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Christiaan van Beilen
31-05-2018, 12:25
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wn8Aacf4cfQ


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkezakAmxmA



So, I am just curious who is aiming for one of these puppies? :)

GrimeyDog
31-05-2018, 13:59
Im Getting it!!! Soon as pre order opens I'm Ready!!!

Atak Kat
31-05-2018, 14:58
Well..... I am shopping....
For this I'll be watching closely. The timing is about right....

Christiaan van Beilen
31-05-2018, 15:58
I am split between getting an LG OLED C7 for a new TV and monitor (my gaming rig is hooked up to the telly)... or quite possibly getting the high end version or the a podium series.

I mean, there were going to be different torque versions. So I just don't want to run out of dynamic range ever again.

The first thing I would try when I would get mine is... set the wheel at full force and than tune down the game's output accordingly. That way there is no way the game its ffb signal would clip at the output stage to the wheels driver, nor will the podium motor clip at any point.

Fight-Test
31-05-2018, 16:28
Im Getting it!!! Soon as pre order opens I'm Ready!!!

I'm buying after you work out the kinks. :)

Asturbo
31-05-2018, 16:40
A month ago I was convinced to buy it, but now I have some doubts.

I recently had a problem with my wheel and the support is not beeing as good as expected. Let's see how it ends.

Other problem is that until it's natively supported by the games, probably has to run in compatibility mode with previous Fanatec models (the McLaren GT3 rim i.e. don't take advantage of some controls). Probably the additional torque will be there from the beggining, but we can not take it all the way until the developers lauch new versions of the games.

I think I'm going to wait for the specifications, the final price, and the first reviews.

Brainbug
31-05-2018, 17:19
I am waiting since the first anouncement. Let them come, finaly. :)

Christiaan van Beilen
31-05-2018, 22:03
A month ago I was convinced to buy it.

But I recently have a problem with my wheel and the support is not beeing as expected. Let's see how it ends.

Other problem is that until it's natively supported by the games, probably has to run in compatibility mode with previous Fanatec models (the McLaren GT3 rim i.e. don't take advantage of some controls). Probably the additional torque will be there from the beggining, but we can not take it all the way until the developers lauch new versions of the games.

I think I'm going to wait to the specifications, the final price, and the first reviews.

I can understand you holding back because of your support experience. Mine has never been bad but I hear it differs from person to person.

About compatibility though. I think AJ will get us sorted quickly on this one, maybe even hotfix patch this one in. Otherwise grabbing the Fanatec CSW V2.5 profile won't be a bad decision as it doesn't have any extra tinkering done to it I believe, plus you might need a custom RAW file with no wheel specific additives enabled.
SMS has always been quick on bringing compatibility to their games at least.

In any case, waiting never hurt anyone. ;)

Asturbo
31-05-2018, 22:44
I can understand you holding back because of your support experience. Mine has never been bad but I hear it differs from person to person.
Yeah, I don't want so say that the support is bad. It's my first experience and I can't generalize, but ATM in my personal case is not beeing good. I was even thinking in buying another CSL wheel base, but it isn't avaliable until september (3 months). I finally bought a G29 until the problem is solved.


About compatibility though. I think AJ will get us sorted quickly on this one, maybe even hotfix patch this one in. Otherwise grabbing the Fanatec CSW V2.5 profile won't be a bad decision as it doesn't have any extra tinkering done to it I believe, plus you might need a custom RAW file with no wheel specific additives enabled.
SMS has always been quick on bringing compatibility to their games at least.
Yes, I think that could be compatible with CSW 2.5 to have full functionality from launch.

morpwr
31-05-2018, 23:25
I am split between getting an LG OLED C7 for a new TV and monitor (my gaming rig is hooked up to the telly)... or quite possibly getting the high end version or the a podium series.

I mean, there were going to be different torque versions. So I just don't want to run out of dynamic range ever again.

The first thing I would try when I would get mine is... set the wheel at full force and than tune down the game's output accordingly. That way there is no way the game its ffb signal would clip at the output stage to the wheels driver, nor will the podium motor clip at any point.


That works great on the osw and yes not running out of range is awesome!!!!!! Crashing hurts though with the wheel set so you can get max force when the game tells it to(like crashing). You learn to let go of the wheel real fast. Youll never go back once you try a dd wheel.

morpwr
31-05-2018, 23:30
I can understand you holding back because of your support experience. Mine has never been bad but I hear it differs from person to person.

About compatibility though. I think AJ will get us sorted quickly on this one, maybe even hotfix patch this one in. Otherwise grabbing the Fanatec CSW V2.5 profile won't be a bad decision as it doesn't have any extra tinkering done to it I believe, plus you might need a custom RAW file with no wheel specific additives enabled.
SMS has always been quick on bringing compatibility to their games at least.

In any case, waiting never hurt anyone. ;)


Custom for sure but I don't think you will need to change much. Just no deadzone removal and probably have to turn the in game gain waaaaaaay down. My original volume,tone and fx are still pretty close to what I used before.

Christiaan van Beilen
31-05-2018, 23:52
That works great on the osw and yes not running out of range is awesome!!!!!! Crashing hurts though with the wheel set so you can get max force when the game tells it to(like crashing). You learn to let go of the wheel real fast. Youll never go back once you try a dd wheel.


Custom for sure but I don't think you will need to change much. Just no deadzone removal and probably have to turn the in game gain waaaaaaay down. My original volume,tone and fx are still pretty close to what I used before.

Crashing would be indeed a hands-off event and one might need to learn to drive 'thumbs out' as well. About going back... if I own something that is better than I'd only go back if it ever breaks down and I need a temporary replacement. ;)

Sounds like the custom I have will be fine in that case. It hasn't got any deadzones, smoothing or anything really. For most folk it might even be called bland as I don't add FX either as I prefer to just get through the wheel what I should get through the wheel, letting the buttkickers do the rest of the talking if needed. Still... I'm only 1.9 seconds off of Emerson Fittipaldi's '73 Monaco lap time so I can't be lacking that much info but just a better setup and line (been doing some hotlapping tonight and ended up 3rd on the leaderboard). ;)


As for why I would personally choose a Podium base over an OSW, Sim Steering or AccuForce. Well, I am heavily invested in the Fanatec ecosystem and thus getting the wheels to work out of the box is a plus. Besides... no USB wires that dangle and can get stretched or worse break.

Oh, and one thing with DD wheels and modern games. The limit in most games is 900 or 1080 degrees, with these direct drive wheels we can finally get original lock-to-lock rotations even if it's for a Bus driving sim (like OMSI 2 or something). Which kinda gets me excited, because you won't have to deal with steering sensitivity issues anymore if a vehicle has beyond 900 or 1080 degrees of lock-to-lock and the game needs to step it down to 900/1080 degrees.
How quickly games will support this though... it might take a while. Though without the hardware supporting these capabilities the game developers have no need to build in support in the first place.

Brainbug
01-06-2018, 00:46
I think sms is testing the new stuff from fanatec since some time, at least i hope they do as one important player in audience market. And fanatec started the testing phase since end last year for the DD, so lets hope at least one baby found the way to sms to gets the hand on and bring to life in pcars 2.

Christiaan van Beilen
01-06-2018, 01:26
It was demonstrated to the public for the first time at the sim racing expo with pC2 after all. So no worries from me at least.

Edit:
Going through the videos I hear Thomas say they are using an "Outrunner Motor". Which is a certain type of brushless DC motor.

See: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outrunner

Mascot
01-06-2018, 10:50
I'm a little disappointed that after a year of delays all we've got is a vague tease with a date six weeks in the future.
13th July is what? Specs revealed? Pricing info? Preorders open? Available to buy right away? Project cancelled? Thomas's favourite flavour of ice cream?

Christiaan van Beilen
01-06-2018, 19:44
Well, apart from the skepticism about what might be announced we could also talk about what the Podium series might bring.


Here's my guess:

- DD1: 20 Nm torque & DD2: 30 Nm
- Wireless communication internally in the wheel, so that all wheels are plug and play (including buttons and displays). With wireless energie being transmitted as well for wheel electronics operation including future fancy displays as seen in F1 rims etc. (like wireless charging your phone or toothbrush)
- Continues rotation of the wheel without an end-stop or risk of damaging internal or external cables. Also can be read as having endless lock-to-lock configuration possibilities (e.g. you could even properly drive an old-school bus in OMSI 2 with the right lock-to-lock).
- Monogrome LCD display that can driven like the first Logitech G15 keyboard displays. (e.g. you can have it show anything from laptimes, revs, speed, FFB histogram, date/time or even incoming messages from your phone
- Podium QR is backwards compatible, but using a wheel with the plastic QR is not recommended beyond a certain torque level. So wheels with metal QR will be strongly advised.
- The base has new side mounting holes but is still compatible with 3 bottom or 4 mounting holes as with previous wheels. Giving more mounting possibilities as well as backwards compatibility for rigs with older Fanatec style mounting holes
- At least 12-bit encoder (most likely HALL-effect) but most likely 16-bit or even 24-bit.
- dedicated USB 3.0 port directly to the motherboard/usb controller will be mandatory due to necessary data bandwidth, so can't be used with a USB 3.0 hub.
- Big powersupply but most likely a lot smaller than the competition with an entire controller box.
- Can't bolt on static shifters anymore to the front of the case, nor any dashboards like with the CSW/CSL/CSE Elite wheels. At least I didn't see any holes so far, not even in the latest teaser.
- Estimate Price ranges: DD1 @ 1000-1200 Euro & DD2: 1500-1800 Euro


I don't know what other features there might be other than maybe some nice software/firmware ones that you can access via the wheel's menu or driver.

RomKnight
02-06-2018, 21:39
This thread is expensive... Should not read but damn you Christiaan :)

Ps: I'm currently in Bremen if you happen to be close, let me know :)

Christiaan van Beilen
02-06-2018, 22:41
This thread is expensive... Should not read but damn you Christiaan :)

Ps: I'm currently in Bremen if you happen to be close, let me know :)

I am 'only' 185 kilometers to the west of you, or a roughly 2 hour drive, but I think Fanatec's warehouse in Hamburg is closer if you wish to raid that. :p

Still, nothing to see in my house apart from a big mess currently. So I also know just as much as any other normal person does... if you were aiming for that with your comment. ;)


NB. From a good source I got to know that the base can be mounted via the 3 bolt mount pattern as found on the bottom of the CSW base without its angle mount.

For me this means I might use an angle mount off of one of my three CSW bases, as I don't think I could drill those 3 holes in my plate. The bolts would end up obstructing how the mounting plate of the rSeat Evo is fitted to the rig. The metal used in the angle mount plates of the CSW bases should be strong enough to not flex, but it might require some testing. I rather think my rSeat would flex sooner.

Mascot
04-06-2018, 14:10
I posted this elsewhere, but the Podium DDW has my attention right now based on a few assumptions. All, none or some of those assumptions might actually turn out to be true.

I assume the electronics and PSU are built into the motor housing, so there's no need for a big ugly black box like there is with OSW. [edit: it's been confirmed that the power brick is separate, but all other electronics are in the motor housing]
I assume the motor will be optimised for a DDW, not an industrial-grade overkill motor that I'd use at a fraction of its operating capacity (this has now been confirmed).
I assume the Podium wheel will draw less power and be cheaper to run because of the reasons above.
I assume it'll be lighter and sleeker and look more like a dedicated product than an OSW.
I assume it'll have no coily cables connecting the rim to the wheel base (this has now been confirmed)
I assume it'll work seamlessly and with full functional compatibility with ALL Fanatec rims (the McLaren rim is giving some OSW owners a few issues right now).
I assume it will be priced competitively with similarly-spec'd OSW kits (no more than 15% more, anyway).

I've come close to buying an OSW recently but am cooling my jets to see what Podium will actually offer. If it can give comparable performance to an OSW and be priced in the same ballpark, but bring a whole host of advantages, then it will certainly appeal to me.

I've got a nasty feeling however that Fanatec will stick a ridiculous price on it and bank on people being willing to pay a large premium for the convenience of having a one-stop shop for a branded product and a sleeker overall package. That would kill it stone dead in the water for me.

Sankyo
04-06-2018, 14:22
I posted this elsewhere, but the Podium DDW has my attention right now based on a few assumptions. All, none or some of those assumptions might actually turn out to be true.

I assume the electronics and PSU are built into the motor housing, so there's no need for a big ugly black box like there is with OSW. [edit: it's been confirmed that the power brick is separate, but all other electronics are in the motor housing]
I assume the motor will be optimised for a DDW, not an industrial-grade overkill motor that I'd use at a fraction of its operating capacity (this has now been confirmed).
I assume the Podium wheel will draw less power and be cheaper to run because of the reasons above.
I assume it'll be lighter and sleeker and look more like a dedicated product than an OSW.
I assume it'll have no coily cables connecting the rim to the wheel base (this has now been confirmed)
I assume it'll work seamlessly and with full functional compatibility with ALL Fanatec rims (the McLaren rim is giving some OSW owners a few issues right now).
I assume it will be priced competitively with similarly-spec'd OSW kits (no more than 15% more, anyway).

I've come close to buying an OSW recently but am cooling my jets to see what Podium will actually offer. If it can give comparable performance to an OSW and be priced in the same ballpark, but bring a whole host of advantages, then it will certainly appeal to me.

I've got a nasty feeling however that Fanatec will stick a ridiculous price on it and bank on people being willing to pay a large premium for the convenience of having a one-stop shop for a branded product and a sleeker overall package. That would kill it stone dead in the water for me.
Could you define what would be a 'ridiculous price' for you?

Mascot
04-06-2018, 14:35
Could you define what would be a 'ridiculous price' for you?

Hard to say without seeing the specs of the final unit but anything that's significantly pricier than an equivalent OSW would make it a difficult purchase for me. I've got no idea where Fanatec are going to pitch this though. Are they trying to get the Bodnar buyers or the Accuforce buyers, or somewhere in between? I'm hoping their bespoke motor (claimed to more appropriate and efficient than the overkill industrial OSW units) will keep the price reasonable and make it a very attractive proposition. A few years ago a plug 'n' play DD solution was a novelty, but now they are readily available from several sources, and OSW isn't the risky black art it once was. Fanatec can't use convenience alone as a USP to justify a high price.

I'd like the lower model to be sub-£1k with a BMW GT2 wheel bundled in. I think I'd be happy with that, but I think it'll be priced much higher, like 50% higher. If so, adios Fanatec, hola OSW.

I guess I'm hoping that Fanatec want to compete directly with the Accuforce Pro v2, which is, what, $1,300 as a complete kit with steering wheel/button box.

GrimeyDog
04-06-2018, 16:00
Im thinking the Lower Model Base alone will be $1k with the Higher tier Base being between $1.5 to 2k .... So far i think its only 2 DD base tiers which will make the v 2.5 be the Entry Level High End Gear tier @ $500.

I really wouldnt expect any wheel Base + Rim and or Pedal Bundle sets for under $1,500.

Consider the price for a OSW wheel Base alone then Factor in the Price of the Wheel QR, Wheel Rim & Wheel Rim Button Box... it gets Very Pricey and you still have to be Connected to the PC from a USB Bungie cord and Hope the buttons and display work right.

As Time Goes on the Prices will probably come down but i think at launch the people that will benefit most will be current Fanatec Gear owners because its just a matter of buying the wheel base.

Mascot
04-06-2018, 18:09
Im thinking the Lower Model Base alone will be $1k with the Higher tier Base being between $1.5 to 2k .... So far i think its only 2 DD base tiers which will make the v 2.5 be the Entry Level High End Gear tier @ $500.

I really wouldnt expect any wheel Base + Rim and or Pedal Bundle sets for under $1,500.

Consider the price for a OSW wheel Base alone then Factor in the Price of the Wheel QR, Wheel Rim & Wheel Rim Button Box... it gets Very Pricey and you still have to be Connected to the PC from a USB Bungie cord and Hope the buttons and display work right.

As Time Goes on the Prices will probably come down but i think at launch the people that will benefit most will be current Fanatec Gear owners because its just a matter of buying the wheel base.

A lower-priced early bird base/rim bundle for loyal Fanatec customers willing to take a chance on unproven hardware would be nice.

RomKnight
04-06-2018, 19:12
I have no time to race ATM and not sure I'll do in any foreseeable future. New job and all that.
Still this thread keeps me interested because fanatec investment for me is also a good thing... Despite having only a couple of ours on my new McLaren wheel rim :(

Anyway, podium series even the weaker one might be a huge step up from my cswv2 but again, so far is speculation on my part though I'm having good expectations and will probably buy one nonetheless unless some bad surprise comes out of reviews.

Christiaan, im here at work but since I now know you're close, next time I'm either here or Frankfurt I'll make sure I'll let you know in advance even if only to drink a beer. Meeting other pcars fans is always a good thing IMO :)

Christiaan van Beilen
04-06-2018, 19:36
I have no time to race ATM and not sure I'll do in any foreseeable future. New job and all that.
Still this thread keeps me interested because fanatec investment for me is also a good thing... Despite having only a couple of ours on my new McLaren wheel rim :(

Anyway, podium series even the weaker one might be a huge step up from my cswv2 but again, so far is speculation on my part though I'm having good expectations and will probably buy one nonetheless unless some bad surprise comes out of reviews.

