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Androphonomania
24-08-2016, 16:01
While Assetto Corsa had to make a day one patch for the ps4 to exclude fanatec support. Will there be a patch for project cars to exclude fanatec support on the ps4?

I am frightened, this is a ridiculous move by sony.

This destroys the racing communities on the ps4.

Aldo Zampatti
24-08-2016, 16:22
As per https://www.fanatec.com/forum/discussion/187/playstation-compatibility:


You might have already noticed that we have removed the icons to show the PlayStation compatibility on our website. So what does that mean?

As part of the licensing process for a new, officially licensed racing wheel, Sony Computer Entertainment (SCE) has asked us to stop promoting our unlicensed wheels as beeing PlayStation compatible and we are happy to comply with that. As soon as we have a fully licensed PlayStation wheel on the market, we will officially announce the compatibility again.


If you already purchased a Fanatec product with previously promoted PS3 or PS4 compatibility, basically nothing will change for you. The compatibility for those wheels still depends solely on the game developers and if they decide to add/keep support for their wheels in their games or not.
If you purchase a new wheel from us from now on we will only guarantee the PC or Xbox One compatibility as advertised.


I hope you understand our position and rest assured that we do everything to make our products as compatible as possible.

pavano
24-08-2016, 16:38
As per https://www.fanatec.com/forum/discussion/187/playstation-compatibility:

this is stone-age old from March.

I think, nearly every Fanatec user knows about this statement from back then.
But now it seems, Sony is doubling down on developers to explicitly exclude Fanatec support.
Is was in the disc version of AC, and the day one patch removed it.
So Androphonomania has a point in asking whether SMS has to remove Fanatec support with the next patch as well.

Sessionerror
24-08-2016, 16:51
And the other question is: Does SMS know anything about PS4 Firmware 4.0 and if the support for Fanatec wheels might be removed with that? I guess both are questions, many pCARS users are wondering about right now, so an official statement might help here :)

Sankyo
24-08-2016, 18:37
Old games will still function, new games are not allowed to support unlicensed hardware.

pavano
24-08-2016, 18:59
Old games will still function, new games are not allowed to support unlicensed hardware.

are you extrapolating or do you actually know for sure?
And by sure I mean something like a statement by Sony that is specific to a game, not just the vagueness they are giving out lately.

Sankyo
24-08-2016, 19:04
are you extrapolating or do you actually know for sure?
And by sure I mean something like a statement by Sony that is specific to a game, not just the vagueness they are giving out lately.

Fanatec have currently only information from Sony that new games are only allowed to support licensed hardware. If you seek 100% certainty from Sony then no-one can give it; Sony also changed the rules of the game or of the blue with this move :p

pavano
24-08-2016, 19:14
Fanatec have currently only information from Sony that new games are only allowed to support licensed hardware. If you seek 100% certainty from Sony then no-one can give it; Sony also changed the rules of the game or of the blue with this move :p

that's what I meant.
Nobody can know for sure what Sony could force onto developers if they want a new patch to be pushed.
So, who knows, maybe a new Pcars patch could remove Fanatec support after all.
Sony is unpredictable.

Boskapongen
24-08-2016, 22:19
Never trust big companies like Sony, Apple and such, they dont care about us at all. They change and add new rules anytime when they feel like it. Selling my PS4 tomorrow, have no use for it anymore.

Ryzza5
25-08-2016, 00:42
Wow what a move. Next they'll be making our old televisions incompatible with the latest consoles because they're not licensed.

There are no PS4-compatible wheels out there subjectively better than my CSR-Elite (which was PS2, PS3, Xbox 360 and PC compatible) so I have no plans on switching wheels to the T300 or whatever else is out there. Do they want me to just throw out a perfectly functioning steering wheel setup purchased for $1300 only 3 years ago?

Maybe a bunch of new wheels will be released to coincide with Gran Turismo Sport but I won't be buying that game. If it wasn't for the Fanatec working with Project CARS on the PS4 I wouldn't actually own that console right now either.



I get the feeling Fanatec may have been 'cheeky' with their practices of emulating a Logitech G25 for PS3 support and this is revenge. Doesn't help the players one bit though.

Fanapryde
25-08-2016, 04:25
Never trust big companies like Sony, Apple and such, they dont care about us at all. They change and add new rules anytime when they feel like it. Selling my PS4 tomorrow, have no use for it anymore.
You did not mention Microsoft. I hope you don't think they are to be thrusted. If so, you will be in for a surprise...:adjoint:

KillerFox1978
25-08-2016, 07:37
I too am worried about this support being taken away. i have put a post on the Sony playstation forum to see if we get any answer to why this is going on. please feel free to put you feeling down to see if we here anything back. i doubt we will but it worth a go

thanks
nick
http://community.eu.playstation.com/t5/PS4/Fanatec-support-PS4/td-p/24483823#thread-replies

Mascot
25-08-2016, 08:26
While Assetto Corsa had to make a day one patch for the ps4 to exclude fanatec support. Will there be a patch for project cars to exclude fanatec support on the ps4?

I am frightened, this is a ridiculous move by sony.

This destroys the racing communities on the ps4.

Not doubting, but do you have a solid source for the bolded part please?

Boskapongen
25-08-2016, 08:31
Not doubting, but do you have a solid source for the bolded part please?

I read lots of comments that the day 1 patch excluded Fanatec support, but not that it was the only reason for the day patch.
Lots of people that got the game one week ago showed taht their Fanatec worked, after patch yesterday all gone.

Same with F1 2016, betatesters had Fanatec support, after release all gone.

