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Kaz1983
27-03-2018, 14:16
Just as the title says, as much as I really respect SMS for having a balls to put together such an impressive game.. I'm really struggling right now.... I'm not too sure whether it's me, the game or combination of both but it's really got me pissed off if I'm honest, pissed off with myself....

I'm using a controller at the moment (I'm on the verge of getting a G29) or that it's just the result of bad habits from playing games like Need for Speed when I was younger (a lot younger) and more recently Gran Turismo for example. I have GT Sport here, so it's not like I have to buy or anything and problems to say that I don't think about switching back over to playing a game that is generally more forgiving and more enjoyable in a relaxed sort of way, not a game that punishes mistakes and demands your full attention..... that is Project CARS 2 in a nutshell to be honest.... I'm leaning towards the fact that I have only used to controller so far as the reason why I'm struggling so much.

But it's not all bad news.....

Even though I'm 7 seconds off the pace and whether it be the first sector or third, I'm still (at times, here and there) setting the fastest times -top 3 times- but I just can't turn that into the fastest laps or the most consistent 10+ laps, should I say. I increased my lap times just recently by only adding 10 laps fuel, rather than a full tank..... so tuning it's not something I've gotten into as yet but I have noticed that I don't drive smoothly at all but rather in a stutter/jerky matter, which is really annoying and brings me back to my original point, should I stay with Project CARS 2 or head back to Gran Turismo Sport with my tail between my legs?

Alfisti
27-03-2018, 14:21
Are you just slow or can't keep it straight and always spinning?

Kaz1983
27-03-2018, 14:23
I don't have enough confidence to go fast I suppose and when I do set a good sector I often then spin out or temporary lose control should I say...

John Hargreaves
27-03-2018, 14:26
Lots of good advice here, it might help you.

http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?61350-Pls-help-the-game-is-unplayable

edit: this is another good one, lots of useful suggestions here too

http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?59707-I-need-a-lot-of-help-unplayable-for-me-right-now

banner77amc
27-03-2018, 14:33
I will say the moment I went from controller to wheel it changed everything for me. PC1 made me upgrade to a wheel and the Thrustmaster T80 did a decent job but as I became less aware of bumps or feel I felt I needed more.

The G29 is a very good investment to immerse yourself more and I've enjoyed every bit of it. I'm faster now that I ever was and can confidently bring the aggression and skill of the AI up above the 70 mark.

Atak Kat
27-03-2018, 14:37
It's hard to say, but:

First, there are various posts on this forum with lots of suggestions how to get the game settings (not car setups) in a way to work much better with the controller. I don't use controller myself, only tried it once, but it was a mess for me. I don't have the threads to copy/paste here, but I know there are a lot of good advice from forum members that use controllers with settings to help get things a bit more under control. It's definitely possible to drive fast, and consistent with controller.... some of the guys I see regularly in lobbies are always at the top, winning races, and I know a few of them use controllers. So there is for sure a way. Car setups can have a big influence too, but make sure the overall controller settings are adjusted first (find/pick a reasonably stable car to fine-tune the controller settings that work for you first). After that, you can go to the next step of frustration re: the various car setup details.

Second. Consider seriously a wheel, if you really enjoy racing games (even GTS). This depends on many things, but with a wheel the whole situation becomes much different. There are also lots of debates also about wheel settings, ffb, etc (it's not a holy grail), but I think the game overall is much more suited to a wheel user (without being specific re: why.)

My opinion, I just cannot appreciate the whole way the driving works in GTS. I like PC2 much much better. That said, there are clearly people who prefer the overall package of GTS and it suits them much much better. And the point is to enjoy a game, and not be so frustrated. There's a trade-off either way. Neither is perfect in my opinion. But you do have to figure out which suits your need better. For me, GTS is more suitable to someone using controller, and just wanting to play and drive nice cars. Which is fine, and someone will argue with me on this.... that's why I say 'for me'. PC2 is more suitable for someone that is looking for something more realistic, technical, and intricate (as far as the handling details go, again 'for me'). Both have their down-sides as well.

