PDA

View Full Version : Camber Angle Question



Ezuna
22-01-2016, 17:53
I am watching some excellent videos about setting up cars, and camber has me puzzled.

I have adjusted the camber to make it easier to corner, but I have also not gone overboard to the point that there's excessive tyre wear or temperature (about 5 - 8 degree spread from inner to outer).

But I've seen ANOTHER video where the person says 'adjust camber to try and get as close to zero camber across the tyre'.

Which is right - the way I'm doing it or the second way?

Thanks

MortICi
22-01-2016, 18:16
I am watching some excellent videos about setting up cars, and camber has me puzzled.

I have adjusted the camber to make it easier to corner, but I have also not gone overboard to the point that there's excessive tyre wear or temperature (about 5 - 8 degree spread from inner to outer).

But I've seen ANOTHER video where the person says 'adjust camber to try and get as close to zero camber across the tyre'.

Which is right - the way I'm doing it or the second way?

Thanks

Depends if the video is a bit old, there was a camber exploit at 0* camber. On tight courses with lots of turns, camber can provide better turn in and more even wear (as you corner the weight shifts, and the tire flexes 'flattening' out) it at all really depends on the track honestly. Sadly there is no one camber setting fits all scenario. As you drive a track you have to add/remove camber to see if you get better or worse turn in.

No camber also increases straight line speed afaik. You are on the right path, but sadly I don't think there is a solid answer to all the possibilities when on track.

Ezuna
22-01-2016, 18:25
Thanks - what do you think of the temp spread across the tyre surface? If I'm getting spread, but no appreciable tyre wear then is that ok?

PostBox981
22-01-2016, 18:26
Please can one of the German guys tell me the German word for camber? Since release of patch 7 I read a lot about the camber issue but as I installed the German version I never read the word "camber" anywhere. Is it "Spur" or "Sturz" or something completely different? Internet translation doesn´t work for me, only leads to some irrelevant translations not referring to cars at all. Thanks. :distrust:

Jussi Viljami Karjalainen
22-01-2016, 18:27
It's good to have a temperature difference between inside and outside. 5-8 degrees is actually fairly conservative, 10 degrees wouldn't be too bad for racing radials, and for some series (like Michelin suggestions for Porsche Supercup) you could get insane figures like 20 degree C difference between inside and outside (they also suggested running -4.5 degrees of camber front and rear).

Jussi Viljami Karjalainen
22-01-2016, 18:29
Please can one of the German guys tell me the German word for camber? Since release of patch 7 I read a lot about the camber issue but as I installed the German version I never read the word "camber" anywhere. Is it "Spur" or "Sturz" or something completely different? Internet translation doesn´t work for me, only leads to some irrelevant translations not referring to cars at all. Thanks. :distrust:Spur = toe, Sturz = camber, or at least that's what Sport Auto magazine uses.

PostBox981
22-01-2016, 18:30
It's good to have a temperature difference between inside and outside. 5-8 degrees is actually fairly conservative, 10 degrees wouldn't be too bad for racing radials, and for some series (like Michelin suggestions for Porsche Supercup) you could get insane figures like 20 degree C difference between inside and outside (they also suggested running -4.5 degrees of camber front and rear).

This already seems to answer my question, Jussi. So it is the vertical angle of the wheels, so to say - right?

PostBox981
22-01-2016, 18:32
Spur = toe, Sturz = camber, or at least that's what Sport Auto magazine uses.

Right. Now we speak the same language. :)

Thx.

Ezuna
22-01-2016, 19:36
These are great replies thanks very much guys

PostBox981
23-01-2016, 16:45
Not really answers on your question from my side, I just took the chance to get some clarification for myself. Once again, thanks to Jussi we learned a little more about suspension... :cool:

Haiden
23-01-2016, 17:23
Thanks - what do you think of the temp spread across the tyre surface? If I'm getting spread, but no appreciable tyre wear then is that ok?

In the end, I guess it depends on the track, race length, if it's a time trial, etc. But I learned, and often hear repeated, that the inner and outer should both be within 5 degrees of the middle, and that's pretty much the rule I follow. Reason being, when the inner and outer are both within 5 degrees of the middle, it suggests you're getting a more even contact patch. If your inner is 102 and your middle 95, then that suggests you're riding on the inside of the tire and not getting enough grip from the middle and outer.

Jussi Viljami Karjalainen
23-01-2016, 17:32
FWIW when we discussed this stuff in WMD, Doug Arnao, one of the physics devs, said that with bias ply tyres in real life you'd want to see something like 5-8 degrees Celsius of difference between inside and outside, and with radials more like 8-11 degrees Celsius. Even more than that would probably still be quicker due to camber thrust effect (you CAN actually get more cornering grip even while you have less rubber touching the ground, since the camber effect can be just that strong IRL), but it'd eat up the tyres super quick on the inside and isn't worth it, diminishing returns. And it also can start to affect your straight line grip too much.

I'm not sure our camber thrust effect is large enough to warrant this method though. There is some camber thrust but not that much.

EDIT: Also the temperature measurement points vs. the lateral resolution of the tyre causes some of the results to be a bit more mellowed out in the display than they perhaps really are, so it's perhaps best to err on the side of caution.

Jason PLAdoh
24-01-2016, 09:47
It's interesting to know that zero camber can increase straightline speed, might explain why people gain ground so easily. somthing else to play with.

Thanx Jussi & MortICi

J

DreamsKnight
24-01-2016, 10:23
Please can one of the German guys tell me the German word for camber? Since release of patch 7 I read a lot about the camber issue but as I installed the German version I never read the word "camber" anywhere. Is it "Spur" or "Sturz" or something completely different? Internet translation doesn´t work for me, only leads to some irrelevant translations not referring to cars at all. Thanks. :distrust:

i had same problem. at the end now i launch english version. you can change language with 2 click in steam.

hkraft300
24-01-2016, 11:24
Some say to aim for a temp variation.
I'm not sure if temp spread from in-game telemetry can be used to get a feel for contact patch and setting camber. If temps a little closer to the tread surface were being shown, then maybe you could set camber using temp readings (i think its what Jussi mentions in his last post above).


It's interesting to know that zero camber can increase straightline speed, might explain why people gain ground so easily. somthing else to play with.

Thanx Jussi & MortICi

J

That's pre-patch 7 when there was a camber exploit in the game.

PostBox981
24-01-2016, 12:19
i had same problem. at the end now i launch english version. you can change language with 2 click in steam.

Thanks, I will keep that in mind for the next translation problem which will occur sooner or later. :untroubled:

DreamsKnight
24-01-2016, 13:08
Thanks, I will keep that in mind for the next translation problem which will occur sooner or later. :untroubled:

Right click properties language
;)