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BuToNz
12-10-2015, 16:34
Having ran quite a few races now, I find it becoming fairly easy to get lost in the game. Concentrating so hard that you actually feel like you could be there. No HUD, helmet cam, headphones on, FOV set correct. You are there, your heart races.

I often slip into this zone very briefly but then - sucked back into reality by various in game distractions. My main 'immersion breakers' are: The microstutters between me and the AI when close, rapid on/off braking from AI (Lights flicker), no lights on while in 'poor' weather conditions.

So the question is...What would you change/add/fix to keep you 'in the zone'. What makes or breaks your 'beyond reality' experience?

What do you change/tweak to overcome these 'immersion breakers'?

Machinist90
12-10-2015, 16:40
empty pitlanes kill it for me

Umer Ahmad
12-10-2015, 16:53
For me it's that last bit of human-ness missing from our AI. Sometimes you can tell you're racing a robot.

Then again i can DEFINITELY tell that sometimes i am racing stupid humans ;)

Schumi-
12-10-2015, 16:59
My main 'immersion breakers' are: The microstutters between me and the AI when close,

Try upping the Jitter Tweak in graphics settings for that problem, i had the same, i upped mine to 6, and now the jitters are no more. Thanks to @RogerPrynne for that one.

Cheesenium
12-10-2015, 17:09
The microstutters between me and the AI when close, rapid on/off braking from AI (Lights flicker), no lights on while in 'poor' weather conditions.


These are my major bugbears too.

The lack of lights in poor weather condition is quite inconvenient though, I had trouble determining whether there are 2-3 cars in front of me with the enhanced water spray that looks incredible. It is also harder to gauge the distance because there isnt any lights unless the AI brakes.

I am still hoping for a toggle that could just force the AI to turn on the lights in poor weather on PC, despite there will be performance losses.

Pink_650S
12-10-2015, 17:13
l wont even start.

Nelson Pacheco
12-10-2015, 17:21
made a quick search on youtube...
one example:
https://youtu.be/IfwrTUESE0M?t=26s

Cholton82
12-10-2015, 17:23
The bloody postman with a parcel for next door because they're out !

J4M35_R
12-10-2015, 18:18
I love the racing in this game however it has its flaws in my opinion. Here is my bucket list of things that i would like fixed to make the game perfect.

1 The flag system is very poor.
2 Animated pit stops and lack of pit crew.
3 The track drying within 2 laps and no drying race line.
4 The new rain effects on the windscreen are distracting and they don't look realistic.
5 Static steering wheels. Please give us the option to switch them off.

Hopefully not to much to ask for. ;)

Cholton82
12-10-2015, 18:22
I love the racing in this game however it has its flaws in my opinion. Here is my bucket list of things that i would like fixed to make the game perfect.

1 The flag system is very poor.
2 Animated pit stops and lack of pit crew.
3 The track drying within 2 laps and no drying race line.
4 The new rain effects on the windscreen are distracting and they don't look realistic.
5 Static steering wheels. Please give us the option to switch them off.

Hopefully not to much to ask for. ;)

The Flag system is non existent full stop !

JupiterJoe
12-10-2015, 18:27
Your own sector times for the last completed lap don't show-up once you return to the garage.

Yep, as the video link above graphically illustrates, the grid starts are still a cluster f***. All things considered though, Project Cars is the best racing game the world has ever seen. It's so good it actually feels like it's from the future.

artao
12-10-2015, 18:56
Lack of manual control in pits, and un-realistic pit times -- particularly instant damage fixing

John Hargreaves
12-10-2015, 19:58
Lack of manual control in pits, and un-realistic pit times -- particularly instant damage fixing

Yeah, it would be nice to have the 2-3sec pit stops in the FA, adds to the drama.

Invincible
12-10-2015, 20:01
#1 My cat jumping on my lap, begging to be petted during a race.
#2 My girlfriend asking what's for dinner and questioning me about my day
#3 Me, crashing and not dying from hitting a wall at 150 mph.
#4 Actual game-related immersion breakers.

Robhd
12-10-2015, 20:10
The only one i have really noticed is finishing a race, glancing out of the window and realising.. No i don't seem to actually own a Pagani...

This would be a really straight forward fix if The Wookie would just be so kind as to send me that Pagani?

Invincible
12-10-2015, 20:14
The only one i have really noticed is finishing a race, glancing out of the window and realising.. No i don't seem to actually own a Pagani...

This would be a really straight forward fix if The Wookie would just be so kind as to send me that Pagani?

Nah, when you get one, everyone wants one. And for that, the game wasn't expensive enough. :p

SUBGTRACER
12-10-2015, 20:56
1 . Flag rules fixed ........ as said above , they just don't work "pointless really "
2. Would love to see pit crews as said above the pits are dead .
3. Better damage effects and harsher damage as it seems like its dumbed down " hardcore mode"

As for Ai with lights , I was running a race last night as fog started to lay over the track and I was pleasantly surprised to see the Ai start turning there lights on , not all but some of them.

VanquishedVantage
12-10-2015, 20:59
My "immersion breakers" are when you realize you're playing a sim after an hour or so of playing and when my girlfriend walks into the room I'm playing in.

Shinzah
12-10-2015, 21:02
The lack of Monaco grid boys!

VanquishedVantage
12-10-2015, 21:02
The lack of Monaco grid boys!

Grid boys?
In Monaco?
Wot.

Shinzah
12-10-2015, 21:04
Grid boys?
In Monaco?
Wot.

http://f.blick.ch/img/incoming/origs3791938/6105562754-w644-h429/027976567.jpg
Aren't they adorable? ^^;

VanquishedVantage
12-10-2015, 21:05
http://f.blick.ch/img/incoming/origs3791938/6105562754-w644-h429/027976567.jpg
Aren't they adorable? ^^;

My girlfriend would think so.

Shinzah
12-10-2015, 21:06
I guess you have poor taste in men ^^;

VanquishedVantage
12-10-2015, 21:06
I guess you have poor taste in men ^^;

Probably because I AM a man...

Shinzah
12-10-2015, 21:07
Probably because I AM a man...