Good luck.

cpcdem
27-03-2018, 14:39
I'd say definitely stick to it, most probably it will give you a big reward later. Personally, after a brief time with F1 2010, I played Grid 2 for a year or so and really enjoyed it (despite the extremely bad AI), then I tried Grid Autosport and at first I thought, oh, that's not for me, cars are so extremely difficult to drive, this cannot be right. But after a couple months I got used to it, liked it a lot and got hooked to it (despite the even worse AI:)). I tried playing Grid 2 again and now couldn't stand it, I could not believe I was playing a game with sooooo loose physics before!

Same story again, tried Project Cars 1 later, also AC and RaceRoom and at first I thought those games are definitely not for me, it thought it must be only stupid elitists who think they're doing something important playing such games with immense difficulty. Well, after a while I got used to those, too, it all started to make sense and I've been having a blast with those games since, and lately with PC2. Needless to say I tried to have again a race or two with Autosport and I couldn't stand its physics anymore for more than a few minutes.

Not saying the same will happen to you, different people, different tastes, but give it a good chance, you maybe will end up completely loving it, too, once you get the hang of it. Mind you though, I am using a wheel and I have no idea how the game feels like with a gamepad.

John Hargreaves
27-03-2018, 14:46
PC2 works well on a gamepad, but I usually drive with ABS/TC/SC on my PS4 as I just don't have the 21stC thumb skillz necessary. Even so, you can feel the physics well enough and you have to employ all the real world techniques - smoothness, braking + accelerating at the right time etc. to do well.

That said, the game does move to a whole other level with a wheel though, so there is an immense amount of depth to explore.

Alfisti
27-03-2018, 14:46
I don't have enough confidence to go fast I suppose and when I do set a good sector I often then spin out or temporary lose control should I say...

OK.

I recently moved over to GTSport because I just cannot use the sticks and pull triggers on a controller, so using the analog inputs the game is extremely difficult. I will say that the assists turning off at random, session to session, made it very difficult to get a rhythm for the game. It is, if you can keep it on track, a better game than GTSport which feels wooden and fake in comparison. However PC2 suffers from poor UI and is just not as polished as GTSport.

My advice would be to increase ABS to 90-100%, drop brake pressure to 75%, use stability control and Traction Control and see if all that helps. But beware, assists WILl turn themselves off so check before each session.

Kaz1983
27-03-2018, 14:58
I've got the wheel here, just setting it up.. see I'm in a wheelchair so gotta make a few changes to my G29, my hands aren't the best in terms holding a controller and making quick recoveries and countering oversteer or understeer when/if I get it etc etc .... a wheel will be great once its converted for me....... rather than going full throttle, then having to lift off, then full throttle just before I touch the brakes, lift off - then slam on the brakes .. rinse, repeat etc etc

So yeah I'm sticking with it, plenty good info here.. thanks everyone.

Kaz1983
27-03-2018, 15:33
Ohh if any bodies interested or in the same boat, these the mods I'm doing to my G29 wheel.....

Atak Kat
27-03-2018, 17:18
I've got the wheel here, just setting it up.. see I'm in a wheelchair so gotta make a few changes to my G29, my hands aren't the best in terms holding a controller and making quick recoveries and countering oversteer or understeer when/if I get it etc etc .... a wheel will be great once its converted for me....... rather than going full throttle, then having to lift off, then full throttle just before I touch the brakes, lift off - then slam on the brakes .. rinse, repeat etc etc

So yeah I'm sticking with it, plenty good info here.. thanks everyone.

A wheel will benefit the overall sim racing fun factor, no doubt. No matter what. The nice thing about PC2 is you can adjust the AI level and aggressiveness to suit you. Who cares what level it is. Have fun and race at the level you want.

Edit> I find I'm doing a lot more AI races myself these days, when the online lobbies are pretty poor. Truth be told.... recently.... I've been having more fun with the AI races....

