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Bliman
30-12-2018, 22:48
I still play Project Cars2 and I really love it. I have been away for a little while (didn't play other games also), but now I am still playing it because a friend of mine is challenging me in Time Trial. And boy this game is good.
Now I know there are a lot of bugs in the game, and that's the point of my post.
Project Cars is a young series and has accomplished a lot in little time. Now for the first game the sales were very good.
But gamers were left with a bitter taste by the bugs in the game. Then Project Cars 2 came out and I don't think it sell as good as the first one (I don't know for sure).
Now I know the studio is not a big one, my question is if SMS can survive this (I know they will bring PC3 but are they ok)?
To me it is sad that Gran Turismo and Forza sell so well and Project Cars not. I really really hope that they don't make the simulator simpler, I want them to really focus on the simulator side and push it.
The problem to me is that the more complex something is the more chance for bugs, but if you don't push enough you get the oh it is basically Project Cars 2.5 without the bugs.
So my question is how do you minimize the bugs and still continue be on the edge, and if there is something we gamers can do? How can they minimize the bugs so that the only one that pops up are small one?
When I look at for example DCS flight simulator they keep bringing out amazing stuff after amazing stuff (I still don't own it). With something that is also highly complex. Is there something you guys can learn from them?
My question also is why some of these bugs aren't noticed in the testing, some of these things are noticed by gamers in the first hour.
This is a post because I hold Project Cars deep in my heart (basically the only thing I play, and my backlog of games keep growing) and I want this simulator series go in an upward curve, so they get the attention they deserve from the sim community which in itself is already pretty small.

hkraft300
30-12-2018, 23:29
Well the pc1 to 2 jump was significant.
I don't know how they'd top that.
A "2.5" on new gen platforms, with polished and slightly improved physics will easily pass for a sequel.
That said : they have the Pro version going. If the 3 gets the hand-me-down tech from the pro I think it'll be a riot.
Fret not, fellow fan. I think we're in for a treat across all titles in the coming age :)

Bliman
31-12-2018, 00:04
Yeah I wish them to do very well.
I just want them to go from strength to strength. Maybe what I am saying is that there has to be some positive vibe.
Like I said I love airplanes (have been going to airshows my entire life) and there seems to be such a positive vibe in that DCS community and story and game.
Then I come here and I see such such thread like "I am disappointed with Project Cars, etc...). And all I hear are bugs bugs bugs.
I look at the youtube channel of Jardier which is a very good sim driver and I also see sometimes these bugs and connection issues. And this saddens me because I think with a push here and there (I wish it was this simple I know) this sim would rule even more.
To me (I could be wrong of course) it feels like there is something holding them back, not in pushing the envelope but in delivering without major bugs.
Maybe it all comes down to how healthy the situation is (I don't have the numbers), if they sold well enough in Project Cars 2 because they are very talented and deserve to grow.
I hope this all made a bit of sense.
If not then take this away: I wish all the people who post here and whole the team a great new year with plenty of fun and health.

Sentry87
31-12-2018, 03:49
I would say early access beta like ACC but that might alienate the console crowd such as myself. Me myself I wouldn't mind

hkraft300
31-12-2018, 06:44
I wouldn't either.
I'd just froth for it over months and months over the sim racing pornogrpahy the beta produces.

SunnySunday
31-12-2018, 09:28
Well the whole development of project cars have been a "early access" type of thing where the community have played early builds from the start. It just hasn't been released as an early access title on Steam if that's what you meant

Chimildo
31-12-2018, 09:37
I know I’m the odd one, but I don’t think that there has been any really significant bugs that have hampered my game play and I really like PCARS 2 but I feel a bit let down that after a year they just drop it. Would they not learn anything for number 3 if they keep trying to make better what they have. Some more DLC would be nice

ELAhrairah
31-12-2018, 10:12
I spoke with many console owners in my family and friends. All of them were positive about Pcars 2. They respected the time the devs put in the physics engine so that console owners could enjoy a proper race sim. But their criticism is also without exemption the same : the game play bugs. That made most of them stop playing it. And a few even sold the game. They were fed up with lost career progress etc.
My personal opinion is that Pcars 2 shouldn't be released on every system simultaniously. For a tiny studio like SMS it is impossible. It will never reach its full potential. Always half succeed or half fail.
They should release the game for one system, get it completely right and then start porting the game to other systems.
The way Pcars2 was launched could've been done better.
My second problem with Pcars2 is that it lacks soul. To atract the highly lucrative console market the devs should've made a better story line in career mode. It's way to simply and dry the way it is now. Sure the serious online sim racer wouldn't care less but if you target the console market you better dress the game up. Just look at the F1 game series.

