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Grijo
26-04-2016, 15:49
Good afternoon. Almost an year after Project Cars being launched, after almost 450 hours racing and after I made the "Project Cars: The claimant's manual", thatīs a personal point of view of a consumer and a honest point of view of a gamer about Project Cars todays state. This topic is not meant to complain or praise, it is only a personal opinion. I will write that in topics, pros and cons.

Cons
1. General instability - I have never seen a game so instable. After almost an year, crashes and disconnections happens frequently, most that I can accept in a game like this. Is very frustrating and a game breaker.

2. Undrivable cars - Most of the cars donīt have a great handling with default setups, but acceptable. Some are really bad in default setups. But other cars are simply impossible to race, even if you are good to setup a car. And some cars simply changed (I donīt know what) in a bad, bad, bad way. Letīs take the Caper Stockcar for a example. In the first time that I raced that car, it felt great! And, in that time, I did not even know how to setup a car. I simply chose a car and track. Now, Iīm not able to keep the car on the track, itīs like Iīm running on ice! For me, here are some cars impossible to drive with Dualshock 4, TC and SC set to OFF: Audi R8 V10, Mercedes A45 AMG, Caper Monterey Stockcar, Renault Clio Cup, Ruf CTR 3, Ford Sierra RS500, BMW 320 TC, Mazda Radbul and Ford Falcon Supercar V8 (these are the ones that i can remember).

3. Problems with light exposure in the cockpit of some cars - It is a very annoying problem for a person who only plays in the cockpit cam. Some cars were adjusted in these past months, but other cars persists with that problem. RUF CTR Yellow Bird is the worse. But we have the RGT8 (Road), all the Ginettas, BMW 320 turbo group 5, McLaren F1 (Road) and F1 GTR (these are the ones that I can remember).

4. Tracks - Silverstone Classic, a beautiful track that are useless for online racing. Various problems already reported to SMS team, and none of those resolved. A real shame. Beside that, we have all of these tracks useless for online racing because they donīt have pits: Azure Coast, Califórnia Highway, Circuit de Barcelona – Catalunya Club, Mojave, Nurburgring Müllenbach, Oschersleben C Circuit, Silverstone Stowe, Snetterton 100 and Willow Springs Horse Thief Mile. Also, I was expecting to race in Indianápolis and Daytona because these were announced. It seems is not gonna happen.

5. Small varied problems – The Audi R8 V10 transmission still jumps to neutral after the car gets a strong bump. In my opinion, the headlights donīt illuminate well in clear night races. Some kind of tyres in some cars donīt work properly, like intermediates in GT3. And the telemetry could be more complete, with more information about the engine condition, temperature and other stuff. I could add to this the fact that, in some menus (graphics, controller adjusts) we donīt have explanations about what consequences we have changing one or another option, we have to guess.

6. Unbalanced categories, cars placed in the wrong categories, categories with only one car... in this regard, I found the game pretty messy.

Pros
1. I never invested 450 hours in a game, never! And even after that amount of time, I feel that I didnīt enjoyed all of the content that Project Cars offers. I want more!!!

2. All content unlocked since the beginning. If you buy the game and all the DLCīs today, in your first time you can choose whatever car or track that you want. This is awesome! It showed to the famous franchises (GT and Forza) that we donīt need a billion of cars to buy, we donīt need to race a championship for ten times to buy a used Ford Ka to run another championship ten times. I donīt want a "school" to show me how to brake or accelerate. I donīt want to buy 25 different Miatas. I want to grab a car, a track, qualify, and race like there is no tomorrow to win! And thatīs what Project Cars gave me!

3. Describe the feel of racing in Project Cars is something difficult to explain for me. One thing I know for sure: none of the existent asphalt racing games that I played gave me that sensation of thrill! I donīt want to race three laps to win at any cost! I want to setup my car, test it, not good, do it again, until it feels good. After this, race my guts in qualify. After that, I want to sweat, scream, curse and maybe, just maybe, win the race after twenty laps (minimum)!

4. The majority of the cars in Project Cars feels incredible! The handling, response, graphics and sounds...OH MY GOD!!!

5. Variable weather and time progression brings the "reality sensation" that other games donīt. And with the graphics that Project Cars presents, it brings to us those "WOW moments". Sometimes, I donīt know if I continue to race or stop the car and admire the scenery.

6. Some people keep complaining about the A.I. In my opinion, the A.I. is sensational! Competitive, sometimes they fight with themselves and throw each other of the track, like humans do when they are fighting for positions. They are not the bunch of morons we used to encounter in other games just driving in a line, one behind the other, only to difficult your objective to achieve the first position. Those guys are not racers, are drivers. And, in other games, I donīt call it "grid", I call it "traffic".

