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Jussi Viljami Karjalainen
06-01-2016, 14:14
Here are my current pet peeves (this is outside any major issues being discussed in threads like TYRE PHYSICS etc.) just ideas, thoughts and suggestions:

Ginetta G55 GT3 seemingly underpowered: This is the only car in the GT3 lineup that has a lower power output than listed on the info page. Info claims 525 bhp, car only manages 498 bhp on Test Track which seems to be the lowest elevation track in the game and gives highest naturally aspirated power outputs. Higher altitude tracks are even more out of line. The G55 GT3 is also just plum slower than the others, not necessarily by a massive margin when driven by a competent driver and good setup on a suitable track where it gets to show its cornering prowess, but still slower, and very much slower on some less suitable tracks. If it actually produced the 525 bhp it claims to the situation would likely be different. The other cars all produce as much or more power than claimed on the info screen (well apart from the Bentley GT3, which is -1 bhp, but the nominal power has been changed after it was updated):

Aston GT3: Claimed 520, produces 528, plus 8 bhp
Aston GTE: Claimed 450, produces 468 with fully open restrictor, plus 18 bhp
Audi R8 LMS Ultra: Claimed 520, produces 524, plus 4 bhp
Bentley GT3: Claimed 515, produces 514, minus 1 bhp
BMW M3 GT: Claimed 481, produces 489, plus 8 bhp
BMW Z4 GT3: Claimed 484, produces 491, plus 7 bhp.
Ginetta GT3: Claimed 525, produces 498, minus 27 bhp
McLaren GT3: Claimed 496, produces 499, plus 3 bhp
Mercedes GT3: Claimed 550, produces 567, plus 17 bhp
Ruf GT3: Claimed 505, produces 511, plus 6 bhp.

To me it seems like there's a fair case for making the G55 GT3 more powerful than it currently is by upping the power a little closer to what it is claimed to have. 27 bhp could be overkill, it is a really big jump, but it is significantly slower at this point and getting it closer to claimed output could help.

Aston Martin Rapide S Hydrogen Hybrid is seemingly underpowered and lacks a turbo: Another car that is clearly slow in its class, this time by a more significant margin. The Vantage GT4 and the G55 GT4 completely dominate the class, but this car is significantly slower than the M3 and Boss as well. Every source I've seen has claimed 550 bhp for the Hydrogen Hybrid, the in-game info says 560 bhp, yet the car produces only 516 bhp at the Test Track. OK, Casey has a point when in an earlier discussion he said that the class the car was entered in for the Nords race tends to frown upon cars that are more powerful than 500 bhp, so it might indeed have been restricted (nothing 100% conclusive though on that). Be that as it may, one thing is for certain: The real car is turbocharged, the in-game car is not. This means that at high altitude (starting straight on Nürburgring) the car only produces 472 bhp. Even if the car is to be restricted below the claimed 550 bhp level, it should at least be turbocharged and capable of maintaining the ~516 bhp it now produces at all altitudes. At least on higher altitude tracks it'd already make a big difference to the performance, and I noticed that those high altitude tracks tend to be exactly where it suffers the most, because only thing it really has going for itself is power.

So perhaps worth consideration to add a turbo to the Rapide, which it really should have had from the start (can't believe I missed this during WMD as well).

Aston Martin V8 Vantage GTE seems sluggish, possibly too low aero efficiency: I felt that the GTE was a bit sluggish compared to the others, so I did fairly extensive lateral and longitudinal G testing for all of the in-game GT3 class cars, and came up with the following results: Despite the Aston GTE being very capable in the corners, planted, stable, well behaved and quick, it's not as good at generating lateral and longitudinal forces as the M3 GT, the Z4 GT3 and the G55 GT3 when comparing all cars with low, mid level and high DF settings (balanced so that aero under or oversteer isn't an issue, all cars running identical toe and camber settings as well as tyre pressures, fuel levels, radiator settings and set up with springs and dampers that I felt were comfortable for track use), and when comparing low DF settings even the Bentley GT3 (running the post-update ride height etc.). The clear winners in these tests were consistently the M3 GT for cornering prowess and G55 GT3 for braking performance, the Z4 more or less striking an average between them. The Z4 and M3 also can hold their own on the leaderboards as well. The Aston GTE lost to the three mentioned cars In every test.

