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View Full Version : Ace AI (100%) is too slow



Arthelm
26-08-2015, 05:03
It's like they had less horse power in their cars. I have seen this in karts, in GT's, in Prototypes, etc. So it's not that i have been playing career and the AI of the karts on 100% is easier than the AI of for example some invitational event.

For example, lets put some long straight, lets say the last straight sector of Nordschleife (that long long long straight before the finish line)

Let's imagine we both have the same car and im behind the Ai by a fair distance that wont allow me to slipstream. Even being far away for some reason its like i had more HP than them and i can slowly catch him, get to a slipstream distance do a takeover and finally get in front.

There is issue #1, the Ai is noticable slower than me

Secondly, and following the past example. When i get ahead, lets say i deliberately stay in front of him so he can slipstream me back and therefore get ahead of me. Well it doesnt mather because for some reason he STILL is slower than i am and i manage to gain distance until the "slipstream" is broken.

So issue #2 is like there was no physics over the wind whatsoever because there is no slipstream for the AI and im not even sure there is slipstream at all because when im catching up some other driver i dont find a noticeable difference between the speed that i have when getting closer than the speed that i get when being on the tail of other car "slipstreaming"


So...

Sooo.....

I really find the Ai slower and im thinking the slipstream doesnt exist in this game

bobbylion
26-08-2015, 07:05
Your a hero.....

Denco
26-08-2015, 07:53
He is, he is a hero :)

fa-racing
26-08-2015, 07:56
It's like they had less horse power in their cars. I have seen this in karts, in GT's, in Prototypes, etc. So it's not that i have been playing career and the AI of the karts on 100% is easier than the AI of for example some invitational event.

For example, lets put some long straight, lets say the last straight sector of Nordschleife (that long long long straight before the finish line)

Let's imagine we both have the same car and im behind the Ai by a fair distance that wont allow me to slipstream. Even being far away for some reason its like i had more HP than them and i can slowly catch him, get to a slipstream distance do a takeover and finally get in front.

There is issue #1, the Ai is noticable slower than me

Secondly, and following the past example. When i get ahead, lets say i deliberately stay in front of him so he can slipstream me back and therefore get ahead of me. Well it doesnt mather because for some reason he STILL is slower than i am and i manage to gain distance until the "slipstream" is broken.

So issue #2 is like there was no physics over the wind whatsoever because there is no slipstream for the AI and im not even sure there is slipstream at all because when im catching up some other driver i dont find a noticeable difference between the speed that i have when getting closer than the speed that i get when being on the tail of other car "slipstreaming"


So...

Sooo.....

I really find the Ai slower and im thinking the slipstream doesnt exist in this game

I think they're slow because they suffer from poor setup iirc

Bealdor
26-08-2015, 07:59
Are you using custom setups with reduced DF? If yes, that's where your advantage comes from.
They're using a standard setup and not a low DF setup. Additionally their gearing is most likely an issue on this long straight at Nords.

The AI does use slipstream.

Read here (http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?23553-The-AI-discussion-%28all-platforms%29&p=1000474&viewfull=1#post1000474) and here (http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?23553-The-AI-discussion-%28all-platforms%29&p=1000495&viewfull=1#post1000495).

But i agree that 100% AI is still too slow in general and I'd also like to see a 110% or 120% setting.

Angst1974
26-08-2015, 11:24
I wonder what would happen for we could tune the AI cars, or allow the AI to match our tune .

I don't even know if the engine would handle it, much like the AI tires are simplified.

pigsy
26-08-2015, 11:59
Yes they have less hp than the player car if your running a turbocharged car. Just go and monitor the telemetry for both the player and AI and you'll see the player has more horsepower. Here's a post I made about it http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?36640-Ruf-CTR3-too-much-power-compared-to-AI

Nats
26-08-2015, 12:45
I honestly dont know why people are saying the AI is slow. I play the Clio Cup and for me the AI is pretty much level with me at 60%. I can just about catch them on some corners around Brands Hatch, Oulton and Donnington but they are too fast for me around Silverstone's International GT track. And on the straights they are pretty much level unless I get a good corner exit or slipstream (in which case I catch them very slightly). This is all on PC. I havent tried many of the other cars in races so cant comment on those but generally, so far, the AI seems perfect for me.

Mind you I don't spend ages tuning my setups and I am not a great driver either (although not bad).