Itīs a mess, they all stated in the beggining of this year Assetto would work. Sony should leave this for all games releasing in 2016 IMO and just write, "Compatible but not supported".
Its not the gamers problem they canīt fix this.

EDIT: Still trying to get refund from Sony on my Pre-order, almost one week now, still "investigating".....
They suddenly take the money up front on pre-orders...

Boskapongen
25-08-2016, 08:57
Review:

EDIT: can mods move this to Assetto thread? My bad.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YBzNDY5hMk

Mascot
25-08-2016, 10:21
I read lots of comments that the day 1 patch excluded Fanatec support, but not that it was the only reason for the day patch.
Lots of people that got the game one week ago showed taht their Fanatec worked, after patch yesterday all gone.

Same with F1 2016, betatesters had Fanatec support, after release all gone.

Itīs a mess, they all stated in the beggining of this year Assetto would work. Sony should leave this for all games releasing in 2016 IMO and just write, "Compatible but not supported".
Its not the gamers problem they canīt fix this.

EDIT: Still trying to get refund from Sony on my Pre-order, almost one week now, still "investigating".....
They suddenly take the money up front on pre-orders...

OK, thanks. It has been confirmed from multiple sources.

So, no Fanatec support for pCARS 2 on PS4 then.

Cheerio - it's been emotional.

Boskapongen
25-08-2016, 10:38
OK, thanks. It has been confirmed from multiple sources.

So, no Fanatec support for pCARS 2 on PS4 then.

Cheerio - it's been emotional.

True...i was about to pull the trigger on PS4 "NEO", not gonna happpen. Xbox Scorpio / PC is the path I am taking.

Boskapongen
25-08-2016, 15:41
Check this answer a gamer just got from Sony....LOL

Dear xxxx,

Please contact the Customer Service Sony PlayStation.

In this case , we can tell that this has not been a commercial decision of Sony PlayStation , these incompatibilities can occur due to constant updates to the operating system of our consoles to improve the user experience , so we can not guarantee that all third-party devices are compatible with the PlayStation consoles. In this case we recommend that you contact the manufacturer of your device and check if they are working on creating some firmware that allows compatibility with new versions of operating system PlayStation.

Haiden
25-08-2016, 15:43
Never trust big companies like Sony, Apple and such, they dont care about us at all. They change and add new rules anytime when they feel like it. Selling my PS4 tomorrow, have no use for it anymore.

Same. Sony ruined it for me with this totally greed driven move. I'm getting rid of my console, and basically writing them off for gaming.


You did not mention Microsoft. I hope you don't think they are to be thrusted. If so, you will be in for a surprise...:adjoint:

The difference with MS is they have a vested interest in remaining open. They want their hardware to be as compatible with PC as possible, because it allows them to sell to both markets. They have a more open culture, and closer relationship with hardware manufacturers because they started on the PC side, where that was basically a requirement for them--PC works with a variety of devices. Compare that to Apple and Sony who, from inception, have basically operated with a closed platform mentality. Apple only allows "approved' devices and software to be used with their products. And Sony has been in an exclusive rivalry with console makers (and every other part of their business) for so long that it's just the way they think now. Compared to companies like that, Microsoft isn't even close to being a problem.

Androphonomania
25-08-2016, 20:20
Check this answer a gamer just got from Sony....LOL

Dear xxxx,

Please contact the Customer Service Sony PlayStation.

In this case , we can tell that this has not been a commercial decision of Sony PlayStation , these incompatibilities can occur due to constant updates to the operating system of our consoles to improve the user experience , so we can not guarantee that all third-party devices are compatible with the PlayStation consoles. In this case we recommend that you contact the manufacturer of your device and check if they are working on creating some firmware that allows compatibility with new versions of operating system PlayStation.

LOL, has this been posted/forwarded in/to the official forums?

This is an hilarious answer. It is all on Fanatec. They arent able to do a proper firmware. In the end Sony is doing all these updates 4 the players... :D

Fanapryde
25-08-2016, 21:14
@Haiden
I was not talking about their hardware, maybe I should have been more clear.
If you don't use other software to block them, MS almost takes over your PC, forcing you upon things you don't need/want, whether you like it or not.
Switching from Win7Pro to Win10Pro resulted in a complete mess. None of the sims worked, all drivers needed to be updated and/or re-installed, sound was messed up and I can go on for a while. It took me almost a week to sort everything out and to get it all working as it was supposed to. Have not upgraded to the Anniversary Edition yet, since tht seems to provoque some more trouble for a great deal of users (though others claim all went well for them).
Once it all works, racing on PC has a lot of advantages, but I lost countless hours in the process.

Androphonomania
25-08-2016, 22:22
Something i've forgotten:

One guy in our community called in at fanatec.

The answer he got was:

"Fanatec is in licencing debates, but they do not have a clue how long these will go on.
If they have a license for the wheels, there will be a firmware update for the licensed wheel. These could then be used..."


So, is there the possibility Sony could make the ultimate bitch move and erase the Fanatec support out of existing games? As DiRT or pCars?

I mean Sony is capable of doing sth. like this. But could this be done without an agreement with SMS or Codemasters?

lazpete
26-08-2016, 05:19
This whole thing sucks. The only ones getting dragged in the dirt are the owners and racers of fanatec.

Sankyo
26-08-2016, 06:41
Check this answer a gamer just got from Sony....LOL

Dear xxxx,

Please contact the Customer Service Sony PlayStation.