So based on this and other tests it seems that the Aston GTE's power and drag behavior match up with the real car quite well (at least looking at top speed and acceleration behavior), but it isn't living up to the level of the other GTE car in the corners (and has a worse power to weight ratio to boot, by far the worst in class, followed by the M3 GT, but GTE cars tend have lower power to weight than GT3 IRL as well), or even the better cornering GT3 cars. This leads me to think that the aero efficiency on the Aston GTE is a bit down, or something else is robbing it of peak cornering capabilities. If it could corner and brake as hard as the M3 GT it might match the lineup a bit better. That, or the 2011 based M3 GT benefits from the later season wide tyres a lot, while the newer Aston GTE that was designed for wider tyres and worse power to weight ratio suffers from being forced to run on GT3 tyres in the game (which as far as I have been able to figure out seem to be outclassed by GTE tyres, both in overall performance level and freedom of choice for what compound to use). So increasing aero efficiency (more DF for the same drag) or better tyre compound for this car sound like fairly reasonable options.

Rain doesn't seem to have an effect on HOT road tyres: This isn't quite as solid, and I didn't test quite as extensively as I usually do, but I noticed that when I was testing the road tyres on the skid pan in various weather conditions, there didn't seem to be any difference in the braking and cornering Gs I was able to get, provided the tyres were still at 90 deg or above (Test Track always has you start with warm tyres, even on road cars). On another track with cold tyres the Gs were lower in the wet, so this seemed to be a purely hot tyre related thing.

EDIT:
Ginetta G55 GT4 and Aston Martin V8 Vantage GT4 are just plain faster than any other GT4 car: These two are fairly balanced with each other, the M3 and the Boss are fairly balanced with each other as well, but there's a large gap between the two groups (plus the Rapide is even slower, currently don't have anything to say about the GT86 since I haven't really driven it). Hard to say what should be done exactly, but my vote would be to restrict the performance on the Ginetta and Aston, rather than speeding up the M3 and Boss (and others). I say it this way, because looking at the leaderboards the M3 GT4 and Boss are already a bit faster than GT4 class tends to be these days, while the Ginetta and Aston are usually a LOT faster.

EDIT2:
The Mustang GT is not a Road B car, it's a Road C1 car: It can not keep up with any of the Road B cars on any track, especially when driven by the AI. The power to weight ratio (258 hbp/ton by in-game info) is about 100 bhp behind the other Road B cars (and in many cases much more than that), and wouldn't be the best in Road C1 either (second best though after the Evo IX). The current Nords WR for it would put it third in Road C1 as well, behind the Evo IX and the 1M Coupe, ahead of the A45 AMG, Evo X and Megane 275 Trophy-R. On Catalunya GP it fits right within the pack as well.

The Mustang GT is very clearly a Road C1 car, towards the faster end of that range, but still a Road C1 car. Power to weight and lap times all point in that direction. Currently you can't really drive this car online because it's completely outmatched by the other cars in the class it is in.

EDIT3:
The Brake Mapping setting, the one that's supposed to increase engine braking with low values and decrease it with high values, does nothing. During development I remember this having at times a massive effect, but now I can not get it to do anything in tests, and specifically when looking at the telemetry you can't see any difference in the negative torque/power when lifting off between the settings.

Invincible
06-01-2016, 14:30
+1 for the car adjustments. Especially the Ginetta G55 GT3. Even if it might be only +15 hp instead of +27.

seb02
06-01-2016, 14:31
I add Toyota gt86 Gt4 that is really too slow compared others gt4

RomKnight
06-01-2016, 14:45
Great post Jussi (as usual)

Jussi Viljami Karjalainen
06-01-2016, 14:52
I add Toyota gt86 Gt4 that is really too slow compared others gt4I've been hearing that, but I'll need to test myself to see if it's just plain slow or just slow compared to the Ginetta and Aston Vantage duo, which are just in a class of their own. Which reminds me, I need to add that in there...

Shinzah
06-01-2016, 14:59
I didn't find it slow in the slightest, it's one lap is on par with the ginetta for me

But it'll munch through rubber at hypersonic rates which drastically reduces its potential over a run

MAARTEN
06-01-2016, 15:06
Did some tests and as Jussi i got only 498 bhp in the Ginetta GT3 driving at Snetterton.

With the Toyota GT86 GT3 i got 333 bhp so that's only minus 2 bhp so pretty accurate.

seb02
07-01-2016, 08:34
Did some tests and as Jussi i got only 498 bhp in the Ginetta GT3 driving at Snetterton.