7. The large amount of tracks in this game is awesome! Project Cars donīt have 1000 cars. I donīt remember the exactly number, but I think is around 120 cars (with all DLCīs). And I can say is, If you add to that the variety of weather and time, you have more than enough to race during 450 hours without experiencing everything the game offers.


My conclusions:
1. This is not a perfect game. Away from this, have serious flaws.
2. Not all content that has been announced is present in the game, a fact that I consider serious.
3. Thereīs a lot of room for improvement but, for a first attempt, I have to say Congratulations SMS!
4. If you want a racing game only to play occasionally, an easy game, only to grab the first position in 3 laps, donīt buy it because, probably, you wonīt like it. But, if you want a challenge, that need some knowledge about cars and setups, that need some dedication, thatīs the title for you, at least in the consoles.
5. Arcade? Simulation? Simcade? I donīt care, itīs simply a hell of a game that demands a lot of you to achieve the glory! And I want more of this!
6. If I feel sorry to have bought this game on pre-order ? No. If I had known all the facts surrounding this game after a year , I would buy anyway? Yes.
7. For me, this game became a reference for what will come!

People can ask why I wrote this. I wrote because I wanted to demonstrate for SMS studios my personal view of this game, without rant, without exalting a perfection that doesnīt exist, only showing what I like and do not like, simple as that. Thanks to everyone who read and, please, do not turn this into a rant thread. I'm also not discussing what is the best or worst racing game because I like them all (or almost), each game has its proposal and is well within what is presented.

PS: Sorry about any mistakes in my english. And please Cluck, donīt ban me!

Konan
26-04-2016, 16:30
I don't think cluck is going to ban anyone for giving his honest opinion (although he must be very eager to ban someone by now... :cool: )
You stated your pro's and con's about the game as you see it...some i agree with...some i don't...that's personal preference and hardly a reason to start a rant imo...
All in all a good thread and it gives the Devs a nice summarised overview of possible issues to consider (now or in the future)
Good job! :cool:

Rambo_Commando
26-04-2016, 16:50
Nice write up. But I have to disagree with a lot of your cons. I'm also on PS4 and use the dual shock controller. So I guess we can compare apples to apples.
1-I have only had the game crash 3 times since I bought it on release day.

2-if you were expecting to "car hop" in this game then you're in for a surprise. Each car is different and each car requires practice to drive and even more practice to master. From my experience, every car is driveable, with the Lotus 98T being to most difficult.

3-I only play in cockpit mode and I've never really noticed this. The McLarens were my "go to" cars.

4-that's personal taste is guess. I still think there is loads of tracks to make MP interesting.

5-completely agree with you. Especially needing some sort of graphic/HUD indicating what's damaged on the car.

And I agree with all your pros.

Grijo
26-04-2016, 17:05
....
2-if you were expecting to "car hop" in this game then you're in for a surprise. Each car is different and each car requires practice to drive and even more practice to master. From my experience, every car is driveable, with the Lotus 98T being to most difficult.
...


I found more easier to drive the Lotus 98T Renault than the Audi R8 V10, Mercedes A45 AMG, Caper Monterey Stockcar, Renault Clio Cup. Those cars, for me, are almost impossible to get a clean lap. Go figure...I race without TC or SC.

cluck
26-04-2016, 18:30
PS: Sorry about any mistakes in my english. And please Cluck, donīt ban me!

I don't think cluck is going to ban anyone for giving his honest opinionIndeed Konan. I think it's fair to say that neither myself nor any of the far longer serving mods would ban the OP (or anybody else, for that matter) for voicing an opinion in a calm, well balanced manner :).

BigAlex
26-04-2016, 18:34
Great Summary. I don't have 10% of your knowledge of the game, but I agree with most of what you said. A few tweaks here and there and this game would be much better. I think one thing that pisses me off so bad is a lack of a players log. I should be able to consult my previous laps in a specific track and shouldn't need to rely on a pen and a piece of paper to register my lap times, set ups, liveries, etc.

FS7
26-04-2016, 19:13
Especially needing some sort of graphic/HUD indicating what's damaged on the car.
Agreed.
I remember last year suggesting a damage indicator on the hud along with tyre wear indicator. We got tyre wear indicator but never got damage indicator.