David Wright
31-12-2018, 10:26
While PC2 probably didn't sell as well as PC1, PC1 sold really well, and I don't think PC2 needed to sell as well to be a commercial success. For a start, on PC at least, PC2 was sold at a higher price than PC1. Ian Bell said the break even point for PC2 was 700,000 sales and I'm certain its done better than that. It sold 265,000 on PC alone in the first 9 months. Finally, the announcement of PC3 is a good indication PC2 was a commercial success.

However, I agree Project Cars reputation for bugs must be a concern. And though we have had a couple of small patches since the last major one in September, it does seem that they have given up. One thing is once you get that kind of reputation - unexplained issues are put down to bugs when in reality they might not be. Watching Jardier's AOR stream at Le Mans he felt others were cutting the track and not being penalised which he felt was a bug. While the cut track system in PC2 is frustrating, I'm dubious people were cutting the track and not being penalised. In another Jardier AOR stream there was a mass-disconnection during the race. Now AORs other league running at the same time suffered the same issue at the same time, indicating it might be an external issue. Indeed the AOR officials put it down to a steam issue but once a game gets a reputation for bugs you can bet the game will be blamed. I have watched loads of GamerMuscle streams where the AC server has crashed but somehow AC seems to have escaped criticism. Having said that, I'm certainly not saying PC2 doesn't have bugs. Watching AORs own PC2 streams in director mode shows strange shadowy blobs on the track during night races and other visual issues which really let the game down.

John Hargreaves
31-12-2018, 12:18
When I look at for example DCS flight simulator they keep bringing out amazing stuff after amazing stuff (I still don't own it). With something that is also highly complex. Is there something you guys can learn from them?


Not sure DCS is a good example to use. It's still in beta, as are most of the (very expensive) DLC modules. It doesn't take advantage of multi core cpus and if you spend any time on their forum, you will find plenty of people having all sorts of issues. Don't get me wrong, it's a great and very ambitious piece of work, but in terms of anyone learning from anyone about a complex physics based simulation that takes full advantage of modern hardware, it would be the other way round in my opinion.

Bliman
31-12-2018, 13:47
Not sure DCS is a good example to use. It's still in beta, as are most of the (very expensive) DLC modules. It doesn't take advantage of multi core cpus and if you spend any time on their forum, you will find plenty of people having all sorts of issues. Don't get me wrong, it's a great and very ambitious piece of work, but in terms of anyone learning from anyone about a complex physics based simulation that takes full advantage of modern hardware, it would be the other way round in my opinion.

That could be very well be. But I still feel there is a positive vibe with DCS that is missing from Project Cars. Maybe it is because it has not much competition but they also get credit to deliver and keep their fans happy. And that is not simple with such a narrow and highly knowledgeable fanbase.
And I don't mean that SMS could technical learn from them (you can always learn of course) but maybe from their structure or something.
What I find is their fans have no problem to shell much money at the planes. They seem to like it, but I think this is because a plane is much more complex with the buttons so it seems you get more from your money then a car.
Now I don't want to glorify DCS to much because it will have problems for sure, but I bought Flaming Cliffs 2 and A10 many years ago and it was a positive experience. And such things stick.
That's the problem that Project Cars has and that's it's reputation. It is a fight that is very important to have in such a small market I think. Once you have bugs or inconsistent penalty system you get very close that they will question everything in the simulation (from tyre physics, etc...) it creates a slippery slope. Then it is very important that you test the new features very hard like the track system in the rain.
I really don't know the solution to all this. For me to make it a story game is very hard to do. Maybe you could create historical situations with context , like for example this driver (famous driver) became a star driver by taking this bad car to the top in Monaco making him a star. Now you have races which are just races with no goal. But this is maybe good for another thread.
I feel they are very close to nailing it even with all the consoles but the thing they lack (stable base, no connection issues,time trial problems, etc...) are hurting them very bad.
I just want them to grow and grow (because I love their vision from the first trailer I saw of Project Cars).
Maybe when I think of it maybe they need some kind of Project Cars 2.5 where they don't do anything revolutionary (they have pushed the envelope so much) but keep polishing this diamond.
Maybe that's why it is sad that they didn't use this game to do that and work silently at the background for Project Cars 2.

hkraft300
31-12-2018, 14:08
Oh you think the vibes are bad in this forum?
In every other site/forum/platform, pc2 is a dirty secret and its praise is only whispered in private messages.