For all those saying its slow try the Clio in a race around Oulton or Donnington and then report back.

I really wonder if you guys who think its too slow are playing a different game lol ...

DidNotFinish
26-08-2015, 13:13
I play at 75% and that gives me intense enough races. If you can easily beat 100% AI and that bores you, then the only other thing you can do is MP!

As for the slipstreams ... if you are expecting some GTAV style slipstreaming in PCARS you'll be disappointed. Slipstreaming does give an advantage, but it's often difficult to point out.

DidNotFinish
26-08-2015, 13:17
I honestly dont know why people are saying the AI is slow. I play the Clio Cup and for me the AI is pretty much level with me at 60%. I can just about catch them on some corners around Brands Hatch, Oulton and Donnington but they are too fast for me around Silverstone's International GT track. And on the straights they are pretty much level unless I get a good corner exit or slipstream (in which case I catch them very slightly). This is all on PC. I havent tried many of the other cars in races so cant comment on those but generally, so far, the AI seems perfect for me.

Mind you I don't spend ages tuning my setups and I am not a great driver either (although not bad).

For all those saying its slow try the Clio in a race around Oulton or Donnington and then report back.

I really wonder if you guys who think its too slow are playing a different game lol ...

Well, everyone has a different skill level with the game. I only have about a half hour every other day to play so I can only be so good. Maybe the OP plays everyday for several hours or maybe he's just a racing prodigy, who knows? I do agree though...slow? No way. If you lose your lead in the Clio Cup then you'll be hard pressed to gain it back.

Shadowoff
26-08-2015, 22:13
Do you use a custom setup?

Shadowoff
26-08-2015, 22:16
And I have to say: The AI is rly too slow... I win in Monza in Z4 with NO custom setup :/
Can SMS pls make AI lvl 120 or something like this :D

Knightfall
26-08-2015, 22:33
Are you using custom setups with reduced DF? If yes, that's where your advantage comes from.
They're using a standard setup and not a low DF setup. Additionally their gearing is most likely an issue on this long straight at Nords.

The AI does use slipstream.

Read here (http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?23553-The-AI-discussion-%28all-platforms%29&p=1000474&viewfull=1#post1000474) and here (http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?23553-The-AI-discussion-%28all-platforms%29&p=1000495&viewfull=1#post1000495).

But i agree that 100% AI is still too slow in general and I'd also like to see a 110% or 120% setting.

I am so happy to read your suggestion. Please don't make the current AI levels harder. Us non-heros are actually getting better at driving in this game by progressing through the 70-90s... Raise max, don't adjust current slider.

ibby
26-08-2015, 22:45
They could make them have more power or more grip easily.
Instead they decided to make them as realistic as possible grip/power wise vs us with default setups.
Seems like a good decision to me.
Yes it could be better, if they got more realistic tyre heating, rain speed were perfectly matched etc.

Imho it's a good idea to not have 110% 120%. Mainly because:

They are actually too fast in some corners but too slow in others. Imho it's more important to make them take every corner optimally first before thinking about letting them 'cheat'.
I like the idea of having 100% as 100% realistic.
What i'd maybe do is have them accept custom setups from alien drivers and see how they fare with them.
Then we can have a 100% default setup and a 100% pro setup option.

fa-racing
26-08-2015, 22:58
They could make them have more power or more grip easily.
Instead they decided to make them as realistic as possible grip/power wise vs us with default setups.
Seems like a good decision to me.
Yes it could be better, if they got more realistic tyre heating, rain speed were perfectly matched etc.

Imho it's a good idea to not have 110% 120%. Mainly because:

They are actually too fast in some corners but too slow in others. Imho it's more important to make them take every corner optimally first before thinking about letting them 'cheat'.
I like the idea of having 100% as 100% realistic.
What i'd maybe do is have them accept custom setups from alien drivers and see how they fare with them.
Then we can have a 100% default setup and a 100% pro setup option.

With this 100% real racing speeds to their real life counter parts, in the 2011 f1 grand Prix at monza the lap times they were doing were, 1.26ish which is what this game makes the f1 cars go at in a 100% AI race.

What is slightly disappointing is that I average 1.20-1.21 around monza so my race against the ai is very boring. So it would be nice to see faster AI.

ibby
26-08-2015, 23:05
With this 100% real racing speeds to their real life counter parts, in the 2011 f1 grand Prix at monza the lap times they were doing were, 1.26ish which is what this game makes the f1 cars go at in a 100% AI race.

