PDA

View Full Version : Lose back end on corner entry



freeon
22-12-2017, 14:22
I mostly run default lose setup. Where I'm struggling the most is on turn entry under braking. To the point that I sometimes spin out. It seam to be the same for most car/track combo. What is the best way to fix this? More rear brakes? Or suspension tuning?

Sankyo
22-12-2017, 14:28
Rear end stability under trail braking (braking and steering) is usually coast differential, brake balance, rear roll bar stiffness.

AbeWoz
22-12-2017, 14:31
I mostly run default lose setup. Where I'm struggling the most is on turn entry under braking. To the point that I sometimes spin out. It seam to be the same for most car/track combo. What is the best way to fix this? More rear brakes? Or suspension tuning?

try moving brake balance more towards the front. Too much rear brake can cause the rear tires to lock up and induce a spin

You can also add some coast differential as Sanyo stated.

freeon
22-12-2017, 14:37
try moving brake balance more towards the front. Too much rear brake can cause the rear tires to lock up and induce a spin

You can also add some coast differential as Sanyo stated.

I run the crew chief app and he is always saying I'm locking up the fronts. Wouldn't moving balance more towards the front make this worst ?

hkraft300
22-12-2017, 14:43
I mostly run default lose setup. Where I'm struggling the most is on turn entry under braking. To the point that I sometimes spin out. It seam to be the same for most car/track combo. What is the best way to fix this?

Brake earlier, and try not to downshift during turn-in.

freeon
22-12-2017, 14:48
I think your right on the breaking earlier. I was hoping that a set up change would make it more stable and prevent me from spinning out if I make a mistake and break to late.

Visceral_Syn
22-12-2017, 14:53
Moving the brake controller forward will make this worse, if you do not change your braking technique. May be less effort in reducing Coast differential settings, or softening the rear anti-roll bars.

AbeWoz
22-12-2017, 15:03
I run the crew chief app and he is always saying I'm locking up the fronts. Wouldn't moving balance more towards the front make this worst ?

yeah, but i didnt know when I offered some suggestions.

Sankyo
22-12-2017, 15:11
Interesting how you spin out when the fronts are locking up. Usually you go straight when that happens.

John Hargreaves
22-12-2017, 15:15
Do you run with ABS on? This can be a quick fix for the rear locking up on some cars.

freeon
22-12-2017, 15:18
I never seemed to have this issue before. I don't think it started immediately after the last patch but could have. Maybe my driving styled changed or maybe it's a bug? Haven't seen anyone else mentioned it so probably not. Most people here are very vocal about it when they suspect a bug:rolleyes:

freeon
22-12-2017, 15:19
Do you run with ABS on? This can be a quick fix for the rear locking up on some cars.

I run authentic.

Visceral_Syn
22-12-2017, 15:21
I run the crew chief as well, and since the 1.3 patch he has been more vocal about the fronts locking up under braking. With my bad braking techniques. I can also see the fronts lock up in the replay. I've been concentrating on moving the brake controller to the rear, and or braking earlier, moreso in straightline and not trailbraking as much

hkraft300
22-12-2017, 15:39
You brake hard and late, hence the frequent front lock.
You brake late and turn late, so you’ forced to transition brake->steer in very short time, but really you stay on the brakes a fraction too long to slow enough to make the corner = too much trailing the brakes = entry oversteer.

Visceral_Syn
22-12-2017, 15:49
also known as bad braking techniques...

PeteMason
22-12-2017, 16:42
It amazes me with posts like this how little information is given per fault.
What car are you using?
FWD, RWD, AWD?
What tyres etc?
Are you using ABS,TC,SC ?
What track?
Plus any other information.

This information is really needed for anyone to give out good advice.
One of the best places to look for cures is the internet as everyone here has there own opinion on the remedy. But that depends on whether or not you wish to learn.