And? This stops you from recognizing the beauty of others somehow because of what reason exactly...?

VanquishedVantage
12-10-2015, 21:09
And? This stops you from recognizing the beauty of others somehow because of what reason exactly...?

Ugh, I hate it when people ask questions that are hard as hell to explain...
I have my own beauty tastes, ok?
Now back on topic.

Is it bad that I play with the volume on my PC at max and I don't wear a headset?

Shinzah
12-10-2015, 21:15
Ugh, I hate it when people ask questions that are hard as hell to explain...
I have my own beauty tastes, ok?
Now back on topic.

Is it bad that I play with the volume on my PC at max and I don't wear a headset?

Oh it's not hard to explain at all.
You don't like to recognize the beauty in nice looking men because the social pressure of the society you are in effectively curved your personal ideologue by teaching that you shouldn't do it because it is somehow wrong.


It's perfectly okay to be a sheep in a herd of sheep, as long as you know that you are a sheep.


I have my own beauty tastes too. I like Red Headed women whom are tall and have fair but pale skin. ^^'

But I'm not going to shy away from someone who is fairly nice looking, regardless of whom they are. I find that ridiculous.

If you can call a baby adorable or cute, but you can't call another guy adorable or cute there's a large dissonance there. ^^;

It's not like you want to throw them down and screw their brains out or anything. They're just adorable.

Well I mean, the guy on the right, maybe...

Vennt
12-10-2015, 21:15
What set of Blue Flag rules do you want them to be fixed to?

They are different for most series, some are informational only (no penalties), some have minor penalties that are never acted on ("Infractions are reported to Clerk of the Course, who usually bins them"), different series have different rules for who gets a blue flag and which session types they are used in.

Even the few series that do penalise for ignoring it have different measures of compliance, do you need to comply "in a reasonable time"? or "in 3 corners, max"?

Are you saying all series should have a different ruleset for blue flags based on the real world rules of the closest series to the ingame one, or just one ruleset that covers the majority of motorsports?

Because if the answer to that is the latter, let me tell you something, they already have the most common ruleset already working in the game. :P

(Source: I come from a family of Marshalls, all of whom have marshalled various series at Donington Park, their comment on Blue Flags? - "Wave it, then just fuggetabootit!" :P)

Shinzah
12-10-2015, 21:17
(Source: I come from a family of Marshalls, all of whom have marshalled various series at Donington Park, their comment on Blue Flags? - "Wave it, then just fuggetabootit!" :P)

The Marshall Mafia...?

VanquishedVantage
12-10-2015, 21:17
Oh it's not hard to explain at all.
You don't like to recognize the beauty in nice looking men because the social pressure of the society you are in effectively curved your personal ideologue by teaching that you shouldn't do it because it is somehow wrong.


It's perfectly okay to be a sheep in a herd of sheep, as long as you know that you are a sheep.


I have my own beauty tastes too. I like Red Headed women whom are tall and have fair but pale skin. ^^'

But I'm not going to shy away from someone who is fairly nice looking, regardless of whom they are. I find that ridiculous.

If you can call a baby adorable or cute, but you can't call another guy adorable or cute there's a large dissonance there. ^^;

It's not like you want to throw them down and screw their brains out or anything. They're just adorable.

Well I mean, the guy on the right, maybe...
That pose man...

VanquishedVantage
12-10-2015, 21:18
The Marshall Mafia...?
The next generation in gangs.

Shinzah
12-10-2015, 21:20
"Make him an offer he can't refuse."
"What if he refuses?"
"Black Flag him."
https://media.giphy.com/media/MT8oDPnGQh8Oc/giphy.gif

Flihp
12-10-2015, 21:48
My wife or son walking or talking behind me and I can't see them in rear vision mirror. Freaking out a few laps into the race because I realised I'm not wearing a seatbelt, and as mentioned above, my cat wanting attention or deciding to chew my headset cord during race. Also had her playing hide and seek behind my pedals, enough to ruin a good run.

VanquishedVantage
12-10-2015, 22:14
My wife or son walking or talking behind me and I can't see them in rear vision mirror. Freaking out a few laps into the race because I realised I'm not wearing a seatbelt, and as mentioned above, my cat wanting attention or deciding to chew my headset cord during race. Also had her playing hide and seek behind my pedals, enough to ruin a good run.

My girlfriend walks into my room every 5 minutes.
I feel you, bro.

chig88
12-10-2015, 22:42
The 5/10 second rev limiter penalties in multiplayer. Totally immersion breaking.

Wouldn't even mind if they were only given out if you've gained a big advantage, but getting them when you've run deep into a corner & already lost time is adding insult to injury. Not to mention the random ones when you haven't left the track :(.

ElectricBlues85
12-10-2015, 22:59
For me, the deal breaker is that it's (apparently) not OK to piss myself mid endurance race.

BullWinkle
12-10-2015, 23:17
No fuzzy dice hanging from the rearview mirror in the 1966 Ford Mustang. Makes it totally undrivable and an immersion killer.:D

SUBGTRACER
12-10-2015, 23:19
When the dog barks :( ........... I would never hear a dog barking driving at 250k around Bathurst in a thumping v8

N0body Of The Goat
13-10-2015, 05:15
The variable time "go slow" penalties, instead of a post-race addition of time, or a pit lane penalty (stop 'n' go, drive through).

"Dead cars" on the multiplayer grid (I would like to see everyone have to press a "drive" button within say ~30 seconds to place their car on the starting grid).

Better implementation of blue flag rules, both in the race, but also in qualifying (if I'm on an out lap and you are on a flying lap, I should have to get out of your way if you are approaching me, also if I am preventing you from going at your race pace I should have to give way or get a grid penalty).

Rolling starts, especially online.

Time Trial / Events times being able to be set with artificial settings (non-real TC/ABS/SC are supposed to be fixed now, 0 camber exploit coming SMSsoon, but what about damage/mechanical damage "of" and alike?).

Eeek, time for work!

hkraft300
13-10-2015, 10:00
The girlfriends... They just don't get it, do they?
My wife likes to ask me in the first few laps of a long race if I'd like tea or something to eat. Never before the race starts.
Racers don't eat While driving damn it...