With the Toyota GT86 GT3 i got 333 bhp so that's only minus 2 bhp so pretty accurate.

See this thread :

http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?42770-TOYOTA-GT86-ROCKET-BUNNY-GT4

Jussi Viljami Karjalainen
12-01-2016, 16:54
Another pet peeve: The Mustang GT is not a Road B car, it can not keep up with any of them on any track, especially when driven by the AI. The power to weight ratio (258 hbp/ton by in-game info) is about 100 bhp behind the other Road B cars, and wouldn't be the best in Road C1 either (second best though after the Evo IX). The current Nords WR for it would put it third in Road C1 as well, behind the Evo IX and the 1M Coupe, ahead of the A45 AMG, Evo X and Megane 275 Trophy-R. On Catalunya GP it fits right within the pack as well.

The Mustang GT is very clearly a Road C1 car, towards the faster end of that range, but still a Road C1 car. Power to weight and lap times all point in that direction. Currently you can't really drive this car online because it's completely outmatched by the other cars in the class it is in.

Jussi Viljami Karjalainen
12-01-2016, 17:44
Also confirmed that the rain has either no or very little effect on grip of hot road tyres. When at 90-100 C the road tyres all show the same level of grip as they do in the dry, even in Thunderstorm conditions. When cold there is a massive difference though. It is of course more difficult to warm up the tyres in the wet, so there is a net effect of less grip in the wet. Especially the Soft option that already is more slippery than the other when cold suffers the most and isn't good in the wet, but the Street-Mediums seem to start with exactly as much grip or a hair more than the All Weathers, and as they warm up get even better.

It's funny that the temperature affects the grip so much in the wet. Does the temperature of the tyre have a bigger effect on mechanical keying than on the sheer adhesion grip of the tyres, so when the wet track reduces the adhesion grip somewhat the larger shifts in mechanical grip due to temp changes become more apparent, or something? But why does the grip return to the same level as dry when fully warmed up though? I noticed that when doing sustained cornering in the wet I got more and more grip up until the tyres really started to overheat beyond 100 C, usually in the dry the grip drops off a bit way before that in sustained cornering. I'm sort of guessing that this is because in the dry the outermost surface layer gets overheated quickly and starts to get slippery, so even though the indicated tyre temps aren't that massively high yet the contact patch is too hot. In the wet the water would keep the outermost surface layer cooler more effectively, so it requires you to push the inner temps higher before the outermost layer is warm enough to grip as well as it can? Sounds plausible, I guess. This could also be a reason why the tyres are so much more slippery in the wet when cold than in the dry. In the dry the outermost layer warms up more and is closer to operating temp even when the inner temps are still on the cold side, so the tyres behave closer to optimum even then (and conversely when the tyre temp inside gets closer to optimal the surface might already be going above optimal, balancing it out a bit). In the wet though the outermost layer is always kept closer to the temp of the inside of the tyres, so they show the cold effects much more clearly.

There seems to really be no difference in the wet and dry handling of the tyres beyond temperature effects, the tread depth doesn't seem to make a difference. I know the model can and does model how well the treaded surface of the tyre can clear the water, so this might just be a case of the tyres being designed "on the safe side" initially, any tread makes them good enough for all rain conditions. That, or Thunderstorm doesn't have enough water on the track. There was a time when Thunderstorm was nigh biblical in the amounts of water on track, and immensely difficult to string together a lap with. I preferred that to the current, where IIRC Thunderstorm took the level that Storm used to have.

This brings up an interesting thing I intend to test at some point: Does tread depth make any difference at all on the water handling currently? I intend to test this by taking a car on slicks in Thunderstorm conditions onto the Test Track where I know for certain the temps can be kept at above 90 C.

RomKnight
13-01-2016, 14:04
IIRC correctly discussed in the tyre physics thread too.

Wet compounds are a bit weird...

IJOJOI
13-01-2016, 14:21
IIRC correctly discussed in the tyre physics thread too.

Wet compounds are a bit weird...

Yes, but this was indroduced with patch 7.0 i believe.

Invincible
13-01-2016, 14:23
Yes, but this was indroduced with patch 8.0 i believe.

You've been to the future? :p
I'm sure you mean patch 7.0 :D

Jussi Viljami Karjalainen
13-01-2016, 14:25
FWIW the first time I noticed signs of this particular wet behavior in road tyres was back when the Toyota pack came, which I believe was still patch 5 or 6 territory? So it's unrelated to the heating changes in 7.