In this case , we can tell that this has not been a commercial decision of Sony PlayStation , these incompatibilities can occur due to constant updates to the operating system of our consoles to improve the user experience , so we can not guarantee that all third-party devices are compatible with the PlayStation consoles. In this case we recommend that you contact the manufacturer of your device and check if they are working on creating some firmware that allows compatibility with new versions of operating system PlayStation.
That's just so sad. I know from pCARS experience that the different Sony departments do not communicate very well, if at all, but this is just plain lying IMO.

pavano
26-08-2016, 06:42
That's just so sad. I know from pCARS experience that the different Sony departments do not communicate very well, if at all, but this is just plain lying IMO.

not to our local Sony defender Silraed, that is :D

Sankyo
26-08-2016, 07:28
not to our local Sony defender Silraed, that is :D
I don't think we want to use such classifications of other forum members here ;), please be careful with what you write.

FWIF I've always been a sort-of Sony fan (mainly for their phone/camera/audio hardware), but this is not scoring points with me...

BigDad
26-08-2016, 07:42
Check this answer a gamer just got from Sony....LOL

Dear xxxx,

Please contact the Customer Service Sony PlayStation.

In this case , we can tell that this has not been a commercial decision of Sony PlayStation , these incompatibilities can occur due to constant updates to the operating system of our consoles to improve the user experience , so we can not guarantee that all third-party devices are compatible with the PlayStation consoles. In this case we recommend that you contact the manufacturer of your device and check if they are working on creating some firmware that allows compatibility with new versions of operating system PlayStation.

Sound reminiscent of the Logitec G25/27 + PS4 debacle

Sankyo
26-08-2016, 07:47
Sound reminiscent of the Logitec G25/27 + PS4 debacle
Not sure I followed that. Could you give a summary?

pavano
26-08-2016, 07:53
I don't think we want to use such classifications of other forum members here ;), please be careful with what you write.

FWIF I've always been a sort-of Sony fan (mainly for their phone/camera/audio hardware), but this is not scoring points with me...

yes, me neither. I've had nothing against Sony, but this does not sound or look good to me.
In the least it's giving a fiddlers fart about your customers.
Unfortunately, indifference to a small fraction of your customers surely works for a big company like Sony.

cluck
26-08-2016, 08:09
There is the possibility - though this is pure speculation on my part, based on something I read on here a day or two ago - that Thrustmaster and/or Logitech have put the pressure on Sony to take action. If you were a hardware manufacturer, had spent considerable sums of money to be 'officially licensed' and you see a competitor's product being allowed to work without that license, you'd probably be quite miffed ;). More so if you are about to release a new wheel to coincide with a console's flagship game series.

Is it right? No.
Has it been handled and communicated the right way? No.
Is there an overarching conspiracy to anger and annoy customers? Don't be daft, of course not.

However, has anybody approached the larger gaming web-sites to see if they want to run a story on this? As hard a fact as it is to accept by some (and I'm guilty of this myself in the past), complaining on forums here and there is not going to achieve anything. Get a large gaming website involved and Sony can't afford to ignore it, even if it is just a public announcement of why the changes have been made :).

Sankyo
26-08-2016, 08:55
There is the possibility - though this is pure speculation on my part, based on something I read on here a day or two ago - that Thrustmaster and/or Logitech have put the pressure on Sony to take action. If you were a hardware manufacturer, had spent considerable sums of money to be 'officially licensed' and you see a competitor's product being allowed to work without that license, you'd probably be quite miffed ;). More so if you are about to release a new wheel to coincide with a console's flagship game series.
My question would be: why spend effort/money on an official license when hardware support does not depend on any licensing but on developer support, i.e. Sony has no part in that at all?

cluck
26-08-2016, 10:12
My question would be: why spend effort/money on an official license when hardware support does not depend on any licensing but on developer support, i.e. Sony has no part in that at all?I have no idea Remco, it was just a wild speculation idea that popped into my head. I don't have a console and I don't have a Fanatec wheel (although I do have the v3 pedals :)) but I thought I'd throw the idea into the mix just so that if it turns out to be true, I can point at it later and say "told you so" :D

GrimeyDog
26-08-2016, 11:42
My question would be: why spend effort/money on an official license when hardware support does not depend on any licensing but on developer support, i.e. Sony has no part in that at all?

They Can Make More $$$ by Monopolizing the Wheel Market for Console!!! Get Rid of the Competition and the wirld is yours mind set...Seems that they have forsaken the fact of Dominating a Market by putting out the best Quality product!!!

Sankyo
26-08-2016, 11:44
Latest word, hidden here (https://www.fanatec.com/forum/discussion/529/csl-elite-wheel-base-pedals): at least a new PS4-compatible wheel base is in the pipeline. Whether existing hardware will still get support in some way is still open.

Boskapongen
26-08-2016, 11:53
Latest word, hidden here (https://www.fanatec.com/forum/discussion/529/csl-elite-wheel-base-pedals): at least a new PS4-compatible wheel base is in the pipeline. Whether existing hardware will still get support in some way is still open.



THIS: "I am confident that we can announce a PS4 Version of this Wheel base soon".
Dose not sound very open i am afraid.... hope some hackers can make a custom firmware for V2.

Final nail in the coffin for me and ps4. We all know that the current wheelbase already works 100%.....man....

EDIT: nice find Remco.

Ryzza5
26-08-2016, 13:10
Maybe the 'simplest' way out for a lot of us is to give this GIMX thing a try.
http://gimx.fr/wiki/index.php?title=DIY_USB_adapter_for_dummies

While a bit convoluted it apparently supports force feedback and not discernable traces of input lag. Roughly $30 worth of bits and pieces to get going. Only have to worry about getting a 'G25 > G29' emulation firmware as many older Fanatec wheels emulate a G25 in PS mode.