Christiaan, im here at work but since I now know you're close, next time I'm either here or Frankfurt I'll make sure I'll let you know in advance even if only to drink a beer. Meeting other pcars fans is always a good thing IMO :)

I will look forward to it and hope our agendas will align by that time. Although I never drink and drive for obvious reasons. :)

I am expecting a huge step up as well from my CSWv2. I really want to have the biggest one though so that there is more than enough headroom to play with. I just don't ever want to feel clipping again on a realistic level of torque from the steering wheel. Not even in high speed high downforce cornering moments.

GrimeyDog
04-06-2018, 21:33
A lower-priced early bird base/rim bundle for loyal Fanatec customers willing to take a chance on unproven hardware would be nice.

I dont think a Early Bird Major discount is going to happen... I would like that too!!! But Given the time and resources that had to be put into Fanatec DD developement it may take a bit before they decide to drop prices....Thomas has also been very stern on the fact that the v2.5 will Remain at its price point as the Entry High end equipment option and the Podium line will be priced accordingly... I have No insider info so dont quote Me but My best Guess is Lowest DD Base alone $999 to $1200 but will be stronger and faster than Accuforce... Higher DD wheel base alone $1,500 to $2,000 i don't think they will be going for Loe Bodnair DD Prices on the top of the line wheel because they will Not Sell but to a select few... for Me I'd spend the $1,500+ Tax but Not $2,000!!!

Fanatec has always made their mark by providing Great Quality Sim Gear at Reasonable prices and i dont think that will Change...

Fanatec by default should have the Leg up on Current Existing DD wheels... The Software alone is going to make a Huge Difference... The v2.5 like many DD wheels has 1000Htz refresh rate So even games that are Not optumized for the Fanatec DD should run Really Nice even just using v2.5 Dr/Fw until they get updated...

The Equipment should be better because Fanatec said they designed the Motor and Electronics from scratch Specifically for Sim Racing the same as they did with the v2.5... I have a v2 its a Good wheel!!! I have a v2.5 and the feel is Great its sooo Much better that i will Never use My v2 again but i keep it for a back up wheel... Now if the Podium DD Feels better than the v2.5 i Might just lose My Mind, My Job, My Wife and My Kids are Grown so they can Piss off:p LOL I will be locked in My Man Kave Sim Racing sooo much that i'd have to remodel My house to put a bathroom in there!!! --> its bad enough I allready have a Fridge and Microwave So I may Never Come out!!! My poor electric Bill:cower: LOL

Christiaan van Beilen
04-06-2018, 21:46
I dont think a Early Bird Major discount is going to happen... I would like that too!!! But Given the time and resources that had to be put into Fanatec DD developement it may take a bit before they decide to drop prices....Thomas has also been very stern on the fact that the v2.5 will Remain at its price point as the Entry High end equipment option and the Podium line will be priced accordingly... I have No insider info so dont quote Me but My best Guess is Lowest DD Base alone $999 to $1200 but will be stronger and faster than Accuforce... Higher DD wheel base alone $1,500 to $2,000 i don't think they will be going for Loe Bodnair DD Prices on the top of the line wheel because they will Not Sell but to a select few... for Me I'd spend the $1,500+ Tax but Not $2,000!!!

Fanatec has always made their mark by providing Great Quality Sim Gear at Reasonable prices and i dont think that will Change...

Fanatec by default should have the Leg up on Current Existing DD wheels... The Software alone is going to make a Huge Difference... The v2.5 like many DD wheels has 1000Htz refresh rate So even games that are Not optumized for the Fanatec DD should run Really Nice even just using v2.5 Dr/Fw until they get updated...

The Equipment should be better because Fanatec said they designed the Motor and Electronics from scratch Specifically for Sim Racing the same as they did with the v2.5... I have a v2 was a Great wheel!!! I have a v2.5 and the feel is sooo Much better that i will Never use My v2 again but i keep it for a back up wheel... Now if the Podium DD Feels better than the v2.5 i Might just lose My Mind, My Job, My Wife abd My Kids are Grown so they can Piss off:p LOL I will be locked in My Man Kave in Sim Racing sooo much that i'd have to remodel My house to put a bathroom in there!!! --> its bad enough I allready have a Fridge and Microwave So I may Never Come out!!! My poor electric Bill:cower: LOL

I thought the V2.5 wasn't worth the upgrade over the V2 according to certain reviewers? I guess it's due to the refresh rate + smoother motor that doesn't induce as much drag (if any).

Well, I'll only make one more jump if any to be honest. These wheels are quite expensive for my income anyways and as such it has to be a very considerable upgrade to make me decide to do an upgrade. :)

Than again... I shouldn't complain for what I payed for my V2 and V1 bases way back. So the money saved can go to a DD unit for sure. :rolleyes: :o

GrimeyDog
05-06-2018, 02:34
I thought the V2.5 wasn't worth the upgrade over the V2 according to certain reviewers? I guess it's due to the refresh rate + smoother motor that doesn't induce as much drag (if any).

Well, I'll only make one more jump if any to be honest. These wheels are quite expensive for my income anyways and as such it has to be a very considerable upgrade to make me decide to do an upgrade. :)

Than again... I shouldn't complain for what I payed for my V2 and V1 bases way back. So the money saved can go to a DD unit for sure. :rolleyes: :o

The v 2.5 is and was definitely worth the upgrade!!! The increase in Subtle FFB feel that the 1000Htz drag free wheel center provides was and is a Game Changer!!! For Me the Difference is Night and Day... Some may say its Not that big of a difference but when you speak to those who Own both wheels v2 and v2.5 wheel bases i will bet No one is willing to go back to v2 after Owning a v2.5 ---> the v2 is either sold off or becomes a back up wheel. Even though the total FFB power of both wheels remains the same because the v2.5 has faster Smoother FFB ramp up it feels Stronger and Much more Dynamic.

Olijke Poffer
05-07-2018, 09:11
https://podium.fanatec.com

I’m very curious what the price tag will be..

BigDad
05-07-2018, 09:18
https://podium.fanatec.com

I’m very curious what the price tag will be..

Crap ! I need to avoid looking at this !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Christiaan van Beilen
05-07-2018, 12:36
https://podium.fanatec.com

I’m very curious what the price tag will be..

I think it'll be in the same range as the OSW and Accuforce wheels (between 999-1299 euro), and seriously doubt it'll be Leo Bodnar's crazy price for his SimSteering system (3500-3800 euro).

At least, to me it would seem logical to try to stay at least competitive on price by staying at the same level while mainly competing the other systems in terms of features and ease of use.

Olijke Poffer
05-07-2018, 15:34
I think you’re right about the price tag. Just a tad above the CSW v2.5. I believe they said this will be the price. I don’t think the CSW will drop in price.

Christiaan van Beilen
05-07-2018, 16:03
I think you’re right about the price tag. Just a tad above the CSW v2.5. I believe they said this will be the price. I don’t think the CSW will drop in price.

Thomas confirmed at the sim expo last year that the CSW won't go down in price. The CSW V2.5 will stay at its current 550 euro.
He also said the Podium will be quite a bit more expensive but that what people are thinking in the forums is just about right on the money. So around double the price is quite a bit more but it is in the same range as the rest, so makes sense.

I talked to Shaun Cole in a stream a couple of nights back, and asked him if I could mount a direct drive to the old rSeat Evo rig. His only concern was the wheel deck that might move under strain, but I fixed that many moons ago.
As in I can lift my entire rig by that wheel deck. Wheel, pedals, shifter, butt kickers, chair included.

So I will take my chances if I am to buy a podium base. Otherwise I will upgrade my rig later on.

BigDad
06-07-2018, 01:07
I think you’re right about the price tag. Just a tad above the CSW v2.5. I believe they said this will be the price. I don’t think the CSW will drop in price.

I got my CSWv2 when the 2.5 released and they were running them out to make room for the 2.5's and it was only $650 , they were $899 just before the 2.5 came out , so I think there may be some room to reduce it to make a gap between the lower DD and 2.5 .

leonstone
06-07-2018, 06:17
there is two versions . maybe 13nm and 15nm. Thomas said that more price advantages than existing products in the current market. But they are still expensive.
maybe 899$ 999$

Olijke Poffer
06-07-2018, 07:27
I got my CSWv2 when the 2.5 released and they were running them out to make room for the 2.5's and it was only $650 , they were $899 just before the 2.5 came out , so I think there may be some room to reduce it to make a gap between the lower DD and 2.5 .
Mmm perhaps I need to talk with the vendor then. Cancel my order and just wait two weeks to see if the price of he CSW v2.5 will drop a bit..

Maurice Boeschen
06-07-2018, 07:32
I got my CSWv2 when the 2.5 released and they were running them out to make room for the 2.5's and it was only $650 , they were $899 just before the 2.5 came out , so I think there may be some room to reduce it to make a gap between the lower DD and 2.5 .

There wont be price cut on the CSW v2.5.
They did this with the v2 to sell all stock of the CSW v2 to make room for the v2.5. They then removed the v2 from their webshop.
This time it is completely different. The CSW v2.5 will not be replaced by the DD Bases. The CSW v2.5 will stay in the webshop. Therefore there is no need at all to sell out the v2.5.

Maurice Boeschen
06-07-2018, 07:32
there is two versions . maybe 13nm and 15nm. Thomas said that more price advantages than existing products in the current market. But they are still expensive.
maybe 899$ 999$

The big one will be a LOT more powerful then 15Nm for sure. :D

BigDad
06-07-2018, 07:46
There wont be price cut on the CSW v2.5.
They did this with the v2 to sell all stock of the CSW v2 to make room for the v2.5. They then removed the v2 from their webshop.
This time it is completely different. The CSW v2.5 will not be replaced by the DD Bases. The CSW v2.5 will stay in the webshop. Therefore there is no need at all to sell out the v2.5.

Makes sense !

Olijke Poffer
06-07-2018, 08:29
Indeed.. :D

BigDad
07-07-2018, 01:20
I got an email saying this :

"Yes, it is true… Fanatec is now an Official F1 Partner!

Dear 2ndLastJedi

We are thrilled to announce that Fanatec is now a Formula 1 Partner, and Official Sponsor of the F1 Esports Series! This unprecedented five year deal gives us an incredible opportunity to bring you closer to the thrills of the pinnacle of motorsport than ever before!

As from the Austrian Grand Prix last weekend, Fanatec is the Official Supplier of racing steering wheels and pedals for F1 Esports. All of the simulators used in the Fanzone at Spielberg and for the remaining twelve FIA Formula 1 World Championship Grands Prix have been upgraded with Fanatec steering wheels and pedals.

We’ll be working closely with Formula 1 at all F1 Esports Series events, extending to the supply of cockpits and seats for simulators used in the next F1 Esports Series in 2019. We can’t wait to show you what’s next!"

Seems we might see an official F1 rim soon !

Olijke Poffer
07-07-2018, 07:20
I got an email saying this :

"Yes, it is true… Fanatec is now an Official F1 Partner!

Dear 2ndLastJedi

We are thrilled to announce that Fanatec is now a Formula 1 Partner, and Official Sponsor of the F1 Esports Series! This unprecedented five year deal gives us an incredible opportunity to bring you closer to the thrills of the pinnacle of motorsport than ever before!

As from the Austrian Grand Prix last weekend, Fanatec is the Official Supplier of racing steering wheels and pedals for F1 Esports. All of the simulators used in the Fanzone at Spielberg and for the remaining twelve FIA Formula 1 World Championship Grands Prix have been upgraded with Fanatec steering wheels and pedals.

We’ll be working closely with Formula 1 at all F1 Esports Series events, extending to the supply of cockpits and seats for simulators used in the next F1 Esports Series in 2019. We can’t wait to show you what’s next!"

Seems we might see an official F1 rim soon !

Remove the “might” in the last sentence. :loyal:

morpwr
07-07-2018, 13:36
I got an email saying this :

"Yes, it is true… Fanatec is now an Official F1 Partner!

Dear 2ndLastJedi

We are thrilled to announce that Fanatec is now a Formula 1 Partner, and Official Sponsor of the F1 Esports Series! This unprecedented five year deal gives us an incredible opportunity to bring you closer to the thrills of the pinnacle of motorsport than ever before!

As from the Austrian Grand Prix last weekend, Fanatec is the Official Supplier of racing steering wheels and pedals for F1 Esports. All of the simulators used in the Fanzone at Spielberg and for the remaining twelve FIA Formula 1 World Championship Grands Prix have been upgraded with Fanatec steering wheels and pedals.

We’ll be working closely with Formula 1 at all F1 Esports Series events, extending to the supply of cockpits and seats for simulators used in the next F1 Esports Series in 2019. We can’t wait to show you what’s next!"

Seems we might see an official F1 rim soon !


Its really cool to see so much involvement between these games/sims and real motorsports. It can only help everyone.

BigDad
13-07-2018, 02:03
D-Day !

Olijke Poffer
13-07-2018, 05:12
Indeed 17:00 hours local here. I’m Very curious.

Fight-Test
13-07-2018, 14:53
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IH5dRGpI108

Almost time

bporion
13-07-2018, 15:15
o my god , what is the price already !!! it can rip your fingers off , cool ! boring !!!! this guy is killing me … pc and console compatible ,all fanatic wheels work whit it and pedals , new quick release , oled display , upgraded tuning menu 1499 euro so 1749us DD2 ! but not quite sure actually . price of the DD1 is no price except it is going to be sold in an auction like on eBay but starting bit its 1 euro . 3 to 5 year warranty on both . that was painful to watch . and the price is just way too mutch for me so that's a no buy for me .

Asturbo
13-07-2018, 15:38
Some fast notes:



2 models of Podium DD base
DD1 15NM with peaks of 18NM
DD2 18NM with peaks of 24NM
Compatible with consoles
New quick release system
Existing rims compatible
Existing accesories compatible
New F1 rim
3 years warranty upgradeable to 5 years
Price DD2: 1499.95 € (preorder now)
Shipping date: 10 december
Price DD1: auction system

Olijke Poffer
13-07-2018, 15:38
Unbelievable no price indication. What a waste of my time.

Edit: did I missed the price? Lol I tuned in a bit later..

Asturbo
13-07-2018, 15:39
Unbelievable no price indication. What a waste of my time.
No price info for the DD1 (the cheapest) but yes for the most powerful (1.499€). I don't like the auctions system for the DD1. I suppose that shipping will be also december.

PS: They have uploaded a new video:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOSRtvc4Lks

Fight-Test
13-07-2018, 15:48
Possibly the worst product launch video I have ever seen.

Andrew_WOT
13-07-2018, 16:05
6NM, 2800 EURO (excl Tax), PC only. Nice.
Congratrs to those waiting so long for this. :p
https://www.facebook.com/Fanatec/videos/1803305556412099/

EDIT: Looks like Thomas was joking, Weirdo.

Khyber GT
13-07-2018, 16:26
stupid price and really STUPID auction system... worst thing i've seen in sim racing and I've been doing it since i was a kid in the early 90s. grrrrr

Andrew_WOT
13-07-2018, 16:42
Do we know what is included into 1.499. Is it just base or wheel with button plate also?

Khyber GT
13-07-2018, 16:44
Do we know what is included into 1.499. Is it just base or wheel with button plate also?

https://www.fanatec.com/us-en/wheel-bases/podium-wheel-base-dd2-usa.html

Andrew_WOT
13-07-2018, 16:48
Thanks, so it's bare base only. :(

bporion
13-07-2018, 16:48
https://www.fanatec.com/us-en/wheel-bases/podium-wheel-base-dd2-usa.html

what is not included is the second job you need to pay for it .

Asturbo
13-07-2018, 16:52
https://www.fanatec.com/eu-en/wheel-bases/podium-wheel-base-dd1-eu-1.html
https://www.fanatec.com/eu-en/wheel-bases/podium-wheel-base-dd2-eu.html

The upgrade warranty to 5 years is 300€ so 1.800€ in total. If you a decent rim and pedals, you're in 2.400€. I have rim and pedals, but still much money for me.
And I don't trust in the Auction system of the DD1. I still remember last year's advent calendar.

Andrew_WOT
13-07-2018, 17:49
To add to insult they used AC Nord to demo the wheel this time.
https://www.facebook.com/Fanatec/videos/1803305556412099/

Charger
13-07-2018, 18:32
Just way overpriced imo, you can buy an Accuforce ready to go with rim, button plate and QR for 1300 US, you can get a 20Nm OSW for £900 plus a good Formula rim for £500 and add a Q1R for another £100 would be a much better setup, crazy pricing that is.

https://www.3drap.it/product/f1-rim-addon-pro-logitech-and-thrustmaster/

bporion
13-07-2018, 21:27
Just way overpriced imo, you can buy an Accuforce ready to go with rim, button plate and QR for 1300 US, you can get a 20Nm OSW for £900 plus a good Formula rim for £500 and add a Q1R for another £100 would be a much better setup, crazy pricing that is.

https://www.3drap.it/product/f1-rim-addon-pro-logitech-and-thrustmaster/

that wheel is incredible but in vr its quite useless .