Invincible
13-10-2015, 10:02
The girlfriends... They just don't get it, do they?
My wife likes to ask me in the first few laps of a long race if I'd like tea or something to eat. Never before the race starts.
Racers don't eat While driving damn it...

Although my girlfriend does sometimes silently places a glass of water or juice on my table during a longer race. I appreciate that :D

VanquishedVantage
13-10-2015, 10:52
Although my girlfriend does sometimes silently places a glass of water or juice on my table during a longer race. I appreciate that :D

For some reason I hate drinking water or juice when I'm in the middle of a 24 hour race.

VanquishedVantage
13-10-2015, 10:52
The girlfriends... They just don't get it, do they?
My wife likes to ask me in the first few laps of a long race if I'd like tea or something to eat. Never before the race starts.
Racers don't eat While driving damn it...

At least my girlfriend doesn't bother me during 24 hour races. :p

WeirdoLogic
13-10-2015, 11:03
Although my girlfriend does sometimes silently places a glass of water or juice on my table during a longer race. I appreciate that :D

Marry her NOW! ;)

cluck
13-10-2015, 11:06
I wear a Rift for racing and the main thing that breaks immersion for me is when I lift my arm up to look at the time on my watch :D. Why doesn't the driver do that in the game. Please fix this SMS - paying careful attention to the brand of watch I wear and the exact time my watch shows, not the time on my PC - it is ruining my racing :mad:

(warning : this post may contain traces of sarcasm. If you are allergic to sarcasm, or have no sense of humour, then please seek assistance immediately)

VanquishedVantage
13-10-2015, 11:09
Marry her NOW! ;)

What if she's a Bridezilla...?

VanquishedVantage
13-10-2015, 11:10
I wear a Rift for racing and the main thing that breaks immersion for me is when I lift my arm up to look at the time on my watch :D. Why doesn't the driver do that in the game. Please fix this SMS - paying careful attention to the brand of watch I wear and the exact time my watch shows, not the time on my PC - it is ruining my racing :mad:

(warning : this post may contain traces of sarcasm. If you are allergic to sarcasm, or have no sense of humour, then please seek assistance immediately)

What brand is your watch anyway? :p

cluck
13-10-2015, 11:14
What brand is your watch anyway? :pnot a Rolex :)

VanquishedVantage
13-10-2015, 11:17
not a Rolex :)

I see you there, you little small text, you...

Ralph B
13-10-2015, 11:19
The biggest immersion killers of pCars are the strange revlimiter penalties - mostly in situations where they get you and other cars arround you in trouble. Like others I'd really whished annother solution like adding a penalty-time to the race result, a stop and go or drive through penalty. Theoretical ... as at this point we are at the second immersion killer: the horrible autopit function, that cannot switched off! Nowhere in reality a computer takes control over the car when pitting. As a fan of vintage cars and racing it's a no go for me. And a third one is the cockpit exposure of some cars. It's not really fun, to have the best looking racegame currently availabel, when the nice details of the car and track go under in everlasting gloominess.

Bkim
13-10-2015, 11:31
The good: graphics
The bad:
- AI is aggressive in a very wrong way. They don't hold back
- No headlights during bad weather
- pitstops are still a drama (pitbox is occupied)
- AI still banging pitwalls
- AI racing lines (every track has this major slow corner)
- No proper flag system(!)
- No safety car (Booooh)
- I would like to choose the AI cars myself in a multirace
- AI defends when lapped, ignoring blue flag
- Setting up Steering wheel FFB takes hours to tweak with the ridiculous amount of settings.

Back to rFactor 2. Rather having full options within a race with less graohics than visa versa. Setting up race wheel within 10 sec.

Invincible
13-10-2015, 11:33
Marry her NOW! ;)

That's the plan! :D



- pitstops are still a drama (pitbox is occupied)


Your fault if you don't call them. Never had an occupied box when I called my stops.

VanquishedVantage
13-10-2015, 11:38
That's the plan! :D



Your fault if you don't call them. Never had an occupied box when I called my stops.
Safety Car, box, box, box!

pigsy
13-10-2015, 11:46
Unrealistic crash physics
Inability of AI to spin out
Unrealistic damage system. Visually and physically. Cars are too tough.
Short length of time you sit on the gridline before the green light.
Engineer saying stupid irrelevant things. eg (leading race by 10+ seconds on last lap and he asks you to stretch the lead to 2nd.)
No flag rules.

VanquishedVantage
13-10-2015, 11:51
Unrealistic crash physics
Inability of AI to spin out
Unrealistic damage system. Visually and physically. Cars are too tough.
Short length of time you sit on the gridline before the green light.
Engineer saying stupid irrelevant things. eg (leading race by 10+ seconds on last lap and he asks you to stretch the lead to 2nd.)
No flag rules.
We should have a real person doing the engineer's role in online races...

cluck
13-10-2015, 12:15
Unrealistic crash physics
Inability of AI to spin out
Unrealistic damage system. Visually and physically. Cars are too tough.
Short length of time you sit on the gridline before the green light.
Engineer saying stupid irrelevant things. eg (leading race by 10+ seconds on last lap and he asks you to stretch the lead to 2nd.)
No flag rules.Run a race at Willow Springs with the Aston Lola DBR1-2 - I saw multiple spins, loss of control and running wide by the AI (set to 80 strength) in a short race I did there :).

F2kSel
13-10-2015, 12:23
For me it's the sticky collision physics, what should be a minor exchange of paint results in a major off.

chrisracer
13-10-2015, 12:44
What kills it for me? When I choose to run a mixed field at Le Mans (or any other track) and I'm racing my LMP car against a Bac Mono or some other car that just doesn't belong there. Or even just picking similar cars. When I spen five or six laps catching the leaders in a race only to find out that the race leader is a twenty year old (Sauber) Group C car in a field of LMP cars.

We really do need (an Ian I know you don't like the "need" word) a way to choose which cars are in the field. We should be able to have a "mixed field" meaning LMP's and GT's in the same race. Oh and they should be from the same era.

Ian, this was asked for three years ago during game development, I know because I asked for it several times.