Haiden
26-08-2016, 13:12
I have no idea Remco, it was just a wild speculation idea that popped into my head. I don't have a console and I don't have a Fanatec wheel (although I do have the v3 pedals :)) but I thought I'd throw the idea into the mix just so that if it turns out to be true, I can point at it later and say "told you so" :D

I actually think you're right, but I I think it was more Thrustmaster. It can't be coincidence that this "shift" from Sony started shortly before Thrustmaster revealed it's new GT6 branded direct drive wheel. What would be the closest competitor to TM's direct drive wheel? Most likely, the CSW-v2.

Haiden
26-08-2016, 13:16
Maybe the 'simplest' way out for a lot of us is to give this GIMX thing a try.
http://gimx.fr/wiki/index.php?title=DIY_USB_adapter_for_dummies

While a bit convoluted it apparently supports force feedback and not discernable traces of input lag. Roughly $30 worth of bits and pieces to get going. Only have to worry about getting a 'G25 > G29' emulation firmware as many older Fanatec wheels emulate a G25 in PS mode.

Or, I could just tell Sony to piss off, forget about GT6, and go play any of the other sims from developers that aren't farting around. Yeah...that actually seems easier. :)

Don't reward or accept this kind of f'ckery from these guys. If you do, they'll just keep doing it.

Figuur84
26-08-2016, 13:40
Edit: Double post

Figuur84
26-08-2016, 13:42
I actually think you're right, but I I think it was more Thrustmaster. It can't be coincidence that this "shift" from Sony started shortly before Thrustmaster revealed it's new GT6 branded direct drive wheel. What would be the closest competitor to TM's direct drive wheel? Most likely, the CSW-v2.

Hey pssshhht, don't tell anyone further.... but the new TM will not be DD so I heard...

Boskapongen
26-08-2016, 13:43
Fanatec jsut announeced the all new setup. CSL Elite (PC/XB1). My guess we will see a PS4 version later.

https://www.fanatec.com/eu-en/bundle/product;bundle_id;107

235556

Sum Dixon-Ear
26-08-2016, 13:50
Bye bye Sony...
Thomas earlier -
"I can already confirm that the CSW will not be compatible with PS4 on any new games. This is part of the Agreement with Sony and enableus to get a license for PS4. There will probably be a dedicated CSL Elite base for PS4 but I cannot confirm anything until the contracts are signed.

We are not making those rules"

Boskapongen
26-08-2016, 14:05
Just in:

235557

Sankyo
26-08-2016, 14:43
Small correction on that: the new CSL E is a step below the CSW v2, but 'inferior' doesn't do it justice at all...

pavano
26-08-2016, 14:45
Small correction on that: the new CSL E is a step below the CSW v2, but 'inferior' doesn't do it justice at all...

did you test it already?
or quoting marketing?

IJOJOI
26-08-2016, 14:52
I tested the CSL, and I agree it's better than a CSWv1, but that doesnt help if you have a CSWv2 ;)

bradleyland
26-08-2016, 14:56
What an incredible blunder on Sony & Fanatec's part. It's important to keep an open mind and recognize that failures like this can't be attributed to a single party. In other words, it takes two to tango.

For Sony's part, they have a platform that they're trying to curate. It is certainly a matter of prerogative, but Sony's history is pretty clear in this regard. One of the reasons for having "licensed hardware" is so that Sony can control the quality of experience on their platform. Think of it like this: if any crap-ass manufacturer can put out a product for PS4, then there is a risk that the market will be flooded with poor quality products. The consumer is then forced to look very hard at any new hardware purchase. Sony's strategy is to "officially license" hardware, giving them the ability to keep poor quality vendors off their platform.

Where things go off the rails is when viewpoints collide. From Fanatec's perspective, it's bound to feel a bit like Sony is seeking "rent" for access to their platform, and this is also a perfectly defensible viewpoint. After much disagreement, the two parties become locked in a power struggle, and an optimal solution moves out of reach. Consumers suffer because the "compromise" between the manufacturer (Fanatec) and the platform (Sony) allows them both to save face, but does nothing for the people who already bought hardware that has worked historically.

In all honesty, I have to place the majority of the blame on Sony here. They're the ones in charge of the platform, and it's their inconsistent application of policies that have lead to this situation. If they wanted fully licensed access to their platform, they should have done that from day 1. This way, no one would have spent $1,500 on Fanatec hardware, only to have it stop working with new titles. That is a raw deal, and if I had spent the extra money on Fanatec gear, I'd sell my Playstation and never look back. Sony has the ability to make this right, but they won't. They've put their platform priorities ahead of consumers.

No doubt Fanatec bears some of the blame here as well, but I suspect they're bound by business financial constraints. If they came to the table with enough resources and licensing money, I'm sure Sony would cut a deal, but they're a small company. They're absolutely tiny by comparison.

There's one clear loser here though, and that's consumers who bought both Fanatec gear and a Sony Playstation. What a shame.

Sum Dixon-Ear
26-08-2016, 14:59
Small correction on that: the new CSL E is a step below the CSW v2, but 'inferior' doesn't do it justice at all...

Remco, are there any assurances that you know of that us poor Fanatec owners will be able to continue playing pCARS and support will not be patched out either by SMS or Sony in the future??

IJOJOI
26-08-2016, 15:03
It wont be patched out of existing games ;)

Figuur84
26-08-2016, 15:57
What an incredible blunder on Sony & Fanatec's part. It's important to keep an open mind and recognize that failures like this can't be attributed to a single party. In other words, it takes two to tango.

