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Fractured Life
16-10-2015, 12:05
For the last couple of races in our GrpA league, although I'm pretty close to the qualifying times of the other racers (and occasionally just as fast), once the race starts I just go backwards as the tyre wear kills me. I can race with the leaders fine up until I no longer have a front left tyre - I can push beyond this but eventually there will be an accident. This point arrives for me in roughly half the time of the Wheel racers.

Last race was at Silverstone National (I think - the sub 1minute track).
42 lap race
Tyre Wear x5
Light Cloud
BMW E30 (which the guys claim is nicer on tyres than the Mercs)

Before the race guys are talking about it being a 2 stop or 1 at a push. I think I had to pit 4 times. I started the race setup with enough fuel for 15 laps in case a 2 stop would work for me, but mainly looking at a 3 stop strategy with low fuel runs, taking on about 9 laps worth each stint. I know most of the rest started on full fuel. And whilst i had pitted on lap 8 or 9 as the front left was completely empty and the other tyres were about 2/3 worn, the others were able to run 18 to 21 lap stints with more fuel on board.

Its not like I am hooning it around trying to hotlap, destroying my tyres, I am aware I need to look after them but it doesn't seem to matter. Setups are usually default with a little more/less wing and gears adjusted to match, so I don't see that I am doing anything obviously stupid with my setup that would ruin the tyres. In a few offline races I've tried setting up for tyre life but the differences were tiny, maybe I was eking out another 2 laps-on a long stint for me, still I would be pitting almost twice for every AI pit.

With the pad, you're constantly making small inputs to the steering on the straights - in the long turns I'm quite good at using the right amount of lock for the corner and not leaning too much on the outside tyre - acute turns I'm always careful not to be lighting the rears up or accelerating in a low gear as that will eat the outside..but on the straights I feel I have to correct the car fractionally, multiple times. I feel this may somehow be causing increased wear as thats a turning event so possibly the game is wearing the tyres appropriately

Dynomight Motorsports
17-10-2015, 01:13
It is also higher on the non-FFB Thrustmaster Spider wheel. I have both the Spider and the TX. I've notice ridiculously high tire wear with my Spider vs my TX. So you're hypothesis is plausible.

RTA nOsKiLlS
17-10-2015, 02:06
I mentioned this a few months back. I was told Im scrubbing the tyres too much....buy a wheel.

This is the reason why I am mostly in a lobby with tyre wear turned off.

It would be great if there was some kind of controller compensation for this scrubbing. We have roughly 1 inch of thumbstick movement to input the same as the steering wheels. IMO the game should really allow for this lack of travel.

As I've said before, I don't want an advantage over wheel users, but I don't want to be at a DISadvantage like we currently have.

Willow springs is a great example, the front left tyre can be cooked on the outlap, and all 4 cooked after 2 - 4 laps. Meaning if tyre wear was on, Id have have to pit every 3 laps. My front left tyre on that track has been at 270 degrees.

Im pretty smooth with a controller but I cannot move the stick 3mm to the left and hold it, then quickly move it 4.5mm to the right and hold it. With a wheel, its easy to turn 10 degrees and hold it, then turn 20 degrees in the other direction and hold that. In fast turns that would need such movement, its most likely to just be a full stick movement one way, and then the other way. That translates into scrubbing the turns.

I've never had to "tap" steer on any game before, but with this game I find myself doing it ALOT. When I try to be smooth on a curve, sometimes its ok, but other times the car acts like i've gone full lock, and I end up having to tap/flick the stick to make very minor steering adjustments.

The controller could do with a complete overhaul for project cars 2 please. The controller really needs to be smooth like it is on Forza, and Codemasters games (its pretty much the only thing you can count on Codemasters to get right).

If the DEVS could play something like Grid Autosport or Grid 1, and see how smoothly the cars can turn, and how easy it is with a controller, then try the same on Pcars, I think they would see what I mean.

Im not saying its unplayable or anything, but there is an air of twitchiness with the controller, and I have tried loads of different settings. It hasn't stopped me getting fairly decent times, its just a bit annoying, when you know you were super smooth on the same track on a different game.

PTG Baby Cow
17-10-2015, 02:07
Sounds to me like a setup issue also.

RTA nOsKiLlS
17-10-2015, 02:20
Im used to it now, so its not a major issue for me. :)

Are you saying a controller setup issue or a car setup issue?