Twinz
31-12-2018, 14:56
People who enjoy a product...enjoy the product. The usually don't bother searching for a forum, creating an account, and starting threads on how much they enjoy the product. (Although I do see it happen occasionally)

Go to any car forum, pretty much any car form, and look at the threads....you will get the impression that the car breaks all the time, is plagued with recalls, and generally just junk.

A happy customer will tell a friend. An unhappy customer will tell the world.

Bliman
31-12-2018, 15:00
Oh you think the vibes are bad in this forum?
In every other site/forum/platform, pc2 is a dirty secret and its praise is only whispered in private messages.

To be honest I don't visit many game forums. But yeah I find it has a negative vibe.
Maybe I give to much weight to the negative comments and threads (a bad character trait of me). To me it seems like it is not ok to find Project Cars 2 great. It is always with a but. Like yeah it is fun but it isn't a sim, yes it has potential but is flawed, Project bugs, etc...
Maybe I am just to negative (not the first time someone says that to me), it is just if I connect myself to something then I want it to succeed.

Bliman
31-12-2018, 15:02
People who enjoy a product...enjoy the product. The usually don't bother searching for a forum, creating an account, and starting threads on how much they enjoy the product. (Although I do see it happen occasionally)

Go to any car forum, pretty much any car form, and look at the threads....you will get the impression that the car breaks all the time, is plagued with recalls, and generally just junk.

A happy customer will tell a friend. An unhappy customer will tell the world.

Yeah that is true. I am just more sensitive to that because I feel more connected to the game. But yeah you are right.

John Hargreaves
31-12-2018, 15:25
A lot of people have worked very hard to make those negative vibes and create this 'pCARS is bugged' 'reputation' :confused:

I don't think overall this game is any more buggy than most modern titles across all genres. I know people seem to have more trouble with multiplayer, I'm more of an offline player and in my experience pC2 has been rock solid. Personally I think it's best to make up your own mind based on experience.

sas5320
31-12-2018, 16:37
^do you race offline with AI in mixed weather? How do you claim "Rock solid" when we know Live track does not affect the AI? For me this renders Livetrack useless as an offline player.

David Wright
31-12-2018, 17:11
^do you race offline with AI in mixed weather? How do you claim "Rock solid" when we know Live track does not affect the AI? For me this renders Livetrack useless as an offline player.

In what sense doesn't livetrack affect the AI? The AI are affected by a wet track for example.

morpwr
31-12-2018, 17:47
To be honest I don't visit many game forums. But yeah I find it has a negative vibe.
Maybe I give to much weight to the negative comments and threads (a bad character trait of me). To me it seems like it is not ok to find Project Cars 2 great. It is always with a but. Like yeah it is fun but it isn't a sim, yes it has potential but is flawed, Project bugs, etc...
Maybe I am just to negative (not the first time someone says that to me), it is just if I connect myself to something then I want it to succeed.


They all do. Check out some of the other sim forums if you think this ones bad. Sim racers are a funny bunch because most pick one sim and every other one sucks. Many of us here do play other ones and openly talk about it here. So id just ignore what you read in other forums or even here and make up your own mind. If you need help with anything there is a group of people here that are always willing to help.

Bliman
31-12-2018, 17:55
They all do. Check out some of the other sim forums if you think this ones bad. Sim racers are a funny bunch because most pick one sim and every other one sucks. Many of us here do play other ones and openly talk about it here. So id just ignore what you read in other forums or even here and make up your own mind. If you need help with anything there is a group of people here that are always willing to help.

Yeah I was a little triggered (it was slumbering a bit) that Project Cars 2 sold so bad. But maybe that isn't true.
I hope everything is in a healthy situation on the finance side. Because it would be sad to see such a developer go down or that they have to scale back to sell more copies. With that I mean make the simulation simpler to push the graphics side so that you can compete with GranTurismo and Forza. I want them to stay true to their roots.

ELAhrairah
31-12-2018, 18:05
To be honest I've mentioned a few times in general forums about racing and even during chats at live racing events how much I enjoyed pcars2 and I was greeted with a salute of how bad pcars1 was, how buggy Pcars2 was at release etc.

morpwr
31-12-2018, 18:16
Yeah I was a little triggered (it was slumbering a bit) that Project Cars 2 sold so bad. But maybe that isn't true.
I hope everything is in a healthy situation on the finance side. Because it would be sad to see such a developer go down or that they have to scale back to sell more copies. With that I mean make the simulation simpler to push the graphics side so that you can compete with GranTurismo and Forza. I want them to stay true to their roots.

You have to remember what PCARS1 brought too. It had so many things that hadn't been done before or as well that everyone wanted it. Most other sims are playing catch up right now with the things 1 and 2 brought. So pcars2 didn't have the same initial draw as PCARS1. Not that it sold bad just different. I don't think you have to worry about them dumbing it down if anything id expect just the opposite from SMS.