RomKnight
13-01-2016, 14:28
and yes, patch 7 broke several things. I can only hope for patch 8 to come as p6 with camber fix and the bug they've found in the meantime also fixed

Jussi Viljami Karjalainen
22-01-2016, 00:22
Another pet peeve: The Brake Mapping setting, the one that's supposed to increase engine braking with low values and decrease it with high values does nothing. During development I remember this having at times a massive effect, but now I can not get it to do anything in tests, and specifically when looking at the telemetry you can't see any difference in the negative torque/power when lifting off between the settings.

AndrexUK
22-01-2016, 07:38
Have to agree with the GT findings!!!
I can't think of a single track where the Ginetta G55 GT3, and the Aston Martin GTE shine, or REALLY put up a fight.
certainly when looking at car selection for a league, neither would really be a viable choice if you wanted to be at the front end (depending on the other drivers abilities)
But either way, I doubt very much that a driver would be quicker in either of these cars. And it's not like the Z4, where it might not be the best, but it's close to the front for everything.
I would say the G55 needs approx 20 bhp more to make it competitive, and the Aston may need looking at, as I know the GTE works differently than just BHP.

My concern here at the moment, is what's going to happen to the new GT cars that are on their way??? is the Vette going to match up against the Aston GTE, thus having 2 great cars that won't be driven that much?

Agree with the GT4 balance as well. I have not driven them that much, and although I would love to drive the M3 (closest to my irl car) If I wanted to be in with a better chance of winning, it would have to be the Ginetta, or the Aston :(

havocc
22-01-2016, 08:01
Another pet peeve: The Brake Mapping setting, the one that's supposed to increase engine braking with low values and decrease it with high values does nothing. During development I remember this having at times a massive effect, but now I can not get it to do anything in tests, and specifically when looking at the telemetry you can't see any difference in the negative torque/power when lifting off between the settings.

Engine braking is sooo abused in this game since there isn't a gearbox protection and wild downshifting hardly causes wheel lock

Default
22-01-2016, 08:06
Have to agree with the GT findings!!!
I can't think of a single track where the Ginetta G55 GT3, and the Aston Martin GTE shine, or REALLY put up a fight.
certainly when looking at car selection for a league, neither would really be a viable choice if you wanted to be at the front end (depending on the other drivers abilities)
But either way, I doubt very much that a driver would be quicker in either of these cars. And it's not like the Z4, where it might not be the best, but it's close to the front for everything.
I would say the G55 needs approx 20 bhp more to make it competitive, and the Aston may need looking at, as I know the GTE works differently than just BHP.

My concern here at the moment, is what's going to happen to the new GT cars that are on their way??? is the Vette going to match up against the Aston GTE, thus having 2 great cars that won't be driven that much?

Agree with the GT4 balance as well. I have not driven them that much, and although I would love to drive the M3 (closest to my irl car) If I wanted to be in with a better chance of winning, it would have to be the Ginetta, or the Aston :(

After the recent Dubai event the Ginetta GT3 is the fastest GT3 car on that track. So driver skill does make the difference.

AndrexUK
22-01-2016, 08:58
Don't want to sound arrogant in any way, but I would happily take on a G55 at Dubai.
We have recently raced a league race there, and even though I'm not a front runner in terms of pace, I would fancy my chances (unless you give it to the aliens in our league (Masa / Khaki / Alex / Papand)

Don't get me wrong, it can be made to be fast, and in the right hands it could do ok, but not to the same level as the same driver in say the Z4 / R8 (in my and others opinion).
Including our Elite + Pro leagues, we have only 1 Ginetta running! and that's due to his love of the car (he's called Dangerous Gianetta - and he rarely drives anything else).
I think we have only 1 GTE too...
Both cars have their strengths, but they are just not quite enough to counter their weaknesses. (Or if it does, only on a very limited number of tracks).

Pamellaaa
22-01-2016, 09:29
Nice post Jussi, agree with pretty much everything on here.

When we did a GT4 race at Sakitto some time ago the Rocket Bunny was no-where near the pace unfortunately, its a lovely lovely car to drive and will make for a great single car race at some time but it is unfortunately not competitive with the Ginetta/Aston, I can't comment on where it fits in against the other two but I would estimate at Sakitto GP it was at least 2 seconds off the race pace set by the (mostly Ginetta) field.