FLX81
13-10-2015, 13:00
^ So much this. And get the bloody GT4s out of my way when I m lapping them with my P30 in P1. :mad:

Shepard2603
13-10-2015, 13:30
My girlfriend walks into my room every 5 minutes.
I feel you, bro.

It's called porn patrol!

For me, it's mainly the AI. They are way to robotic, and glued to the racing line. And also when going offroad, they are not penalized with severe slowdown as the player. I know this is related to other/looser physics applied to AI, but nevertheless it bothers me a lot. However, MP sessions are really great, at least when the crash kids stay out.

Shinzah
13-10-2015, 13:34
I could never have a girlfriend who wasn't into racing or didn't understand my racing video games addiction :|

I guess this is why I will be single forever :\

http://i.imgur.com/frgOnVX.jpg

Invincible
13-10-2015, 13:40
You don't need a GF who is into racing games. Mine isn't into them too. But, she is into gaming. And that's the important point - even if she doesn't share your enthusiasm for racing games, she will be able to understand it.

My GF for example is nearly addicted to Diablo 3... So, when I race, she's slashing some monsters on her PS4.

Shinzah
13-10-2015, 13:44
You don't need a GF who is into racing games. Mine isn't into them too. But, she is into gaming. And that's the important point - even if she doesn't share your enthusiasm for racing games, she will be able to understand it.

My GF for example is nearly addicted to Diablo 3... So, when I race, she's slashing some monsters on her PS4.

I need one who is in to or actively involved in racing though, even if she wouldn't play racing games. My entire life revolves around race cars. I'm probably slightly autistic. I stay up for 24-25 hour endurance races and make lap charts/pitstop charts/conditions notes ect.

...I have been called slightly insane by other fans of racing. I don't think any woman who can't understand this passion would survive very long. (and none have. Though it's mostly been because ******* aint **** but **** and tricks :| )

Invincible
13-10-2015, 14:35
I need one who is in to or actively involved in racing though, even if she wouldn't play racing games. My entire life revolves around race cars. I'm probably slightly autistic. I stay up for 24-25 hour endurance races and make lap charts/pitstop charts/conditions notes ect.

...I have been called slightly insane by other fans of racing. I don't think any woman who can't understand this passion would survive very long. (and none have. Though it's mostly been because ******* aint **** but **** and tricks :| )

[...]


I like you :D

Don't get me wrong - I just like over-passionate people

BigAlex
13-10-2015, 14:39
The lack of a drying line transitioning from wet to dry is no go for me. As a simulator, this very frequent condition should have been adressed and would give the game a much better realism.

mr_belowski
13-10-2015, 14:53
For me it's the pit box being occupied when I pit. Yes, I called them. Yes, it's still occupied. I only see the "pit box occupied" *after* I've entered the pit lane.

I also find the AI's habit of taking over and ramming you into stuff when you pit to be rather immersion breaking. Especially at a track like Brands where it'll merrily smash into stuff on the entry, then give you the "pit occupied" warning, then blast through the pit lane way over the speed limit ghosting through the other cars (no penalty though), smash into stuff at the end, then stop dead for a second before giving you back control. It's not as severe since 5.0 but it's still not right.

I also find the built in race engineer to be worse than useless. So I made a better one who is super awesome :)

Despite the problems, working on my add-on has encouraged me to play much more PCars (I was and still am a big RaceRoom fan). It's actually really quite good (GT4 Ginettas rule) and *is* getting better with each patch, even if stuff does get broken from time to time

Schnizz58
13-10-2015, 14:57
Out-dueling an AI car only have him invoke the hovercar feature, float over a sausage kerb and cut a corner to get back in front.

N0body Of The Goat
13-10-2015, 15:55
Few more I thought of during the day...

The time and weather sequence resetting at the start of each new session (these both appear to be acknowledged now as a new bug, rather than a feature change to what was always intended as regards time).

After raining, the wetness/slipperiness of the track seems to improve far too quickly.

Some car classes (Formula A; Formula B; GT3; LMP; others?) appear to have "Intermediate" tyres that have no optimum weather conditions in which they are the tyre to be on. I've yet to knowingly ever see inters be fitted to any car by "automatic by weather" tyre selection. I'd like to see inters be the tyre to be on during at least "light rain" and the following ~10mins (real time) of racing after the rain stops, but the track is still wet.

Maybe it is just my PC showing its age, but "medium" settings regularly give me pop-up graphical changes/improvements for track details (barriers; trees; non-racing vehicles just off track; road signs etc.) and the actual racing cars (front wheels vanishing for a split second, the front ~66% of car shells vanishing for a split second etc.) as their distance to my car changes.

AI cars deciding the race aggressively by going off-track to pass eg. taking to the grass section to try and overtake up Spa's Eau Rouge, cutting inside Les Combes etc.

The "steering ratio" bug(s).

Further parity improvement of AMD graphics card performance compared to what should be their Nvidia equivalent eg. AMD R9 390 usually outshines an Nvidia 970.

DirectX12 in pCARS1?

VanquishedVantage
13-10-2015, 17:23
You don't need a GF who is into racing games. Mine isn't into them too. But, she is into gaming. And that's the important point - even if she doesn't share your enthusiasm for racing games, she will be able to understand it.

My GF for example is nearly addicted to Diablo 3... So, when I race, she's slashing some monsters on her PS4.

My GF is actually pretty damn good at Project CARS, really.

Sergi01978
13-10-2015, 18:18
I had the evening planned.Few cold ones in the fridge, controller charged and the Wife out for a couple of hours. :D

Then her friend cancelled their fitness class and she's taken over the TV :miserable:

Now that's immersion breaking!

ex_
13-10-2015, 18:25
good thread. simple for me. lack of true 3D surround support. If an engine sounds great but then comes from the incorrect direction, that definitely kills some of the immersion.

The difficulty of being able to jump in a car and have it feel good on your wheel without tweaking the car, still really hinders my use of the game. I'd jump on and drive a lot more often if I could just get in and go...

EliteK29
13-10-2015, 18:25
AI not giving enough room all the damn time.