First place to start would be reduce brake pressure( you will stop but a lot smoother) This is a good thing to do as it cuts out wheel locks.
I usually run between 80-90% on all my cars.
Then try loosening your rear ABS, gives more body roll. (Hard F Soft R gives understeer)(Soft F and Hard R gives oversteer)
Increase your front tyre patch thus giving you a little more grip, using Camber and Toe settings.
If the above fails tune your suspension.
Failing that, before corner entry try braking while still on the accelerator, this takes some practice but it does work for cars with lift off oversteer.

Good luck

John Hargreaves
22-12-2017, 17:22
I run authentic.

Some cars definitely are worse than others, I used to have trouble with the Ginetta GT3 and Gt4 cars spinning into corners, but ABS cured it. Trouble with a sim is that you can't feel the brakes like you can in real life, so running with ABS off is harder as you can't feel anything back through the pedal. In a real car when you stamp the brakes you can feel the rubber biting into the tarmac through your feet and backside, but all we have in a sim is through the wheel. ABS on low for me just replaces that missing feel.

freeon
22-12-2017, 17:38
It amazes me with posts like this how little information is given per fault.
What car are you using?
FWD, RWD, AWD?
What tyres etc?
Are you using ABS,TC,SC ?
What track?
Plus any other information.


Good luck

I mostly run GT3 NSX and Ferrari but as mentioned earlier it seams to be consistent regardless the track/car combo. RWD. Tyres at default by weather. Authentic for ABS,TC,SC

Thank you all for your advice and I will take them all for consideration. I'm off for 2 weeks so should have plenty of time to practice different techniques and set-ups. See you all on the track.

John Hargreaves
22-12-2017, 17:47
The Ferrari GT3 is one of the most stable cars in the game, maybe you are asking a bit too much of it and turning/rotating just a bit too quick for the outside edge of the tyre to cope with, or maybe just not turning smoothly enough? The first left hander at Zolder is a good test of what a car can do, I often come into that one too fast and spin out, so it gives you a bit of a feel for how fast you can get away with a turn.

pferreirag60
23-12-2017, 14:03
Some cars that suffer from lift off oversteer, the technique i use in every corner(almost): never take your foot from the accelerator, always use some acceleration, in that way, you can enter faster without loosing the back end of the car. Maybe that can help you.

Nyreen
23-12-2017, 18:01
Brake earlier, and try not to downshift during turn-in.

Plenty of good advices, this one will drastically change how cars behave in corner entry. They almost all spin when downshifting to 1st (unless engine braking tuned at 10, which is pointless), so downshift only when tires can handle the brake power : either in a straight line or into the corner, when you know the tires don't have that much load from the brake/throttle/steering. You have to work with your feelings, here.

If that happens in every type of corners, with default setup, it's either your driving, or your hardware's settings.

Atak Kat
23-12-2017, 18:14
Some cars that suffer from lift off oversteer, the technique i use in every corner(almost): never take your foot from the accelerator, always use some acceleration, in that way, you can enter faster without loosing the back end of the car. Maybe that can help you.

This. Especially if you happen to do a downshift as well.... give it a little gas blip when you downshift.....

smokozuna
27-12-2017, 02:59
Some cars that suffer from lift off oversteer, the technique i use in every corner(almost): never take your foot from the accelerator, always use some acceleration, in that way, you can enter faster without loosing the back end of the car. Maybe that can help you.

that is the only way i have been able to drive formula rookie cars. problem is i like coasting around corners, i have had to learn a new way to drive, always keeping the throttle open a little in corners. i wish their was another way.

Nyreen
27-12-2017, 10:47
Yes, the way is not to hug the inside line of the corner, and trail the brake the most as possible. In an optimal situation, there is no coasting, only brake or throttle inputs. Are you taking your corners as such ?

https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-a8478b30bc095b32e341694608fc3b27-c

Get a read on this as well,
http://www.racelogic.co.uk/_downloads/Misc/Racelogic-ebook-advanced-circuit-driving.pdf