AndrexUK
22-01-2016, 09:45
Rather odd that in GT4, the Aston + Ginetta seem to the best option, and in GT3, Aston GTE + Ginetta = the worst option.
Had never really tied the 4 cars together like that..

I just hope the Vette and AMG will be on the pace with the rest of the GT3 field.
Would be nice if the Aston GTE / Vette GTE / M3 (re-adjusted) were to make up an actual GTE class, but I believe no new classes are being made for pCars1.
Would rather they were all GT3s and balanced with each other. As I said, I would hate for the GTE's to continue being the 'underdog' They just need to be competitive so that ppl want to drive them. It would be a shame to put so much work / effort into building them, for them not to be used much.

balderz002
22-01-2016, 09:56
Rather odd that in GT4, the Aston + Ginetta seem to the best option, and in GT3, Aston GTE + Ginetta = the worst option.
Had never really tied the 4 cars together like that..

I just hope the Vette and AMG will be on the pace with the rest of the GT3 field.
Would be nice if the Aston GTE / Vette GTE / M3 (re-adjusted) were to make up an actual GTE class, but I believe no new classes are being made for pCars1.Would rather they were all GT3s and balanced with each other. As I said, I would hate for the GTE's to continue being the 'underdog' They just need to be competitive so that ppl want to drive them. It would be a shame to put so much work / effort into building them, for them not to be used much.

I thought the same, but the V8SC seems to be in its own class (when it turns up next week).

I also wouldve thought the AMG GT3 will be on pace, but maybe the C7R GTE will be the same as the Aston GTE, no reason to think otherwise really. Agree on the GTE class subject (although I know alot of people think the opposite), but I also agree that the Bimmer would need a slight tweek to bring it into line otherwise it might run away with things.

AndrexUK
22-01-2016, 10:27
I can see the reason of the V8SC being in a new class, but since the Aston GTE has been bundled into the GT3 class, I can only imagine that the Vette will do the same.
I see no reason why the AMG will not be balanced against the other GT3s. And I agree, if the C7R is balanced with the Aston GTE, then I would like the M3 to be re-balanced to match.

Here's hoping!

And pls pls give the G55 a little boost! I would love to drive it in a season!

Jussi Viljami Karjalainen
22-01-2016, 14:26
The G55 GT3 is probably my favorite GT3 car, and while it can be a helluva lot quicker than people give it credit for, especially on tracks that reward massive DF, overall it's still lagging behind. Driver skill has a huge effect on it though, it is a car that requires a skilled driver because it needs to be spanked around the corners faster than anything.
Engine braking is sooo abused in this game since there isn't a gearbox protection and wild downshifting hardly causes wheel lockThere are some cars where quick downshifting kicks the tail out viciously, which was one of the reasons I started testing for this. The vast majority of the cars seems to have very little effect from engine braking, and some have massive amounts. I'd really like for that slider to actually do something so I could tune this behavior.

And engine braking has always been abused in every sim that has existed. =)

MortICi
22-01-2016, 16:44
The G55 is my go to GT3 car personally, I dabble with the Bentley from time to time as well, but pretty much everything is spot on that Jussi said. On straights its pretty much a loss, you can only hope to out corner who ever you are battling, but you will never out power them out of a corner.

I have reached top 3 on occasion but for the most part I land in the top 6 consistently with it. Granted I don't have a fancy tune, usually run default setup. I do feel like it lacks a little umph, and believe all the other points Jussi made are spot on.

The sound of the G55 is just scurry from the inside :D

MortICi
22-01-2016, 16:47
The G55 GT3 is probably my favorite GT3 car, and while it can be a helluva lot quicker than people give it credit for, especially on tracks that reward massive DF, overall it's still lagging behind. Driver skill has a huge effect on it though, it is a car that requires a skilled driver because it needs to be spanked around the corners faster than anything.There are some cars where quick downshifting kicks the tail out viciously, which was one of the reasons I started testing for this. The vast majority of the cars seems to have very little effect from engine braking, and some have massive amounts. I'd really like for that slider to actually do something so I could tune this behavior.