Just don't fall prey to the 'one game is better than the other' thing. They all have their downsides. None is perfect. Find the one that makes you smile in the end, or at least motivates you to keep going. So be it. Enjoy.

Mahjik
27-03-2018, 20:26
I would start by working with getting some controller settings that suit your driving style. I don't use a controller, but I know there are several posts here with controller configuration suggestions that I believe will help you get started. Usually once drivers have their controller configs sorted out, they find it easier to control the cars.

Konan
27-03-2018, 20:52
I would start by working with getting some controller settings that suit your driving style. I don't use a controller, but I know there are several posts here with controller configuration suggestions that I believe will help you get started. Usually once drivers have their controller configs sorted out, they find it easier to control the cars.

I'll add to that....first time i played the game i started fiddling with all sorts of settings,trying to get it right....until i got the advice to just stick with the default settings.
It took some time to get adjusted myself (because actually i needed to adjust to the game,not the other way around) but once i did.....BINGO!
I drive everything "out off the box" now (career only player though) and i'm having a blast!

Simerection
28-03-2018, 01:48
Get a wheel.

Turn off all assists except the ones the car came with.

Pick your favorite car and track.

Drive slow enough so that you can complete 1 lap without incident.

Do a bare minimum of 1000 laps a week..preferably 10000 laps a week.

You will get better.

Do this for a year and you will get unbelievably good.

simsimsheree
28-03-2018, 02:37
I've got the wheel here, just setting it up.. see I'm in a wheelchair so gotta make a few changes to my G29, my hands aren't the best in terms holding a controller and making quick recoveries and countering oversteer or understeer when/if I get it etc etc .... a wheel will be great once its converted for me....... rather than going full throttle, then having to lift off, then full throttle just before I touch the brakes, lift off - then slam on the brakes .. rinse, repeat etc etc

So yeah I'm sticking with it, plenty good info here.. thanks everyone.


Trouble is, if you are in a wheelchair, do you have fine motor skills in both feet? If you get the G29, that's going to be an issue. Probably the area that gives me the most trouble in PC2, having come from GT Sport and GT6, is braking.

GT Sport is essentially a binary system. Full on or full off (with ABS on) and stability under braking is far greater than PC2's model. Yes, sure, you can trail brake a little, modulate brakes a bit in GTS, but mostly it's on/off. PC2 is FAR more sensitive to locking up, whether with ABS or without. I basically sucked the first few weeks on PC2 and was tearing my hair out until I watched a few decent drivers online, and noticed how seldom they hit 100% brake travel.

I had been playing GT on a DFGT, with pedals that had no resistance hardly at all. I now have a T150Pro (with the better three pedal floor unit), but still couldn't feel the pedals much. So, I added the included rubber cone brake mod, which made the brake far more resistive, and things started to get a LOT better. Yes, I still have a tendency to stomp on the brakes, but the brake mod makes it FAR harder to get to 100% travel.

But I could see that, if in a wheelchair with perhaps limited leg motion, you might have quite a bit of trouble with that. So, it's hard without knowing about that to tell you whether to bail on PC2 and go back to GT Sport. If your legs can run a car's pedals, or you don't have an issue with moving them accurately at least at the ankles to run pedals, I'd say get the G29 and stick with PC2. But if you have issues with fine motor skills in your feet, PC2 is going to still be a hard game to play even with the wheel...

Nuckerball
28-03-2018, 03:24
If you're on a controller, use opposite lock assist. It turned my game from being nigh unplayable to a far more stable experience. If you get a wheel, turn it off because it's really for controller and keyboards only.

Ravager619
28-03-2018, 05:29
I'd stick with it, and I can understand how it feels so much different than other games. I decided to play Need For Speed: Most Wanted last night for the first time in ages. The physics are so much different, but I wouldn't say one game is better than the other. One is a racing simulator, and the other is fun for terrorizing the cops in Fairhaven while doing my best Hoonigan imitation.

