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KANETAKER
08-06-2017, 16:20
Hi, I would like to take the opportunity to make a suggestion about taking advantage of the game is still under development to take into consideration the current performance (and specially TOP SPEED) of new LMP1&LMP2 cars compared to previous LMP1&LMP2 models of PCARS1. But that's only if SMS would confirm that the PCARS2 will have 2017 models of the LMP1&LMP2 cars.

The issue is that the performance of the LMP2 2017 Spec has been surprising, improving in almost 10 seconds its times per lap in LeMans compared to LMP2 between 2011 and 2016 (included Oreca 03 and Alpine A450 availables on PCARS1). The best lap of LMP2 cars at PCARS1 is 3:34 with a Marek LMP2 (fictional car) and a 3:36 with Oreca and Alpěne 2014 spec.

In this 2017 Edition of LeMans the new lap times of the fastest LMP2 cars (2017 spec) is 3:28 - 3:30, with a amazing top speed of 330 - 341 Km/h instead of 312 Km/h from the Marek LMP2 and 308 Km/h of the PCARS1.

238047

Meanwhile, the current LMP1 cars (2017 spec) can reach 350 km/h, but in reality only reach 330 km/h because they must focus their performance and hybrid power on the acceleration at the exit of the curves, sacrificing top speed at the end of the long straights because they anticipate their braking by their driving style focused on hybrid systems.

238048

The concern is that in the PCARS1 the Toyota LMP1 failed to reach 320 km/h in the fastest lap made in the game unlike its real-life counterpart.
Although it is also necessary to consider that in the game curiously there were players able to somehow squeeze the most cars that in real life did not, such as: The Aston Martin DRB1-2, whose best lap in real life was 3:26 (2010) vs. 3:20 that scored a player in the PCARS1 with a top speed of 336 Km/h (340 Km/h is the max of DBR1-2).

I hope you have all this information in mind, to try to obtain and enjoy a game as realistic as possible, including the driving style when everyone is playing, because in PCARS1 it was frustrating to see how some players could use that hated and unrealistic style of driving used at Codemasters F1 Game's (ex: Fast downshifts without gearbox damage risk when are braking more late before any corner, or in this case, never use or reserved hybrid power for top speed and only use for acceleration at the exit of curves).

Thank You.

dault3883
08-06-2017, 16:24
it is doubtful they would have Up to date speed and handling characteristics since those are team trade secrets

Bealdor
08-06-2017, 16:32
...The concern is that in the PCARS1 the Toyota LMP1 failed to reach 320 km/h in the fastest lap made in the game unlike its real-life counterpart...

I get your concerns but just FYI, the Toyotas did their fastest qualifying times in 2014 (3:22:589) with only 303.9 kph and in 2015 (3:23:543) with only 305.6 kph.
Those are the years the PCARS 1 version was most likely based on.

KANETAKER
08-06-2017, 16:42
I get your concerns but just FYI, the Toyotas did their fastest qualifying times in 2014 (3:22:589) with only 303.9 kph and in 2015 (3:23:543) with only 305.6 kph.
Those are the years the PCARS 1 version was most likely based on.

It is normal in Classification that teams and drivers focus their setups on speed at the curves and acceleration, sacrificing top speed on long straight lines for can take pole position. But already in race they use another setup, in which they do focus on the final speed in the long straights. The big problem is that in the game many players have the (bad) habit of using the same classification setups (and driving style) in the race, when it should not be.

Also, this is the official Top Speed of the cars at the 2015 Edition of 24h of LeMans (race) with the TS040 (2015 spec):

238049

dault3883
08-06-2017, 16:44
It is normal in Classification that teams and drivers focus their setups on speed at the curves and acceleration, sacrificing top speed on long straight lines for can take pole position. But already in race they use another setup, in which they do focus on the final speed in the long straights. The big problem is that in the game many players have the (bad) habit of using the same classification setups (and driving style) in the race, when it should not be.

Also, this is the official Top Speed of the cars at the 2015 Edition of 24h of LeMans (race) with the TS040 (2015 spec):

238049

i disagree with that method i believe you should either qualify with the setup you are going to race in or race with the setup you qualify with

KANETAKER
08-06-2017, 16:49
i disagree with that method i believe you should either qualify with the setup you are going to race in or race with the setup you qualify with

For classification, the car is usually configured for better cornering, sacrificing top speed, and pushing the car mechanics to the maximum (brakes, engines, reduction of ventilation ducts for faster speed, etc.). But in the race, and we are talking about a 24 hour race, we have to prepare the car in a different way, in this case, focusing on being able to overtake other cars in the long straights or avoid being overtaken by lack of top speed, But above all take care that the mechanics of the car will last 24 hours without breaking, as happened to Toyota TS050 in LeMans 2016.

dault3883
08-06-2017, 16:54
For classification, the car is usually configured for better cornering, sacrificing top speed, and pushing the car mechanics to the maximum (brakes, engines, reduction of ventilation ducts for faster speed, etc.). But in the race, and we are talking about a 24 hour race, we have to prepare the car in a different way, in this case, focusing on being able to overtake other cars in the long straights or avoid being overtaken by lack of top speed, But above all take care that the mechanics of the car will last 24 hours without breaking, as happened to Toyota TS050 in LeMans 2016.

i understand what they do and why they do it i just dont agree in it iv always set up my car to race and qualified with that setup thats the way i think it should be done

Mahjik
08-06-2017, 17:16
Just to clarify, the Toyota in PC1 is the 2014 version.