Olijke Poffer
13-07-2018, 21:41
that wheel is incredible but in vr its quite useless .
Why is it useless in VR?

bporion
13-07-2018, 21:56
Why is it useless in VR?

you wont be able to see all of the information from the screen , I guess useless is the wrong word :o

Khyber GT
13-07-2018, 22:14
you wont be able to see all of the information from the screen , I guess useless is the wrong word :o


thomas said on iracing forums you will be able to see what's on that screen in vr.

BigDad
13-07-2018, 23:49
Some fast notes:



2 models of Podium DD base
DD1 15NM with peaks of 18NM
DD2 18NM with peaks of 24NM
Compatible with consoles
New quick release system
Existing rims compatible
Existing accesories compatible
New F1 rim
3 years warranty upgradeable to 5 years
Price DD2: 1499.95 € (preorder now)
Shipping date: 10 december
Price DD1: auction system


So the price puts me out but will the new F1 rims be DD only or will they work on my CSWv2 ?
257650

GrimeyDog
14-07-2018, 02:57
Well Im Not on the Fence anymore about to DD or Not!!! My order was placed at 4:30pm!!! Now to Hurry up and wait for December to get here:o I have wheel Rims, Pedals so for Me to buy the Podium Base its the same as going DD buying Accuforce full set up because total cost was $1,542.×× <-- But had a $100.00 Fanatec discount code that I got as a gift because of the Long McClaren Rim delay... So it would have been +100.00 higher.

Khyber GT
14-07-2018, 03:11
Well Im Not on the Fence anymore about to DD or Not!!! My order qas placed at 4:30pm!!! Now to Hurry up and wait for December to get here:o I have wheel Rims, Pedals so for Me to buy the Podium Base its the same as going DD buying Accuforce full set up.

no accuforce would still be cheaper and you can still use all your same stuff. all you need is the SRM fanatec adapter for the fanatec rims and you would have a DD now instead of december...it's fanatec. it'll be even later than that. accuforce diy kit is $750 right now.

GrimeyDog
14-07-2018, 03:36
no accuforce would still be cheaper and you can still use all your same stuff. all you need is the SRM fanatec adapter for the fanatec rims and you would have a DD now instead of december...it's fanatec. it'll be even later than that. accuforce diy kit is $750 right now.

I was prepared to spend between 1.5k but No more than 2k total and it came in under budget at 1,541.xx ... I dont think i would have gone over 1.7k and felt good about it though and i dont think i would have Ordered it on Launch day.

One thing that really motivated Me was its a 3yr standard warrenty and thats even if its used for commercial use!!! That kind of confidence in the product speaks volumes about the Quality they are sure they put into it.

I think the PS4 version will cost just as much because all the License fees!!!

The v2.5 will be enough to keep Me going until the DD gets here... Actually the v2.5 feels sooo Good thats 1 of the reasons i was really on the fence about going DD wheel... The wife was cheering Me on saying do it do it so why Not... No sense in working to make $$$ and Never enjoy a bit of it for personal enjoyment.

The DD wheel brings Me 1 step closer to My ultimate Full Motion set up:o

Olijke Poffer
14-07-2018, 07:24
No sense in working to make $$$ and Never enjoy a bit of it for personal enjoyment.

Exactly my thoughts. I do recommend to have some savings for backup but please live your life and spend the money, we only be here short. My grandparents did save all their money for later. Later never came. Later already has begun. :applause:

morpwr
14-07-2018, 13:34
Exactly my thoughts. I do recommend to have some savings for backup but please live your life and spend the money, we only be here short. My grandparents did save all their money for later. Later never came. Later already has begun. :applause:

I know someone that their grandparents lived in an apartment all their lives and lived very meagerly. Never bought anything extravagant and when they died they had saved millions and nobody ever knew. That's not how im going.lol

morpwr
14-07-2018, 13:35
I was prepared to spend between 1.5k but No more than 2k total and it came in under budget at 1,541.xx ... I dont think i would have gone over 1.7k and felt good about it though and i dont think i would have Ordered it on Launch day.

One thing that really motivated Me was its a 3yr standard warrenty and thats even if its used for commercial use!!! That kind of confidence in the product speaks volumes about the Quality they are sure they put into it.

I think the PS4 version will cost just as much because all the License fees!!!

The v2.5 will be enough to keep Me going until the DD gets here... Actually the v2.5 feels sooo Good thats 1 of the reasons i was really on the fence about going DD wheel... The wife was cheering Me on saying do it do it so why Not... No sense in working to make $$$ and Never enjoy a bit of it for personal enjoyment.

The DD wheel brings Me 1 step closer to My ultimate Full Motion set up:o

I hope its as good or better then the dd wheels out there already. Youre in for a treat.:)

Olijke Poffer
14-07-2018, 13:35
I know someone that their grandparents lived in and apartment all their lives and lived very meagerly. Never bought anything extravagant and when they died they had saved millions and nobody ever knew. That's not how im going.lol

Haha exactly..

morpwr
14-07-2018, 13:49
Well Im Not on the Fence anymore about to DD or Not!!! My order was placed at 4:30pm!!! Now to Hurry up and wait for December to get here:o I have wheel Rims, Pedals so for Me to buy the Podium Base its the same as going DD buying Accuforce full set up because total cost was $1,542.×× <-- But had a $100.00 Fanatec discount code that I got as a gift because of the Long McClaren Rim delay... So it would have been +100.00 higher.

I think its a little over priced but if you already have a bunch of Fanatec stuff I guess it makes it hard to not go that route. If it works good it will be plenty with it right between the AF and osw 30nm I have.

bporion
14-07-2018, 15:47
I was prepared to spend between 1.5k but No more than 2k total and it came in under budget at 1,541.xx ... I dont think i would have gone over 1.7k and felt good about it though and i dont think i would have Ordered it on Launch day.

One thing that really motivated Me was its a 3yr standard warrenty and thats even if its used for commercial use!!! That kind of confidence in the product speaks volumes about the Quality they are sure they put into it.

I think the PS4 version will cost just as much because all the License fees!!!

The v2.5 will be enough to keep Me going until the DD gets here... Actually the v2.5 feels sooo Good thats 1 of the reasons i was really on the fence about going DD wheel... The wife was cheering Me on saying do it do it so why Not... No sense in working to make $$$ and Never enjoy a bit of it for personal enjoyment.

The DD wheel brings Me 1 step closer to My ultimate Full Motion set up:o

is the v2.5 for sale ?

Charger
14-07-2018, 16:25
I was prepared to spend between 1.5k but No more than 2k total and it came in under budget at 1,541.xx ... I dont think i would have gone over 1.7k and felt good about it though and i dont think i would have Ordered it on Launch day.

One thing that really motivated Me was its a 3yr standard warrenty and thats even if its used for commercial use!!! That kind of confidence in the product speaks volumes about the Quality they are sure they put into it.

I think the PS4 version will cost just as much because all the License fees!!!

The v2.5 will be enough to keep Me going until the DD gets here... Actually the v2.5 feels sooo Good thats 1 of the reasons i was really on the fence about going DD wheel... The wife was cheering Me on saying do it do it so why Not... No sense in working to make $$$ and Never enjoy a bit of it for personal enjoyment.

The DD wheel brings Me 1 step closer to My ultimate Full Motion set up:o

and you can add another 2 year warranty for 300 euros! bargain ;-)

Charger
14-07-2018, 16:35
One thing that bothers me about the Podium DD base is that all the electronics and fans are in the base, there are big heatsinks in there, that is going to get rather warm, makes you wonder why Accuforce and OSW have external boxes with the electronics and fans in doesn't it, I mean the OSW boxes are the size of a small media centre PC?

The OSW and Accuforce have no fans in the base as they do not get hot but putting the electronics in there is gonna make it warm, also why use a Out runner type motor more commonly found in things like remote control aeroplanes rather than a servo or stepper more commonly found in lathes?

That peak Nm stuff is marketing BS as well, that's peak not sustained torque, OSW motors don't advertise peaks they are sustained torque over a period of time, they will also peak but they don't advertise it, people will be calling these DD1 and DD2 bases 18Nm and 24Nm which they aren't, they are 15Nm and 18Nm.

Oh and the presentation was cringe worthy ;-)

morpwr
14-07-2018, 16:55
One thing that bothers me about the Podium DD base is that all the electronics and fans are in the base, there are big heatsinks in there, that is going to get rather warm, makes you wonder why Accuforce and OSW have external boxes with the electronics and fans in doesn't it, I mean the OSW boxes are the size of a small media centre PC?

The OSW and Accuforce have no fans in the base as they do not get hot but putting the electronics in there is gonna make it warm, also why use a Out runner type motor more commonly found in things like remote control aeroplanes rather than a servo or stepper more commonly found in lathes?

That peak Nm stuff is marketing BS as well, that's peak not sustained torque, OSW motors don't advertise peaks they are sustained torque over a period of time, they will also peak but they don't advertise it, people will be calling these DD1 and DD2 bases 18Nm and 24Nm which they aren't, they are 15Nm and 18Nm.

Oh and the presentation was cringe worthy ;-)

The out runner design was brought up in the osw forum by someone involved with the osw wheels. They said it might actually work really well but that's to be seen yet. All I know is im glad I didn't wait for it to come out now and just got an osw.

Charger
14-07-2018, 18:41
The out runner design was brought up in the osw forum by someone involved with the osw wheels. They said it might actually work really well but that's to be seen yet. All I know is im glad I didn't wait for it to come out now and just got an osw.

Do you have a link to that discussion?

GrimeyDog
14-07-2018, 20:05
is the v2.5 for sale ?

I doubt it i still have the wheel and pedal sets from the CSW v2, CSR Elite, 911gt2 and Tx458 wheel ---> Im a Sim Gear Whoader:dejection: ... I have them sitting in My Man Kave as trophies for Now.

GrimeyDog
14-07-2018, 20:12
One thing that bothers me about the Podium DD base is that all the electronics and fans are in the base, there are big heatsinks in there, that is going to get rather warm, makes you wonder why Accuforce and OSW have external boxes with the electronics and fans in doesn't it, I mean the OSW boxes are the size of a small media centre PC?

The OSW and Accuforce have no fans in the base as they do not get hot but putting the electronics in there is gonna make it warm, also why use a Out runner type motor more commonly found in things like remote control aeroplanes rather than a servo or stepper more commonly found in lathes?

That peak Nm stuff is marketing BS as well, that's peak not sustained torque, OSW motors don't advertise peaks they are sustained torque over a period of time, they will also peak but they don't advertise it, people will be calling these DD1 and DD2 bases 18Nm and 24Nm which they aren't, they are 15Nm and 18Nm.

Oh and the presentation was cringe worthy ;-)

Im Not worried about it... The Fanatec DD2 has a 3 year and you can purchase a 5yr warranty for it and even if you use it for commercial use you dont void the warranty!!! Now thats Confidence in your product!!!

Charger
14-07-2018, 23:13
You know what boils my piss, US Pay 1500 dollars approx £1135 plus shipping which is about the same on the shipping side but we only can buy in Euros and it's 1500 euros which is around £1330 plus shipping, does the USA have to pay any taxes on top of that?

Khyber GT
14-07-2018, 23:13
Now thats Confidence in your product!!!

lol come on now

http://www.zikoko.com/wp-content/uploads/cloudinary/v1472395797/rwipywmncyw7i0dxxaqc.jpg

Andrew_WOT
15-07-2018, 01:33
"We are so confident in the quality and durability of our product that we offer it with a five year warranty! But it costs 300 euros extra. "

Seems like "confidence" doesn't come for cheap these days.

GrimeyDog
15-07-2018, 04:22
lol come on now

http://www.zikoko.com/wp-content/uploads/cloudinary/v1472395797/rwipywmncyw7i0dxxaqc.jpg


"We are so confident in the quality and durability of our product that we offer it with a five year warranty! But it costs 300 euros extra. "

Seems like "confidence" doesn't come for cheap these days.

Come on are you people seriouse??? Any product with a warrenty No matter how long if you want a Extended warrenty its cost extra $$$.

The Choice is yours to Buy or Not to Buy... You No like You No Buy Very Simple... I opted to stay with the Regular 3yr warrenty and did Not buy the 5yr plan <---Nope I didnt like the extra cost also in 5yrs this current DD wheel tec will be out dated we will probably be on wheels that are 3x the refersh rate in 5 yrs.

For Me it was $$$ well spent:victorious:

Khyber GT
15-07-2018, 04:55
it ain't well spent at all. fanatec got your money and you essentially gave them a 6 month no interest loan that you don't get a return on till december or later(it will be later, it's fanatec they can't hit a date to save their life) lol

Olijke Poffer
15-07-2018, 07:35
Lol, about buying extra warrenty.

buying extra warrenty is te same as throwing your money in the fireplace. (At least here in the Netherlands)
When you buy something, you may expect it will last for an XX years before it breaks down.
When you buy a dishwasher you may expect it will be still operational after 5 years. If it breaks down you could get a free repair or replacement. Lol, this is theoretical of course but this is how the law works in the Netherlands. When it does break down, you have to start a court case.
In other words, When buying extra waranty you buy something you already paid for.

Christiaan van Beilen
15-07-2018, 08:19
Lol, about buying extra warrenty.

buying extra warrenty is te same as throwing your money in the fireplace. (At least here in the Netherlands)
When you buy something, you may expect it will last for an XX years before it breaks down.
When you buy a dishwasher you may expect it will be still operational after 5 years. If it breaks down you could get a free repair or replacement. Lol, this is theoretical of course but this is how the law works in the Netherlands. When it does break down, you have to start a court case.
In other words, When buying extra waranty you buy something you already paid for.

I was thinking the same thing. I think we're pretty lucky with our Dutch law when it comes to so called consumer rights. If Fanatec offers up to at least 5 years than you can thus at least expect the product to function for 5 years, so as a result it is technically covered by Dutch law already. :)

Here's a nice English link to how it works exactly over here, for those wondering of course: https://amsterdam-mamas.nl/articles/consumer-rights-netherlands

Noticeable quotes:
- If the warranty period has expired, this doesn’t mean you don’t have any rights. Also after this period, you retain the right to a faultless product.

- If a product shows a defect within 6 months, the law assumes the product is defective. The seller has to prove the opposite, by for example showing that the product was not used as intended.

- Also in case of extended warranty, the seller/manufacturer must prove that the product is flawless and that the defect does not fall under the warranty. If he cannot prove it, the problem must be resolved.

- Extended warranty is an addition to the legal warranty and none of the rights may be restricted or excluded.

- Outside the warranty period, you can always claim your product is defective, as the seller is legally bound to deliver a flawless product.

- When a product is defective, this doesn’t mean that you regret your purchase (even though you do!) so the seller cannot just give you a voucher.

- Make sure you inform the seller of the defect as soon as possible and within 2 months of discovering the problem. You are within time according to the law.

MaximusN
15-07-2018, 10:45
I was thinking the same thing. I think we're pretty lucky with our Dutch law when it comes to so called consumer rights. If Fanatec offers up to at least 5 years than you can thus at least expect the product to function for 5 years, so as a result it is technically covered by Dutch law already. :)
Well I don't think you can just say that the fact that you can buy x years of warranty means that you can expect it to last that long (also by law). What if they sold a 500 10 years warranty? And in fact you are not buying warranty but just pre-paying repair anyway. It's more of an insurance than warranty.

Christiaan van Beilen
15-07-2018, 10:59
Well I don't think you can just say that the fact that you can buy x years of warranty means that you can expect it to last that long (also by law). What if they sold a 500 10 years warranty? And in fact you are not buying warranty but just pre-paying repair anyway. It's more of an insurance than warranty.

You can say it is pre-paying repairs but what is there to repair really? A fan, an electronics board, a quick release and the motor unit itself.
Everything except the motor is basically within the price range of that pre-paid repair kind of warranty idea. Which means that Fanatec is confident the motor won't fail.
Also everything except maybe the fan is made to last at least 5 to 10 years easily. After 10 years you can see signs of bad capacitors within electronic circuits.

So I still think it is safe to assume that based on that this product is made to last at least 5 years, compared to similar components used within this product in other products in the market.
Most likely the fan wil fail after 5 years. Than maybe after 10 a capacitor will dry up and give you electronics issues.
Also maybe afger 10 years the rubber on the new QR might have dried up a bit and will have become a bit too hard, or might even crack.

Those are really the only failure points I see. Non of which are designed to fail within 5 years. So yes, I think it is safe to assume that this product is made for at leat 5 year flawless operation. Thus it being covered by Dutch law if a defect does happen.

Although mind that after normal warranty you will have to prove that you used the product correctly.

cluck
15-07-2018, 11:34
You know what boils my piss, US Pay 1500 dollars approx £1135 plus shipping which is about the same on the shipping side but we only can buy in Euros and it's 1500 euros which is around £1330 plus shipping, does the USA have to pay any taxes on top of that?US has sales tax on top of anything that is sold, and that varies state-to-state. When you factor in VAT, we're actually getting it very slightly cheaper in the UK - pre-taxes - than the US price.

cluck
15-07-2018, 11:53
lol come on now

http://www.zikoko.com/wp-content/uploads/cloudinary/v1472395797/rwipywmncyw7i0dxxaqc.jpg


"We are so confident in the quality and durability of our product that we offer it with a five year warranty! But it costs 300 euros extra. "

Seems like "confidence" doesn't come for cheap these days.I'll wager that the warranty cost is covering the "worse-case" scenario and is priced accordingly. If you want peace of mind for another couple of years then it's worth it - not to mention the additional value (albeit nowhere near the full 300 euro) it gives if you choose to sell the device on, should something better come along in the meantime.