For Sony's part, they have a platform that they're trying to curate. It is certainly a matter of prerogative, but Sony's history is pretty clear in this regard. One of the reasons for having "licensed hardware" is so that Sony can control the quality of experience on their platform. Think of it like this: if any crap-ass manufacturer can put out a product for PS4, then there is a risk that the market will be flooded with poor quality products. The consumer is then forced to look very hard at any new hardware purchase. Sony's strategy is to "officially license" hardware, giving them the ability to keep poor quality vendors off their platform.

Where things go off the rails is when viewpoints collide. From Fanatec's perspective, it's bound to feel a bit like Sony is seeking "rent" for access to their platform, and this is also a perfectly defensible viewpoint. After much disagreement, the two parties become locked in a power struggle, and an optimal solution moves out of reach. Consumers suffer because the "compromise" between the manufacturer (Fanatec) and the platform (Sony) allows them both to save face, but does nothing for the people who already bought hardware that has worked historically.

In all honesty, I have to place the majority of the blame on Sony here. They're the ones in charge of the platform, and it's their inconsistent application of policies that have lead to this situation. If they wanted fully licensed access to their platform, they should have done that from day 1. This way, no one would have spent $1,500 on Fanatec hardware, only to have it stop working with new titles. That is a raw deal, and if I had spent the extra money on Fanatec gear, I'd sell my Playstation and never look back. Sony has the ability to make this right, but they won't. They've put their platform priorities ahead of consumers.

No doubt Fanatec bears some of the blame here as well, but I suspect they're bound by business financial constraints. If they came to the table with enough resources and licensing money, I'm sure Sony would cut a deal, but they're a small company. They're absolutely tiny by comparison.

There's one clear loser here though, and that's consumers who bought both Fanatec gear and a Sony Playstation. What a shame.

Good story. But can state that Sony wants no peripherals which work on both playstation and xbox. You can see that in the fact Sony now wants a licensed base in stead of wheel. They want to bind customers to their console/brand. If someone buys a base for ps4 which will never work on xbox, those people will not tend to 'walk over to the competition' that easy. I think, besides money, this is their biggest argument to do this.

Konan
26-08-2016, 16:02
Good story. But can state that Sony wants no peripherals which work on both playstation and xbox. You can see that in the fact Sony now wants a licensed base in stead of wheel. They want to bind customers to their console/brand. If someone buys a base for ps4 which will never work on xbox, those people will not tend to 'walk over to the competition' that easy. I think, besides money, this is their biggest argument to do this.

Agreed...but the step to move over from Xbox just became bigger too...

pavano
26-08-2016, 16:03
yeah, the best step is just away from both

Figuur84
26-08-2016, 16:04
Agreed...but the step to move over from Xbox just became bigger too...

That's correct. While Sony sells a lot more consoles then Microsoft, they now feel the king of the world and dare to do this. That is also why it happens now, not in the beginning of the ps4 live cycle. They now have a far bigger user Base, and tend to keep it that way.

Figuur84
26-08-2016, 16:06
yeah, the best step is just away from both

I am more and more considering that yes ;)

Sankyo
26-08-2016, 16:38
Remco, are there any assurances that you know of that us poor Fanatec owners will be able to continue playing pCARS and support will not be patched out either by SMS or Sony in the future??

Currently the whole drama is only about new releases. But with Sony pulling a stunt like this, no-one can give any guarantees. I consider existing games being affected very small, though.

Sankyo
26-08-2016, 16:39
did you test it already?
or quoting marketing?
Been testing it for months already as part-time Fanatec tech support employee and regular beta tester :)

Sum Dixon-Ear
26-08-2016, 17:35
Currently the whole drama is only about new releases. But with Sony pulling a stunt like this, no-one can give any guarantees. I consider existing games being affected very small, though.

OK, thanks bud. After this bombshell, I will always consider Sony to be something that rhymes with 'stunts'. Oh well, time to get back to my roots and consider building another full-on gaming PC... it's been a few years!

flatspunout
26-08-2016, 18:46
The only reason I purchased a PS4 was because my Microsoft licensed, Forza branded CSR isn't compatible with Xbone...thanks Sony.

Does anyone have experience with the CronusMax adapter? It sounds like it is emulating a G25, which is basically how Fanatec worked around PS4 compatibility issues to start with right?

bradleyland
26-08-2016, 20:08
Good story. But can state that Sony wants no peripherals which work on both playstation and xbox. You can see that in the fact Sony now wants a licensed base in stead of wheel. They want to bind customers to their console/brand. If someone buys a base for ps4 which will never work on xbox, those people will not tend to 'walk over to the competition' that easy. I think, besides money, this is their biggest argument to do this.

Agree 100%. There are many reasons why a platform owner like Sony would want a "licensed hardware" only approach, and this is one of them. It's difficult to argue that there isn't a rent-seeking component.

Mascot
26-08-2016, 20:16
OK, thanks bud. After this bombshell, I will always consider Sony to be something that rhymes with 'stunts'. Oh well, time to get back to my roots and consider building another full-on gaming PC... it's been a few years!

Totally agree bud.


http://static.giantbomb.com/uploads/scale_super/0/334/440546-cat.jpg

Ryzza5
26-08-2016, 23:04
I feel that Sony could make an exception to their 'accessory curation' when those accessories cost more than $500. Let's not mince words here, there is no way that forcing removal of support for these wheels is for the reason of 'improved user experience' when those users would prefer something over nothing for products they already own.



Parallel Universe A: No curation, you buy a cheap gamepad that doesn't work. You exchange/refund it. You're out of pocket a few hours/dollars.

Parallel Universe B: Your existing wheel no longer works because of a Sony decision. Their official remedy is to spend hundreds of dollars on a new wheel (which you probably spend many hours researching).