KANETAKER
08-06-2017, 19:20
Just to clarify, the Toyota in PC1 is the 2014 version.

Thanks for clarify.

But the main target of this post is about the new top speed of the LMP2 2017 Spec. For now, only the Ligier JS P2 was confirmed (at the E3 trailer), but I don't know if these Ligier LMP2 is the 2016 spec ( suspected 312 km/h top speed - at PCARS1) or 2017 spec (330 - 340 km/h top speed in the Practice Session of LeMans 2017).

Mahjik
08-06-2017, 19:28
Thanks for clarify.

But the main target of this post is about the new top speed of the LMP2 2017 Spec. For now, only the Ligier JS P2 was confirmed (at the E3 trailer), but I don't know if these Ligier LMP2 is the 2016 spec ( suspected 312 km/h top speed - at PCARS1) or 2017 spec (330 - 340 km/h top speed in the Practice Session of LeMans 2017).

Given the man-months it takes to create these cars and get them into the sim, it's highly unlikely to be 2017 specs.

hkraft300
09-06-2017, 02:48
If you listen to driver interviews, you realise LMP cars in an endurance race is still a 6/12/24 hour sprint. They're flat out going for fastest laps all the time.
This is no longer 1997.
So I suspect setup between qualifying and race isn't very different.
Because of the new hybrid systems, the top speed is less of a consideration.

Also the Toyota TS040 (2014/5 I forget) had a flexible rear wing mount that worked like a passive DRS. Which was more or less illegal and gave it higher top speed than in pc1.

Cheesenium
09-06-2017, 06:06
Thanks for clarify.

But the main target of this post is about the new top speed of the LMP2 2017 Spec. For now, only the Ligier JS P2 was confirmed (at the E3 trailer), but I don't know if these Ligier LMP2 is the 2016 spec ( suspected 312 km/h top speed - at PCARS1) or 2017 spec (330 - 340 km/h top speed in the Practice Session of LeMans 2017).

There will not be any data for the 2017 LMP1 which they won't do it. SMS needs quite a fair bit of data to work on a car where there are quite a fair bit of 2016 version's data.

breyzipp
09-06-2017, 09:03
I know we all can get excited about the latest motorsport series currently active, I started following rallycross now avidly (even back-traced several seasons to get up to speed with the previous years). I would love to see the 2017 cars, specs and liveries in the game but these things take time and if a game is done properly it will be hard to get a full fledged racing series with cars from the current year. Hence why most racings series have the cars from 2016 in it, for PCARS 2 it seems to me Indycar, rallycross and GT3, GT4, GTE are all based on the 2016 season with perhaps an oddball 2015 spec car in it. That makes balancing out cars for the game easier as well instead of having to add new cars that perhaps race with new regulations.

I much rather have SMS use the modern racing cars from the 2015 & 2016 seasons with accurate stats, factory data backup and well tested & balanced than if they would add the 2017 cars in the game in a hurry.

As far as LMP1 & LMP2 go, it's great to see the Ligier JS P2 confirmed, I really hope the Oreca 07 will make it in as well, then you already have 2 great LMP2 cars for the 2016 season. For LMP1 I would actually prefer SMS to use the 2016 season as well since we still have Toyota, Porsche AND Audi in it. My main concern would be that the TS040 would stay in the game and not be replaced with the TS050. That TS050 livery looks soooooo much sexier than the old TS040 livery. But if for whatever reason the TS050 won't make it, that would be sad but it's not the end of the (PC2) world. The car list we have so far is truly outstanding already, I don't think there are even 10 cars on the list that completely not interest me (counting all the modern indycars for 1 car :P) and that is truly exceptional. If you scroll down through a Forza 6 or Forza Horizon 3 car list for example that's a whole lot of "page-downs" through uninteresting stuff.

dault3883
09-06-2017, 11:44
There will not be any data for the 2017 LMP1 which they won't do it. SMS needs quite a fair bit of data to work on a car where there are quite a fair bit of 2016 version's data.

which is pretty much what i have been saying but he wont listen

KANETAKER
09-06-2017, 17:27
which is pretty much what i have been saying but he wont listen

Under what conclusion or argument do you assume that I am not listening to the clarifications given by some WMD and SMS guys regarding my original post? I really do not understand why apparently you (and maybe Hkraft too) want to turn this topic into a very, very ... PERSONAL matter? (Without a real reason or justification).