Did Fanatec kick some people in the nuts or something, I just wonder why there is so much negativity aimed at this device? It's a device aimed at people who want a step up from Fanatec's existing offerings and want a neater solution, that works with their existing wheels without need for adapters, who don't want multiple boxes and lots of wires and is as simple as can be to plug in and set up. Are there cheaper solutions available? Yes. Are there more powerful solutions available? Yes. So what? This is Fanatec's offering and if you don't want to buy it, don't buy it. I've got no interest in spending £1500 on a hub so I won't buy it but I don't doubt that IF I was in the market to buy a direct drive system, the neatness and single-box solution would appeal to me far more than a mess of wires and extra boxes. My setup has enough of that already!

morpwr
15-07-2018, 13:33
Do you have a link to that discussion?

I don't at this point but it was on the granity forum for the osw. I was just reading up when I got the wheel and ran across the discussion.

Bealdor
15-07-2018, 15:31
I'll wager that the warranty cost is covering the "worse-case" scenario and is priced accordingly. If you want peace of mind for another couple of years then it's worth it - not to mention the additional value (albeit nowhere near the full 300 euro) it gives if you choose to sell the device on, should something better come along in the meantime.

Additional warranty is normally not transferable if you sell it privately.

cluck
15-07-2018, 16:37
Additional warranty is normally not transferable if you sell it privately.Is that unique to Fanatec, because it's definitely possible with a lot of other items. The warranty is usually with the item, not the end-user.

Charger
15-07-2018, 18:00
US has sales tax on top of anything that is sold, and that varies state-to-state. When you factor in VAT, we're actually getting it very slightly cheaper in the UK - pre-taxes - than the US price.

I was wondering that, cheers, answered the question.

Khyber GT
15-07-2018, 19:12
Did Fanatec kick some people in the nuts or something, I just wonder why there is so much negativity aimed at this device?


because of the stupid auction or take your money now, you get nothing for 6-12 months because it's fanatec

Sankyo
15-07-2018, 19:45
Is that unique to Fanatec, because it's definitely possible with a lot of other items. The warranty is usually with the item, not the end-user.

It works that way with Fanatec as well.

Bealdor
15-07-2018, 19:48
Is that unique to Fanatec, because it's definitely possible with a lot of other items. The warranty is usually with the item, not the end-user.

Every optional warranty extension I've seen here in Germany (for various electronic devices for example) includes a paragraph that it only applies to the original customer who actually bought the device and expires when you resell it. I don't know if Fanatec handles this differently though. But if they do they're definitely the exception and not the rule.

GrimeyDog
17-07-2018, 02:03
The Sim Racing Community begged Fanatec to Make a DD wheel and Holy all Crap people do is Cry about the Price!!! Thomas/Fanatec said it wont be cheap from the start...What did they thonk it was going to Cost??? its pretty Much the same as any other DD wheel price once you add up all the stuff you Need to get it 100% up and running Ex: QR, Wheel Rim, Button Box for wheel Rim.

Fanatec Gave a all in 1 solution No external Box and including Console Compatability!!! what other DD wheel has a FFB Graph on the wheel base and it does more!!! and it has on wheen and on wheel base Base tuning functions in a OLED screen??? WTF what did 0eie thinknit would cost??? the DD2 is the top of the line fanatec DD solution and any time you buy top of the line anything it cost a bit More... So again i wonder what did the people think it would cost???

Now when we scream for more wheel rims what will happen because people dont want to Pay.

BigDad
17-07-2018, 03:51
The Sim Racing Community begged Fanatec to Make a DD wheel and Holy all Crap people do is Cry about the Price!!! Thomas/Fanatec said it wont be cheap from the start...What did they thonk it was going to Cost??? its pretty Much the same as any other DD wheel price once you add up all the stuff you Need to get it 100% up and running Ex: QR, Wheel Rim, Button Box for wheel Rim.

Fanatec Gave a all in 1 solution No external Box and including Console Compatability!!! what other DD wheel has a FFB Graph on the wheel base and it does more!!! and it has on wheen and on wheel base Base tuning functions in a OLED screen??? WTF what did 0eie thinknit would cost??? the DD2 is the top of the line fanatec DD solution and any time you buy top of the line anything it cost a bit More... So again i wonder what did the people think it would cost???

Now when we scream for more wheel rims what will happen because people dont want to Pay.

I ain't screaming but I sure am keen AF for the new F1 rims ;) but I'll probably fall over or stumble when they release Price as its going to be F1 licensed but who gives a fuk , its a licensed F1 wheel !
Im more hyped for this than even the next GTX Ti :)
For me DD is just a pipe dream !

Atak Kat
17-07-2018, 04:54
The Sim Racing Community begged Fanatec to Make a DD wheel and Holy all Crap people do is Cry about the Price!!! Thomas/Fanatec said it wont be cheap from the start...What did they thonk it was going to Cost??? its pretty Much the same as any other DD wheel price once you add up all the stuff you Need to get it 100% up and running Ex: QR, Wheel Rim, Button Box for wheel Rim.

Fanatec Gave a all in 1 solution No external Box and including Console Compatability!!! what other DD wheel has a FFB Graph on the wheel base and it does more!!! and it has on wheen and on wheel base Base tuning functions in a OLED screen??? WTF what did 0eie thinknit would cost??? the DD2 is the top of the line fanatec DD solution and any time you buy top of the line anything it cost a bit More... So again i wonder what did the people think it would cost???

Now when we scream for more wheel rims what will happen because people dont want to Pay.

I don't know very much, but I do tend to agree with this. Fanatec is such a strong brand, and customers will come no matter the few haters or critics. Their pricing is what it is (gosh, pedals alone can be just as much....). Personally I'm very interested in this option mainly because of their full line of other items (wheels, pedals, etc, etc). The overall price is a bit difficult when you start to price out a whole package, but I remember reading another comment 'you only live once....'

I'll be watching for GrimeyDog's report after he receives it... Or, better yet, some youTuber's that hopefully will receive sample/test versions.

morpwr
17-07-2018, 11:04
The Sim Racing Community begged Fanatec to Make a DD wheel and Holy all Crap people do is Cry about the Price!!! Thomas/Fanatec said it wont be cheap from the start...What did they thonk it was going to Cost??? its pretty Much the same as any other DD wheel price once you add up all the stuff you Need to get it 100% up and running Ex: QR, Wheel Rim, Button Box for wheel Rim.

Fanatec Gave a all in 1 solution No external Box and including Console Compatability!!! what other DD wheel has a FFB Graph on the wheel base and it does more!!! and it has on wheen and on wheel base Base tuning functions in a OLED screen??? WTF what did 0eie thinknit would cost??? the DD2 is the top of the line fanatec DD solution and any time you buy top of the line anything it cost a bit More... So again i wonder what did the people think it would cost???

Now when we scream for more wheel rims what will happen because people dont want to Pay.


I thinks its priced a little high especially with no wheel. But if its as good as it is supposed to be then it might be worth it. I think the biggest turn off was the release video what the hell was that? Definitely didn't make me want to rush out and hand over my money. The other thing is im really surprised none of the sim sites have got one to review. Normally at least a couple have this stuff prerelease to test which would help sales im sure if its good. Are there still issues with I and that's why nobody has seen one yet working? Im waiting to see how they price the new wheels but I have a sneaking suspicion they are going to priced at the same level as some of the custom wheels but I hope not.

Atak Kat
17-07-2018, 13:16
I think the biggest turn off was the release video what the hell was that?

I have not seen it, but seen this comment often. I have been trying to find it online to watch it, but I cannot find it. Anyone knows a link for the livestream replay?

morpwr
17-07-2018, 13:34
I have not seen it, but seen this comment often. I have been trying to find it online to watch it, but I cannot find it. Anyone knows a link for the livestream replay?

There was a link a few pages back but I don't know if it still works. It was one of the worst product releases ive ever seen.

PostBox981
17-07-2018, 13:38
There was a link a few pages back but I don't know if it still works. It was one of the worst product releases ive ever seen.

Page 5 or 6, still works okay.

bporion
17-07-2018, 18:08
I have not seen it, but seen this comment often. I have been trying to find it online to watch it, but I cannot find it. Anyone knows a link for the livestream replay?

you do not want to see it , it was brutal !!

Khyber GT
17-07-2018, 20:32
I have not seen it, but seen this comment often. I have been trying to find it online to watch it, but I cannot find it. Anyone knows a link for the livestream replay?

their facebook and their blog

GJones88
17-07-2018, 21:04
That peak Nm stuff is marketing BS as well, that's peak not sustained torque, OSW motors don't advertise peaks they are sustained torque over a period of time, they will also peak but they don't advertise it, people will be calling these DD1 and DD2 bases 18Nm and 24Nm which they aren't, they are 15Nm and 18Nm.


OSW advertises Peak Torque.
The Holding Torque on the "big 30Nm MiGE" is only 15Nm.
Which is what the smaller Podium DD1 has.

granitedevices.com/wiki/List_of_motors_for_SimuCUBE"]https://granitedevices.com/wiki/List_of_motors_for_SimuCUBE (https://granitedevices.com/wiki/List_of_motors_for_SimuCUBE)

alibaba.com/product-detail/SERVO-MOTOR-2300w-OF-130ST-M15015_60128934786.html?spm=a2700.galleryofferlist.normalList.1.66a26ed5OqHX0n
(https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/SERVO-MOTOR-2300w-OF-130ST-M15015_60128934786.html?spm=a2700.galleryofferlist.normalList.1.66a26ed5OqHX0n)
MOTOR MODEL 130ST-M15015
Rated power(w) 2300
Rated voltage(v) 220
Rated current(A) 9.5
Rated speed(rpm) 1500
Holding torque(N.m) 15
Peak torque(N.m) 30


"That peak Nm stuff is marketing BS"

bporion
17-07-2018, 21:21
when are they going to show the f1 rim , that's all I want . my formula carbon is on its last legs :(

GrimeyDog
17-07-2018, 23:27
OSW advertises Peak Torque.
The Holding Torque on the "big 30Nm MiGE" is only 15Nm.
Which is what the smaller Podium DD1 has.

granitedevices.com/wiki/List_of_motors_for_SimuCUBE"]https://granitedevices.com/wiki/List_of_motors_for_SimuCUBE (https://granitedevices.com/wiki/List_of_motors_for_SimuCUBE)

alibaba.com/product-detail/SERVO-MOTOR-2300w-OF-130ST-M15015_60128934786.html?spm=a2700.galleryofferlist.normalList.1.66a26ed5OqHX0n
(https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/SERVO-MOTOR-2300w-OF-130ST-M15015_60128934786.html?spm=a2700.galleryofferlist.normalList.1.66a26ed5OqHX0n)
MOTOR MODEL 130ST-M15015
Rated power(w) 2300
Rated voltage(v) 220
Rated current(A) 9.5
Rated speed(rpm) 1500
Holding torque(N.m) 15
Peak torque(N.m) 30


"That peak Nm stuff is marketing BS"

Man your gonna start a war with this post!!! LOL
Im gonna get My lawn Chair and charge My phone battery and troll:barbershop_quartet_

morpwr
18-07-2018, 11:15
OSW advertises Peak Torque.
The Holding Torque on the "big 30Nm MiGE" is only 15Nm.
Which is what the smaller Podium DD1 has.

granitedevices.com/wiki/List_of_motors_for_SimuCUBE"]https://granitedevices.com/wiki/List_of_motors_for_SimuCUBE (https://granitedevices.com/wiki/List_of_motors_for_SimuCUBE)

alibaba.com/product-detail/SERVO-MOTOR-2300w-OF-130ST-M15015_60128934786.html?spm=a2700.galleryofferlist.normalList.1.66a26ed5OqHX0n
(https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/SERVO-MOTOR-2300w-OF-130ST-M15015_60128934786.html?spm=a2700.galleryofferlist.normalList.1.66a26ed5OqHX0n)
MOTOR MODEL 130ST-M15015
Rated power(w) 2300
Rated voltage(v) 220
Rated current(A) 9.5
Rated speed(rpm) 1500
Holding torque(N.m) 15
Peak torque(N.m) 30


"That peak Nm stuff is marketing BS"


Im not sure if that's actually accurate because of the way we use them and most run them at a much higher current then 9.5amps.

Twinz
18-07-2018, 11:49
Maybe it's because I'm primarily concerned with stimulating a normal "street" car, but I'm not in the "must be stronger" camp. My CSL Elite is too strong at 100% gain/ raw settings.

I mean I have never driven a GT3 car, so maybe it's weak for that, but I need to turn down the gain to 80-ish so that the force resembles what my FRS (GT86) feels like IRL.

Atak Kat
18-07-2018, 12:15
their facebook and their blog

I've been searching for it. Maybe they removed it.

morpwr
18-07-2018, 12:19
Maybe it's because I'm primarily concerned with stimulating a normal "street" car, but I'm not in the "must be stronger" camp. My CSL Elite is too strong at 100% gain/ raw settings.

I mean I have never driven a GT3 car, so maybe it's weak for that, but I need to turn down the gain to 80-ish so that the force resembles what my FRS (GT86) feels like IRL.

Its not about how hard the wheel is to turn its about not running out of room to make the forces. Higher nm means more room to make them all.

Twinz
18-07-2018, 14:43
Its not about how hard the wheel is to turn its about not running out of room to make the forces. Higher nm means more room to make them all.

Do we have a Nm number that we have determined is enough to make "all the forces"? -A point where we all agree that "more" doesn't serve a useful purpose beyond marketing?

I have driven a lot of performance cars IRL and the most force I can recall getting from a steering wheel was in an overpowered FWD car with nasty torque-steer. I don't think my CSL Elite could quite duplicate that amount of force, but I'm not sure I would spend extra money in search if that "feature".

The idea that a DD wheel can simultaneously (and accurately) produce both heavy tire-load forces and delicate road-noise forces seems valuable, but I doubt that's something that can be reflected in Nm numbers alone. (I don't think more headroom guarantees a base's ability to pull this off)

I used to be heavy into car stereos and the focus on Nm numbers reminds me of the way amplifier power numbers were advertised. 1000 watts of power could mean drastically different things between two different amplifiers.

One 1000 watt amp could sound awesome while another 1000 watt amp would just sound like crap. (Albeit very loud crap)

In sound systems not all watts are created equally. I suspect not all Nm are either.

cluck
18-07-2018, 14:58
There is one major aspect to direct drives that a lot of people aren't really aware of, without using one. They are exceptionally smooth to use, just like a real steering wheel. There's none of the notchiness of gear-driven wheels or that slight detached feeling you get from a belt-driven wheel. It is that very direct-drive nature that makes them more of a pleasure to use. I had a play with the prototype that Fanatec took to the sim-racing expo last September and it was that smoothness and sense that my inputs were directly connected to the wheels that I remember the most.

Maurice Boeschen
18-07-2018, 15:02
There is one major aspect to direct drives that a lot of people aren't really aware of, without using one. They are exceptionally smooth to use, just like a real steering wheel. There's none of the notchiness of gear-driven wheels or that slight detached feeling you get from a belt-driven wheel. It is that very direct-drive nature that makes them more of a pleasure to use. I had a play with the prototype that Fanatec took to the sim-racing expo last September and it was that smoothness and sense that my inputs were directly connected to the wheels that I remember the most.

not every DD is smooth. The hybrid-stepper/servo motor in the Accuforce DDs for example is very notchy and has a lot of cogging, the CSW Bases are a LOT smoother for example. In fact, the CSW v2.5 is maybe even equal to some high-end DDs in terms of smoothness/notchiness, you really cant fell any notchiness/cogging at all, it turns already really smoothly.

cluck
18-07-2018, 15:08
not every DD is smooth. The hybrid-stepper/servo motor in the Accuforce DDs for example is very notchy and has a lot of cogging, the CSW Bases are a LOT smoother for example. In fact, the CSW v2.5 is maybe even equal to some high-end DDs in terms of smoothness/notchiness, you really cant fell any notchiness/cogging at all, it turns already really smoothly.I can only speak from experiencing the Fanatec one and assumed that's how they all were. There was a noticeable improvement over the CSW 2.5 (which they also had at the show), in terms of the smoothness of operation. Interesting that they're not all that smooth, thanks for that, another classic Cluck assumption blunder :D

morpwr
18-07-2018, 15:21
Do we have a Nm number that we have determined is enough to make "all the forces"? -A point where we all agree that "more" doesn't serve a useful purpose beyond marketing?

I have driven a lot of performance cars IRL and the most force I can recall getting from a steering wheel was in an overpowered FWD car with nasty torque-steer. I don't think my CSL Elite could quite duplicate that amount of force, but I'm not sure I would spend extra money in search if that "feature".

The idea that a DD wheel can simultaneously (and accurately) produce both heavy tire-load forces and delicate road-noise forces seems valuable, but I doubt that's something that can be reflected in Nm numbers alone. (I don't think more headroom guarantees a base's ability to pull this off)

I used to be heavy into car stereos and the focus on Nm numbers reminds me of the way amplifier power numbers were advertised. 1000 watts of power could mean drastically different things between two different amplifiers.