If you can, go for a wheel. I've had a T150 in the past and I'm using the T300RS now. For both, I could imagine you can program any of those buttons to do anything you need them to do.

Kaz1983
28-03-2018, 09:38
Trouble is, if you are in a wheelchair, do you have fine motor skills in both feet? If you get the G29, that's going to be an issue.

I pulled apart the throttle, brake and clutch... it doing that I've managed to have it so I left hand controls the throttle and brake (using a downward motion to initiate the throttle and I'm pushing motion to activate the brakes) ....... .. I will take a photo once everything's been put together.


But I could see that, if in a wheelchair with perhaps limited leg motion, you might have quite a bit of trouble with that.

If there's no modifications done to the wheel/pedals, you're 100% right... oh just to add I was nervous as fu#k the first time I started pulling apart the G29's pedals, after all it was brand new and still in the box the day before lol

Kaz1983
28-03-2018, 09:41
My hand controls are similar to this guys....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12bckWI3FSU

Gav88888
28-03-2018, 10:04
A lot of good advice in this thread, but what I will add is that some of the fastest guys use a controller, I regularly race with guys that kick my a55 and they use controllers, also getting a wheel makes it easier/more realistic but not faster, well, depending on the issues you have with a controller.

Controller setup is also a pain until you get it right.

Kaz1983
28-03-2018, 12:26
Its kinda a case of being TOO aware of the fact one little error can cause a chain reaction that ends in you facing north when you should be pointed south.... I'm holding back you could say and that's not doing me any favours.... .. I can't wait till my wheel is ready to go, shouldn't be too long but in the mean time I might but the AI on 20 and add +1 for any victory and +1 for every pole position .. if I finish bottom 3 spots I'll substitute -1 .. I'm thinking that might be the go for the time being

Alfisti
28-03-2018, 15:38
I've not used a wheel but it's surely got to be more forgiving than a controller. You can do little corrections much easier surely?

Ofnir4
28-03-2018, 15:52
Maybe not more forgiving, but surely more informative. Going from vibrations and rumble to true force feedback must be a nice step in understanding what the car is doing. (before it's too late that is)

Pendy
28-03-2018, 16:25
It took me a long time to get as fast as I'd like to be at this game. Took awhile to get controller settings just right. Most of all it took a lot of practice. I've never been a wheel guy and I used to be pretty decent at other racing sims. I'm not trying L2P you or anything like that but practice was my ticket to getting faster. This game is hard and unforgiving bit it's being improved upon and it is truly rewarding when you finally reap the fruits of your efforts.
My two cents.

riverreveal
28-03-2018, 16:54
I find it hard but I twist the knife further everyday.

I'm not getting better, but I like it.

Kaz1983
28-03-2018, 21:53
I've not used a wheel but it's surely got to be more forgiving than a controller. You can do little corrections much easier surely?

Yep, in fact that's my problem right now.. I'm so used to making, little corrections and not getting punished when they go wrong, learning bad habits from playing arcade d type racing games has left me always questioning myself before I go to make little corrections on Project CARS 2.

simsimsheree
28-03-2018, 22:09
There's a tendency, when coming from games where you have already mastered high speed and power racing because of the arcade ease, to want to start in PC2 at that level.

I think you are going to learn faster and develop fewer bad habits (or unlearn the ones you already have from the arcade game!) if you start strictly at the bottom. Low power road cars and GT5 Ginetta's, stuff like that. Possibly, not even Formula Rookie until you can make an FR-S or something like that do your bidding.

Basically, you have to toss out everything you learned in arcadey games. That takes time!

Kaz1983
28-03-2018, 23:59
I think you might be right, re "you have to toss out everything you learned in arcadey games"

zedeeyen
29-03-2018, 13:17
I played for a while on controller, then switched to a wheel.

I had decent enough pace on the controller in most classes. Not Leaderboard-level, but within a couple of seconds of it, which meant usually starting and finishing at worst top-five in MP unless it was a particularly strong lobby. I absolutely couldn't just jump into a car I'd never driven and be on pace though, I would have to practice for many laps to get up to speed.