Stop this, and focus on the topic of the post, please. Thanks.

dault3883
09-06-2017, 17:32
Under what conclusion or argument do you assume that I am not listening to the clarifications given by some WMD and SMS guys regarding my original post? I really do not understand why apparently you (and maybe Hkraft too) want to turn this topic into a very, very ... PERSONAL matter? (Without a real reason or justification).

Stop this, and focus on the topic of the post, please. Thanks.

the simple matter that you keep arguing with us over the same matter after your question has been answered. They have told you why it wont be happining yet you keep pushing the issue. so i will say what they all have been continuously been saying REQUEST DENIED!

hkraft300
09-06-2017, 17:45
Anyway
I'm hoping the aggressive downshift issue will be resolved for pc2.
It's not really an issue in pc1 if mechanical failures are on. It heavily damaged the engine within a few laps with a resulting loss of HP.

dault3883
09-06-2017, 17:49
Anyway
I'm hoping the aggressive downshift issue will be resolved for pc2.
It's not really an issue in pc1 if mechanical failures are on. It heavily damaged the engine within a few laps with a resulting loss of HP.

you mean if the mechanical failures are off?

hkraft300
09-06-2017, 18:01
you mean if the mechanical failures are off?

If mech failures on, then the engine is damaged from smashing the redline on up and downshifts.
Unfortunately, for TT and sprint races, people turn mech failure off, so there's no damage to the engine from silly shifting.

dault3883
09-06-2017, 18:07
If mech failures on, then the engine is damaged from smashing the redline on up and downshifts.
Unfortunately, for TT and sprint races, people turn mech failure off, so there's no damage to the engine from silly shifting.

i cant say that i dont have damage off too so sorry

hkraft300
09-06-2017, 18:24
i cant say that i dont have damage off too so sorry

N00B :p

dault3883
09-06-2017, 18:39
N00B :p

yea and i know it i do it for the fun but im still against artificial performance i want the cars the way they were. With no artificial performance to make them how they are now

Azure Flare
09-06-2017, 21:09
OP is gonna have egg on his face if it turns out PCars 2 won't have 2017 spec P1 or P2 cars.

dault3883
09-06-2017, 21:11
OP is gonna have egg on his face if it turns out PCars 2 won't have 2017 spec P1 or P2 cars.

i know Kane is going to be raising more of a fuss

KANETAKER
09-06-2017, 22:30
i know Kane is going to be raising more of a fuss Do you see it You are misrepresenting the subject of this post and you are turning it into a personal matter against me; To the point of making insinuations about things that I will not do, much less said that I would do if the suggestions are not accepted; Because for something they are suggestions, which means that it is not an obligation, much less an order that must be accepted.

But it seems that for you alone is a reason to make all this laughter and criticism about me. I ask you again: Have I ever hurt you, hurt you, insulted you, or laughed at you to deserve this?

I came here only to make a suggestion, writing in a polite and serious manner (assuming that I am dealing with adults as well as myself, not with children) and little by little they were distorting the subject ... Now it turns out that one can no longer Issue a comment without being the target of mockery or criticism as if in the past we had between the two some pending account to pay ...

KANETAKER
09-06-2017, 22:32
For finish this... I will buy PC2 after all, with or without 2017 spec cars. Ok?

Azure Flare
09-06-2017, 22:59
Well, you are making a big deal out of cars that may or may not be in the game.

hkraft300
10-06-2017, 02:47
All the talk of incredible fast '17 LMP2...
But I'm excited at having LMP3 cars in the game!
The LMP3 will make for great racing, and if it isn't a huge jump for GT3 drivers, it'll be excellent.

It's going to be tough to BoP LMP2, especially if we have some imsa dpi cars too.

And what about LMP900? '99 TS020 LMGTP = Speed 8, so that will be 900 not GT1, no?

With multi class it'll be varied grids using different classes of similar performance :D

dault3883
10-06-2017, 03:00
All the talk of incredible fast '17 LMP2...
But I'm excited at having LMP3 cars in the game!
The LMP3 will make for great racing, and if it isn't a huge jump for GT3 drivers, it'll be excellent.

It's going to be tough to BoP LMP2, especially if we have some imsa dpi cars too.

And what about LMP900? '99 TS020 LMGTP = Speed 8, so that will be 900 not GT1, no?

With multi class it'll be varied grids using different classes of similar performance :D

agreed Lmp3 will be cool to have

hkraft300
10-06-2017, 03:09
never use or reserved hybrid power for top speed and only use for acceleration at the exit of curves)..

LMP1 drivers never do that in real life.
It's faster to discharge for Max acceleration, even at Le Mans. They don't reserve it for top speed overtaking.
Watch footage of LMP1 cars catching and passing GTE cars and you'll know what I mean.

Roger Prynne
10-06-2017, 09:06
i know Kane is going to be raising more of a fuss

dault please stop putting fuel on the fire.

