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ProjectCARSFiend
10-02-2016, 06:46
I'm just wondering, why is there for some reason, in some cars that have a handbrake in real life, no handbrake option. An example is recently I was driving the 2015 Mustang GT, and noticed it didn't have one. I thought this was kinda weird, as I've seen pics of the interior of this car and it clearly has one. Basically, what I'm asking is to add a handbrake option to any of the cars that are missing one, that in real life do. Is this possible or is it harder then I think it would be?

Mad Al
10-02-2016, 10:04
The Mustang GT has already got a hand brake... a fairly poor one, but it is there.

ProjectCARSFiend
10-02-2016, 11:52
The Mustang GT has already got a hand brake... a fairly poor one, but it is there.

I mean like a handbrake that the rear wheels actually lock up, you know, like they would in real life? If they don't, as far as I'm concerned, there is no handbrake. And what about all the other cars that are missing a handbrake, what's up with that?

MysterG
10-02-2016, 11:57
I mean like a handbrake that the rear wheels actually lock up, you know, like they would in real life? If they don't, as far as I'm concerned, there is no handbrake. And what about all the other cars that are missing a handbrake, what's up with that?

Perhaps you could provide a list of those cars that you feel are missing a hand brake? "all the other cars" is a bit vague.

Mad Al
10-02-2016, 12:47
I mean like a handbrake that the rear wheels actually lock up, you know, like they would in real life? If they don't, as far as I'm concerned, there is no handbrake. And what about all the other cars that are missing a handbrake, what's up with that?

The purpose of a hand brake is to stop a car rolling when parked, it's not specifically fitted to lock the wheels at high speed... having said that, the Mustang does a good job of throwing itself sideways if you hit the handbrake whilst cornering.. I'd call that as working fine
As for "all the other cars", race cars don't have or need a hand brake..

Alex Hobbs
10-02-2016, 12:53
As for "all the other cars", race cars don't have or need a hand brake..

You should try the RADBUL at some point, it's got the same problem with an asthmatic handbrake. For some that problem works, but not a formula drift car

Mad Al
10-02-2016, 13:05
You should try the RADBUL at some point, it's got the same problem with an asthmatic handbrake. For some that problem works, but not a formula drift car

I'll be pedantic and say, I'd not class the Drift car as a race car..

that aside, are you using auto clutch, as that makes a difference to the perceived power of the handbrake (as it always dips the clutch when applying the handbrake), without auto clutch, unless you have a big lift to stop driving the wheels the handbrake, does indeed, feel pretty weak (I think some people think you can lock the wheels whilst still chucking 1200HP at them too!).

Alex Hobbs
10-02-2016, 13:06
I'll be pedantic and say, I'd not class the Drift car as a race car..

that aside, are you using auto clutch, as that makes a difference to the perceived power of the handbrake (as it always dips the clutch when applying the handbrake), without auto clutch, unless you have a big lift to stop driving the wheels the handbrake, does indeed, feel pretty weak (I think some people think you can lock the wheels whilst still chucking 1200HP at them too!).

Us WMD guys put our specs in our sigs for a reason you know ;)

Jussi Viljami Karjalainen
10-02-2016, 13:29
I'll be pedantic and say, I'd not class the Drift car as a race car..

that aside, are you using auto clutch, as that makes a difference to the perceived power of the handbrake (as it always dips the clutch when applying the handbrake), without auto clutch, unless you have a big lift to stop driving the wheels the handbrake, does indeed, feel pretty weak (I think some people think you can lock the wheels whilst still chucking 1200HP at them too!).I think I read somewhere that at least some drift cars are built so that the handbrake lever always disengages the clutch as well... =)

Might've just been a Ken Block story though. =)

Mad Al
10-02-2016, 13:56
Us WMD guys put our specs in our sigs for a reason you know ;)

Signature, what signature ;) (us WMD guys get so used to seeing them they don't always register :))


I think I read somewhere that at least some drift cars are built so that the handbrake lever always disengages the clutch as well... =)

Might've just been a Ken Block story though. =)

That would make sense.. but the Radbull doesn't do that, except with auto clutch, hence my question.

Silraed
11-02-2016, 09:27
Doesn't it do this by locking up the front or rear wheels, depending if it's front or rear wheel drive?

Locking wheels and stopping as fast as possible seems counterproductive.

Tomcul
11-02-2016, 09:38
Yes, I know the MAIN purpose of a handbrake is to stop a car from rolling when it's parked, but isn't another purpose to stop the car as quickly as possible in the event of an emergency, or when the main brakes fail. Isn't that is why it's called the E(mergency) brake? Doesn't it do this by locking up the front or rear wheels, depending if it's front or rear wheel drive?

WOW!!! You actually believe this?!

deedub777
11-02-2016, 10:08
I mapped the handbrake to a button to hold it on the line for starts (rev engine in first gear, let go of button at green light. But when on a gradient (Spa for example) the car rolls down the hill! Feels like the button is mapped to the clutch rather than the handbrake (Try the Merc 190E for example). Yes I use auto clutch, no I can't left foot brake or use the clutch (not enough feet;))

Sankyo
11-02-2016, 10:27
Yes, I know the MAIN purpose of a handbrake is to stop a car from rolling when it's parked, but isn't another purpose to stop the car as quickly as possible in the event of an emergency, or when the main brakes fail. Isn't that is why it's called the E(mergency) brake? Doesn't it do this by locking up the front or rear wheels, depending if it's front or rear wheel drive?
I've been told that the emergency brake name is a historic misnomer that, like many things, cannot be get rid of anymore. The handbrake hasn't been an emergency brake for a very long time, or maybe even has never been (I'd look it up in Wikipedia but I'm short on time...).