What is slightly disappointing is that I average 1.20-1.21 around monza so my race against the ai is very boring. So it would be nice to see faster AI.

The fastest default setup time on the leaderboard is 1:24.750.
That is with assists though. The fastest without assists is 1:26.272 on the PC.
So you are using a custom setup with low wings ?
Of course it's gonna be easy. Try beating them with default set and no assists. :)

Arthelm
26-08-2015, 23:15
He is, he is a hero :)

http://images.amcnetworks.com/bbcamerica.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/55/files/2011/12/stig2.jpg


Are you using custom setups with reduced DF? If yes, that's where your advantage comes from.
They're using a standard setup and not a low DF setup. Additionally their gearing is most likely an issue on this long straight at Nords.

I dont use custom set ups, i almost only mess up with the tire pressures because in some tracks i can't for the life of me take them into temperature. Aside of that when in rain i decrease the wheel spin to maintain control. That's it. So i really dont think it has to be about the downforce.


Well, everyone has a different skill level with the game. I only have about a half hour every other day to play so I can only be so good. Maybe the OP plays everyday for several hours or maybe he's just a racing prodigy, who knows? I do agree though...slow? No way. If you lose your lead in the Clio Cup then you'll be hard pressed to gain it back.

I don't play much maybe 4 hours a week if so. About the racing prodigy, well i have played Top Gear Rally and F1 world grand Prix in my N64 when i was a kid and some other race video games like F1 2005 and some other in my PS2 but they are all arcadish so i dont think they count for "racing training" heh


Aside of the responses i realized there is another issue i have "discovered".

The racing lines of the AI are not that good. For example and mainly in the high and medium speed corners they go in a line that makes me catch up on them fairly easily taking the corner a little more tight, about 0.300 to 1,000 is what i end up gaining of them depeding of wich corner. For example in the corner of Riches in Snetterton, a high speed corner that the AI usually brakes when going in, thing that i dont do; i usually just get the foot off the gas or if im going way too fast i brake a little bit so i can take the corner properly and BAAM! like 1 sec of recovery over the guy in front

nhitrac
26-08-2015, 23:31
With this 100% real racing speeds to their real life counter parts, in the 2011 f1 grand Prix at monza the lap times they were doing were, 1.26ish which is what this game makes the f1 cars go at in a 100% AI race.

What is slightly disappointing is that I average 1.20-1.21 around monza so my race against the ai is very boring. So it would be nice to see faster AI.

Isnt that the problem though? We're driving beyond the limit of what the pros can do in real life?

I've always been concious with this point and have made an effort to not blast around a track in an unrealistic way. I.e. I don't want to be setting unrealistic lap times and drive in a way that not even pros would do in real life.

I don't agree that AI should be setting faster lap times than what can be done in RL however.

Roger Prynne
26-08-2015, 23:56
If you find you are beating the AI so easily then why not de-tune your cars to make it an even race, it would still be a challenge.

fa-racing
27-08-2015, 10:22
If you find you are beating the AI so easily then why not de-tune your cars to make it an even race, it would still be a challenge.
I was thinking of doing this, however if I were to detune my car it would alter my racing line, which is not ideal if you're bouncing between ai and online. As for op, maybe if he doesn't use online this would be a good suggestion for him.

rams1de
27-08-2015, 13:45
Aside of the responses i realized there is another issue i have "discovered".

The racing lines of the AI are not that good. For example and mainly in the high and medium speed corners they go in a line that makes me catch up on them fairly easily taking the corner a little more tight, about 0.300 to 1,000 is what i end up gaining of them depeding of wich corner. For example in the corner of Riches in Snetterton, a high speed corner that the AI usually brakes when going in, thing that i dont do; i usually just get the foot off the gas or if im going way too fast i brake a little bit so i can take the corner properly and BAAM! like 1 sec of recovery over the guy in front

Yes, it's common for the AI to slow or brake unnecessarily at a number of tracks, Hawthorn at Brands Hatch and the Old Hair Pin at Donnington are two such examples.

They also go too deep into many corners giving them a slow exit (if you avoid being rear ended) which makes them slower on the following straights. Considering pigsy's discovery that they are also rev limited, I'm feeling quite inadequate right now for some reason.