Shinzah
13-10-2015, 18:35
If I see another wife/girlfriend post in here, imma hurt someone ;-;

https://media.giphy.com/media/46itMIe0bkQeY/giphy.gif

Sergi01978
13-10-2015, 18:50
If I see another wife/girlfriend post in here, imma hurt someone ;-;

https://media.giphy.com/media/46itMIe0bkQeY/giphy.gif

If you hurt me, she's gonna hurt you more:boxing:

Shinzah
13-10-2015, 18:53
If you hurt me, she's gonna hurt you more:boxing:

*checks location*

Bristol :|

I believe it :|

Sergi01978
13-10-2015, 18:57
She might fly a jet plane!

Sorry I'm just being silly. ...She is a pretty good swimmer though.

Shinzah
13-10-2015, 18:58
She might fly a jet plane!

Sorry I'm just being silly. ...She is a pretty good swimmer though.

https://media.giphy.com/media/xTiTnrXms89HECwatO/giphy.gif

flybikes
13-10-2015, 19:27
The lack of position lights on the prototypes kill the immersion for me!

Haiden
13-10-2015, 20:34
AI's excessive corner cutting, especially when they do it to maintain position, instead of just falling back. Not only would they not do that IRL, but they wouldn't get to keep the position if they did. It's really aggravating to pull off a nice clean overtake, only to see the same car you just outwitted come barreling back into view, kicking up dirt and fishtailing back onto the track.

ex_
13-10-2015, 20:34
For me, the deal breaker is that it's (apparently) not OK to piss myself mid endurance race.

and people want faster pit-stops...:confused:

pigsy
13-10-2015, 22:33
Run a race at Willow Springs with the Aston Lola DBR1-2 - I saw multiple spins, loss of control and running wide by the AI (set to 80 strength) in a short race I did there :).

I'd like to see video evidence of this Cluck. Loss of control is usually a car understeering off the track and maybe hitting a barrier. But when they slide off they never lose the rear end. The whole car just slides sideways with way to much grip. Crash, loss of control physics looks very unrealistic and is a real immersion killer imo.

pigsy
13-10-2015, 22:40
I'll add one more. My suspension damage was fixed in 1 second flat.

pigsy
13-10-2015, 22:50
I'll just put this out there it's a bit off topic, but I'd rather say it here than start a new one.
With Assetto Cora's ability to setup a Custom Championship (albeit with a 3rd party addon). Their extra cars and tracks with the newest DLC. You can have about 9 different GT3 car makes now. Incredible sound (best in class imo) Improved AI. Excellent timing and replay system. Pretty good physics. Real road implementation with persistent skids. It's looking like a genuine alternative as an offline simulator.

FIA
13-10-2015, 23:08
the one thing missing in pcars is create your own championship
this mode would be the best thing to keep you playing all night long.

pick your weather, laps, grid size, time of day, how many races and tracks of your choosing, pit stop or no stops
this mode would be the icing on the cake, and maybe the best mode ever added...(if ever added)

hkraft300
13-10-2015, 23:47
Empty pit lanes and garages. How about some toolboxes and equipment in the garage, some mechanics/marshals (the assets are already in game) going about their business looking rather useless :)
The track side marshals and a few "spectator" figures along the pit lane looking important... The pit guy with the trolley/Jack thing you could have a few more of them standing around with maybe a trolley full of wheels... Just a bit more atmosphere, sense of occasion, you know?
Not so much an immersion killer but it'd add to immersion even if/before animated pit crews are implemented.

Race days are looking like closed test sessions in the pits. A little sparse at the moment.

SUBGTRACER
14-10-2015, 00:24
Empty pit lanes and garages. How about some toolboxes and equipment in the garage, some mechanics/marshals (the assets are already in game) going about their business looking rather useless :)
The track side marshals and a few "spectator" figures along the pit lane looking important... The pit guy with the trolley/Jack thing you could have a few more of them standing around with maybe a trolley full of wheels... Just a bit more atmosphere, sense of occasion, you know?
Not so much an immersion killer but it'd add to immersion even if/before animated pit crews are implemented.

Race days are looking like closed test sessions in the pits. A little sparse at the moment.

+ 100

chig88
14-10-2015, 15:15
Empty pit lanes and garages. How about some toolboxes and equipment in the garage, some mechanics/marshals (the assets are already in game) going about their business looking rather useless :)
The track side marshals and a few "spectator" figures along the pit lane looking important... The pit guy with the trolley/Jack thing you could have a few more of them standing around with maybe a trolley full of wheels... Just a bit more atmosphere, sense of occasion, you know?
Not so much an immersion killer but it'd add to immersion even if/before animated pit crews are implemented.

Race days are looking like closed test sessions in the pits. A little sparse at the moment.

Suggested that months ago & it got some traction but ended up falling by the wayside. Honestly don't understand the clamour for working pit crews - just having the pitlane looking a bit more populated would suffice.

Even if working pitcrews do arrive you'd either miss most of what they were doing due to your chosen camera settings, or the novelty would wear off in 5 seconds flat. I also fear it will introduce more bugs so it's probably not going to be worth it.

Schnizz58
14-10-2015, 15:26
Suggested that months ago & it got some traction but ended up falling by the wayside. Honestly don't understand the clamour for working pit crews - just having the pitlane looking a bit more populated would suffice.

Even if working pitcrews do arrive you'd either miss most of what they were doing due to your chosen camera settings, or the novelty would wear off in 5 seconds flat. I also fear it will introduce more bugs so it's probably not going to be worth it.
It seems like a few things have been added in some of the patches but maybe it's just my imagination. Still pretty bare so I totally agree with you and hkraft.

cluck
14-10-2015, 16:12
I'd like to see video evidence of this Cluck. Loss of control is usually a car understeering off the track and maybe hitting a barrier. But when they slide off they never lose the rear end. The whole car just slides sideways with way to much grip. Crash, loss of control physics looks very unrealistic and is a real immersion killer imo.If it didn't take a week to upload videos, I'd take a video and upload one. But as for what I saw, it's in the tight left-hander, just before the 'Balcony' right turn. I saw multiple (but not all) AI clip the kerb and lose the back end, sliding off to the right of the track. Maybe I have too loose a definition of spinning out :). As for running wide, that was on the final turn - I saw 2 cars run wide in my rear-view mirror, whilst most cars would take the corner OK.