Angst1974
11-02-2016, 13:27
It's mostly called a parking brake here in the USA . Used for when your car is parked .

Mark Quigley
11-02-2016, 13:41
I've been told that the emergency brake name is a historic misnomer that, like many things, cannot be get rid of anymore. The handbrake hasn't been an emergency brake for a very long time, or maybe even has never been (I'd look it up in Wikipedia but I'm short on time...).

It still has to be on a separate system so the emergency aspect is still retained to this day.
I call it the handbrake and it has a few uses :p
Every single jap car I have owned with a mechanical system built into the rear calipers has been hopeless.

Panopticism
11-02-2016, 23:48
The integral hand brake on that car's rear brakes is useless. The brakes on that car are useless.

"Emergency brake" is indeed a bit of a misnomer. It was never really the best option to crank the hand brake in the event of complete brake failure. The likelihood of a complete brake failure is so low now that modern cars tend to have dual circuit brakes as standard.

ProjectCARSFiend
12-02-2016, 07:47
WOW!!! You actually believe this?!

Geez, you don't have to be a dick about it. Ok, maybe what I said was a bit misinformed, but all I was trying to ask was if the handbrake stops your car from rolling when parked, doesn't it do this by locking (in the case of a rear wheel drive car) the rear wheels? If it does, if you were driving along and pulled the handbrake, would it not lock the wheels? Or does the handbrake somehow work differently when you are actually driving as opposed to when you're parking? If it does, could you please explain?

MysterG
12-02-2016, 08:21
Ok, maybe what I said was a bit stupid, but what I was saying was since the handbrake stops your car from rolling when parked, doesn't it do this by locking (in the case of a rear wheel drive car) the rear wheels? If it does, if you were driving along and pulled the handbrake, would it not lock the wheels? Or does the handbrake somehow work differently when you are actually driving as opposed to when you're parking? If it does, could you please explain?

When moving the engine is powering the wheels, forcing them to turn. At rest there are no forces trying to turn the wheels apart from gravity if you are on a slope.
Correspondingly the amount of force required to overcome these forces is different when moving and at rest. The hand brake works exactly the same in both instances which is why it can easily lock the wheels when at rest but is not able to do so as easily (if at all) when in motion.


Geez, you don't have to be a dick about it.

Not sure why you felt the need to edit your post to include an unecessary insult. That's not going to encourage people to help you.

Tomcul
12-02-2016, 09:56
Geez, you don't have to be a dick about it. Ok, maybe what I said was a bit misinformed, but all I was trying to ask was if the handbrake stops your car from rolling when parked, doesn't it do this by locking (in the case of a rear wheel drive car) the rear wheels? If it does, if you were driving along and pulled the handbrake, would it not lock the wheels? Or does the handbrake somehow work differently when you are actually driving as opposed to when you're parking? If it does, could you please explain?

Sorry dude didn't mean to be a dick but you've started a thread kinda complaining about handbrakes not working right, but you don't know how it works..
As was explained you need to press the clutch when moving to lock the wheels but you also need a good handbrake especially for rwd cars as you have the added weight of the drivetrain connected to the rear wheels.. Fwd cars lock the rears easier. But lots of newer cars have handbrakes built into calipers and they're just not up to the job of locking the wheels like the older drum brake setup..

Mad Al
12-02-2016, 11:01
I mapped the handbrake to a button to hold it on the line for starts (rev engine in first gear, let go of button at green light. But when on a gradient (Spa for example) the car rolls down the hill! Feels like the button is mapped to the clutch rather than the handbrake (Try the Merc 190E for example). Yes I use auto clutch, no I can't left foot brake or use the clutch (not enough feet;))

that car has no hand brake.... all the road cars should have a hand brake, the race cars don't (general rule, there may be the odd exception, which I'm sure someone will come in with if they find it)

You can practice a heal toe technique to hold the brake on the start line, whilst putting in some throttle, the handbrake then gives you an effective clutch at the same time (due to auto clutch).. so only one foot required... (that's no different to using a manual clutch and holding the car on the brakes using both feet)

ProjectCARSFiend
13-02-2016, 01:29
When moving the engine is powering the wheels, forcing them to turn. At rest there are no forces trying to turn the wheels apart from gravity if you are on a slope.
Correspondingly the amount of force required to overcome these forces is different when moving and at rest. The hand brake works exactly the same in both instances which is why it can easily lock the wheels when at rest but is not able to do so as easily (if at all) when in motion.



Not sure why you felt the need to edit your post to include an unecessary insult. That's not going to encourage people to help you.

Ok, I confess, what I said was an unnecessary insult, I'm sorry, can we all be friends again now?

ProjectCARSFiend
13-02-2016, 01:34
Sorry dude didn't mean to be a dick but you've started a thread kinda complaining about handbrakes not working right, but you don't know how it works..
As was explained you need to press the clutch when moving to lock the wheels but you also need a good handbrake especially for rwd cars as you have the added weight of the drivetrain connected to the rear wheels.. Fwd cars lock the rears easier. But lots of newer cars have handbrakes built into calipers and they're just not up to the job of locking the wheels like the older drum brake setup..

Ok, yeah, now I can see that I clearly didn't know how handbrakes work and how they work today. I was just always used to the idea back in the day how handbrakes could usually lock the wheels, but clearly from what you explained, that's not the case so much today. And sorry for the insult, that was really immature of me.

VaplexR
13-02-2016, 06:12
we should be able to change the values of the braking power of the handbrake.