Which of the two evils sounds worse? Windows PC's are in camp A and I don't hear massive outcries to start curating every USB device out there.

Sankyo
27-08-2016, 06:56
I feel that Sony could make an exception to their 'accessory curation' when those accessories cost more than $500. Let's not mince words here, there is no way that forcing removal of support for these wheels is for the reason of 'improved user experience' when those users would prefer something over nothing for products they already own.



Parallel Universe A: No curation, you buy a cheap gamepad that doesn't work. You exchange/refund it. You're out of pocket a few hours/dollars.

Parallel Universe B: Your existing wheel no longer works because of a Sony decision. Their official remedy is to spend hundreds of dollars on a new wheel (which you probably spend many hours researching).



Which of the two evils sounds worse? Windows PC's are in camp A and I don't hear massive outcries to start curating every USB device out there.

Hold on, in the PS4 case people have (expensive) gear that does work, but Sony then decides after more than a year or so that support of perfectly working peripherals is no longer allowed for a fantasy reason.

Ryzza5
29-08-2016, 06:54
In any case I have ordered a Cronus Max Plus doodad. It has a new PS4 Wheel Mode firmware update which now supports Force feedback, so if I put my Fanatec CSRE wheel into PlayStation mode it emulates a Logitech G25 and then the device makes the PS4 think I'm using a Logitech G29.


More expensive than the GIMX route but a slightly better user experience it seems. Firmware/support/features seem to be regularly updated for free as well. The other benefit is that I can use an Xbox gamepad on the PS4 as well. I'll report back when it arrives.

KillerFox1978
29-08-2016, 11:15
In any case I have ordered a Cronus Max Plus doodad. It has a new PS4 Wheel Mode firmware update which now supports Force feedback, so if I put my Fanatec CSRE wheel into PlayStation mode it emulates a Logitech G25 and then the device makes the PS4 think I'm using a Logitech G29.


More expensive than the GIMX route but a slightly better user experience it seems. Firmware/support/features seem to be regularly updated for free as well. The other benefit is that I can use an Xbox gamepad on the PS4 as well. I'll report back when it arrives.

Hi
yes please keep us posted how this works out and if you notice any time lag between this and the ps4.

thanks

Boskapongen
29-08-2016, 11:56
In any case I have ordered a Cronus Max Plus doodad. It has a new PS4 Wheel Mode firmware update which now supports Force feedback, so if I put my Fanatec CSRE wheel into PlayStation mode it emulates a Logitech G25 and then the device makes the PS4 think I'm using a Logitech G29.


More expensive than the GIMX route but a slightly better user experience it seems. Firmware/support/features seem to be regularly updated for free as well. The other benefit is that I can use an Xbox gamepad on the PS4 as well. I'll report back when it arrives.

Is this the one?

235586

K_Soze
29-08-2016, 13:04
Never trust big companies like Sony, Apple and such, they dont care about us at all. They change and add new rules anytime when they feel like it. Selling my PS4 tomorrow, have no use for it anymore.

Will do exactly the same. And add Sony to my black list. PC seems to be the only place where customers are almost respected.

Boskapongen
29-08-2016, 13:06
Post from AC forum.


Hi Guys,

I just have had an new chat with FANATEC Customer-Support a couple of hours ago.
Hereīs the results for now:

1. They confirm that (at this stage) all formerly sold CSW will not work with new racing-games on the PS4 - and that might not even change in the future.
2. They can not confirm any Product for PS4-use until contracts with SONY will be signed.
3. There is a statement of FANATECs CEO Thomas Jackermeier that confirms No. 1. "no CSW will ever work again with PS4".
4. ...but remind this: No contract with SONY is signed yet. There still is a very, very small chance that...

The Fanatec-Support really has been very friendly and polite. They understand that their customers are not happy at all about SONYīs decision changing.
Now I am not sure any longer if it is okay to blame Fanatec (that is a small company where the CEO himself is discussing with customers on their own forum).
All what has happened seems to be a tactical warfare against some of the smaller Sim-Wheel-Producers who do not have any chance to fight against those big Players like for example Guillemont.....

I decided to wait until Fanatec has signed a contract with SONY and then I will buy what I need. I will keep as Fanatec-Customer.
Everyone who has discovered the high quality and innovation of their Products should follow me.

It will be no problem to resell your CSW to XBOX or PC Users - and then you just buy the CSL-Base. I guess no one will lose much money at the end of this story, do you do?

With kind regards from Germany
Tobias

Sankyo
29-08-2016, 14:16
I think the "no CSW will ever work again with PS4" part sounds a bit too drastic, it won't work with new games as of now, but it will with already existing games. Not much of a consolation, but a better representation of the current situation.

Stephen1300
29-08-2016, 19:22
In any case I have ordered a Cronus Max Plus doodad. It has a new PS4 Wheel Mode firmware update which now supports Force feedback, so if I put my Fanatec CSRE wheel into PlayStation mode it emulates a Logitech G25 and then the device makes the PS4 think I'm using a Logitech G29.


More expensive than the GIMX route but a slightly better user experience it seems. Firmware/support/features seem to be regularly updated for free as well. The other benefit is that I can use an Xbox gamepad on the PS4 as well. I'll report back when it arrives.

I found that device locally this morning and bought it. After 3 hours plus of efforts to get it to work with my CSW V2 I gave up. I am not saying it could not work yet but I am very confused with the instructions and as how to set it up and or program it. I tried different things with no success, if you can do it some help would be greatly appreciated. I bought one of the recommanded USB hub and am using a DS4 wireless controler to set it up. The Cronus Max Plus site is very clear as to say it should work with my base but the instructions are not easy to follow or to find. I bought the device Boskapongen is showing in post 65.

bradleyland
29-08-2016, 19:38
Is this the one?