KANETAKER
11-06-2017, 21:15
Well, returning to the original theme. I understand that it is very unlikely that for the launch date will be available those cars that were launched in 2017 (unless there are any exceptions or exclusivity that we have reserved as a surprise). Therefore I see that we would only have cars with specification of 2016 and earlier that year (2015, 2014, 2013, etc.) That means that in the case of the LMP2 we would not see the Oreca 07 and also the Ligier JS P217, which are the cars launched for the current 2017 season.

For now, the only confirmed LMP2 has been Oreca 03 and Ligier JS P2 (as everyone can see in the E3 trailer), although there is still hope that at least can have the Oreca 05, which is the successor LMP2 of Oreca 03 and predecessor of Oreca 07, the car with which Oreca fight against Ligier between 2015 and 2016. Along with the Oreca 05 would have to add to the Gibson 015S and the BR01, other LMP2 cars that were available during the seasons 2015 and 2016 together with Oreca 05 and the Ligier JS P2.

In the case of Ligier JS P2, there would be a new question: In the WEC most of the LMP2 use by regulation Judd, Gibson and Nissan engines. But in the case of the Ligier, a few used Honda engines but with restrictions (2.8 L), since that engine was more powerful than the above named. But, in the case of WSCC / IMSA series, the Ligier used a more powerful and unrestricted Honda engine (3.5 L) with which the ESM team won Daytona 24H and 12H of Sebrings 2016.

The question would be which engine would have equipped the Ligier JS P2 that will come in the PCARR2? I think that if the Ligier specification used in Daytona 2016 were used, it would be a more realistic and "legal" way to get closer to the performance of the LMP2 2017 without resorting to fictitious modifications that alter realism, although that could cause the Ligier Honda to have a Advantage over the other LMP2 cars. Even though, in the PCARS1 there were cars that despite belonging to the same category, were somehow superior to other cars. For example: RWD P30 and TS040 at LMP1, Marek at LMP2.

Most likely, in the case of the LMP2 we see the Ligier with a engine that does not give advantage over the other LMP2 cars, for a warranty of an equal race with the LMP2 cars.

hkraft300
12-06-2017, 02:49
There's possibly a Ginetta LMP2 chassis too with a big V8. Can be a DPi car, or a restricted LMP2.

dault3883
12-06-2017, 03:06
There's possibly a Ginetta LMP2 chassis too with a big V8. Can be a DPi car, or a restricted LMP2.

are we getting the cadillac DPI?

TexasTyme214
12-06-2017, 03:07
I think it's possible for the Ligier to come with multiple engines. It didn't happen with the Oreca 03 because the physics devs knew the Judd and Nissan would be fairly similar after the engines were restricted. With the Ligier, the Honda and Nissan engines could provide a large enough difference to have both in game.

Azure Flare
12-06-2017, 03:30
There's possibly a Ginetta LMP2 chassis too with a big V8. Can be a DPi car, or a restricted LMP2.

LMP3 actually.

hkraft300
12-06-2017, 06:00
LMP3 actually.

BUT on Twitter or instagram Ginetta announced their entire lineup will be available on pc2.
Their lineup consists of the G57, which was an LMP2 chassis they had made a bid for WEC, but didn't make the cut like the other 4. I think it's the same G57 chassis that is used in LMP3.
But it's for sale with a V8 as a "track" car.
We know the Ginetta LMP3 is in. I wonder if the "LMP2" will be available too.
Speculating.

http://www.ginetta.com/racing.php?championship=g57&tab=car

Correct me if this is the LMP3 that'll be in pc2. The LS3 v8 in basic street spec is good for LMP3. A race tuned one is good for LMP2

Cheesenium
12-06-2017, 06:07
BUT on Twitter or instagram Ginetta announced their entire lineup will be available on pc2.
Their lineup consists of the G57, which was an LMP2 chassis they had made a bid for WEC, but didn't make the cut like the other 4. I think it's the same G57 chassis that is used in LMP3.
But it's for sale with a V8 as a "track" car.
We know the Ginetta LMP3 is in. I wonder if the "LMP2" will be available too.
Speculating.

http://www.ginetta.com/racing.php?championship=g57&tab=car

Correct me if this is the LMP3 that'll be in pc2. The LS3 v8 in basic street spec is good for LMP3. A race tuned one is good for LMP2

There is no Ginetta LMP2, they only have the LMP3 which is racing in real life along with a privateer LMP1 coming up.

G57 is also sold as a trackday car so that might come too. At most, we will get the LMP1 via DLCs. If not, that's pretty much the entire lineup of Ginetta in the game.

hkraft300
12-06-2017, 06:33
I thought Ginetta had made an LMP2 bid with the G57.

Ginetta LMP1 with Chev power, you say? Interesting proposition.
I just thought it more probable as a DPi-style LMP2.

Are Ginetta involved in an LMP1 project? I may have read about speculation of Ginetta supplying chassis to customer teams for LMP1L.