STEELJOCKEY
17-10-2015, 02:38
I'd say controller setup issue, you should be able to smooth out your steering inputs compared to wheel reaction to make up for this

PTG Baby Cow
17-10-2015, 06:43
Also a vehicle setup issue. Most tracks are clockwise so that tyre is going to see a fair bit of abuse but a good setup can limit this from happening.

RTA nOsKiLlS
17-10-2015, 12:13
I'd say controller setup issue, you should be able to smooth out your steering inputs compared to wheel reaction to make up for this

I should be able to, but I have not found a way yet. I can increase the speed sensitivitity but then the car doesn't turn enough at slow speeds. I could increase the controller filtering but that just causes input lag.

Currently I have:

steering deadzone 20
Steering sensitivity 0

Speed sensitivity 65
Controller filtering 35

and all car setups have the slowest setting on the steering rack.

Most of the GT3 cars are not an issue, except the R8, that just melts tyres, but FA cars I just cannot drive, the slightest steering input, makes the car violently twitch. Have have tried the FA cars with 80 speed sensitivity and it was great, untill I came to a slow turn where the car just didn't turn.

I would have much prefered not having to setup the controller, It would have been much better if the default setup was more or less perfect.

I'll just stick to tyre wear off. Most of the time Im doing 4-6 laps and don't use the pits, unless I've got a jump start penalty.

RTA nOsKiLlS
17-10-2015, 12:16
I'd say controller setup issue, you should be able to smooth out your steering inputs compared to wheel reaction to make up for this

I just noticed your signature.....Your using a wheel aren't you?

Have you used a controller for any length of time with this game? :)

Fractured Life
17-10-2015, 13:47
Been in some lobbies with you no skills, although I like a longer race (i blaze too much in your lobby with the short races lol!!!) with a pit stop so there is some strategy involved.

At the beginning I was setup similar to you with the actual in car steering ratio needing to be slowest, later I changed the settings to something where I didnt have to change steering ratio at all. At the time i was trying to get a pad setup working with the fA and GrpA and I ended up with...

steering dead zone 0
Sensitivity 15
Throttle dead zone 10
Sensitivity 20
Brakes dead zone 0
Sensitivity 35 (<------too much? This killing me?)

Speed sensitivity 60
Controller filtering 15


Anyone see anything obviously stupid there? Been a while since I looked and hadn't realised what I had brakes at. That's not too extreme is it? I tend to brake a little earlier than the guys I race with and carry speed through so maybe I could set sensitivity a little lower.


And please if anyones advice is to just get a wheel, it's not very helpful, many reasons why people race on pads, through disability perhaps? Personally, a good wheel is a lot of blazing so for now I wouldn't be arsed with the outlay. Some day I will, once I get the 'oul fella to follow through on his plan to rip off a good wheelstand design ( toolmaker/manufacturing engineer)

Fractured Life
17-10-2015, 13:53
I also always feel that going lock to lock on the pad takes the same time as going from dead ahead to full lock despite it being twice the distance. I've learned to be very very careful on any left/right or vice versa sweepers as I used to just end up chucked in a wall or hilariously swerving up the track trying to get the control back.

Also I run no assists just in case any of those might have an effect.

PAUL Y0UNG
17-10-2015, 14:14
Even with a wheel its still twitchy, especially at high speed in a straight line in the FA. Thinking back to the Austrian Grand Prix last year i think Pastor Maldonado had a massive moment after making only a minor direction change on the straight, i try to keep this in mind when driving the FA cars and when tuning a setup.

Back to the OP though tyre wear when on Real and with a wheel is pretty bad in the quicker cars, a set of softs around Watkins Glen will last about 10 laps until they give up on the FA. On the GT3's it can sometimes be less ( track depending ).

one1two
17-10-2015, 14:25
Pastor is not exactly the shining example you should want to compare yourself too...:D

PAUL Y0UNG
17-10-2015, 14:31
Lol, i wasnt comparing, just saying that we ( the wheel users ) do have the twitchiness that is also there with the pad. Pastor was an example of real cars/drivers having the same issue.

STEELJOCKEY
17-10-2015, 19:18
I just noticed your signature.....Your using a wheel aren't you?

Have you used a controller for any length of time with this game? :)

Yes I have, for the first month it was out before the first patch was even out and I could plug in my wheel, and for most of the month of August while waiting for a rim replacement. I am a bit on the tap tap side of driving with the controller, did manage to smooth it out a bit, but a wheel is so much better and certainly my choice and recommendation if any one is seriously into this game

CreasingCurve1
20-10-2015, 01:41
I mentioned this a few months back. I was told Im scrubbing the tyres too much....buy a wheel.