235586

We have a phrase for this kind of solution in IT circles: "ugly hack".

Frankly, I wouldn't count on this to work very well, and especially over the long term. Sony have made their intentions clear. They intend to restrict hardware on their platform through their licensing model. The moment they can figure out how to disable a device like this, they'll do it. And don't be fooled in to thinking that they can't detect it because "so and so said that it looks just like a Logitech wheel". There are many methods Sony can use to profile hardware connected to their devices. It will always be an uphill battle to work against them.

I'm not trying to be cynical. I'm just trying to save everyone a lot of frustration. Sony has made their decision, and I for one won't be sticking around on their platform when it comes time to replace my PS4.

Stephen1300
29-08-2016, 22:44
You might be right Bradleyland, I checked the CronusMax forum and I am not alone with the same issue, right now it does not work but some thech seems to be on the case. I guess if it works for a while it will always be subject to issues at each patch or upgrade on the PS4. Oh well I tried.

Redslayer
30-08-2016, 17:01
http://gimx.fr/wiki/index.php?title=DIY_USB_adapter_for_dummies

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/playing-on-ps4-with-a-logitech-driving-force-gt-g27-with-ffb.336625/page-5

This works with CSR and other Fanatec wheels with Ps3 mode. For me I can't use full 900 degree rotation, but, it's enough that I was able to get the same 540 I usually use on Pcars anyway out of it, with full force feedback support.

And this works will all Ps4 racing games, I even tested it on driveclub.

bradleyland
30-08-2016, 18:05
http://gimx.fr/wiki/index.php?title=DIY_USB_adapter_for_dummies

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/playing-on-ps4-with-a-logitech-driving-force-gt-g27-with-ffb.336625/page-5

This works with CSR and other Fanatec wheels with Ps3 mode. For me I can't use full 900 degree rotation, but, it's enough that I was able to get the same 540 I usually use on Pcars anyway out of it, with full force feedback support.

And this works will all Ps4 racing games, I even tested it on driveclub.

No offense, but good god that looks like a real menagerie.

Wheel to PC...

PC software emulation...

PC to USB=>Serial Converter...

USB=>Serial Converter to Teensy...

Teensy to console.

What could go wrong!?

Haiden
30-08-2016, 19:33
No offense, but good god that looks like a real menagerie.

Wheel to PC...

PC software emulation...

PC to USB=>Serial Converter...

USB=>Serial Converter to Teensy...

Teensy to console.

What could go wrong!?

Right!? Way too many layers in that. Plus, why jump through hoops for Sony? They obviously don't care about us.

Redslayer
30-08-2016, 20:32
True...i was about to pull the trigger on PS4 "NEO", not gonna happpen. Xbox Scorpio / PC is the path I am taking.

Makes no sense. Most Xbox games are coming to PC.

Redslayer
30-08-2016, 20:34
No offense, but good god that looks like a real menagerie.

Wheel to PC...

PC software emulation...

PC to USB=>Serial Converter...

USB=>Serial Converter to Teensy...

Teensy to console.

What could go wrong!?

I mean, if you don't have any understanding of electronics I see your point. But if you have even a basic understanding of computers, it's good. I played for hours with it with no problem once I got it going and one of my league members has been using it since Pcars released with no issues.


Right!? Way too many layers in that. Plus, why jump through hoops for Sony? They obviously don't care about us.


Go buy a new wheel or console then lol. I'm sure that will show them.

Haiden
30-08-2016, 23:53
I mean, if you don't have any understanding of electronics I see your point. But if you have even a basic understanding of computers, it's good. I played for hours with it with no problem once I got it going and one of my league members has been using it since Pcars released with no issues.

Go buy a new wheel or console then lol. I'm sure that will show them.

No need to buy a new wheel. I love my CSW-v2. I just went to PC as soon as I saw the writing on the wall. It's a better experience, and all my hardware works there, and I don't have to worry about silly console rivalries. IMO, when a company screws me over to the point that I'm no longer happy, I just leave. Why put so much work into staying with a company like that? They've just shown you what they think of you.

Believe me, I don't think Sony will miss me, but you what doesn't show them anything? Giving in to their craziness and continuing to support them. I doubt it'll be the last time Sony screws you over, because you're basically telling them that you'll keep giving them your money and go the extra mile, even when they crap on you.

Also, I have a pretty good understanding of electronics. I see a lot layers in that solution. Converters, adapters, and emulators may work, but they usually add latency to the signal. The more layers, the more latency you get.

Ryzza5
31-08-2016, 05:01
No offense, but good god that looks like a real menagerie.

Wheel to PC...

PC software emulation...

PC to USB=>Serial Converter...

USB=>Serial Converter to Teensy...

Teensy to console.

What could go wrong!?

I've been using a 'homemade' PCB adapter that makes my Fanatec wheel think my directly connected TH8RS shifter is a Fanatec branded one, allowing me to use it on any console racing game. Hasn't given me any trouble in years. I agree GIMX is more than a few hoops to jump through but for some that's still a better option than 0 compatibility or wasting $hundreds on a new (and perhaps overall inferior) wheel.

I'm kind of looking forward to seeing if DriveClub will work with a wheel now, ahead of GT Sport sometime in 2017.

bradleyland
31-08-2016, 17:46
I mean, if you don't have any understanding of electronics I see your point. But if you have even a basic understanding of computers, it's good. I played for hours with it with no problem once I got it going and one of my league members has been using it since Pcars released with no issues.