-carbo-
27-04-2016, 00:31
Although we still have a league running in pCars that we'll see through, a lot of the folk I race with have become increasingly disillusioned with the game in general and the lack of real progress since release. This game has soo much potential, unfortunately it isn't maturing quickly enough (lately not at all) and everyone I race with is jumping ship to AC, including me. On the flip side, AC has progressed leaps and bounds, it too has some shortfalls no doubt but MP is working out to be a far more enjoyable experience so far and some of the mods and tools available are amazing. If you haven't done so recently I would urge any simracing fan to give it a go, if however you are more interested in an SP experience pCars may be your best choice.

With AC about to release on console it will be interesting to see what happens moving forward?

In the meantime I hope that SMS can get it together for pCars 2.

m355y
27-04-2016, 06:59
I think overall it's more stable now, I haven't had too many problems with it in recent months although I certainly haven't put 450hrs into it! My wife would have divorced me. I think as far as console racers go, it's probably almost on a par with Forza 6 - better in some ways (deeper, more focused simulation of motorsport), and worse in others (gets absolutely trumped by F6 on cars, tracks, variety and touches like official series/liveries). Actually, that's a good achievement. You make a racing game from scratch, on presumably a far, far lower budget and come close to matching a series like Forza on your first attempt. It bodes well for PC2 and beyond. I think a lot of us have got a bit bogged down in negativity, because sure, it's not quite what lots of us hoped for. It has less content than we'd been led to believe, and announcing stuff that never makes it in the game is a bit of a PR **** up at best. I think for a few people the issue is actually less the game itself and more the way SMS have handled a lot of the negativity from a PR perspective. This forum hasn't always been a comfortable place to be at times.

I think the thing for me is that it does spread itself too thinly. Yeah, you can drive the Indycar DW12 and it's nicely realised in the game, but there are no official teams/drivers/liveries, no street circuits and no ovals. Same with the console version not being able to do a multiclass WEC style race with LMP1/LMP2/GT3 cars on the same track at the same time. WTF. It's all there, you should be able to do it, yet you can't. For a game that's aimed at real racing fans, that's almost unforgivable and I still to this day can't believe they didn't find a way to add that afterwards, at least. If it works with a mod on the PC version, what's the problem?

Right now I'd give it about a 7/10. And by that I mean it does some things very, very well but has some serious flaws like I've put above that probably won't be much of an issue to more casual fans - but isn't the game specifically aimed at those of us who want something more realistic and authentic? It's like it doesn't quite know what it wants to be. I'm hoping they take this on board for the sequel.

I think Assetto Corsa will probably expose a few of those issues all the more when it comes out, and I'm provbably more looking forward to that now, but I've enjoyed my time with PCars a lot and will definitely go back to it quite regularly because there's nothing on console that compares to the feeling of being in the middle of a really intense battle with the AI for 14th place in the middle of a GT3 field, or anything close.

APR193
27-04-2016, 08:39
it's probably almost on a par with Forza 6 - better in some ways (deeper, more focused simulation of motorsport), and worse in others (gets absolutely trumped by F6 on cars, tracks, variety and touches like official series/liveries).

I personally would have said that the track list from Pcars is a lot lot better than Forza 6. Much more variety and larger number of tracks (believe I'm right on that one?). The massive number of American tracks on Forza that just don't flow bored me away from the game quite quickly. VIR especially when it was added with the Porsches is one of the worst tracks I've ever driven

m355y
27-04-2016, 09:07
F6 has street tracks and ovals. PCars has a huge number of tracks, but they're all road courses. What I wouldn't give for Long Beach in PCars.

APR193
27-04-2016, 10:37
F6 has street tracks and ovals. PCars has a huge number of tracks, but they're all road courses. What I wouldn't give for Long Beach in PCars.

True, forgot about ovals etc. Even with street circuits and ovals I'd much rather take Pcars track list over F6, but that's personal preference.

Leper Messiah
27-04-2016, 13:21
I'd like there to be more US tracks in PCARS, the aforementioned Long Beach.....plus Sebring, Road Atlanta, Mosport, maybe lesser known tracks like Barber Motorsports Park. Then again I'm very happy with the US tracks we have!

RomKnight
27-04-2016, 15:11
After all this time, in Portugal, people just stopped playing pCARS. AC/rF2 are "kings" and now Automobilista and R3E gaining momentum as well (especially automobilista).

But pCARS was just abandoned. I've actually predicted this months ago and turns out I hate to be right sometimes.

Results, I stopped simracing! (TBH i really don't have the time atm but racing outside my timezone is even harder :( )

on the upside... "more time" for pC2. OK, not really but changes increased dramatically. I just have to turn the damn pc on one of this days :D

Jezza819
27-04-2016, 16:37
Coming up on the first anniversary the game has gotten better for me. My biggest gripe was the crashing to the dashboard but since whatever patch (I can't remember specifically) it hasn't happened since.