PostBox981
01-01-2019, 11:01
To be honest I've mentioned a few times in general forums about racing and even during chats at live racing events how much I enjoyed pcars2 and I was greeted with a salute of how bad pcars1 was, how buggy Pcars2 was at release etc.

I too believe people are biased to their favourite racing game and thatīs why PC2 keeps having a bad reputation in many peopleīs minds. For example, I love watching Jimmy Broadbent, but he usually uses AC or sometimes iRacing, and if I am not mistaken he openly said he doesnīt like PC2 very well. Thatīs (I believe) because AC was first and he knows his way in the menus.

Being a WMD2 member, I guess I am biased too. As an adult person though I am able to compare all current racing games/sims in a neutral way. Doing so, the result is that we
- have some great official content regarding cars as well as tracks,
- have Live Track 3.0, bringing us permanently changing track conditions, constantly changing water levels in the rain, working and constantly changing puddles. Start a light rain session five times and you will get five different starting conditions,
- were probably the first to have rain as well as night racing, others catching up now,
- have seasons and even snowy roads,
- have the best working HUD in my personal opinion.
Finally reading Caseyīs DLC posts you see that this is a real simulation diving deep into physics calculations.

Having said all this, I donīt think that most biased people will ever leave their personal comfort zone and go deep enough into PC2 to realise what a gem this is. Seeing the hype when ACC came along with finally having rain and night racing was just rediculous, keeping in mind that even PC1 already had both.

Jurld
01-01-2019, 11:22
I love PC2, but TBH, I am going to continue my bitching and moaning until *somebody* puts out Grand Prix Legends 2 and/or a decent oval track simulator that doesn't cost ~300 USD plus a monthly sub to get all the cars/tracks.

Twinz
01-01-2019, 13:11
I would like to see the ability to run one-card-per-eye in VR. I thought I read news about an API for that a few months ago, but have not seen any games actually implementing it.

I am doing my next build with a 1000w PSU, just in case.

Konan
01-01-2019, 15:10
Have you guys seen this:

http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?65126-The-Future-of-Project-Cars&p=1554413&viewfull=1#post1554413

PostBox981
01-01-2019, 15:49
Have you guys seen this:

http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?65126-The-Future-of-Project-Cars&p=1554413&viewfull=1#post1554413
Yes, I did, thanks for pointing it out again. Not sure what to think about it, sharing some concerns about what kind of game PC3 will be. Maybe too early for any concerns so I will creep back under my stone and patiently wait for some more information.

Konan
01-01-2019, 15:51
Yeah i can understand some people getting worried but as long as there are no more details released there is really no need to IMHO

cpcdem
01-01-2019, 15:55
He did post some more details/clarifications, answering to some questions. It sounds even better now :)

PostBox981
01-01-2019, 15:56
He did post some more details/clarifications, answering to some questions. It sounds even better now :)
Link? I donīt follow that other forum. Thanks. :)

cpcdem
01-01-2019, 15:59
Link? I donīt follow that other forum. Thanks. :)

Here you go :)

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/slightly-mad-studios-confirms-new-project-cars-title-is-in-development.383838/page-6#post-12590713
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/slightly-mad-studios-confirms-new-project-cars-title-is-in-development.383838/page-6#post-12590735

PostBox981
01-01-2019, 16:01
Here you go :)

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/slightly-mad-studios-confirms-new-project-cars-title-is-in-development.383838/page-6#post-12590713
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/slightly-mad-studios-confirms-new-project-cars-title-is-in-development.383838/page-6#post-12590735
Thanks mate. Off for reading... :yes:

Konan
01-01-2019, 16:09
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/slightly-mad-studios-confirms-new-project-cars-title-is-in-development.383838/page-6#post-12590712

Konan
01-01-2019, 16:10
Damn...Ninja'd lol

PostBox981
01-01-2019, 16:18
Damn...Ninja'd lol
No īlikeī for you this time. :p

Cladandadum
01-01-2019, 16:24
Is there a reason why Ian doesn't post on this forum anymore? I think I may have missed something?

Konan
01-01-2019, 16:34
Because of the way he's being "welcomed" sometimes over here.

Cladandadum
01-01-2019, 16:36
Makes sense. Shame that the minority ruin it for everyone else.

