through the guy.

That's a horrible option. The reality is that there is no technical solution to eliminate poor, unskillful drivers.

SpeedFreakDTM
16-07-2015, 15:46
With that option I no longer have to work to get into position to make the pass. I can just drive through the guy.

That's a horrible option. The reality is that there is no technical solution to eliminate poor, unskillful drivers.

Hence the need to give the host the power to kick.

holdin09
16-07-2015, 15:52
You could give the host the option to rate drivers after the race. With a list of incidents and replays to hand. If you get marked down after the race, future hosts can see your rating and kick you out before their race starts.

That will just get abused as the host could give low ratings to clean racers

MrFlibble81
16-07-2015, 16:03
Ok, here's my theory on how to stop it. Please don't hate me for it.

Do nothing. Quite simply, do nothing.

If people want to ram in order to win a race or just piss people off then discussing it on this forum is giving them EXACTLY what they want. Attention.

Now, I know that it's annoying having to deal with rammers but really there is no black and white solution that's going to be an easy enough fix for SMS and one which pleases everyone.

There's certain things they could add in there such as the ability for the host to kick people (I have no idea how easy or difficult that is to code) but the rammers are likely never going to go away. Especially if they keep getting talked about and are getting that attention.

I guess I've just come to terms with it but if I get rammed and I end up racing myself then so be it. I'll just keep trying to knock out quicker and quicker laps and have fun that way.

But I reckon if the rammers stop getting attention then they might go away. Or at least not be as many of them.

K, You can all start hating on me now....

smithdan78
16-07-2015, 16:12
That will just get abused as the host could give low ratings to clean racers

Not if it was incidents only available to the host, with a replay of it attached? and ratings only given to cars involved?

And the ratings dont even become available to you until youve hosted so many races? maybe too complicated come to think of it, ha!

ccvampyre
16-07-2015, 16:23
If you could do the stuff you could in project cars irl...



its not about just spoilers, it's the win at all costs mentality.
In any sport there are regs...

holdin09
16-07-2015, 16:35
Ok, here's my theory on how to stop it. Please don't hate me for it.

Do nothing. Quite simply, do nothing.

If people want to ram in order to win a race or just piss people off then discussing it on this forum is giving them EXACTLY what they want. Attention.

Now, I know that it's annoying having to deal with rammers but really there is no black and white solution that's going to be an easy enough fix for SMS and one which pleases everyone.

There's certain things they could add in there such as the ability for the host to kick people (I have no idea how easy or difficult that is to code) but the rammers are likely never going to go away. Especially if they keep getting talked about and are getting that attention.

I guess I've just come to terms with it but if I get rammed and I end up racing myself then so be it. I'll just keep trying to knock out quicker and quicker laps and have fun that way.

But I reckon if the rammers stop getting attention then they might go away. Or at least not be as many of them.

K, You can all start hating on me now....

Other games deal with it though and why shouldn't rules be implemented to keep customers happy? And have to say in Motorsport the rules get changed so the game should be more life like.

MrFlibble81
16-07-2015, 16:37
Other games deal with it though and why shouldn't rules be implemented to keep customers happy? And have to say in Motorsport the rules get changed so the game should be more life like.

Yes but it's a game. You can't treat games like real life, that's not how it works.

Also, I would say that the bulk of the customers are happy.

Stocky
16-07-2015, 16:41
Yes, I am happy with the game for the most part.

holdin09
16-07-2015, 16:54
Yes but it's a game. You can't treat games like real life, that's not how it works.

Also, I would say that the bulk of the customers are happy.

It is a simulation of racing though. I am happy with the career and single player it's the multiplayer that lets it down

Stocky
16-07-2015, 17:00
I haven't even touched the single player or career modes.
I have only played online multiplayer (240 hours so far), am addicted, and have a bunch of great drivers that all join up together at night, and on teamspeak.

MXR SMILER
16-07-2015, 17:04
Could the host block players so that they will not be allowed to join any future games/races set up by the same host?

beetes_juice
16-07-2015, 17:18
Could the host block players so that they will not be allowed to join any future games/races set up by the same host?

Have to block them through xbox. Dosen't work all the time though.

MXR SMILER
16-07-2015, 17:23
Have to block them through xbox. Dosen't work all the time though.

Doesnt work at all for me - I regularly get destroyed by some pillock I have previously blocked. Just wondering if poss through in game programming :(

RTA nOsKiLlS
16-07-2015, 23:54
Doesnt work at all for me - I regularly get destroyed by some pillock I have previously blocked. Just wondering if poss through in game programming :(

Did you report them, as well as block them? I've not re-encountered anyone who I have reported for unsporting conduct and then blocked them.........yet.