And engine braking has always been abused in every sim that has existed. =)

I did notice that abusive engine breaking with mechanical damage turned on will damage the engine rather than the gearbox thus reducing the power output, ive spotted on occasion even less power after several laps of nutter downshifting and the power output was less by several bhp as wes torque and my laptimes suffered. At least there is that, I do wish gearbox damage was a bit higher from the early downshifts.

balderz002
22-01-2016, 20:41
Hey Jussi,

If you go to the Ginetta website, to the 'approved used' section, they have an ex works G55 GT3 from 2013 (same as in game) and they quote its hp figure as having 560 bhp. Now that would do!

http://www.ginetta.com/used_cars#23

Jussi Viljami Karjalainen
22-01-2016, 21:09
Hey Jussi,

If you go to the Ginetta website, to the 'approved used' section, they have an ex works G55 GT3 from 2013 (same as in game) and they quote its hp figure as having 560 bhp. Now that would do!

http://www.ginetta.com/used_cars#23Yeah, well aware. =)

Though it's worth noticing that EVERY GTE and GT3 car can produce more power than what the actual homologations and rulings allow, each an every one of them is restricted compared to what they're capable of.

N0body Of The Goat
22-01-2016, 21:55
At default setup and no exploits, the Ginetta GT3 was the second quickest GT3 around Spa for me in patch 7 (behind the Aston GT3), not had chance to check this in patch 8 yet.

Martin G Webb
23-01-2016, 08:28
I have to agree with your analysis Jussi, the only other issue I have with the game is the lack of Suzuka but that's for another thread.

Now I've got my life back I can start running through some of your points myself but from memory the tweeks you've suggested sound spot on.

Jussi Viljami Karjalainen
26-01-2016, 02:23
Starting to think the Pagani Huayra's turbos might be kicking in too slowly and too late. I mean they're big bastards, obviously, but still... The car is VERY tame on the throttle, you basically have nothing to worry about when flooring it most of the time, the power comes in so slowly and smoothly that you're not really in any danger of losing control, which seems odd for a ~1000 Nm ~720 bhp car on road tyres.

Looking into it, I found that Pagani had been claiming between 720-730 bhp (assuming 730 might have been "PS") at either 5800 rpm or 6500 rpm, and 1000 Nm of torque, supposed to be flat from 2250 rpm to 4500 rpm. I saw this claimed by 4 different car magazines, including major ones, so it does appear to be an official Pagani claim. Still, it's probably an exaggeration, but something close to that isn't exactly out of the question. Basically this sounds like the turbo should kick in at fairly low revs (if they claim maximum torque from 2250 rpm on then the turbo should have kicked in at least a bit before that), and since it can't kick in super early (only a very small turbo would spool up at really low revs) it should be a fairly abrupt kick.

In contrast what I feel in-game is that the turbo comes on late and sloooowly, never really straining the tyres for grip until you're way up high in the rev range, and even then it's building up so smoothly that you barely notice it. So I recorded a video of a 5th gear pull from <1000 rpm to the rev limiter at 7000 rpm, loading up as much as I could so that the turbo could get into action as soon as possible, then went through that video frame by frame to get the torque figure at every 100 rpm interval, so that I could make a torque/power curve for the car in Excel. Here it is, combined with the dotted "Pagani Claimed" section representing a very rough idea of what Pagani is claiming the car should be doing:

https://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1555/23988835904_bfd3acb05e_o.png

You can right click and open it in a new tab to see it better.

So based on this it would indeed appear that the Pagani's turbo comes in late, or at least veeery slowly. You could argue that it already starts to do something near the 2200 rpm range, but the torque increases very smoothly, instead of more abruptly like you usually see in a turbocharged car, all the way until it reaches peak value of ~960-970 Nm at around 4100-4200 rpm, nearly 2000 rpm later than Pagani claims. This basically means that compared to Pagani's claims the car is missing about 130 bhp in the low range, which would surely help light up the tyres, and since achieving that'd require a quicker spooling turbo which would work faster at high revs too, getting on the throttle when exiting a corner at middish rev range would be much trickier as well. Max boost itself seems totally fine (960+ Nm of torque is a ton and the 1000 Nm may well have been marketing talk) and max power likewise isn't far from claimed at 714-715 bhp or so.

That said this is pure speculation and assumes Pagani weren't exaggerating to hell and back in their claims (something which they definitely have done with their downforce claims). All I know is the Huayra seems very tame and safe compared to even cars with 100-200 bhp less max power and using the same tyres.

Gotta try to do a "plant down at 3500 rpm and see how long it takes for the turbo to kick in, if it manages at all" run later.