One 1000 watt amp could sound awesome while another 1000 watt amp would just sound like crap. (Albeit very loud crap)

In sound systems not all watts are created equally. I suspect not all Nm are either.


No. But I can say 30 is enough for me but I know the osw guys are playing around with much bigger like 60 plus nm ones. Its really hard to explain unless you have tried one but it does allow you to run a normal wheel weight while still being able to feel all the forces and bumps even in a high load situation. Small forces can still be felt without having to compensate with more wheel weight then you really want like on a consumer wheel. Obviously things like speed and smoothness come into play too when talking about how realistic it feels.

Andrew_WOT
18-07-2018, 16:45
Im not sure if that's actually accurate because of the way we use them and most run them at a much higher current then 9.5amps.

The amperage from sheet is RMS (root mean square), what you enter in Granity is POS (peak of sine).
You just multiply it by 1.41421356237 (square of two)
For small Mige it's 9.1A RMS X 1.4142 = 12.87A POS.

Source: https://forum.virtualracing.org/showthread.php/100800-Project-Bruteforce-3-The-Torque-Monster?p=2175476&viewfull=1#post2175476

You can also overdrive motor, it's fairly safe for our application. The link covers that too.

What I really want to see is what PSU they are using, as this is second to motor critical part. Also one that will give up first if anything.

Haiden
18-07-2018, 18:42
not every DD is smooth. The hybrid-stepper/servo motor in the Accuforce DDs for example is very notchy and has a lot of cogging, the CSW Bases are a LOT smoother for example. In fact, the CSW v2.5 is maybe even equal to some high-end DDs in terms of smoothness/notchiness, you really cant fell any notchiness/cogging at all, it turns already really smoothly.

The V2.5 isn't smoother than an Accuforce. I've been experimenting with both recently, and used to own a V2. If you don't dial the AF in, you might have that issue. But all you have to do is tune the wheel. There's no cogging or notchiness. The AF with PCars, feels more realistic than any belt driven wheel I've ever tried. OSW is better and Podium probably will be, too. But the CSW bases are not even close.

Charger
18-07-2018, 19:06
I don't find any notchiness either with the Accuforce, every other belt or gear wheel I have tried I have though.

With regards to peak torques that is very interesting on the OSW, different ways of advertising it appears.

What does concern me though is looking at the figures for the Mige motors and lets assume the Podium with the same sort of torque is similar, it would look to achieve around 24Nm peak you need something around a 500w ish PSU, how the hell have they crammed that into the base and surely that is going to generate some heat, this is my primary concern with the Podium.

Every other DD wheel uses an external control box, PC if you like with the PSU externally, I understand why they have done it for plug and play purposes and for easy set up but I think that will be a weak point, as said the PSU will be the first thing to give up.

The Accuforce base is huge and if you see a teardown of it most of that space is empty except for a circuit board at the back, no fans just empty space.

I would be very interested to hear how much heat is generated from it.

Maurice Boeschen
18-07-2018, 19:20
I don't find any notchiness either with the Accuforce, every other belt or gear wheel I have tried I have though.

With regards to peak torques that is very interesting on the OSW, different ways of advertising it appears.

What does concern me though is looking at the figures for the Mige motors and lets assume the Podium with the same sort of torque is similar, it would look to achieve around 24Nm peak you need something around a 500w ish PSU, how the hell have they crammed that into the base and surely that is going to generate some heat, this is my primary concern with the Podium.

Every other DD wheel uses an external control box, PC if you like with the PSU externally, I understand why they have done it for plug and play purposes and for easy set up but I think that will be a weak point, as said the PSU will be the first thing to give up.

The Accuforce base is huge and if you see a teardown of it most of that space is empty except for a circuit board at the back, no fans just empty space.

I would be very interested to hear how much heat is generated from it.

I guess you are not sensitive to cogging then. A Logitech Wheel has enormous cogging, even with Thrustmaster wheels (including their high end TS-PC Racer) you can clearly feel the cogging..

And Fanatec never stated that their PSU is internal. The PSU will be external as you can read on the Webshop description ;)

Haiden
18-07-2018, 19:30
I guess you are not sensitive to cogging then. A Logitech Wheel has enormous cogging, even with Thrustmaster wheels (including their high end TS-PC Racer) you can clearly feel the cogging..

And Fanatec never stated that their PSU is internal. The PSU will be external as you can read on the Webshop description ;)

Or you just used tried a wheel that wasn't tuned properly. I felt cogging in TM and Fanatec wheels. Not getting that with the AF.

Charger
18-07-2018, 19:36
I guess you are not sensitive to cogging then. A Logitech Wheel has enormous cogging, even with Thrustmaster wheels (including their high end TS-PC Racer) you can clearly feel the cogging..

And Fanatec never stated that their PSU is internal. The PSU will be external as you can read on the Webshop description ;)

If you re read I said every other wheel I have tried I have felt cogging, Momo, G25, T500, G27 etc but not with the Accuforce.

I read this on the Fanatec site, Integrated electronics within wheel base housing, no external control box required. but then it's says external PSU, either way it has fans on it so there is some heat generated.

Maurice Boeschen
18-07-2018, 19:38
If you re read I said every other wheel I have tried I have felt cogging, Momo, G25, T500, G27 etc but not with the Accuforce.

Ah okay, misunderstood ^^

GJones88
18-07-2018, 21:24
Fanatec had a graph of Torque Ripple they showed at the livestream.
Thomas detailed about how the Podium was designed to be very smooth.
It is likely the "26Nm Servo" motor is the Leo Bodnar.
The "Hybrid Stepper" is likely the Accuforce.
Clubsport Wheelbase "CSW V2.5" is the blue line.

Torque Ripple is defined as "an effect seen in many electric motor designs, referring to a periodic increase or decrease in output torque as the motor shaft rotates. It is measured as the difference in maximum and minimum torque over one complete revolution."


257769

morpwr
19-07-2018, 11:03
The amperage from sheet is RMS (root mean square), what you enter in Granity is POS (peak of sine).
You just multiply it by 1.41421356237 (square of two)
For small Mige it's 9.1A RMS X 1.4142 = 12.87A POS.

Source: https://forum.virtualracing.org/showthread.php/100800-Project-Bruteforce-3-The-Torque-Monster?p=2175476&viewfull=1#post2175476

You can also overdrive motor, it's fairly safe for our application. The link covers that too.

What I really want to see is what PSU they are using, as this is second to motor critical part. Also one that will give up first if anything.


I cant overdrive mine because I have the big mige.

Olijke Poffer
21-07-2018, 17:19
http://youtu.be/YEFMsth2urA

Asturbo
21-07-2018, 17:42
Interesting 5 years warrantie free of charge in DD2 preorders and finaly he explain the diferences between DD1 and DD2.

He also announced the price of DD1 (999€) and a good looking rim in 2:30 for the podium series.

This is the video we needed, not the Facebook one.

Olijke Poffer
21-07-2018, 19:01
€999 is doable but for me a step to high atm. My CSW v2,5 will do for now but who knows. I then can use my rim which came with the CSW.

Haiden
21-07-2018, 19:27
Interesting 5 years warrantie free of charge in DD2 preorders and finaly he explain the diferences between DD1 and DD2.

He also announced the price of DD1 (999€) and a good looking rim in 2:30 for the podium series.

This is the video we needed, not the Facebook one.

I want that rim. It looks great. I wonder what the F1 rim is going to look like.

Asturbo
21-07-2018, 19:57
I want that rim. It looks great. I wonder what the F1 rim is going to look like.
That rim is great. Looks still a prototype, but magnetic contacts and he said that it's not very expensive (we hope so).

257929 257930

But if I understand correctly, he said that they are working in other 9 rims, all of them compatible with previous Fanatec bases. That sounds fantastic.

morpwr
21-07-2018, 22:05
http://youtu.be/YEFMsth2urA

Now that's more like what I expected. Looks promising.

GrimeyDog
21-07-2018, 22:28
That rim is great. Looks still a prototype, but magnetic contacts and he said that it's not very expensive (we hope so).

257929 257930

But if I understand correctly, he said that they are working in other 9 rims, all of them compatible with previous Fanatec bases. That sounds fantastic.

The Rim is the Same as the Forza Rim--> Which is the Most comfortable Rim i Own -->Comfort order is --> Forza Rim, McClaren, F1 Black, Porsche... Its the Back Hub part thats different and it Looks/ seems that the Rims will be Changable from the Screws on the front... I just hope the option to add more button Hubs is there.... I'm Going to buy it for sure!!! also very nice News about all Pre orders getting the 5yr warranty at No extra cost!!!

Happy i got My Pre order in on day 1!!! Now just the waiting time until it gets here.

Charger
22-07-2018, 00:58
Now that's more like what I expected. Looks promising.

I agree, adding the 5 years in as well for pre orders is a good move, took the piss a bit that, $999 on the DD1 is a lot better than I expected, looks a lot more attractive for Fanatec owners now.

That other video was cringe worthy.

One thing I did pick up on or maybe misheard is that the DD1 will ship with the DD2 motor but will only be limited by electronics, if so that's the one I would buy, did I hear that right?

GrimeyDog
22-07-2018, 02:59
One thing I did pick up on or maybe misheard is that the DD1 will ship with the DD2 motor but will only be limited by electronics, if so that's the one I would buy, did I hear that right?

That is Correct... Its exactly what was said.

From looking at the Prices of other DD wheels Both Fanatec wheels seem to be in the right price range with wheels of comparable NM power.... My DD2 pre order total with Shipping was $1,540.×× ...OSW DD wheels once you consider you still have to buy the QR adapter, wheel rim button box and wheel rim to get the DD 100% up and running the total cost is about the same... Even if the Fanatec DD wheels come out a tad bit more $$$ its still going to be worth it the On wheel Base Data and tuning Screen is enough to justify the extra wheel base cost <--- Especially if you already own Fanatec Wheel Rim and Pedals.

Also Very Nice that Fantec will have its own version of Sim Vibe.

morpwr
22-07-2018, 13:12
I agree, adding the 5 years in as well for pre orders is a good move, took the piss a bit that, $999 on the DD1 is a lot better than I expected, looks a lot more attractive for Fanatec owners now.

That other video was cringe worthy.

One thing I did pick up on or maybe misheard is that the DD1 will ship with the DD2 motor but will only be limited by electronics, if so that's the one I would buy, did I hear that right?


It was really bad. I thought he was high lol. But now that the actual specs are out it looks much better. You did but you wont get the full use of the motor. Id still go for the bigger one just so you don't have to worry about clipping at the wheel. I like the fact he wants to work with the osw guys which was mentioned on the osw forum that some big players were getting involved. Should be some interesting times for dd development.

morpwr
22-07-2018, 13:20
That is Correct... Its exactly what was said.

From looking at the Prices of other DD wheels Both Fanatec wheels seem to be in the right price range with wheels of comparable NM power.... My DD2 pre order total with Shipping was $1,540.×× ...OSW DD wheels once you consider you still have to buy the QR adapter, wheel rim button box and wheel rim to get the DD 100% up and running the total cost is about the same... Even if the Fanatec DD wheels come out a tad bit more $$$ its still going to be worth it the On wheel Base Data and tuning Screen is enough to justify the extra wheel base cost <--- Especially if you already own Fanatec Wheel Rim and Pedals.

Also Very Nice that Fantec will have its own version of Sim Vibe.

Sucks that you have to wait until dec. Youre going to love it! Youre right about the total cost. That's about exactly what my 30nm osw cost with a reasonable wheel cost wise and the exchange. Right around 2 grand when you add in everything. But id do it again for sure. The quality of the stuff is outstanding.

Haiden
22-07-2018, 13:48
I agree, adding the 5 years in as well for pre orders is a good move, took the piss a bit that, $999 on the DD1 is a lot better than I expected, looks a lot more attractive for Fanatec owners now.

That other video was cringe worthy.

One thing I did pick up on or maybe misheard is that the DD1 will ship with the DD2 motor but will only be limited by electronics, if so that's the one I would buy, did I hear that right?

I think both bases are priced appropriately, but I think it's wrong that they announced the DD1 as auction only when they opened pre-orders for the DD2, then a week later, let everyone know that the DD1 will be $999 with the same motor, just a little less torque.

morpwr
22-07-2018, 13:52
I think both bases are priced appropriately, but I think it's wrong that they announced the DD1 as auction only when they opened pre-orders for the DD2, then a week later, let everyone know that the DD1 will be $999 with the same motor, just a little less torque.

I wonder how long it will be before somebody figures out how to hack it? Seeing it only limited by the software.

GrimeyDog
22-07-2018, 14:36
Sucks that you have to wait until dec. Youre going to love it! Youre right about the total cost. That's about exactly what my 30nm osw cost with a reasonable wheel cost wise and the exchange. Right around 2 grand when you add in everything. But id do it again for sure. The quality of the stuff is outstanding.

Being a Fanatec Customer since 2010 i pretty Much knew what to expect...This is exactly why i upgraded from the v2 and bought the v2.5 by the time i get the DD2 i would have had the v2.5 almost 2yrs!!! Its still working Great and i can fully enjoy Sim racing until the DD2 gets here --> it will still have Nice resale value but I don't think i will sell it... I'm thinking to maybe sell the v2 and regular v3 pedals as a bundle I'm running outta sim gear whoarding space:cower: LOL


I think both bases are priced appropriately, but I think it's wrong that they announced the DD1 as auction only when they opened pre-orders for the DD2, then a week later, let everyone know that the DD1 will be $999 with the same motor, just a little less torque.

TBH i don't think they knew where to price either wheel base... they were waiting to see the community backlash from original pricing of the DD2... Once they processed that they threw in the 5yr warranty to sweeten the pot and were able to come up with a happy medium price for the DD1 --> I don't expect the PS4 DD base to be Cheap i think it will be more than $999.99 --> it will be the only DD base that works with All platforms... Kudos to Fanatec.

Haiden
22-07-2018, 15:20
TBH i don't think they knew where to price either wheel base... they were waiting to see the community backlash from original pricing of the DD2... Once they processed that they threw in the 5yr warranty to sweeten the post and were able to come up with a happy medium price for the DD1 --> I don't expect the PS4 DD base to be Cheap i think it will be more than $999.99 --> it will be the only DD bade that works with All platforms... Kudos to Fanatec.

True. But it doesn't change the fact that some people that pre-ordered, would have opted for the cheaper DD1, if they had known it was going to have the same motor, just with less torque. They were basically steered into a $500 add-on, because they weren't given a choice. The inclusion of the 5yr warranty with the DD2 pre-orders is basically them trying to appease anyone who might be a little ticked about the way things played out. Otherwise, some DD2 pre-order customers, could ask for a refund and wait for the DD1. They should have priced them both at announcement time or stuck to the auction model, until December, like they said. Taking orders then changing the game wasn't really right.

I agree, though. They are building a nice complete ecosystem. And given how expensive the hobby can be, having a line of rims alone can save you f'ton of money. That's why I opted for the base-side Fantatc conversion kit for the Accuforce. It was cheaper and didn't require modifying the rims.

GrimeyDog
22-07-2018, 16:33
Yeah the $999.00 DD1 price is sweeter than the DD2 $1500.00 price and will get more people to buy it... I even thought about changing the order later on if the DD1 was Much lower with similar NM specs... I didnt order the extra 2yr warranty and Once they added it in for Free i was very happy... Its been said Many times that if you go DD get the highest NM model you can afford because it give more Dynamic range --> I never really understood this concept but i just jumped on the DD2 because of this away.

TBH Looking at the 2 models i think the DD1 and DD2 were going to have the same motors anyway and the Difference would be Power supply and different electronics to regulate performance....the Cases are Exactly the same size seems they would have to make a DD1 case if the motor was much smaller and It dont seem to make sense to develope 2 motors to do the same thing and you can differentiate them with power supply and electronics.... unless there is a Huge performance difference between the 2 so 1 requires a Bigger motor --> that dont seem to be the case because the Total NM diff is less than 10NM between the DD1 and DD2.

What ever the case its a Great time to be a Sim Racer!!!

bporion
22-07-2018, 19:38
is there a time line for the release of the F1 wheel or at least a picture of it ? that's what I am waiting for .

Invincible
23-07-2018, 08:59
is there a time line for the release of the F1 wheel or at least a picture of it ? that's what I am waiting for .

I think that will be unveiled with the PS4 base. Because from the looks of it, the PS4 DD base might feature said F1 wheel.

Haiden
23-07-2018, 13:40
Any mention of a DD3? Thomas made it seem like they were going to have another tier. Or maybe it was the PS4 edition he was referring to. But I thought there was talk of a 30Nm version.

Invincible
23-07-2018, 13:45
Any mention of a DD3? Thomas made it seem like they were going to have another tier. Or maybe it was the PS4 edition he was referring to. But I thought there was talk of a 30Nm version.

Afaik, there was no mention of another, even stronger DD wheel from Fanatec. Also - what for? Fast 'n' easy broken thumbs and wrists?

Maurice Boeschen
23-07-2018, 13:58
Any mention of a DD3? Thomas made it seem like they were going to have another tier. Or maybe it was the PS4 edition he was referring to. But I thought there was talk of a 30Nm version.