KANETAKER
12-06-2017, 07:00
are we getting the cadillac DPI?

What a surprise. But is not it supposed that (according to you) it would be unlikely that PCARS2 could have racecars 2017 Spec for its release date?
Although in spite of that, in the list of confirmed cars I have seen some cars that were launched in this 2017:

2017 Nissan GT-R NISMO (R35)
2017 McLaren 720S
2017 Mercedes-AMG GT R
2017 Ford GT

In the case of the new DPi cars, although its official debut was in the 24 hours of Daytona 2017, but actually saw the light at the end of 2016, so I hope the SMS guys have been able to get the licenses or do not have That inconvenience that you or Hkraft had suggested, that one reason why it would be difficult to count on cars this 2017 season would be to prevent teams from getting any information or benchmarks on the performance of rival cars.

Finally, the new DPi could be used in multiclass races as if they were the new LMP2 due to its great performance, being superior to the LMP2 2017 spec. In contrast the old DPi (before 2016) were not rivals neither for the LMP2 2016 Spec. The Cadillac DPi is one of my favorite cars I'd like to see in PCARS2 (also the Peugeot 908 2011, Toyota TS050, Mazda 787b, and Porsche 919 Hybrid).

hkraft300
12-06-2017, 07:42
What a surprise. But is not it supposed that (according to you) it would be unlikely that PCARS2 could have racecars 2017 Spec for its release date?
Although in spite of that, in the list of confirmed cars I have seen some cars that were launched in this 2017:

2017 Nissan GT-R NISMO (R35)
2017 McLaren 720S
2017 Mercedes-AMG GT R
2017 Ford GT



The Nissan and Mercedes platforms are a few years old now. For 2017 they have minor updates, racing and road versions. Nothing new about them. Same as the Ford GT, the GTE car competed in the wec 2016 season. For 2017 it's minor updates again, not a completely new chassis.
McLaren 720S is a road car. McLaren (also Nissan, Ford and Mercedes) would have supplied SMS with all the CAD and engineering (suspension, powertrain, performance) data for SMS to build the cars. This type of data is no performance secret, as the cars (road and GT3/E) are available for purchase.
Same for the Porsche cars.
This is possible long before the release date of the real car as they go through prototype testing and final pre-production phases, which the 720S would be doing while SMS builds the digital version through 2016/7.

So you can't use these cars as a reason to have 2017 spec high end race cars in pc2.

Cheesenium
12-06-2017, 08:17
What a surprise. But is not it supposed that (according to you) it would be unlikely that PCARS2 could have racecars 2017 Spec for its release date?
Although in spite of that, in the list of confirmed cars I have seen some cars that were launched in this 2017:

2017 Nissan GT-R NISMO (R35)
2017 McLaren 720S
2017 Mercedes-AMG GT R
2017 Ford GT

In the case of the new DPi cars, although its official debut was in the 24 hours of Daytona 2017, but actually saw the light at the end of 2016, so I hope the SMS guys have been able to get the licenses or do not have That inconvenience that you or Hkraft had suggested, that one reason why it would be difficult to count on cars this 2017 season would be to prevent teams from getting any information or benchmarks on the performance of rival cars.

Finally, the new DPi could be used in multiclass races as if they were the new LMP2 due to its great performance, being superior to the LMP2 2017 spec. In contrast the old DPi (before 2016) were not rivals neither for the LMP2 2016 Spec. The Cadillac DPi is one of my favorite cars I'd like to see in PCARS2 (also the Peugeot 908 2011, Toyota TS050, Mazda 787b, and Porsche 919 Hybrid).

What's your obsession with 2017 cars? Does that make the game less enjoyable if it's older models?

The 2017 GT3s are largely the same as previous years with some minor changes on the body work. At large, it is still the same car at it's core. There is one GT3 from pcars 1 received a major upgrade in real life, which SMS had implemented the new changes to the car returning in pcars 2.

LMP2 had received a new car along with many classes in the original game is returning with more cars. I think that is good enough for a sequel as having solely 2017 cars will not make it a good game.

SMS will never develop a licensed car without sufficient data, 2017 cars are fairly unlikely. It is not only the data they are looking for, they need good amount of references to build the car too. They did canned a car that I really hope to see in Pcars in early development of Pcars 2 because of lack of data.

On the other hand, each car takes up to 6 months to develop where even if they have the 2017 data and references, it is only likely that they will appear via DLC. There was another announced race car that was originally planned for Pcars 1 DLC that was unfortunately pushed back to Pcars 2 because they have nothing to work on.

hkraft300
12-06-2017, 08:37
What's your obsession with 2017 cars?

For the love of top speed, Cheesy! Read the full thread next time before you get involved in the discussion :p


Hi, I would like to take the opportunity to make a suggestion about taking advantage of the game is still under development to take into consideration the current performance (and specially TOP SPEED) of new LMP1&LMP2 cars compared to previous LMP1&LMP2 models of PCARS1. But that's only if SMS would confirm that the PCARS2 will have 2017 models of the LMP1&LMP2 cars.
.