The addition of so many more cars, more tracks, myself learning more about the features of the game (time progression and varying race time starts), just the driveability of the cars, all goes into a great experience for me.

If I had to ding it for anything it would be for some missing manufacturers and the lack of actual race liveries which I know is a licensing issue. Half point off for each so I would give it 9/10 at this point.

Krus Control
27-04-2016, 17:58
For rach car there is a solution rooted in logic that reflects how you would solve such a problem in real life. If you really want to drive any of these cars ask me and I can provide you with an excellent and drivable setup. With some like the Radbul or RS500 though, even a good setup might not save you from how difficult those cars are. Still I already have stellar setups for both.

Edit: one car at a time though please

Rasp
27-04-2016, 18:18
For rach car there is a solution rooted in logic that reflects how you would solve such a problem in real life. If you really want to drive any of these cars ask me and I can provide you with an excellent and drivable setup. With some like the Radbul or RS500 though, even a good setup might not save you from how difficult those cars are. Still I already have stellar setups for both.

Edit: one car at a time though please

I would like a full list one car at a time of all 65+ car setups before midnight, thank you.

Krus Control
27-04-2016, 18:42
I would like a full list one car at a time of all 65+ car setups before midnight, thank you.

I've got almost all of them to a sort of half way point where they're racable. And probably half of them to a complete or near complete point. That's including all DLC too. But if somebody asks for a formula C, Caper stock car, Audi R8, Formula gulf, and McLaren GT3 tune all at once, I might just post a GT40 tune and say "go drive the GT40."

Rasp
27-04-2016, 18:44
Seems like you have been very busy Krus Control, well done.

Black_Gold_Saw
27-04-2016, 19:06
The only thing I really care about is that after a year a full frikin year. The game still loses controller support out of nowhere and the game freezes every 5 frikin minutes.
Im spending more time loading up the game and loading into the race than that im actually driving. I mean come on get ur stuff together and patch it already.

Krus Control
27-04-2016, 19:18
The only thing I really care about is that after a year a full frikin year. The game still loses controller support out of nowhere and the game freezes every 5 frikin minutes.
Im spending more time loading up the game and loading into the race than that im actually driving. I mean come on get ur stuff together and patch it already.

Yeah my hit rate for game launches to race STARTS (let alone finishes) is less than 50%.

Konan
27-04-2016, 20:34
...so far for the no-rant request of the op...

Krus Control
27-04-2016, 21:26
Honestly though, if we're just talking about our feelings about the game this sort of thing is going to come up. I have a lot more good things to say than bad about this game. But man, does it infuriate me on a consistent basis. Every session I put in is affected by huge bugs.

Konan
27-04-2016, 21:40
Honestly though, if we're just talking about our feelings about the game this sort of thing is going to come up. I have a lot more good things to say than bad about this game. But man, does it infuriate me on a consistent basis. Every session I put in is affected by huge bugs.

Understandable...and i wasn't really reffering to your post...more the one above.
I can understand the grieves about those things but still there are more civilised manors of expressing ones' aggrevations...

Haiden
27-04-2016, 21:40
People can ask why I wrote this. I wrote because I wanted to demonstrate for SMS studios my personal view of this game, without rant, without exalting a perfection that doesnīt exist, only showing what I like and do not like, simple as that. Thanks to everyone who read and, please, do not turn this into a rant thread. I'm also not discussing what is the best or worst racing game because I like them all (or almost), each game has its proposal and is well within what is presented.

PS: Sorry about any mistakes in my english. And please Cluck, donīt ban me!

Great post, man! And spot on. 450 hours on a game with some frustrating issues, just proves how awesome this game is. I've never put even half as much time into any other game either, even the bug-free ones. That definitely says a lot. :)

Krus Control
27-04-2016, 21:45
I would say the amount of time I've put into PCARS is approaching the amount of time I've put into all other games I've played my entire life put together. And I've been gaming hard since NES.

Malcstar
27-04-2016, 22:06
@OP, feel the same way. Especially about how much of the game I still haven't touched yet. I could've just bought the game for the Caper Stock car. Hopefully the technical issues get worked out for PCars 2 and that console specific features be addressed.

racesafegrandad
28-04-2016, 09:45
I would say the amount of time I've put into PCARS is approaching the amount of time I've put into all other games I've played my entire life put together. And I've been gaming hard since NES.

I agree. All previous race sims did not give me the feel of really being there or really in a race. But P.Cars does. My empty days of retirement are now over. I just race all day :)

Bunga412
28-04-2016, 11:16
Yeah it's OKAY I guess.
Wife hates it.
She never gets to see me.
Oh well...