There will be the DD1 (Base only with DD2 Motor), the DD2 (Base only) and the Podium Racing Wheel PS4 Edition (DD1 Base with DD2 Motor Plus additional electronics to ensure PS4 compatibility and a new formula style wheel Rim)

Seelenkrank
23-07-2018, 16:39
you really dont want drive with full 30Nm.
trust me.
highest i got was @75% on my DD and i cant cornering around tight corners.

Haiden
23-07-2018, 18:28
Afaik, there was no mention of another, even stronger DD wheel from Fanatec. Also - what for? Fast 'n' easy broken thumbs and wrists?

Because it gives you more dynamic range.


you really dont want drive with full 30Nm.
trust me.
highest i got was @75% on my DD and i cant cornering around tight corners.

Wasn't planning to set it to 100%. I just want to know, because a 30Nm base would have better fidelity. I've heard some OSW guys are actually experimenting with 60Nm wheels for that very reason.

morpwr
23-07-2018, 19:00
you really dont want drive with full 30Nm.
trust me.
highest i got was @75% on my DD and i cant cornering around tight corners.

I run mine like that so you don't limit the wheel just turn the in game gain down. Just be careful if you crash. It will hurt if you try to hold the wheel. You learn to let go real fast.

Charger
23-07-2018, 19:12
I can't run my Accuforce at 100% and that is 13Nm with 16Nm peaks at 100%, I reinstalled AMS recently and it was brutal, I have had to turn it down to around 40% for that.

Injuries are a real issue with DD wheels, got cracked in the knuckle from the Formula rim the other night while not concentrating on the post race slowdown, was coming to a stop and just lifted my hands off the wheel and crack got hit full force and the wheel just snapped left, ouch!

Should have gone into the brace position lol.

Seelenkrank
23-07-2018, 19:24
I run mine like that so you don't limit the wheel just turn the in game gain down. Just be careful if you crash. It will hurt if you try to hold the wheel. You learn to let go real fast.

i got/had 100% in the driver (Mmos software) and in the game (AC) set it to 100% gain and 75% in the car FFB setting.
it was not so nice.
even the lighter corners ;)
crashing in AC i finde not so bad like when you had an accident in PC2 or in R3E (and there my wheel is limited to 33%! ingame).
so not every game give the same result with the same hardware/identical setting in the driver.

Asturbo
23-07-2018, 19:25
We will see soon people in emergencies with serious injuries after a heavy traffic accident... with his sim...

How are you going to explain the doctor that the corkscrew was a bit slipery. :cool:

morpwr
23-07-2018, 20:03
i got/had 100% in the driver (Mmos software) and in the game (AC) set it to 100% gain and 75% in the car FFB setting.
it was not so nice.
even the lighter corners ;)
crashing in AC i finde not so bad like when you had an accident in PC2 or in R3E (and there my wheel is limited to 33%! ingame).
so not every game give the same result with the same hardware/identical setting in the driver.

Yeah there is no way I could or would want to run my wheel and I game at 100. Usually somewhere between 30-40 gain in game gives a realistic weight to the wheel. R3e is definitely the worst for crashing. Its actually scary with the osw. There is a setting that you need to turn off so that doesn't happen but I cant remember what it was called right now.

Haiden
23-07-2018, 20:31
I can't run my Accuforce at 100% and that is 13Nm with 16Nm peaks at 100%, I reinstalled AMS recently and it was brutal, I have had to turn it down to around 40% for that.

Injuries are a real issue with DD wheels, got cracked in the knuckle from the Formula rim the other night while not concentrating on the post race slowdown, was coming to a stop and just lifted my hands off the wheel and crack got hit full force and the wheel just snapped left, ouch!

Should have gone into the brace position lol.

Same. I run mine around 40-50, depending on the title. During my first week with it. I pulled over in-game, and then stood and reached for something near by rig. A car rear-ended me on track and the F1 rims pun and hit me in the stomach as I was reaching over the rim. Last time I'll ever do that...LOL.


Yeah there is no way I could or would want to run my wheel and I game at 100. Usually somewhere between 30-40 gain in game gives a realistic weight to the wheel. R3e is definitely the worst for crashing. Its actually scary with the osw. There is a setting that you need to turn off so that doesn't happen but I cant remember what it was called right now.

Yes. It's the Collision Effect scale. Default is something high like 200. You need to turn that down to something around 30-50 for DD wheels. 200 is just to dangerous for crash feedback.

Seelenkrank
24-07-2018, 10:30
ohh i dont know if i changed this value in the .ini.
thx for the info, will take an eye on it later :)

morpwr
24-07-2018, 10:44
ohh i dont know if i changed this value in the .ini.
thx for the info, will take an eye on it later :)

There are actually a couple you should change if you have an osw. I think the other one was curb pull. Look up the gamer muscle video he shows what to change in the ini files.

Haiden
24-07-2018, 12:02
ohh i dont know if i changed this value in the .ini.
thx for the info, will take an eye on it later :)

Not sure which setting, you're talking about, but if it's Collision Effect, that's in the R3E settings.

leonstone
24-07-2018, 12:31
Do you really think the higher the torque is, the better the fidelity is?

morpwr
24-07-2018, 12:55
Do you really think the higher the torque is, the better the fidelity is?

Yes larger range to work in before the wheel clips and you don't need to crank up the wheel weight to feel small forces. Obviously there are other things like speed,software that come into play.

leonstone
24-07-2018, 13:04
Yes larger range to work in before the wheel clips and you don't need to crank up the wheel weight to feel small forces. Obviously there are other things like speed,software that come into play.

now the question is for real or for game .

morpwr
24-07-2018, 13:08
now the question is for real or for game .

Not sure what you mean by that.

leonstone
24-07-2018, 14:04
Think about it, game devices exist to play games better.
Simulated reality? just a joke.

Haiden
24-07-2018, 14:13
Think about it, game devices exist to play games better.
Simulated reality? just a joke.

Is that why professional drivers use sims off track to practice their race craft and learn the cars better? Is that why race teams have drivers back at the facilities running the car and track combo and advises the crews at the track what adjustments to make and where the driver might be able to push a little harder? They do that because simulated reality is a joke, huh? I guess that's what all the other simulations--flight, medical, etc. are, too, huh? Just jokes? :confused:

Seelenkrank
24-07-2018, 14:33
Not sure which setting, you're talking about, but if it's Collision Effect, that's in the R3E settings.

ok :)
most other settings are hiding in the .ini file, i had changed there something to (but dont ask me what. didnt remember *g*)

Mascot
24-07-2018, 14:51
One thing I've never really understood is the common complaint that a belt-driven wheel can feel slightly 'rubbery' due to flex in the belt compared to a DDW.

What the hell do people think tyres are made of? I've never driven a car in real life that didn't have an ever-so-slightly rubbery feel to the steering. ALL contact with the road is via four rubber buffers so it would feel pretty bloody odd if it didn't have that feel, even with power assistance.

This second video is a massive improvement and the podium wheels look like decent propositions, but to be perfectly honest I'm perfectly happy with my CSWv2.5 right now. Ignorance might be bliss but I never feel like I'm missing out on anything while using it.

leonstone
24-07-2018, 15:00
Is that why professional drivers use sims off track to practice their race craft and learn the cars better? Is that why race teams have drivers back at the facilities running the car and track combo and advises the crews at the track what adjustments to make and where the driver might be able to push a little harder? They do that because simulated reality is a joke, huh? I guess that's what all the other simulations--flight, medical, etc. are, too, huh? Just jokes? :confused:

Do you really think the higher the torque is, the better the fidelity is?

I found that OSW players have evolved in a strange direction.

Olijke Poffer
24-07-2018, 15:03
One thing I've never really understood is the common complaint that a belt-driven wheel can feel slightly 'rubbery' due to flex in the belt compared to a DDW.

What the hell do people think tyres are made of? I've never driven a car in real life that didn't have an ever-so-slightly rubbery feel to the steering. ALL contact with the road is via four rubber buffers so it would feel pretty bloody odd if it didn't have that feel, even with power assistance.

This second video is a massive improvement and the podium wheels look like decent propositions, but to be perfectly honest I'm perfectly happy with my CSWv2.5 right now. Ignorance might be bliss but I never feel like I'm missing out on anything while using it.

That is my thought as well. My own car has a wheel which does not react better than my game wheel. And also feels not that direct at all. :-)

morpwr
24-07-2018, 15:10
One thing I've never really understood is the common complaint that a belt-driven wheel can feel slightly 'rubbery' due to flex in the belt compared to a DDW.

What the hell do people think tyres are made of? I've never driven a car in real life that didn't have an ever-so-slightly rubbery feel to the steering. ALL contact with the road is via four rubber buffers so it would feel pretty bloody odd if it didn't have that feel, even with power assistance.

This second video is a massive improvement and the podium wheels look like decent propositions, but to be perfectly honest I'm perfectly happy with my CSWv2.5 right now. Ignorance might be bliss but I never feel like I'm missing out on anything while using it.

I think what they mean is when you change directions. You can feel the belt wrap/stretch whatever you want to call it. I never noticed it or at least didn't know what I was feeling until I got a dd.

morpwr
24-07-2018, 15:11
Do you really think the higher the torque is, the better the fidelity is?

I found that OSW players have evolved in a strange direction.


Whys is that? Every other dd wheel is about the same level as the osw wheels.

Haiden
24-07-2018, 15:47
One thing I've never really understood is the common complaint that a belt-driven wheel can feel slightly 'rubbery' due to flex in the belt compared to a DDW.

What the hell do people think tyres are made of? I've never driven a car in real life that didn't have an ever-so-slightly rubbery feel to the steering. ALL contact with the road is via four rubber buffers so it would feel pretty bloody odd if it didn't have that feel, even with power assistance.

This second video is a massive improvement and the podium wheels look like decent propositions, but to be perfectly honest I'm perfectly happy with my CSWv2.5 right now. Ignorance might be bliss but I never feel like I'm missing out on anything while using it.


That is my thought as well. My own car has a wheel which does not react better than my game wheel. And also feels not that direct at all. :-)


I think what they mean is when you change directions. You can feel the belt wrap/stretch whatever you want to call it. I never noticed it or at least didn't know what I was feeling until I got a dd.

That's exactly what they mean. When a belt drive changes direction, the belt stretches a bit before the actual rotation is reversed. It makes the belt-drive response feel laggard compared to DDs. With direct drives there's nothing to stretch. The thing is, if you've never tried a DD, then you don't really no the difference and can't tell that the belt-drive is deficient in that regard. That's why people say, "I've never really understood..." Once you spend a little time with a DD, you'll know exactly what the difference is.

Seelenkrank
24-07-2018, 15:48
the biggest pro on a DD is reaction speed from the wheel.
at AC with my T500 i cant feel the rear of the car until i see it and then it was to late --> oversteer ---> crash.
with the speed of the servo i can counterstear in a minimum of time --> feel and react in a part from a second.
so force is not the part making a DD better then a belt driven wheel.

morpwr
24-07-2018, 15:58
the biggest pro on a DD is reaction speed from the wheel.
at AC with my T500 i cant feel the rear of the car until i see it and then it was to late --> oversteer ---> crash.
with the speed of the servo i can counterstear in a minimum of time --> feel and react in a part from a second.
so force is not the part making a DD better then a belt driven wheel.


That's just one part like I stated earlier. Speed definitely helps and obviously the part you really like but for others being able to feel everything might be.

Haiden
24-07-2018, 16:02
Do you really think the higher the torque is, the better the fidelity is?

I found that OSW players have evolved in a strange direction.

Alone, no. Software plays a huge role, as well. But think about this... If you're listening to an orchestra on a stereo and you hear all the instruments and nuances at 50% volume, then you start turning that volume down. As the sound level decreases, you will start losing sound elements. Some instruments will become hard to hear or eventually fade out all together and subtle nuances, like chimes symbols, etc, will become hard to hear or fade out completely. Now, why is that? Obviously, the instruments and nuances are still present in the signal, right? Of course. The problem is the volume is just too low, and the sound range the music is using has the lower end so low you can't detect the sounds. It can't play them any louder, because that would offset their relation to the louder sounds. Simply put, if sound A is 80% softer than sound B, that ratio will remain constant, regardless of the volume setting. So, as you lower the volume, sound A will always become inaudible before sound B.

Same thing happens with FFB. If force A is 80% softer than force B, and you only have 7Nm of torque to work with, then even when running at 100%, force A will only be about 1.4Nm of force. Were as a wheel capable of 20Nm of torque would output the same forces at 4Nm, which for that wheel is still 80% force B. Now, which wheel do you think would allow you to feel force A more clearly? :)

Twinz
24-07-2018, 16:14
There has to be a point where more torque doesn't add any benefit and torque alone can't possibly tell the whole story.

In sound systems, not all watts are created equal. There's a lot of other factors that go into fidelity that watts alone simply can't define. Likewise, the fact that a motor can rip my arm off doesn't AUTOMATICALLY mean it can faithfully communicate fine details.

Haiden
24-07-2018, 16:29
There has to be a point where more torque doesn't add any benefit and torque alone can't possibly tell the whole story.

In sound systems, not all watts are created equal. There's a lot of other factors that go into fidelity that watts alone simply can't define. Likewise, the fact that a motor can rip my arm off doesn't AUTOMATICALLY mean it can faithfully communicate fine details.

I agree with you on that. I feel there has to be a point where torque doesn't matter. And I'm also not sure how the fidelity gains are affected by lowering the Gain at the wheel base. Because, as far as I know, that would change the force curve, reduces the range.

Also, the sound analogy was just to simply things, basically speaking in-theory. It wasn't mean to be taken as an absolute. Obviously, there are other factors that come into play where fidelity is concerned. But the gist of it is fine for the context of our FFB discussion.

Mascot
25-07-2018, 06:12
That's exactly what they mean. When a belt drive changes direction, the belt stretches a bit before the actual rotation is reversed. It makes the belt-drive response feel laggard compared to DDs. With direct drives there's nothing to stretch. The thing is, if you've never tried a DD, then you don't really no the difference and can't tell that the belt-drive is deficient in that regard. That's why people say, "I've never really understood..." Once you spend a little time with a DD, you'll know exactly what the difference is.

But my point was, steering in a real car is never that instantaneous, never that digital.
This 'lag' that people talk about is present in real cars. It's an analogue effect of the steering linkages and the big black rubber contact patches that interface with the road. Surely this unintended side-effect (or 'deficiency') of a belt-driven wheel actually helps to simulate that effect more realistically than a DDW ever will with its instantaneous digital response? If cars continue to have rubber tyres then steering should continue to have lag. Everyone starts fapping when they see tyre flex videos in their favourite sim, but the feel of that flex is surely what's most important?

MaximusN
25-07-2018, 06:17
But my point was, steering in a real car is never that instantaneous, never that digital.
This 'lag' that people talk about is present in real cars. It's an analogue effect of the steering linkages and the big black rubber contact patches that interface with the road. Surely this unintended side-effect (or 'deficiency') of a belt-driven wheel actually helps to simulate that effect more realistically than a DDW ever will with its instantaneous digital response? If cars continue to have rubber tyres then steering should continue to have lag. Everyone starts fapping when they see tyre flex videos in their favourite sim, but the feel of that flex is surely what's most important?
I agree. I actually like that very (very very) slight slack my T500 and CSW 2.5 have, because of the real connection with the road(the tyres) also is a 'flexible one. I'm actually worried a bit that DD would feel too direct. A steering column should feel rubbery. In fact it's the thing I hate most about gear driven wheels like the G25. If you get wheel shake there it feels nothing like any real steering rack, way too direct(and geary to boot).

Charger
25-07-2018, 06:25
But my point was, steering in a real car is never that instantaneous, never that digital.
This 'lag' that people talk about is present in real cars. It's an analogue effect of the steering linkages and the big black rubber contact patches that interface with the road. Surely this unintended side-effect (or 'deficiency') of a belt-driven wheel actually helps to simulate that effect more realistically than a DDW ever will with its instantaneous digital response? If cars continue to have rubber tyres then steering should continue to have lag. Everyone starts fapping when they see tyre flex videos in their favourite sim, but the feel of that flex is surely what's most important?

It's hard to explain, a direct drive wheel when not powered will spin freely and a belt driven one has inherent friction or drag from the belt itself, you can dial in some friction on a DD wheel to simulate tyre flex with software but you cannot dial out the friction created by a belt driven wheel.

It makes things instant and easier to catch slides and feel under and oversteer, also left to right wheel movements are quicker as you are not fighting the belt.

It's a bit like a car having Power assisted steering and non PAS.

With my T500 I could never drift properly due to the friction in the belt, I was always fighting it to get it to return, RX was very hard, with the DD wheel it is more lifelike, if you look at rally drivers they have very light steering for quick reactions with very little drag from left to right, you can dial that in with a DD wheel or you can dial in a more roadcar feel, you just have more range to play with.

PostBox981
25-07-2018, 07:23
After following this thread and from what I understand it is the simulation´s job to simulate the tyre flex right. If you have any flexibility in your FFB this adds to the simulated tyre flex effect. So I´d agree that a DD with "no" built in flexibility should feel closer to reality as long as the sim is doing a good job. Which I believe PC2 does.