I very rarely run races with the AI though, I mostly spend my time in time trial and multiplayer races with the TGC guys. I was only running that test because somebody reported a problem with laps being locked at 3.

hdh
14-10-2015, 16:15
I would also like to see implementation of real sector timing points. Atm there are two sectors regardless of how long the track is.

Schnizz58
14-10-2015, 16:17
Maybe I have too loose a definition of spinning out :).
That could be. I thought I read where it wasn't possible for the AI to spin completely around.

NebuCD
14-10-2015, 17:47
I'll just put this out there it's a bit off topic, but I'd rather say it here than start a new one.
With Assetto Cora's ability to setup a Custom Championship (albeit with a 3rd party addon). Their extra cars and tracks with the newest DLC. You can have about 9 different GT3 car makes now. Incredible sound (best in class imo) Improved AI. Excellent timing and replay system. Pretty good physics. Real road implementation with persistent skids. It's looking like a genuine alternative as an offline simulator.

Is this ACCG you are on about here, or is there another?

havocc
14-10-2015, 23:18
Not getting disconnected from steam while doing TT would be great

AB_Attack
15-10-2015, 12:04
http://f.blick.ch/img/incoming/origs3791938/6105562754-w644-h429/027976567.jpg
Aren't they adorable? ^^;
What made those guys accept the task of being grid boys anyway? If they are not all gay, then there is something seriously wrong with them. If the dudes were in pit-crew overalls the reaction would've been like "ok, so no gurls, *disappoint*" but now they shoved male models in tight jeans and made hair to look beautiful in front of other hetrosexual men. The people arranging the race are not bright, that's for sure, because there is no good explaination for it. Wanna spark "controversy"? Nobody will learn anything. It is just awkward and will continue to be awkward in the future if continued like this. If F1 in their quest for degenderization wanna use men, then dress them up in something motorsportslike type outfit and it can be accepted for the new bore it is.

Bealdor
15-10-2015, 12:08
What made those guys accept the task of being grid boys anyway? If they are not all gay, then there is something seriously wrong with them.

Maybe they are students and need the money or they want to become models (or they lost a bet ;))? Don't judge them. :)

Invincible
15-10-2015, 12:15
They might even already be models and just being hired to do the job.

Shinzah
15-10-2015, 12:27
What made those guys accept the task of being grid boys anyway? If they are not all gay, then there is something seriously wrong with them. If the dudes were in pit-crew overalls the reaction would've been like "ok, so no gurls, *disappoint*" but now they shoved male models in tight jeans and made hair to look beautiful in front of other hetrosexual men. The people arranging the race are not bright, that's for sure, because there is no good explaination for it. Wanna spark "controversy"? Nobody will learn anything. It is just awkward and will continue to be awkward in the future if continued like this. If F1 in their quest for degenderization wanna use men, then dress them up in something motorsportslike type outfit and it can be accepted for the new bore it is.

This kind of bigotry is exactly why they did it.


They might even already be models and just being hired to do the job.

Afaik. They were, actually ^^;

pigsy
15-10-2015, 12:30
Is this ACCG you are on about here, or is there another?

Yes it is.

AB_Attack
15-10-2015, 12:34
This kind of bigotry is exactly why they did it.
It's not bigotry (unless that is something you call all people not agreeing with you) and handing crap (something you know will not be appreciated) to people with no real goal or hope to change is not needed in this world at all.

Else, please explain the valid goal to me.

Shinzah
15-10-2015, 12:45
It's not bigotry (unless that is something you call all people not agreeing with you) and handing crap (something you know will not be appreciated) to people with no real goal or hope to change is not needed in this world at all.

Else, please explain the valid goal to me.



Else, please explain the valid goal to me.


It's not bigotry and handing crap.


(something you know will not be appreciated) to people with no real goal or hope to change is not needed in this world at all.



(something you know will not be appreciated)



It's not bigotry



handing crap


is not needed in this world at all.


^^;

AB_Attack
15-10-2015, 12:50
^^;

No explaination huh. Cool.

Shinzah
15-10-2015, 12:52
No explaination huh. Cool.

It's there ^^;

I have nothing more to say or prove ^^;

AB_Attack
15-10-2015, 12:54
No need to dig the hole any deeper. I just hope you learned something.

Bealdor
15-10-2015, 12:55
Let's move on please. Take your personal differences to PM please if you must.

Shinzah
15-10-2015, 12:57
No need to dig the hole any deeper. I just hope you learned something.

https://media.giphy.com/media/IMSq59ySKydYQ/giphy.gif

Yep. Sure did. Sure did learn a lot, AB. Sure did.

Keithb23
16-10-2015, 04:17
I have to agree with a lot of the others. The whole pit experience the way it is now is so far from what was intended early in development. We were seeing lots of cool models for the different pit roles, mechanics, timers, engineers, marshals. There were previews and early builds with cool equipment like the overhead hose racks, fueling stations, tools, etc. A lot of promise with some of the pit-stop animations, and then...pffft! All gone. I don't really expect any of it will return for pcars 1, most opinions are leaning to pcars 2. Very sad. With all the different camera options available I was really hoping for some type of first-person mode where we could walk around the car, open doors, look under the hood, approach engineers and interact with them, but alas, not to be. I imagine it's all related to the limited budget. Codemasters does such a great job with their story-driven career modes providing the player with all sorts of animations, cut-scenes, and music that supports an emotional investment in the game. Maybe I'm showing my age here, but I'm afraid the career mode in the game with it's 'Twaddle'-feeds, limited emails, and facebook integration don't do anything for me at all to make me feel immersed in the game. The race beginning and ending is extremely lack-luster as well. If I finish on the podium in a race, then there should be some type of celebration. If people don't want it, it's easy enough to skip it with the 'esc' key, but I think the devs really misjudged how many people enjoy those extra cut-scenes and celebrations.

So enough complaining, what would I do to improve immersion?