Just a thought. :)

Dynomight Motorsports
17-07-2015, 00:06
The main difference between Console and iRacing games is you have to pay to play. So you get all kinds of guys on Xbox. Anybody that pays $60 bucks a year (usually the Parents pay) can get access to online racing. While iRacing is Just Racing and you have to pay for it! So you aren't just playing against some 11 yr old that got done wrecking a bunch of cars on GTA 5. The other thing is iRacing is only on PC, which again has more serious racers.

jason
17-07-2015, 00:48
The main difference between Console and iRacing games is you have to pay to play. So you get all kinds of guys on Xbox. Anybody that pays $60 bucks a year (usually the Parents pay) can get access to online racing. While iRacing is Just Racing and you have to pay for it! So you aren't just playing against some 11 yr old that got done wrecking a bunch of cars on GTA 5. The other thing is iRacing is only on PC, which again has more serious racers.

So pretty much guys we have a serious looking racing game with some pretty serious Physics that doesn't take itself so serious as the options for it just aren't there for the online side of things.

Dam351
17-07-2015, 03:23
With that option I no longer have to work to get into position to make the pass. I can just drive through the guy.

That's a horrible option. The reality is that there is no technical solution to eliminate poor, unskillful drivers.

If player ratings worked, say from 0 to 10, 10 being drivers of exceptional quality, the host could invite anyone over level X as long as the host is that level himself

nono782
17-07-2015, 06:14
The other thing is iRacing is only on PC, which again has more serious racers.

I can't imagine how it could be worse on consoles.

Fong74
17-07-2015, 06:23
With that option I no longer have to work to get into position to make the pass. I can just drive through the guy.

That's a horrible option. The reality is that there is no technical solution to eliminate poor, unskillful drivers.

Nothing hinders you to drive like collisions were on, although they may be set to off. You and your mates could do your racing as usual and wait until the rammers set off for another lobby. Then turn collisions on again. Its just what you make out of it...

I am not affected by rammers, so basically I dont need additional options or approaches to resolve that issue. I do believe though, that a kick and a collisions option would help you guys.

joking_aura
17-07-2015, 14:04
I just wanted to give this thread a bump since it seems the SMS staff has awoken from a quiet period of no posts. Is there anything that can be shared at this time with respect to changes to multiplayer options? I.e. Additional filtering, revised penalty system, ranking and updated reputation system...

holdin09
20-07-2015, 17:26
Still no information from anyone with facts, multiplayer is as bad as ever really thinking about giving up on it.

Ramshackle
20-07-2015, 22:07
I've been watching this thread with interest too. Judging by the amount of views, looks like a lot of other people are.

chart_e
21-07-2015, 01:42
Even if the host had the abilty to boot drivers out the ramming will still happen as you can only eject someone after the crime has been commited.

I was an admin with Openspeedway on NR2003, we sat out races to watch them and eject troublemakers, then providing it was on or before lap 3 restart the race, if it happened any later we still ejected them but the race went on minus all the innocent drivers who got wrecked.

You can reduce but never stop deliberate wreckers in open servers, someone will always be a victim whatever you do.

yeah the damges are done, but the wont wreck the other race that follow

321Respawn
22-07-2015, 00:17
I find when the game first came out I got in a lot more clean races but now 2 months later almost every race is a wreck fest .I find myself having 2 goes at multiplay before giving up and going against AI instead .
Just today I joined a lobby with 30 cars (lets not call them racers) to late to get a qualify lap .It started me in 20th and we got going .I don't know the names of all the corners but you all will understand the sections I am talking about .
Mid way through the first corner before the braking point into the left turn I am up to 15th as far on the outside as I can be to avoid collisions .Suddenly I find myself rammed off track into the sand .Rather than drive back into traffic I decided to just drive through the sand and come out behind everyone at the top of the hill . No such luck though because someone came flying off the track and slammed into me which ended my chances of having a race because a wheel came off .
No idea who it was or how it happened .
Every single car that didn't quit or receive fatal damage was left in a condition that would have left my local panel beater busy for a year .
Now everyone harps on about the AI being crap and rammers etc but I loaded up a 56 car race against AI on Le Mans and started myself at the back .At the same point where the oh so smart humans ended my race I was up to 40th and not a single car crashed .I even managed to finish the whole 10 lap race intact .
I think many of us thought that a few months into Pcars the wreckers and the not so good racers would be bored and move onto something else but it seems we were wrong .They are many and it seems they are here to stay .
So here is the race monitor view of the cars that were left in the human race .
Forgive the 360p upload my internet upload speed is only as fast as most online racers brains so I don't have all day to wait for a decent rez video to upload .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODorzz6oEtQ&feature=youtu.be