Mascot
25-07-2018, 07:25
It's hard to explain, a direct drive wheel when not powered will spin freely and a belt driven one has inherent friction or drag from the belt itself, you can dial in some friction on a DD wheel to simulate tyre flex with software but you cannot dial out the friction created by a belt driven wheel.

It makes things instant and easier to catch slides and feel under and oversteer, also left to right wheel movements are quicker as you are not fighting the belt.

It's a bit like a car having Power assisted steering and non PAS.

With my T500 I could never drift properly due to the friction in the belt, I was always fighting it to get it to return, RX was very hard, with the DD wheel it is more lifelike, if you look at rally drivers they have very light steering for quick reactions with very little drag from left to right, you can dial that in with a DD wheel or you can dial in a more roadcar feel, you just have more range to play with.

So it's easier to catch slides and I'm guessing the faster steering response makes you lap quicker, but is that at the expense of a less realistic feel? Genuine question, I'm not trying to kick a hornet's nest here. It reminds me a little of the other extreme where a lot of people claim they are quicker with a joypad for exactly these reasons, being able to quickly change steering angle without the normal load and inertia associated with realistically-damped steering. And no, I'm not suggesting that a DDW is akin to using a joypad before anyone starts hyperventilating..! :P

Charger
25-07-2018, 07:48
So it's easier to catch slides and I'm guessing the faster steering response makes you lap quicker, but is that at the expense of a less realistic feel? Genuine question, I'm not trying to kick a hornet's nest here. It reminds me a little of the other extreme where a lot of people claim they are quicker with a joypad for exactly these reasons, being able to quickly change steering angle without the normal load and inertia associated with realistically-damped steering. And no, I'm not suggesting that a DDW is akin to using a joypad before anyone starts hyperventilating..! :P

Lol, no hyperventilating ;-)

It depends how you want it to feel, for Formula cars you want to feel the downforce which makes the steering weight up, for road cars you want to feel the tyres flex, for RX you want to be able to react to the slides and correct, it isn't a case of there is no resistance there is but it is the physics and FFB being directly transferred to the motor without any interference from the belt.

I can make a car as heavy or light as I want to without losing any detail from the sim, you still have load and inertia you just have a lot wider range to dial into the specific car you are driving without really having to touch the in game sliders, only one I really use is volume, I also don't run gain at 100%.

It feels more like a real car than you would imagine, not digital and not like a controller, the DD does what a real car would do, for instance you can drift in an RX and get a slide on and as the car wants to straighten up you can let the wheel go and it will flick back with no resistance and you catch it quickly.

As for lap times, I would say over the T500 it has made me a bit quicker but it is more consistency I have gained and feeling the loss of grip instantly to correct slides and not going off.

It's a 1:1 input ratio, what you do with the wheel is instantly transferred to the car you are driving, no lag, just more detail coming back while still giving inertia and load.

It's the biggest jump in hardware I have noticed besides going from T3PA Pro's to V3's with a load cell, that was a big jump also, it's a bit like trying to explain the difference between those pedals.

You have a V2.5 base which is probably the best you can get in that sector so it's hard to see where a DD wheel would take you unless you tried one, boiling it down to £££ and a DD wheel being roughly double a V2.5, does it give 100% more for your money in lap times, no it doesn't but it definitely gives you 100% more immersion in my opinion.

Olijke Poffer
25-07-2018, 08:11
Immersion comes with a price indeed. First I played on a 55inch screen which felt like, whooo.. then the Rift was bought and the immersion went from whooo to whoehieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. I have a T150 and now a fanatec CSW V2.5 and again from whooo to whoehieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. So I presume the same counts for a DD wheel but it is just a little bit to much € wise. As long as I do not win a lottery I have to stay on the Current setup but that is ok.

Charger
25-07-2018, 08:14
Immersion comes with a price indeed. First I played on a 55inch screen which felt like, whooo.. then the Rift was bought and the immersion went from whooo to whoehieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. I have a T150 and now a fanatec CSW V2.5 and again from whooo to whoehieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. So I presume the same counts for a DD wheel but it is just a little bit to much € wise. As long as I do not win a lottery I have to stay on the Current setup but that is ok.

If you think about it though the price of your T150 to a V2.5 is probably a lot more in percentage wise than going from a 2.5 to a DD wheel would be.

Olijke Poffer
25-07-2018, 08:15
If you think about it though the price of your T150 to a V2.5 is probably a lot more in percentage wise than going from a 2.5 to a DD wheel would be.
Yes of course but it have to stop somewhere of course. :very_drunk:

Charger
25-07-2018, 08:17
I found this article from Simexperience a few years back before they released their DD system, obviously marketing blah but it explains the differences better than I can.

https://simxperience.com/Community/SimXperienceDevelopersBlog/TabId/783/ArtMID/1674/ArticleID/13/Direct-Drive-vs-Belt-Drive-vs-Gear-Drive.aspx

Olijke Poffer
25-07-2018, 08:22
I do believe a DD is much better than a belt driven system. Although A belt driven system does not spoil my pleasure. Just like a movie, If you do not have seen it you won’t miss it either.

Charger
25-07-2018, 08:28
I do believe a DD is much better than a belt driven system. Although A belt driven system does not spoil my pleasure. Just like a movie, If you do not have seen it you won’t miss it either.

I totally agree, I never even entertained the idea of buying a DD wheel but it just happened.

Mascot
25-07-2018, 09:39
I do believe a DD is much better than a belt driven system. Although A belt driven system does not spoil my pleasure. Just like a movie, If you do not have seen it you won’t miss it either.

Yep, like I said earlier - ignorance is bliss..!
I can't go back to pancake racing after getting VR and I can't go back to static racing after getting a motion platform.
I used to love Pole Position on my Commodore 64 though.
HOW? By not knowing any better, lol.
:P

Charger
25-07-2018, 09:54
Yep, like I said earlier - ignorance is bliss..!
I can't go back to pancake racing after getting VR and I can't go back to static racing after getting a motion platform.
I used to love Pole Position on my Commodore 64 though.
HOW? By not knowing any better, lol.
:P

It's funny really, I tried VR but it just wasn't for me, I still prefer my triples.

Would love a motion platform though.

Oh the days of the Commodore, that was the biggest thrill I ever had getting one of those when I was 12, especially after mostly playing on the Atari, then the waiting and waiting for it to load while listening to the screech and it crashing halfway through, happy days ;-)

Olijke Poffer
25-07-2018, 10:21
I would love to race with a triple screen myself. Just want trying out a triple screen setup. I’m a GFX lover and everything on high and ultra is really awesome but a single screen setup is just no match for VR.

morpwr
25-07-2018, 11:20
Im not sure why many think there is play in the steering. There shouldn't be any or something is wrong. Most cars have rack and pinion steering which has zero play and even the modern steering boxes are so close its hard to tell the difference. Race cars have solid or much stiffer bushings(even back in the early days guys knew about this) and in lot of case use heim ends on linkage which again has no deflection. Even if they have tie rods there still would be minimal deflection. Now road cars would be a different story but modern ones wouldn't be much different. The technology has come along way.Old 50.60.70s stuff should be a little vague but still mostly direct and I think pcars does a good job with that.

Haiden
25-07-2018, 15:46
But my point was, steering in a real car is never that instantaneous, never that digital.
This 'lag' that people talk about is present in real cars. It's an analogue effect of the steering linkages and the big black rubber contact patches that interface with the road. Surely this unintended side-effect (or 'deficiency') of a belt-driven wheel actually helps to simulate that effect more realistically than a DDW ever will with its instantaneous digital response? If cars continue to have rubber tyres then steering should continue to have lag. Everyone starts fapping when they see tyre flex videos in their favourite sim, but the feel of that flex is surely what's most important?

Ok, if that were true, then why do professional team simulators--from lower end to the big team's million dollar rigs use direct drive? They have the money, engineering skill, and real world knowledge required to build something extremely realistic. It's also a requirement, because they are using it to perfect real world cars. So, if belt-drive was more realistic, why do they build their rigs with DD?

Haiden
25-07-2018, 15:52
I agree. I actually like that very (very very) slight slack my T500 and CSW 2.5 have, because of the real connection with the road(the tyres) also is a 'flexible one. I'm actually worried a bit that DD would feel too direct. A steering column should feel rubbery. In fact it's the thing I hate most about gear driven wheels like the G25. If you get wheel shake there it feels nothing like any real steering rack, way too direct(and geary to boot).

It does feel like rubber. Once I got mine dialed in, it's the most realistic feeling I've ever had. With the VR headset on, I feel like there are real rubber wheels connected to the steering column. I've never felt anything even remotely this realistic from a belt-drive. Compared to a DD, the slack in belt drives feels laggard, not realistic. I loved my V2, but after a couple weeks on the DD, when I tried the V2 again, I was like... "Uh... no thank you. Retired." :)

Olijke Poffer
25-07-2018, 16:23
I think we can come to a conclusion and say, High-end belt driven wheels are not bad by all means but a DD wheel is a few steps up.

bporion
25-07-2018, 16:55
I think we can come to a conclusion and say, High-end belt driven wheels are not bad by all means but a DD wheel is a few steps up.

and not everybody can afford the price and if you already have a fanatec wheel base that is working great why change .

morpwr
25-07-2018, 17:09
and not everybody can afford the price and if you already have a fanatec wheel base that is working great why change .

I don't think anybody says you have too change. It was more just why would you want too. Its honestly really hard to describe the differences its like trying to explain vr to someone that has never tried it. Sure you can explain some of it but you really need to try one to appreciate it.

Twinz
25-07-2018, 17:56
I wonder how much of a difference there is between new belts and old ones.

High-flow air filters generally make a *little* more power than regular paper air filters but a NEW high-flow makes a much bigger difference when compared to old paper filter clogged up with dirt and stuff.

How old/worn are the belt drives people are switching from?

morpwr
25-07-2018, 18:38
I wonder how much of a difference there is between new belts and old ones.

High-flow air filters generally make a *little* more power than regular paper air filters but a NEW high-flow makes a much bigger difference when compared to old paper filter clogged up with dirt and stuff.

How old/worn are the belt drives people are switching from?


Both of the wheels I switched form had less then a year on them.

Haiden
25-07-2018, 23:19
I wonder how much of a difference there is between new belts and old ones.

High-flow air filters generally make a *little* more power than regular paper air filters but a NEW high-flow makes a much bigger difference when compared to old paper filter clogged up with dirt and stuff.

How old/worn are the belt drives people are switching from?

A lot of the fidelity gains made over the years in belt-driven wheels came from the improvements to digital components, like sensors and software. Not saying the hardware didn't improve. I just think the digital contributed more. I think Fanatec wrung every drop of hardware sauce out of the V2 to get the 2.5.

GrimeyDog
26-07-2018, 11:10
A lot of the fidelity gains made over the years in belt-driven wheels came from the improvements to digital components, like sensors and software. Not saying the hardware didn't improve. I just think the digital contributed more. I think Fanatec wrung every drop of hardware sauce out of the V2 to get the 2.5.

Agree... the v2 felt Great but the v2.5 feels sooo Good it makes Me Really Question just how Much more feel will i really get from a DD wheel??? I guess i will know in Dec when the DD2 is delivered:o

morpwr
26-07-2018, 11:12
Agree... the v2.5 feels sooo Good it makes Me Really Question just how Much more feel will i really get from a DD wheel??? I guess i will know in Dec when the DD2 is delivered:o

Enough that you will wish you hadn't waited so long.:)

BigDad
26-07-2018, 12:37
Enough that you will wish you hadn't waited so long.:)

Sounds about the same as the why did i play on consoles for so long , lol then why didnt i get the Rift on release :p
Those two were not $ related but the expense of DD is really a luxury i think i'm going to have to live without in the short term .

I'm more keen on putting that money into a faster graphics card and then the "Rift 2.0" .

When i calculate the $ ive spent already , i need to be reasonable and just enjoy what i have and focus on things that i feel i need to upgrade .
ATM i can't max out Sims in VR so that will be my direction and even more so when/if higher res VR comes and also when i see new cards doing 30% more frames i know i'm going to be like "I need that new card" and if i've just spent $2000 on a wheel (i didnt need) i won't be able to spend more without feeling i shouldn't :(

Its all too much money too fast for my limited income ! lol

Haiden
26-07-2018, 12:58
Agree... the v2 felt Great but the v2.5 feels sooo Good it makes Me Really Question just how Much more feel will i really get from a DD wheel??? I guess i will know in Dec when the DD2 is delivered:o

It's almost like you're comparing apples to oranges. You'll understand when you get one. And even then, you'll notice the difference right away, but it'll still take a week or so for you to fully appreciate it, as new things become more and more apparent each day.

Olijke Poffer
26-07-2018, 13:09
Same with new cars. You want one so badly. Once you got one you shout the lungs out of your chest how happy you are and within a month it is all normall an the trill fades away.. on the other hand, I still have a smile from ear to ear when putting on te rift and step in a million dollar car.. that is still a awesome feeling even I’m used to it.

I’m with bigdad. Sure a DD wheel is awesome but I prefer spending my money on the 2nd gen VR before I buy a new wheel.

GrimeyDog
26-07-2018, 14:50
Same with new cars. You want one so badly. Once you got one you shout the lungs out of your chest how happy you are and within a month it is all normall an the trill fades away.. on the other hand, I still have a smile from ear to ear when putting on te rift and step in a million dollar car.. that is still a awesome feeling even I’m used to it.

I’m with bigdad. Sure a DD wheel is awesome but I prefer spending my money on the 2nd gen VR before I buy a new wheel.

How are you liking the v2.5??? IMO it really feels that Accurate/Good that I Question Just How Much More DD has to offer....Ive been saying/questioning this for Months.... upgrading from the v2 to the v2.5 there was a Clear and Notable leap forward in Subtle FFB Feel and wheel weight Balance i hope that the Step from v2.5 to the DD2 is a bigger even more Notable improvement in FFB performance and feel.

By the time 2nd Gen VR comes out My Finances will be recouped and Ready... So far Still No Official word on Next Gen GPU / VR specs or release dates...thats why i just went and did the 1080ti upgrade.

this year alone between the N1 rig, i7 7700k, 1080ti and Now DD2 wheel im already at 4k in upgrades!!! What ever else comes out if its Not a Major Leap forward im done with upgrades for Now....Maybe:plol

Olijke Poffer
26-07-2018, 16:50
Lol. Did not had the time to install it. I even did not unboxed it. :cower:
I’m on a short trip and will be back next Tuesday. I then still have 2 weeks more and do I have the time to install my new toys.

morpwr
26-07-2018, 20:16
Same with new cars. You want one so badly. Once you got one you shout the lungs out of your chest how happy you are and within a month it is all normall an the trill fades away.. on the other hand, I still have a smile from ear to ear when putting on te rift and step in a million dollar car.. that is still a awesome feeling even I’m used to it.

I’m with bigdad. Sure a DD wheel is awesome but I prefer spending my money on the 2nd gen VR before I buy a new wheel.

Im still completely enjoying the dd. I don't regret the purchase at all but I get where you guys are coming from. My pc-racer was a good wheel did I need a dd no it was just something I really wanted to try and see if it lived up to the hype.

GrimeyDog
26-07-2018, 20:37
Im still completely enjoying the dd. I don't regret the purchase at all but I get where you guys are coming from. My pc-racer was a good wheel did I need a dd no it was just something I really wanted to try and see if it lived up to the hype.

Exactly this... I too am still enjoying the v2.5 very Much...Sooo Much i dont feel i Must have a DD.. I been Contemplating saying this for months... this is why its No bother to Me that after all the waiting for Fanatec to Release their DD i still have to wait even more... but like you said i want to know for Myself if DD really lives up to the Hype.

Im Glad I waited for the Fanatec DD because all My current Fanatec Gear will work with No Need to upgrade.

morpwr
26-07-2018, 20:51
Exactly this... I too am still enjoying the v2.5 very Much...Sooo Much i dont feel i Must have a DD.. I been Contemplating saying this for months... this is why its No bother to Me that after all the waiting for Fanatec to Release their DD i still have to wait even more... but like you said i want to know for Myself if DD really lives up to the Hype.

Im Glad I waited for the Fanatec DD because all My current Fanatec Gear will work with No Need to upgrade.

Once the dd comes the wife will never get you out of the man cave.:D

morpwr
27-07-2018, 10:44
Exactly this... I too am still enjoying the v2.5 very Much...Sooo Much i dont feel i Must have a DD.. I been Contemplating saying this for months... this is why its No bother to Me that after all the waiting for Fanatec to Release their DD i still have to wait even more... but like you said i want to know for Myself if DD really lives up to the Hype.

Im Glad I waited for the Fanatec DD because all My current Fanatec Gear will work with No Need to upgrade.

Speaking of Fanatec gear ive been using the McLaren wheel a lot lately. My shoulder has been really bad this last month so figured id try it and see if it helped being smaller diameter. It did so I kept it on and im really starting to like it. Its a nice wheel especially for the money.

GrimeyDog
27-07-2018, 10:49
I really like the extra buttons on it... I use the right on wheel clutch trigger for look back. really Nice especially in VR.

The Toggle switches i use for assist on Off.

BigDad
27-07-2018, 10:53
Speaking of Fanatec gear ive been using the McLaren wheel a lot lately. My shoulder has been really bad this last month so figured id try it and see if it helped being smaller diameter. It did so I kept it on and im really starting to like it. Its a nice wheel especially for the money.