This is the reason why I am mostly in a lobby with tyre wear turned off.

It would be great if there was some kind of controller compensation for this scrubbing. We have roughly 1 inch of thumbstick movement to input the same as the steering wheels. IMO the game should really allow for this lack of travel.

As I've said before, I don't want an advantage over wheel users, but I don't want to be at a DISadvantage like we currently have.

Willow springs is a great example, the front left tyre can be cooked on the outlap, and all 4 cooked after 2 - 4 laps. Meaning if tyre wear was on, Id have have to pit every 3 laps. My front left tyre on that track has been at 270 degrees.

Im pretty smooth with a controller but I cannot move the stick 3mm to the left and hold it, then quickly move it 4.5mm to the right and hold it. With a wheel, its easy to turn 10 degrees and hold it, then turn 20 degrees in the other direction and hold that. In fast turns that would need such movement, its most likely to just be a full stick movement one way, and then the other way. That translates into scrubbing the turns.

I've never had to "tap" steer on any game before, but with this game I find myself doing it ALOT. When I try to be smooth on a curve, sometimes its ok, but other times the car acts like i've gone full lock, and I end up having to tap/flick the stick to make very minor steering adjustments.

The controller could do with a complete overhaul for project cars 2 please. The controller really needs to be smooth like it is on Forza, and Codemasters games (its pretty much the only thing you can count on Codemasters to get right).

If the DEVS could play something like Grid Autosport or Grid 1, and see how smoothly the cars can turn, and how easy it is with a controller, then try the same on Pcars, I think they would see what I mean.

Im not saying its unplayable or anything, but there is an air of twitchiness with the controller, and I have tried loads of different settings. It hasn't stopped me getting fairly decent times, its just a bit annoying, when you know you were super smooth on the same track on a different game.

I completely agree. I have my sensitivity on 10 and most of the other sensitivity inputs below 20 and when I use the thumbstick the wheel jerks when I steer. on forza 5 the control are slowish but it is much more controlled when you steer and you don't get instant understeer as soon as you try to turn to the left even only with a slight input of the thumbstick

Umer Ahmad
20-10-2015, 02:02
Gonna drop this hear from the other thread where this "reduced tyre wear for gamepads" idea surfaced:

No absolutely the physics calculations MUST be the same REGARDLESS of input device. We will never go down the route of nerfing the physics due to input device. Then you need separate leaderboards, online filters, AI behavior to match based on input device....endless.

If you really NEED the smoothness of wheel based inputs from your controller settings you're gonna half to study and practice and learn from others how it works.

AdM1
20-10-2015, 02:30
x7 wear was usually a problem for me, but anything else seemed okay after a lot of practice and setting up work.

This game just isn't great with a pad really. I mean it still works but I imagine it's half the game with a pad.

Tap steer is the way. Nothing like how real racers drive though.

Dynomight Motorsports
20-10-2015, 11:35
Listen, I own both the Thrustmaster Spider and TX. And I can tell you the Spider is harder on tire wear than the TX even on the same setup. I've tested this. The only way you will be able to run long races with real tire wear effectively is with a FFB wheel. You can actually feel the tire scrub in the FFB TX wheel. Don't know why it is that way I just know I'm glad to have my TX back or else I just wouldn't be able to compete in my endurance league.

morphee7
20-10-2015, 17:34
im having the same issue with the spider 458 wheel and controller as i race in an endurance league in the gt3s having a right nightmare trying to make the front left last longer than 15 laps on dubai with real tire wear imo its a massive disadvantage not having ffb on a wheel looks like im going to have to sell my soul to the devil to buy one

Dynomight Motorsports
21-10-2015, 00:09
im having the same issue with the spider 458 wheel and controller as i race in an endurance league in the gt3s having a right nightmare trying to make the front left last longer than 15 laps on dubai with real tire wear imo its a massive disadvantage not having ffb on a wheel looks like im going to have to sell my soul to the devil to buy one

I think the Devil has a payment plan.. thru PayPal. :devilish:

jonnyyoung2013
22-10-2015, 16:03
Just to throw a spanner into the works here Fractured I was in that race and I'm on a pad, I made 1 stop in 42 laps with a full tank (45 laps worth) and was also in first for most of the race only loosing out on the final corner when I got a little over zelous and put too much power down loosing the back end and finished in second.