When I first switched to wheel I was initially much slower, like 3-4 secs per lap slower than my previous pace. It took a couple of weeks' practice and I'm now slightly faster than I was on controller, but crucially I can now hit pace on unfamiliar car/ track combos in a fraction of the time it was taking me on controller.

ELAhrairah
29-03-2018, 13:51
Dedicate to one car, one circuit and, here's the golden tip: learn to race it in the wet. After you become competitive (top 5) with AI on 100%, set AI to 101%, switch to dry and try to reach top 5 again.
Each time you get in the top 3 add 1% to the AI difficulty.

Good luck

Death Proof
29-03-2018, 15:20
Finding established baseline input settings is the first thing to establish no matter what the device is. Then it is a matter of fine tuning once you know what settings make a difference and where. Then testing the controls across a variety of cars and track conditions. Then picking out anyone of those conditions and disciplines and practicing it many many times along with car tuning at that point...This game has made me really appreciate how much easier it is to drive my real life vehicle at legal road speeds by comparison:nonchalance:

Vic Flange
30-03-2018, 06:30
What cars are your preference ? If you are jumping into some monster powered modern cars they can be a handful to drive.
Try something like the Lotus 25. It is a beautiful car to drive. Very compliant.
Also start at tracks like Monza Classic and Siverstone Classic.

Kaz1983
04-04-2018, 13:07
With a wheel WAY better. :)

Konan
04-04-2018, 14:50
With a wheel WAY better. :)

...so i've heard...:cool:

Smoked_Cheddar
04-04-2018, 15:47
With a wheel WAY better. :)

It's great to see a happy ending, have a great time racing!

iggy
04-04-2018, 18:05
When I first came to PC2, I struggled badly... of course at that time, there were some issues that made it even harder, which since have been resolved. Even so, there for sure is a pretty big learning curve with PC2...

While there are many really fast drivers who use the controller, I can't do it myself... But then I've had my G29 for a while and have gotten used to using a wheel, so I'd have to re-learn everything to do any good with a controller.

Some things that seem to have helped me...

Make sure you stay on the racing line.. not necessarily the line that you can turn on or off, but the actual line where you can see rubber on the track, as far as I can tell, the grip level on the racing line is much higher then off the line. That rubber on the track will give you a lot of clues as to where you should be driving and braking , so I found that turning off the imaginary line that is supposed to help you, actually helped me, by letting me see the track and the rubber on the track.

Tire temperatures are critical... if you can't get up to at least 160F or so on your hard tires, you probably need to use soft tires.. Don't trust the automated choice of compound, it's not always right. Sometimes you need to drive harder , just to keep the tire temperatures up...

Be very conscious of not over driving the car... one of my biggest mistakes even now, is trying to go too fast through corners, often your better off to slow down a little and not slide the car around much...

More than anything , you really need to learn a lot of little things about how everything works, use what you learn to your advantage. If you stick with it ( and you should ), the rewards of your efforts are very satisfying...

Kaz1983
05-04-2018, 13:39
Dedicate to one car, one circuit and, here's the golden tip: learn to race it in the wet. After you become competitive (top 5) with AI on 100%, set AI to 101%, switch to dry and try to reach top 5 again.
Each time you get in the top 3 add 1% to the AI difficulty.

Good luck

Car: Audi V8 Quattro
Track: Catalunya

Some nice flowing corners - I've read your full throttle 60% of the time but that said there is a few nice technical corners and one/maybe two depending what layout you go at the end and start of the GP layout .... nice track..

Been reading the "How to develop your racing skills" and it's recommended as a good track to practice the fundamentals on and it's definitely proving that way... I've gotta practice my getting my entry points well on point lol and being able to drive within my means but still be able to put in good lap time one after another consistent​ly - that will come I'm sure.. oh been watching these SAFE IS FAST videos and they've really helped me - https://www.youtube.com/user/SAFEisFAST/videos