Sweet , how's it holding up with the toque from the OSW ? Seeing as the quick release only really bolts onto a plastic housing ! It does have some metal in the mount holes but its still only on the plastic surround .
I'm a little concerned even just with my CSWv2 as its really a CSL rim !

morpwr
27-07-2018, 10:53
I really like the extra buttons on it... I use the right on wheel clutch trigger for look back. really Nice especially in VR.

The Toggle switches i use for assist on Off.


Why do you need look back with vr? Don't you use the mirrors and crew chief?lol

morpwr
27-07-2018, 10:57
Sweet , how's it holding up with the toque from the OSW ? Seeing as the quick release only really bolts onto a plastic housing ! It does have some metal in the mount holes but its still only on the plastic surround .
I'm a little concerned even just with my CSWv2 as its really a CSL rim !

Great so far and its been on for at least a solid week of racing a couple hours a night. No creaks noises nothing. Ive got the same quick release that accuforce uses which is an actual automotive qr and no issues at all. Some of the things that bothered me about it at first I don't even notice anymore. Like the rocker shifter. Just takes a little getting used to because its different.

Haiden
27-07-2018, 13:08
Why do you need look back with vr? Don't you use the mirrors and crew chief?lol

I was about to ask the same. I don't use any HUD elements, just mirrors and Crew Chief. Makes cars like the McLaren 650 a challenge. I don't know why there's no rear view camera in the McLaren. :confused: I think AC even disables the look L/R and Back buttons in VR mode to force realism. I wish all sims did.

Haiden
27-07-2018, 13:12
Sweet , how's it holding up with the toque from the OSW ? Seeing as the quick release only really bolts onto a plastic housing ! It does have some metal in the mount holes but its still only on the plastic surround .
I'm a little concerned even just with my CSWv2 as its really a CSL rim !

I was wondering that, too. Barry at SRG had the same concern in his review. After taking it apart, he still wasn't really confident about long-term DD use, because the flange the QR connects to is still plastic. My main issue with it is the rubber grips. I like to race with gloves and rubber doesn't usually work well.

I think I'm going to skip the McLaren and wait for the Podium rims. From what they've shown, they are pretty high quality with magnetic shifters and clutch paddles. The GT and F1 will be in my collection soon. :)

morpwr
27-07-2018, 13:18
I was about to ask the same. I don't use any HUD elements, just mirrors and Crew Chief. Makes cars like the McLaren 650 a challenge. I don't know why there's no rear view camera in the McLaren. :confused: I think AC even disables the look L/R and Back buttons in VR mode to force realism. I wish all sims did.

Same here. I like feeling what the drivers feel with no aids. Like how some cars you have to peek around stuff like the roll bar or netting to use the mirrors or the complete lack of a rear view.

Haiden
27-07-2018, 13:21
Same here. I like feeling what the drivers feel with no aids. Like how some cars you have to peek around stuff like the roll bar or netting to use the mirrors or the complete lack of a rear view.

Exactly! It forces you to have to manage your views and maintain a higher level of situational awareness, because you have to steal glances when you can and/or listen to opponent engine sounds or crew chief. Just another realistic stress level added to the process of managing your race.:)

GrimeyDog
27-07-2018, 13:36
Why do you need look back with vr? Don't you use the mirrors and crew chief?lol

I have it assigned to the McClaren Rim Right Clutch paddle mostly just because i can... Pretty Much the same for the Toggle switches being assigned to assist on off ---> I always drive with No assist No matter weather or track temp so to assign them to the toggle switches is pretty much Moot and again just because i can just because the extra buttons are there.... I even have in Car tuning Menu mapped to the thumb stick and its Great to be able to adjust Fuel Mix/ Brake Bias etc on the Fly with a few clicks of the thumb <---I dont use it Much but because i can i like it.

Basicly Its only a few buttons i Need Ex: DRS/ Kers i map them but dont really use them in Pcar2 because cars i drive most dont have DRS/Kers but i do use them in R3E when Driving DTM cars....for Me most buttons are mapped just because they are there to Map.

I haven't used crew chief in a long while.


I was about to ask the same. I don't use any HUD elements, just mirrors and Crew Chief. Makes cars like the McLaren 650 a challenge. I don't know why there's no rear view camera in the McLaren. :confused: I think AC even disables the look L/R and Back buttons in VR mode to force realism. I wish all sims did.

I Do use the Mirrors but its just Nice to have the McClaren Rim Right Clutch Paddle to look back on the fly without having to see or think about where the button is especially for Online Racing.... I use the Left Clutch paddle to Flash Head lights <-- This can be very useful.

My Main point was/ is that the McClaren Rim is really Good because of all the extra mapable buttons.

IIRC you can assign look back in AC while in VR. I havent played it in a bit.

Haiden
27-07-2018, 13:42
I have it assigned to the Clutch paddle mostly just because i can... Pretty Much the same for the Toggle switches being assigned to assist on off ---> I always drive with No assist No matter weather or track temp so to assign them to the toggle switches is pretty much Moot.



I Do use the Mirrors but its just Nice to have the Paddle to look back on the fly without having to see or think about where the button is especially for Online Racing.... I use the Left Clutch paddle to Flash Head lights <-- This can be very useful.

IIRC you can assign look back in AC while in VR. I havent played it in a bit.

I know why you would use it, but it still feel less realistic to me and breaks the immersion.

You can assign the buttons in AC, but they don't work in VR mode. They only work in 2D.

BigDad
27-07-2018, 13:43
I was wondering that, too. Barry at SRG had the same concern in his review. After taking it apart, he still wasn't really confident about long-term DD use, because the flange the QR connects to is still plastic. My main issue with it is the rubber grips. I like to race with gloves and rubber doesn't usually work well.

I think I'm going to skip the McLaren and wait for the Podium rims. From what they've shown, they are pretty high quality with magnetic shifters and clutch paddles. The GT and F1 will be in my collection soon. :)

I think im going to have a problem when they start releasing these new F1 rims , lol , Where to store all my rims ! not a bad problem to have hey ;)

From my limited use of crew chief , he was just to monotonas saying the same things too often for my liking . It's probably been updated now and says more things ( i still have it installed) but it didnt feel real enough back then .

I mostly use no HUD but have it mapped to be able to put it on for cars that don't have Motec .

I use a bit of ABS in rF2 until my tyres are warm just because flat spotting tyres is so easy and soo very painful but once tyres are warm i click it off for the most part .
All other Sims i go aids off generally .

pC2 was supposed to have flat spotting but i still haven't found a car with it working and to my surprise AC seems to have added it !

Back on topic , how many days left G Dog ? lol do you have a calendar and putting a big red X on each day as it passes :p i know i would but id also be going mad waiting .

GrimeyDog
27-07-2018, 14:22
I'm really looking forward to Dec 7 when the Base is shipped... But i can wait because the v2.5 is really Good.... I Never tried a DD before so i dont know what im Missing:o Nope even if i had a chance to try DD right Now i wouldnt because then i would really get impatient for the DD2 to get here:p

GrimeyDog
27-07-2018, 14:28
BigDad you stay more current on Tec than I do... Is there any News on Next Gen GPU, CPU or VR????

Haiden
27-07-2018, 14:41
I think im going to have a problem when they start releasing these new F1 rims , lol , Where to store all my rims ! not a bad problem to have hey ;)

From my limited use of crew chief , he was just to monotonas saying the same things too often for my liking . It's probably been updated now and says more things ( i still have it installed) but it didnt feel real enough back then .

It has been updated a lot. There's a lot more variety in the messages he plays, but I agree he talks a bit too much with the default settings. You can go into the options, and just change lower the frequency of certain messages. I turned the compliments and encouragement down quite a bit. So I basically only get important sector and gap information now at certain points. If I need other info, I just use the push to talk to ask for it.

It also helps if you select a different voice profile for your spotter. That makes it a lot better, because sector and gap info come from one person, but spotter calls from another. :)

Haiden
27-07-2018, 14:41
BigDad you stay more current on Tec than I do... Is there any News on Next Gen GPU, CPU or VR????

Don't know about CPU or VR, but the 1100 series GPU I believe are expected around September.

GrimeyDog
27-07-2018, 18:36
Don't know about CPU or VR, but the 1100 series GPU I believe are expected around September.

I prob wont upgrade GPU again untill the Next Gen VR launches or the 11ti series comes out --> but if the 11 seires GPU is a signifigant performance increase +30% or more then i will upgrade right away.

IMO VR performance is Great for 1st Gen VR... i think the biggest prob with VR is Game Devs are still in the learning curve about how to optimize Games for best VR performance...Once they get the VR programming right it will get even better... More power is Not always the answer Even with the most powerful GPU,CPU if the Game programming aint right all the CPU/GPU muscle is for Nada.

BigDad
27-07-2018, 20:34
BigDad you stay more current on Tec than I do... Is there any News on Next Gen GPU, CPU or VR????

Grr , its all just romour and speculation ! Its all starting to shit me , lol everytime I play rF2 I still need to be mindful that my GPU is holding me back on certain tracks ( thats more S397's fault) but more processing power would just brute force a higher framerate .
I won't jump on the 80 series and again wait for the Ti , id be more than happy to get another year out of my next Ti like I did with this but I really need a 50% performance increase for that to happen .
Hopefully they will have refined the process by then and drop to 7nm where we will see significant performance increase over the almost certain 12nm coming .
There not going to be easy to get your hands on a release so prices will be inflated again so waiting will be in order anyway .

Haiden
27-07-2018, 20:49
I prob wont upgrade GPU again untill the Next Gen VR launches or the 11ti series comes out --> but if the 11 seires GPU is a signifigant performance increase +30% or more then i will upgrade right away.

IMO VR performance is Great for 1st Gen VR... i think the biggest prob with VR is Game Devs are still in the learning curve about how to optimize Games for best VR performance...Once they get the VR programming right it will get even better... More power is Not always the answer Even with the most powerful GPU,CPU if the Game programming aint right all the CPU/GPU muscle is for Nada.

I agree. The performance I'm getting right now is fine. Until a new title comes out that changes that. I don't see the point in upgrading.

inthebagbud
15-03-2019, 18:55
Confirmed shipment on 30/04/2019....countdown begins

https://www.fanatec.com/forum/discussion/632/podium-series-status-update-shipments-begin-next-month-first-batch-stock-almost-sold-out#Item_2

Asturbo
15-03-2019, 19:07
Yes, that's great. I can't wait. Hope it works fine with PC2

inthebagbud
15-03-2019, 20:30
Yes, that's great. I can't wait. Hope it works fine with PC2

I'm sure I saw a list that confirmed compatibility of PC2 - but as always cant find it now!

It "has" to be tested with all current games and there is this comment on website


"Full Fanatec SDK support ensures game compatibility out of the box for all major racing games across all platforms, including those which only support one controller"

Asturbo
31-03-2019, 09:42
Refernces to iRacing, AC & GTS, but no info about PC2 in their new video: https://youtu.be/gSgOEJTxIC4?t=237

Probably no native support until next game but hope it works as a standart CSW base.

Maurice Boeschen
31-03-2019, 10:13
Refernces to iRacing, AC & GTS, but no info about PC2 in their new video: https://youtu.be/gSgOEJTxIC4?t=237

Probably no native support until next game but hope it works as a standart CSW base.

Yes it will work as a CSW because the Podium DDs have a CSW v2.5 compatibility Mode so EVERY game which supports the CSW v2.5 WILL work just fine with the DD in Comp. Mode. However, in pC2 you always can create a custom wheel setup, also in PC mode.
Comp. Mode however has NO disadvantages at all, Torque output wont be restricted to CSW level or anything else so for all EOL games like pC2 you cant go wrong with Comp. Mode :)

inthebagbud
31-03-2019, 11:19
Fanatec site says ( my highlighting)


Introducing the new Podium software for PC applications to tweak any parameters on the fly

Connect external devices to network for displaying telemetry data like speed, lap times, brake temperatures, tachometers and more.
Supports all major PC racing simulators like F1 2017, Dirt Rally, Assetto Corsa, Project Cars 2 and rFactor 2.
Control your Upgraded Fanatec Tuning Menu settings and presets directly from the software.
Save game specific settings to PC software, which will be applied when the game is launched.
Introducing new FFB tuning features like speed sensitive dampening.

rich1e I
31-03-2019, 13:14
There's some kind of friendship or loose partnership between Fanatec and Kunos. In Fact, Kunos are using Fanatec equipment at the Simracing Expo and most probably at any other exhibition they're presenting their games, so it's no surprise the Fanatec guys and gals are being loyal to their friends not promoting the competition in their product presentations.

Sankyo
01-04-2019, 09:06
There's some kind of friendship or loose partnership between Fanatec and Kunos. In Fact, Kunos are using Fanatec equipment at the Simracing Expo and most probably at any other exhibition they're presenting their games, so it's no surprise the Fanatec guys and gals are being loyal to their friends not promoting the competition in their product presentations.
There may be a natural bias in the advertising when a particular game/developer uses the hardware a lot, but Fanatec has no bias or loyalty to a specific game or developer. It would be commercial suicide to do so.

rich1e I
01-04-2019, 13:39
There may be a natural bias in the advertising when a particular game/developer uses the hardware a lot, but Fanatec has no bias or loyalty to a specific game or developer. It would be commercial suicide to do so.

Maybe the word 'loyalty' is a bit too strong, yes. To me they're clearly biased. SimRacingGirl was using AC a lot before she started working for Fanatec and she also got invited by Kunos to different events, so it's also normal once you established a personal relationship. Anyways, I think if you have a few seconds to show some ingame footage in a video and you choose iRacing, AC and GT Sport there must be some kind of reasoning behind it.

Invincible
04-04-2019, 05:52
There's some kind of friendship or loose partnership between Fanatec and Kunos. In Fact, Kunos are using Fanatec equipment at the Simracing Expo and most probably at any other exhibition they're presenting their games, so it's no surprise the Fanatec guys and gals are being loyal to their friends not promoting the competition in their product presentations.

Fanatec partnered up with SMS / Project Cars 2 for the Simracing Expo to show off their Podium prototypes in 2017... so there is that. And when SMS held an event, they used Fanatec equipment, afaik.

rich1e I
04-04-2019, 17:40
Fanatec partnered up with SMS / Project Cars 2 for the Simracing Expo to show off their Podium prototypes in 2017... so there is that. And when SMS held an event, they used Fanatec equipment, afaik.

That may well be and still they're a bit biased in my view. I also may well be wrong, I don't know.

Asturbo
17-04-2019, 22:29
Looks they are delivering first units of the DD bases.

Fingers crossed...

PS: Unboxing of the PS4 version: https://youtu.be/0A1IlUqe_dY

inthebagbud
17-04-2019, 23:01
Looks they are delivering first units of the DD bases.

Fingers crossed...

PS: Unboxing of the PS4 version: https://youtu.be/0A1IlUqe_dY

yep fanatec blog says all units should be received before or on the 30th, hopefully before as im away from 30th for a week !

Charger
18-04-2019, 00:23
INB4 multiple house fire insurance claims :-)

Christiaan van Beilen
18-04-2019, 00:45
Looks they are delivering first units of the DD bases.

Fingers crossed...

PS: Unboxing of the PS4 version: https://youtu.be/0A1IlUqe_dY

Love the way they boxed it and the blue doesn't look half as bad (in my humble opinion) as it came out in the product shots on the product page. I guess natural lighting does wonders sometimes.

I wouldn't mind buying one if I could miss the money, albeit I still don't have a current gen console and the PS5 is already rumored to be around the corner... and how will wheel compatibility fair with that new generation Playstation? As in... here we go again with the compatibility rollercoaster! :(

Asturbo
18-04-2019, 09:47
Fanatec boxings are awesome, and yes the blue F1 rim looks better IRL.

Another video with the unboxing and initial setup: https://youtu.be/8ohOYdqAgGA

transfix
18-04-2019, 10:29
The only issue is that with no further support for PCars2 these new wheels and bases are not supported on console. I have the new Formula V2 Wheel and can’t use it as it shows up as a Thrustmaster / Xbox One Steering Wheel. So I assume this might be the same problem. Not long to wait before I can test it out.
Fingers crossed

Asturbo
18-04-2019, 10:41
You can configure the DD base as CSW 2.5 so it must work with XBOX with a compatible rim.
Different is the button assigment of the newest rims that will not be recognized natively in the game. But this will happen the same with previous bases.

wyldanimal
18-04-2019, 14:42
Love the way they boxed it and the blue doesn't look half as bad (in my humble opinion) as it came out in the product shots on the product page. I guess natural lighting does wonders sometimes.

I wouldn't mind buying one if I could miss the money, albeit I still don't have a current gen console and the PS5 is already rumored to be around the corner... and how will wheel compatibility fair with that new generation Playstation? As in... here we go again with the compatibility rollercoaster! :(

There was just a lot of PS5 info released..
Q1 of 2020 targeted release
8K @60 FPS or 4K @120 FPS
3D sound, Live Ray Tracing
It WILL support physical Gaming Media. ( a Disc Slot )

It will be Backward compatible with PS4 games and Peripherals, including PSVR
So to me, that also Means PS4 wheels will work.