1. We need a lot more activity in the pits. There should be people hovering around the cars working, taking parts off, putting parts on, adjusting, and so forth. There needs to be the same amount of activity around all the other cars too. There also needs to be activity around the timing/scoring/engineering booths for each pit. We need people sitting/standing at the booths who look like they are doing something.

2. There needs to be a lot more 'stuff' in the pit area. Tire racks full of tires, tool benches/cabinets, parts disassembled on counters, air tools, rolling carts, and so on. We also need people doing something with this stuff, see #1.

3. We need to offer the player two modes of play, 'Story-mode' and 'Static-mode'. Story mode involves a first-person view-point that allows the player the freedom to walk around the pit area, look at things, and interact with some of the pit 'characters'. The interaction doesn't need to be completely 3d with the audio matching the lip movements (would be nice, though). It can simply be handled with text cues, as in Mass-effect and other 3d interactive games. I would suggest that, like Mass Effect for instance, the game be divided into several different key areas of play that the player can move freely from one to the other. Codemasters F1 series comes to mind as well, but I really like the detail offered in the Mass Effect games. One area would be the team 'office' or headquarters, another would be the pit area or garage, and a third could be the podium/celebration area. Upon starting a career, the player would be taken to the office to sign the contract and then branch off to other areas, a computer or laptop to view emails, or social media. The workshop where the car is being prepped. Here the player could check on the progress of the preparations, get fitted for his seat/belts, make suggestions for setting up the vehicle based on conditions. If it was a lower level of racing it might be a simple tent and trailer. At the race track the player would be in the pit area discussing the current setup, checking on the weather, reviewing lap times of other drivers. When it's time to begin the session the player would be presented with a cut scene putting on his gloves, putting on his helmet, entering the car, shutting the door, fastening his harness and starting the vehicle. Upon leaving pit lane there would be an animation of the player reaching up and flipping his visor down. At the end of the session there would be either a celebration or debrief, depending on the result or type of session. Then it would be back to headquarters to start prepping for the next race. There would be a much bigger celebration if a championship is won. It would also be neat if the team owner/manager made an appearance from time to time congratulating/cajoling the player.

Static mode would be the career much as it is now, with a calendar and maybe social media and email feeds. The idea behind static mode is for players who just want to get in and race.

4. In-race communication needs to be a lot livelier. Some of the work on the external app that someone has made that substitutes the stock audio with a lot more audio interaction and voice commands is brilliant.

5. Pit-stops in race. We need animated pit crews at the higher levels of racing. GT3/4, Prototype, Open Wheel for sure. As mentioned in #4, we should definitely hear a lot of feedback from the engineer/team manager over the radio during the stop. As mentioned before, the activity in the pit lane needs to be frenetic, full of tension, a sense that anything could go wrong at any moment.

Those are just a few ideas of how I would like the game to provide immersion. I know some of it might seem 'pie-in-the-sky', but I have seen all of those elements in other games, we just the devs to have the vision (and the resources)!

hkraft300
16-10-2015, 05:00
^ point 3...

World of Racecraft

Mass aerodynamic Effect

Grand Theft Auto Racing

Metal Gear Solid Rear Axle

;)

Shinzah
16-10-2015, 05:39
I'm not too bothered about the pits, the board guy and the lollipop man are really all that I need. Until I reach the higher career levels, I play using Skipcrowds anyway. Which unfortunately also removes Marshals but, they don't actually wave flags even if the flags work.

At first I was really down for the first person stuff, but I don't need fancy walk around the pits stuff. I'd rather a system like C1 Grand Prix or Auto Modellista (or even, to a MUCH lesser extent the first GRID game) where you could have control over your paddock. Automodellista and C1 GP was really great as when you won trophies, you could place them in your garage on stands and they had brand name stuff to decorate with.

I wouldn't mind a loosely tied together narrative like Pro-Race Driver, Toca 2 or Toca 3 either. The F1 games were a little annoying with it, as your engineer just followed you around from team to team. Kind of like Ben, even though you get an email from a bunch of different guys throughout your career. I think the feed idea was good in concept, but the time and content limitations made it feel too canned. It doesn't come across as well as the similar idea Ridge Racer was doing....sixteen years ago.

I do like the bulk of the career and have no problem with immersion. I *would* like to see a preview of the liveried cars before committing to a team, and to have more overall contracts as well as some variable controls in the cars that simulate stronger and weaker manufacturing. Especially in the higher levels. The balance is incredible now, but it'd be nice to get an offer from say a STRONG Formula B team after finishing 3rd or 4th with a weak one and really seeing a small but very noticeable difference in car performance.

My main problem is that the championships and to a lesser extent, tiers, are too short. Toca series had this too. I know it's for some balance reason or some other things, but three race championships don't get on with me so well. With so many locales already in the game. The American championships are especially lackluster. Some are both Sonoma and Laguna Seca, but exclude Willow Springs/Horse Thief Mile (West Coast) and put in WGI but not Road America...

In a 'Euro' Championship, like the GT4 series main-staple, there's TWO German tracks (Hockenheim and Oschersleben) and then, Imola and Zolder. Probably because Asia-Pacific has no Euro tracks, and Britain has many Euro tracks and they don't want to re-run tracks you've been to, but where is Catalunya and Monza... :\

The tiers are great for modern series, but there's no representation of Club level motorsport. The Track cars are RIPE for a jump/starting spot to go from Track Cars to GT4 or Super Car racing. Also contempory recent vintage cars like the Trans-Am and Caper would do well with their own tiers.

Most disheartening is that with so many vintage open wheel and sports racing cars, despite the lack of Goodwood (hillclimb and circuit) there's still Laguna Seca which holds a huge Vintage meet annually...but is suspiciously missing from the invitationals I've seen and would even make a good career tier on its own as many rich seat buying gentlemen drivers start by hooning their investments and then move into pay-seats... It's not as fleshed out as I'd like.

And my axe to grind with the GT4 cars in a Multiclass series. No one sane would run multi-million dollar prototypes with race cars on the same track that far out of the spectrum of competition. The closing rate is insane ridiculous! I was fine with them standing in for GTD or even GX type class in American Endurance, but in all Endurance? Noooooo...