In this 2017 Edition of LeMans the new lap times of the fastest LMP2 cars (2017 spec) is 3:28 - 3:30, with a amazing top speed of 330 - 341 Km/h instead of 312 Km/h from the Marek LMP2 and 308 Km/h of the PCARS1.

Cheesenium
12-06-2017, 08:45
For the love of top speed, Cheesy! Read the full thread next time before you get involved in the discussion :p

That does not explain the request of 2017 GT3 or GTEs. The whole thread feels like "I want 2017 cars for the sake of having 2017 cars".

RomKnight
12-06-2017, 16:34
People do tend to forget (probably been said in earlier posts but I'm not reading :P ) that when pC2 development started (or any other game really), it could not be launched a couple of months later but years later. When negotiations and licensing starts some cars didn't even exist.

That being said that's why DLC exists although there's no money that can buy a licenses for every car out there and we all want, like different things.

PS: YES, I would like to have current year models for at least one series - FIA WEC - and since I'm asking, the FIA WEC license itself :D

KANETAKER
12-06-2017, 16:44
That does not explain the request of 2017 GT3 or GTEs. The whole thread feels like "I want 2017 cars for the sake of having 2017 cars".

I never say anything about 2017 GTE&GT3 (all GTE/GT3 confirmed for now are fine for me). I only talking about the LMP1 and specially the new LMP2 and DPi cars.

In the case of LMP1, I would rather have more previous models, such as: Audi R10, Audi R15, Audi R18 TDI, Peugeot 908 2011, Oreca Mammut (Peugeot 908 HDI Fap), Oreca 01, Lola B12/80, Pescarolo Judd, and Toyota TS030... in some cases by the great sound of engines.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCiMk8MYGeo


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ci2BBnPTM3Y

KANETAKER
16-06-2017, 07:16
Someone can see this?:


3:14 at LeMans, new record 238183with the actual track (with chicanes), and one second behind the record with old track (without chicanes). Also, the TS050 reach 336 Km/h in these fast lap.

238185

I hope so SMS can get the 2017 Toyota TS050 at least for 2018 as an DLC. Same wish for LMP2 2017 spec, they make 3:25 at Lemans, 10 seconds faster than old LMP2.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_HrrQChpk4

ELAhrairah
19-06-2017, 17:15
Watching Le Mans this weekend I wonder if PCars2 will ne able to replicate the tear and wear a car endures, especially with the hot weather.
It would give an extra dimension to endurance racing as a game.

dault3883
19-06-2017, 17:27
Watching Le Mans this weekend I wonder if PCars2 will ne able to replicate the tear and wear a car endures, especially with the hot weather.
It would give an extra dimension to endurance racing as a game.

was it really that much hotter at le mans then it usually is or did they just have problems with their cars lasting because the LMP2 and GTE cars didnt seem to be having a problem with the heat

Mahjik
19-06-2017, 17:51
Watching Le Mans this weekend I wonder if PCars2 will ne able to replicate the tear and wear a car endures, especially with the hot weather.
It would give an extra dimension to endurance racing as a game.

There will be suspension and other damage from doing things like bounding over curbs which are too high. There won't be anything directly related to heat other than higher temps will need more radiator openings (and the affect on the tires).

dault3883
19-06-2017, 17:56
There will be suspension and other damage from doing things like bounding over curbs which are too high. There won't be anything directly related to heat other than higher temps will need more radiator openings (and the affect on the tires).

Random part failures for endurance races? just wondering. i wouldnt want it but im sure there are those out there that would

Mahjik
19-06-2017, 18:08
Random part failures for endurance races? just wondering. i wouldnt want it but im sure there are those out there that would

No, not random. Damage is based on driving. i.e. if you take too many high curbs, eventually it could lead to a suspension failure as opposed to slowing down a bit and not using too much curb.

ELAhrairah
19-06-2017, 18:12
was it really that much hotter at le mans then it usually is or did they just have problems with their cars lasting because the LMP2 and GTE cars didnt seem to be having a problem with the heat

Word In the paddock was that the high temperature pushed humans and machines to the limit. I hope to see something like this back in the endurance part of the game: weather (and other variables) & performance correlation.

ELAhrairah
19-06-2017, 18:13
No, not random. Damage is based on driving. i.e. if you take too many high curbs, eventually it could lead to a suspension failure as opposed to slowing down a bit and not using too much curb.

This sounds good, especially the "eventually" part.

dault3883
19-06-2017, 18:17
in racing you do sometimes have parts just randomly brake for no rhyme or reason

Mahjik
19-06-2017, 18:28
in racing you do sometimes have parts just randomly brake for no rhyme or reason

Yes, but nobody wants that in a 'game'..

hkraft300
19-06-2017, 18:36
in racing you do sometimes have parts just randomly brake for no rhyme or reason

I'll argue that parts always fail with good reason.
From defective material, fatigue/stress/overloading to production defect or past it's service life or operating outside design parameters.
There's always a reason.

dault3883
19-06-2017, 18:36
Yes, but nobody wants that in a 'game'..

if you want total realism you do and i know there are those out there that would but no i wouldnt want it to be forced upon me

ELAhrairah
19-06-2017, 18:37
Yes, but nobody wants that in a 'game'..