I manage IT projects that make this look like a toaster oven. That's not really the point. The point is that compared to simply connecting a wheel, this adds a ton of complexity, and you know what they say about complexity and MTTF, right?

It's cool that it works for you, but be realistic. It's not a solution, it's a hack, and hacks always come back to bite you in the end.

bradleyland
31-08-2016, 17:52
I've been using a 'homemade' PCB adapter that makes my Fanatec wheel think my directly connected TH8RS shifter is a Fanatec branded one, allowing me to use it on any console racing game. Hasn't given me any trouble in years. I agree GIMX is more than a few hoops to jump through but for some that's still a better option than 0 compatibility or wasting $hundreds on a new (and perhaps overall inferior) wheel.

I'm kind of looking forward to seeing if DriveClub will work with a wheel now, ahead of GT Sport sometime in 2017.

You're probably talking about the BasherBoard CPX, which is a nicely packaged product. It's not at all comparable (in terms of complexity) to the GIMX solution.

GIMX may be a less costly solution, but I stand by my assertion that it is very complex. I don't like to deal in absolutes, so don't mistake that statement for me saying that no one should use it.

The key point I'm getting at is that the GIMX solution adds a lot of complexity. If you don't mind dealing with complexity, then go for it! However, I have a real distaste for "hand waiving" when it comes to brushing complexity under the rug. I'd have no problem recommending the GIMX solution with a major caveat: you're going to have to be willing to invest time in learning and troubleshooting. If you're not, look for another solution.

Ryzza5
31-08-2016, 22:20
It's called an InterfaceOne

https://vimeo.com/32473439


I avoided the extra 'complexity' on this occasion by spending more on the Cronus Max Plus.

antonpaco
04-09-2016, 13:57
Few months ago, maybe more, Fanatec and Microsoft get an agreement to use Fanatec wheels on XB1. I don't know if Sony did not want Fanatec or Microsoft did non want that fanatec work with Sony too, it's hard to say. I was very disappointed when Logitech G27 did not work with PS4, I had to buy for the first time in my life a Thrustmaster wheel ( T300RS + T3PO ) and let me tell you, I am really really happy about this wheel, after 3-4 months I bought also a F1 wheel (thrustmaster) and believe me, is fantastic with F1 2015 and 2016. I understand your frustration, but if you decide to pass to PS4 do not worry, Thrustmaster wheels are good.

KillerFox1978
04-09-2016, 14:48
It's called an InterfaceOne

https://vimeo.com/32473439


I avoided the extra 'complexity' on this occasion by spending more on the Cronus Max Plus.


how is this Cronus Max Plus working out for you and what wheel are you using it with have you seen any lag?

i have a ClubSport Wheel Base V1 with v3 pedals and the BMW GT2 rim.

Regards
Nick

Ryzza5
04-09-2016, 22:23
So far it is not working, so hold off purchasing. They've got a bunch of Fanatec owners testing a new beta software update release so will have to be a little patient.

Fre.Mo
12-09-2016, 20:53
Will the imminent (tomorrow) firmware 4.0 update stop Fanatec wheel compatibility with pcars?

Ryzza5
12-09-2016, 22:22
Check back tomorrow?

Sankyo
13-09-2016, 05:40
Will the imminent (tomorrow) firmware 4.0 update stop Fanatec wheel compatibility with pcars?

AFAIK, wheel support only depends on the game and not on the PS4 firmware, unless they modify the OS such that unlicensed wheels cannot connect anymore through USB. However, the message has always been that licensed wheel-only support is only for new games.

Mascot
13-09-2016, 07:21
Will the imminent (tomorrow) firmware 4.0 update stop Fanatec wheel compatibility with pcars?

Nothing would surprise me any more. Big corporations despise their customers.

Sum Dixon-Ear
13-09-2016, 12:48
Thankfully Fanatec stuff still functions with pCARS post update.

Mascot
13-09-2016, 13:05
Thankfully Fanatec stuff still functions with pCARS post update.

I am fornicatingly pleased to hear that.

Sum Dixon-Ear
14-09-2016, 08:03
Pretty much sums it up -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QBAGPw3h4JI&feature=youtu.be&t=8m44s

Sankyo
14-09-2016, 10:58
Pretty much sums it up -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QBAGPw3h4JI&feature=youtu.be&t=8m44s

Can't watch it but seeing it's about Sony forbidding Fallout 4/Witcher mod support on PS4, their 'For the players' catch phrase is becoming very inappropriate fast.

Ryzza5
17-10-2016, 10:14
So far it is not working, so hold off purchasing. They've got a bunch of Fanatec owners testing a new beta software update release so will have to be a little patient.

Apologies for the delay but I finally got around to testing the new Cronus Max v1.23 firmware last weekend and the Fanatec CSR:E worked in DRIVECLUB as well as I could expect. It's not perfect but I don't know if that's the fault of the game or the emulation. The CSRE is emulating a G25 (PS3 mode) which is emulating a G29 (Cronus Max). I also tried NFS 2015 but I couldn't get beyond the start screen with the wheel. I can also use the device with an Xbox gamepad for other games such as Rocket League which is great.

Other users report success with their Fanatec gear in Assetto Corsa on PS4.


If you're only mildly interested I would advise holding off again just for now as I've heard whispers of a new product (hardware) in the works that is more targeted to racing wheels. What extra benefits it offers I have no idea. No release date has been hinted so it could still possibly be a year away. Your call. At least if Gran Turismo 7 somehow manages to be awesome and on time I'll potentially have a the wheel sorted.