But beyond the dreadful three race 'qualifying' series and the 4-6 race 'main' series per tier, I think they did really well with the career mode in the game. Honestly, I've sunk many, many hours into just that part.

SUBGTRACER
16-10-2015, 05:41
I have to agree with a lot of the others. The whole pit experience the way it is now is so far from what was intended early in development. We were seeing lots of cool models for the different pit roles, mechanics, timers, engineers, marshals. There were previews and early builds with cool equipment like the overhead hose racks, fueling stations, tools, etc. A lot of promise with some of the pit-stop animations, and then...pffft! All gone. I don't really expect any of it will return for pcars 1, most opinions are leaning to pcars 2. Very sad. With all the different camera options available I was really hoping for some type of first-person mode where we could walk around the car, open doors, look under the hood, approach engineers and interact with them, but alas, not to be. I imagine it's all related to the limited budget. Codemasters does such a great job with their story-driven career modes providing the player with all sorts of animations, cut-scenes, and music that supports an emotional investment in the game. Maybe I'm showing my age here, but I'm afraid the career mode in the game with it's 'Twaddle'-feeds, limited emails, and facebook integration don't do anything for me at all to make me feel immersed in the game. The race beginning and ending is extremely lack-luster as well. If I finish on the podium in a race, then there should be some type of celebration. If people don't want it, it's easy enough to skip it with the 'esc' key, but I think the devs really misjudged how many people enjoy those extra cut-scenes and celebrations.

So enough complaining, what would I do to improve immersion?

1. We need a lot more activity in the pits. There should be people hovering around the cars working, taking parts off, putting parts on, adjusting, and so forth. There needs to be the same amount of activity around all the other cars too. There also needs to be activity around the timing/scoring/engineering booths for each pit. We need people sitting/standing at the booths who look like they are doing something.

2. There needs to be a lot more 'stuff' in the pit area. Tire racks full of tires, tool benches/cabinets, parts disassembled on counters, air tools, rolling carts, and so on. We also need people doing something with this stuff, see #1.

3. We need to offer the player two modes of play, 'Story-mode' and 'Static-mode'. Story mode involves a first-person view-point that allows the player the freedom to walk around the pit area, look at things, and interact with some of the pit 'characters'. The interaction doesn't need to be completely 3d with the audio matching the lip movements (would be nice, though). It can simply be handled with text cues, as in Mass-effect and other 3d interactive games. I would suggest that, like Mass Effect for instance, the game be divided into several different key areas of play that the player can move freely from one to the other. Codemasters F1 series comes to mind as well, but I really like the detail offered in the Mass Effect games. One area would be the team 'office' or headquarters, another would be the pit area or garage, and a third could be the podium/celebration area. Upon starting a career, the player would be taken to the office to sign the contract and then branch off to other areas, a computer or laptop to view emails, or social media. The workshop where the car is being prepped. Here the player could check on the progress of the preparations, get fitted for his seat/belts, make suggestions for setting up the vehicle based on conditions. If it was a lower level of racing it might be a simple tent and trailer. At the race track the player would be in the pit area discussing the current setup, checking on the weather, reviewing lap times of other drivers. When it's time to begin the session the player would be presented with a cut scene putting on his gloves, putting on his helmet, entering the car, shutting the door, fastening his harness and starting the vehicle. Upon leaving pit lane there would be an animation of the player reaching up and flipping his visor down. At the end of the session there would be either a celebration or debrief, depending on the result or type of session. Then it would be back to headquarters to start prepping for the next race. There would be a much bigger celebration if a championship is won. It would also be neat if the team owner/manager made an appearance from time to time congratulating/cajoling the player.

Static mode would be the career much as it is now, with a calendar and maybe social media and email feeds. The idea behind static mode is for players who just want to get in and race.

4. In-race communication needs to be a lot livelier. Some of the work on the external app that someone has made that substitutes the stock audio with a lot more audio interaction and voice commands is brilliant.

5. Pit-stops in race. We need animated pit crews at the higher levels of racing. GT3/4, Prototype, Open Wheel for sure. As mentioned in #4, we should definitely hear a lot of feedback from the engineer/team manager over the radio during the stop. As mentioned before, the activity in the pit lane needs to be frenetic, full of tension, a sense that anything could go wrong at any moment.

Those are just a few ideas of how I would like the game to provide immersion. I know some of it might seem 'pie-in-the-sky', but I have seen all of those elements in other games, we just the devs to have the vision (and the resources)!

I do agree in parts more immersion is always welcome , immersion is missing in a lot of areas you mentioned and I hope it isn't being completely left out of this current product...

hkraft300
16-10-2015, 08:39
Going by Keith's post above, (http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?40744-Your-immersion-breaking-fixes-additional-features&p=1149353&viewfull=1#post1149353)...

1 and 2 I've mentioned before, but he said it better. As for 5 I believe pit crews are on their way (WIP).

4 would be fantastic and an interactive pit boss is far more crucial in a race sim than a Simcades codemasters title. I'd like to see an expansion of Engineer Ben's lines. I think he has a lot more to say than he lets on. A tweak of the parameters, perhaps?

Pretty sure I read somewhere on this forum (correct me if I'm wrong) that the consoles are near their limits of processing power already with pCars as it is. How it'll handle a more advanced tire/physics model, animated pit crews etc more features remains to be seen. Devs are limited also by available hardware. I have high hopes for this franchise being pushed further in its realism in the next gen consoles (pCars 3/4), and not be bogged down by "fluff" like the established players.

AB_Attack
16-10-2015, 08:41
The things I think should be totally doable and add lots to immersion are

1. Formation lap (for standing starts: make your position at the grid glow a little) (with turn off option)
2. Victory lap with pit in. (turn off option)
3. Pitstop Control with speed limiter. Ghost cars standing still at pitlane. (turn off option)
4. People in the pits. Nevermind authenticity at this point, just add people in overalls in different colors doing something and a lollipop (not even a need for a person) during pitstops. Just make them move towards the side of the car and hunch down or something. Make them ghost so it's impossible to run them over if you stop badly or are a wrecker trying to GTA.
5. Celebrations. Just add cut-scenes and happy engineers at pit coming in from victory lap and some exited cheers over the radio. How hard can that be?