Exactly, me neither. There always has to be a relation to the way you treat the car. I hope track circumstances will play a bigger role in Pcars2. I saw a tech of the weather engine you guys have build. Looks good.

ELAhrairah
19-06-2017, 18:39
I'll argue that parts always fail with good reason.
From defective material, fatigue/stress/overloading to production defect or past it's service life or operating outside design parameters.
There's always a reason.

Say you hit the kerbs 5 times to hard, hope the game is sophisticated enough to take this in and force a total suspension failure. According to Mahjik this might be possible.

Roger Prynne
19-06-2017, 18:41
^ Yep

dault3883
19-06-2017, 18:42
I'll argue that parts always fail with good reason.
From defective material, fatigue/stress/overloading to production defect or past it's service life or operating outside design parameters.
There's always a reason.

Defective material would cause random failure in an engine you dont know its defective though

RomKnight
19-06-2017, 18:46
That's just it isn't it? There's always a reason but it might be unknown at the time :) In a game it'll always be "just because".

It's like putting up with spell-checking smartASSphones trying to guess what I want to write or correct my words. It'll just have random guesses at the wrong times when the fingers are all in GO mode and unstoppable ending up in that infamous send arrow :D

hkraft300
19-06-2017, 18:46
Defective material would cause random failure in an engine you dont know its defective though

And that's the reason for the failure = not random.

KANETAKER
19-06-2017, 20:41
Random part failures for endurance races? just wondering. i wouldnt want it but im sure there are those out there that would
Perhaps the only thing that could be random would be faults in the electrical or energy recovery systems, especially if the ambient temperature is very high. But ask Toyota about this (what happened in 2016 with car # 5 or in this 2017 with car # 8), or the Porsche with car # 2.

The problem is that sometimes, despite not making mistakes or forcing the car to the limits, there are usually unexpected mechanical failures other than electronics, whether the clutch (Toyota # 7) or lack of oil pressure (Porsche # 1).

If I remember correctly, in old simulation games (like RFactor or F1 Challenge 99-02) there was an option to configure the system of mechanical failures that was not limited to only 2 options (ON or OFF). The available options were:

- Off.
- Random.
- Depending of the damages (by hits/crashes or by aggressive driving).
- According to the time course / Realistic, which includes the damage factor (the previous point treated) and also the ambient temperature.

It would be nice to take this suggestion into account. Or maybe add a different section for both mechanical damage and failures in electronic systems. Personally using the random mode would be a very bad idea.

In the case of disabling mechanical failures, it was usually not used so much in short races but rather to prevent the affected players to leaving the game immediately, especially if their withdrawal occurred at the beginning of the race and avoid having to wait until the End of the session. At this point, I hope that SMS has been able to correct a very serious BUG in replays, which caused that those cars that had left the game before finishing the race did not appear in the replays, or in their defect they appeared parked like ghosts in the starting grid. Ideally, only the player leaves the game, but his car remains there.

ELAhrairah
19-06-2017, 20:48
And please please please please add insects on the windshield! The amount of bugs during a proper endurance race is very heavy. ;)
I am very serious.

Roger Prynne
19-06-2017, 20:54
And please please please please add insects on the windshield! The amount of bugs during a proper endurance race is very heavy. ;)
I am very serious.
No no, we don't want any bugs anywhere :eek-new:

dault3883
19-06-2017, 21:00
No no, we don't want any bugs anywhere :eek-new:

agreed we dont want bugs in the game people would be livid if there were bugs in it upon release ;)

ELAhrairah
19-06-2017, 21:17
No no, we don't want any bugs anywhere :eek-new:

Seriously, if this game has bugs on the windshield, instant buy.

dault3883
19-06-2017, 21:22
Seriously, if this game has bugs on the windshield, instant buy.

i think there are more important things to have on the game than bugs on a windshield but thats just my opinion

ELAhrairah
19-06-2017, 21:30
i think there are more important things to have on the game than bugs on a windshield but thats just my opinion
hey bugs are to be taken very serious. They make or break a game

GenBrien
20-06-2017, 00:03
hey bugs are to be taken very serious. They make or break a game

like how they over did it in NFS shift series?

if they're doing it, it must be subtle and there should have a way to remove it (helmet/windshield plastic film & rain)

hkraft300
20-06-2017, 00:43
Perhaps the only thing that could be random would be faults in the electrical or energy recovery systems, especially if the ambient temperature is very high.

:hopelessness:

NOT random.
Toyota decided to sacrifice cooling for performance.
Paid the price.
They can make all the hybrid parts durable and long lasting - but the car will lose power/gain weight.