Grijo
28-04-2016, 12:33
For rach car there is a solution rooted in logic that reflects how you would solve such a problem in real life. If you really want to drive any of these cars ask me and I can provide you with an excellent and drivable setup. With some like the Radbul or RS500 though, even a good setup might not save you from how difficult those cars are. Still I already have stellar setups for both.

Edit: one car at a time though please

Thanks bro, I really want to drive those cars. Iīm not an expert but Iīm good to setup a car. But these ones that i referred, I tried everything. Can we start with Caper?


I've got almost all of them to a sort of half way point where they're racable. And probably half of them to a complete or near complete point. That's including all DLC too. But if somebody asks for a formula C, Caper stock car, Audi R8, Formula gulf, and McLaren GT3 tune all at once, I might just post a GT40 tune and say "go drive the GT40."

GT40 in the beginning (06/2015) was a nightmare, now handle like a dream, awesome car!!!


...so far for the no-rant request of the op...

Thanks Konan!


Great post, man! And spot on. 450 hours on a game with some frustrating issues, just proves how awesome this game is. I've never put even half as much time into any other game either, even the bug-free ones. That definitely says a lot. :)


@OP, feel the same way. Especially about how much of the game I still haven't touched yet. I could've just bought the game for the Caper Stock car. Hopefully the technical issues get worked out for PCars 2 and that console specific features be addressed.


I agree. All previous race sims did not give me the feel of really being there or really in a race. But P.Cars does. My empty days of retirement are now over. I just race all day :)

Thanks for reading my post and for your feedback. Thatīs what Iīm talking about, we know that game has flaws, but this game is still irresistible, isnīt it? I race with some Brazilian friends every tuesday, 2 races per night, 1 open wheel and 1 of other category, since november/2015. And we have so much to play yet, none of us are hyped about Assetto Corsa. Ok, could be a good game, but we simply are not caring about.

shrike005
28-04-2016, 13:12
Luckily, I haven't experienced so many problems with projectcars as some of you have.
Three chrashes in total, everyone of them probably caused by overheating since my PS4 isn't optimaly ventilated.
As for the game itself, very stable and no bugs so far.
I play carrer only.
For me, ProjectCars is very well made game.
I play RPGs a lot. When you spend 10 hours on a quest and realise you've encountered a bug and you have to load a 15 hours old save, then you can feel your teeth falling off.
With races - restart.

Krus Control
28-04-2016, 16:24
Thanks bro, I really want to drive those cars. Iīm not an expert but Iīm good to setup a car. But these ones that i referred, I tried everything. Can we start with Caper?

I actually have an excellent tune for this car already. Make sure you get the longitudinal bias and track bar where I have them.

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Grijo
28-04-2016, 17:17
I actually have an excellent tune for this car already. Make sure you get the longitudinal bias and track bar where I have them.



Thanks a lot friend, Iīll try that later and let you know :)

Grijo
21-11-2016, 14:00
2. Undrivable cars - Most of the cars donīt have a great handling with default setups, but acceptable. Some are really bad in default setups. But other cars are simply impossible to race, even if you are good to setup a car. And some cars simply changed (I donīt know what) in a bad, bad, bad way. Letīs take the Caper Stockcar for a example. In the first time that I raced that car, it felt great! And, in that time, I did not even know how to setup a car. I simply chose a car and track. Now, Iīm not able to keep the car on the track, itīs like Iīm running on ice! For me, here are some cars impossible to drive with Dualshock 4, TC and SC set to OFF: Audi R8 V10, Mercedes A45 AMG, Caper Monterey Stockcar, Renault Clio Cup, Ruf CTR 3, Ford Sierra RS500, BMW 320 TC, Mazda Radbul and Ford Falcon Supercar V8 (these are the ones that i can remember).


I think this statement that I did some months ago gone "down the drain" after I purchased my first wheel, a G29. I didnīt drove every car that I related in the post. But I already experienced the Audi R8 and the Mercedes A45. With the wheel, even with default setups, I had fun with these cars. I tried other road cars such the Rufs RGT8 and Yellowbird, Pagani Huayra and the Mustang GT. These road cars were never a great experience for me but now itīs totally diferent. The Audi R8 and the Mercedes A45 were the worst, I hated these ones. First lap with the Merc in the G29 and I said "Whaaat? Really? This car is that good? No way man!!!" Now Iīm like "Gamepad? What is this? This is something to eat?” Project Cars now turned into a brand new game for me. I see you in 600 hours.