KANETAKER
20-06-2017, 01:43
:hopelessness:

NOT random.
Toyota decided to sacrifice cooling for performance.
Paid the price.
They can make all the hybrid parts durable and long lasting - but the car will lose power/gain weight.

I understand that what they did not count was with air conditioning system so that their drivers stay fresh in the cockpit, unlike the Porsche and other cars that did have that system; Rather, what had been said was that the high ambient heat could pass both the Toyota and the Porsche as the only cars with hybrid recovery systems, very likely to overheat.

Rather how do you explain that Porsche also had reliability problems in its two cars, just like Toyota? :v

And the case of the Porsche # 1 is more surprising and worrying since no rival was pressing and running comfortably after the retirement of Toyota #9. Maybe not running in full speed could have affected the car? Not being accustomed to running for more than 6 hours on half gas... possibly the car was slowly "cooling" and could have caused their components to fail because they were not used at full power and at optimum temperature. (?) Perhaps just as it is bad to force something or someone else's account (causing overkill), it must also be bad not to work at all regimens. Same reason why (for example) it is bad for any person lack of physical exercise (causes sedentary, overweight) as well as abuse of exercise (fractures, muscle aches, tears of ligaments, dehydration, etc.)

Cheesenium
20-06-2017, 01:47
Rather how do you explain that Porsche also had reliability problems in its two cars, just like Toyota?

Because shit happens and that's why endurance racing is interesting.

dault3883
20-06-2017, 01:48
Because shit happens and that's why endurance racing is interesting.

and when that happens its random it randomly quite that doesnt mean there wasnt a reason for it breaking just the timing was random

KANETAKER
20-06-2017, 01:53
And the case of the Porsche # 1 is more surprising and worrying since no rival was pressing and running comfortably after the retirement of Toyota #9. Maybe not running in full speed could have affected the car? Not being accustomed to running for more than 6 hours on half gas... possibly the car was slowly "cooling" and could have caused their components to fail because they were not used at full power and at optimum temperature. (?) Perhaps just as it is bad to force something or someone else's account (causing overkill), it must also be bad not to work at all regimens. Same reason why (for example) it is bad for any person lack of physical exercise (causes sedentary, overweight) as well as abuse of exercise (fractures, muscle aches, tears of ligaments, dehydration, etc.)

In the case of cars, on the one hand the brakes and cold tires are bad, as well as the brakes and tires overheated, for example. Possibly something similar happened to the other components of the car, in the case of Porsche # 1, some problem to spend many hours without running at optimum temperature.

The only good thing what happened last year (with Toyota #5) as in this year (with Porsche #1) is that now any team that is leading the race (with 1, 2 or more laps ahead) CAN'T feel calm down or put to celebrate before the end of the race (in the last lap) like in previous years. This time the mechanics of the Porsche# 2 could be seen too serious, worried, scared and tense until the last turn on the last lap .. and that's good.

ELAhrairah
22-06-2017, 14:52
- will the game have yellow flaggs and slow zone rules? Also when an accident happens between A.I. : will the game register this and implement slow zones etc. In Pcars1 everyone just kept on driving around debris like nothing happened.

- safety car? Yes, no, maybe?

- when monitoring a race from the pits will there be a "broadcaster" camera available? So a generic camera view that shows all cars like you see on tv and not just one?

- when setting up your car in a real sim you can actually destroy your car if done wrong. I found Pcars1 very forgiving in this and until patch 7.0 it even had that ridiculous camber exploit. What I am trying to ask: will Pcars 2 be more realistic?

hkraft300
22-06-2017, 16:16
Rather how do you explain that Porsche also had reliability problems in its two cars, just like Toyota? :v

Because:


Toyota and the Porsche as the only cars with hybrid recovery systems, very likely to overheat.

The massive energy charge/discharge cycles create immense heat. Consider how much the battery heats up during charging just a phone or tablet!

To win Any race, you have to design the car correctly and competitively for its purpose.
What I feel Toyota and Porsche are doing is pursuing outright performance, sacrificing reliability. By that I mean they are sacrificing cooling capacity for aerodynamic efficiency. To win le Mans, you can't make any mistakes, from design to personnel, every nut and bolt to multimillion-dollar ICE and hybrid systems.

It's why le Mans is special.



- when setting up your car in a real sim you can actually destroy your car if done wrong. I found Pcars1 very forgiving in this and until patch 7.0 it even had that ridiculous camber exploit. What I am trying to ask: will Pcars 2 be more realistic?

Yes.
I think pc1 was pretty forgiving of damage from bad tuning, for example low ride height and smashing kerbs.
Roger mentioned above that there will be suspension damage.
Camber exploit is gone. Tyre model updated.
If it wasn't, LT3 would be redundant.
As tracks and track conditions get more realistic, the vehicle and tyre physics have to keep up.
It's like releasing a VR game before anyone could buy a VR headset.