Bliman
01-01-2019, 17:37
Have you guys seen this:

http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?65126-The-Future-of-Project-Cars&p=1554413&viewfull=1#post1554413
I will be honest. I looked at the thread "the future of PC" and I saw the Shift reference and it felt very bad.
It is one of the reasons I started the thread "I didn't read the other thread", what a coincidence. It was that Project Cars would go off the path of it's roots and would water it down in search of easier success in the the more arcadey market to search for more customers and more money, because they got burned with Project Cars2.
IMHO that is a mistake, the market where PC2 is in is a small market but it is a very loyal market if you get it right. That is not the case in the more arcadey market. The reason why PC2 wasn't a success is IMO about the bugs and that it wasn't polished enough. The game wasn't ready enough. And that hurts because the first PC had the same thing.
To me it seems like SMS is making the same mistake again and trying something different again. To me it spells of more trouble because you will try to cater to different markets and fail to capture any of them. They have to realize that the Forza players will be Forza players and GranTurismo players will be GranTurismo players. They will only come to Project Cars because Project Cars will give them something different and that is simulation at it's finest.
I of course must wait maybe it will be brilliant and it will be a great simulation, and that Mr Bell means that they will recreate motorsport finer and better, with real marshalls with flags for example or safety cars, etc... and not upgrading the car or fiction or cinematic movies (which don't really pull you in the action). So for now it is wait and see but for the little I heard talk about it is very worrisome. I really hope that they know what there customers want.
One last thing what does that mean "make the game less sandbox"?

sas5320
01-01-2019, 19:07
Because of the way he's being "welcomed" sometimes over here.

Weakest excuse I've heard this year, but it's still early in 2019!

cpcdem
01-01-2019, 19:12
Why is it worrying if it will have an "arcadey"/fun career on top of everything else, while keeping the simulation car handling, especially if that brings more sales, so more development/polish resources?

I think it's a win win situation for everybody, it will be great for those wanting such a career and like to have a sense of progression, it will be great for online only players who do not care about the career anyway, since they will lose nothing, great for those who do time trial, great for people who want to do random offline races at various weather conditions, since I assume this will remain as well. And if it also includes a custom offline championship, then I am guessing that EVERYBODY will be happy :)

And they do realize the problems with the bugs, see the "not biting off more than we can properly chew and digest" part of the message and the bit about sub optimal design decisions. In my mind this means lesson learned, even if the same/similar problems did happen twice, I am now confident that it will be third time's a charm! :) Only thing I am still very disappointed is that still they will not fix PCARS2 multiplayer now, but I guess you cannot have all in life...

Konan
01-01-2019, 20:08
Weakest excuse I've heard this year, but it's still early in 2019!

It's not an excuse... It's the sad truth...

... Which you just helped proven...

Keena
01-01-2019, 20:32
Lets hope Crew Chief and its very able creator get the recognition they clearly warrant. That app is frankly astounding.

David Wright
01-01-2019, 20:37
One last thing what does that mean "make the game less sandbox"?

Sandbox usually refers to the freedom sims have traditionally had in that they present you with a variety of cars and tracks and you decide what you do with them. Even though pCARs2 has a career mode it is completely optional and even the career mode presents you with multiple paths and options. With Shift if I recall correctly you start with the basic cars and work your way up to the more difficult cars. You still had some choice but to progress in the game you had to take part in the career.

While career modes are typically disliked by traditional sim racers, that "king of sims" iRacing effectively has a compulsory career mode where you have to start with the easiest cars and earn points to move up to the more difficult cars.

Keena
01-01-2019, 20:44
I do think having to work for something makes it more rewarding. I recently had a bash at F1 2017 again during a hiatus from PC2 and did a Sauber career. My first point meant more to me from an emotional point of view than many race wins in my PC2 career because it was something I had bought into and become immersed in. As a predominantly offline player, immersion and suspension of disbelief are key, and I need to feel invested in the success or failure of the career that Im living when I pkay the game. Im far to old, fat, slow and unfit to do it any other way ;)

Bliman
01-01-2019, 23:19
The way I see it is that with Project Cars 1 and also 2 is that their ambition was greater then the team could cope.
This created a situation where you have a diamond in your hands but one that is hard to reach with all the bugs. I don't want to say they have a bad team because they have a team that puts many many to shame.
The first time I saw Project Cars I knew it was something for me, a real love for the sport. They had the right cars and the same mindset as me. Now the controls were terrible for me with a gamepad but I still believed in them and I had much fun with Project Cars2 (the first time I found out how it handled with a gamepad I thought to myself "now we can fight".
I started single player but it became boring very quick. So in that sense I would love if you have something to fight for.
But I fear that their ambition will bite them once again, but maybe the team has grown bigger.
And I hope they can carve a path where their ambition is 100 % in the simulation camp and not anything like rally or something like that. I don't want any upgrade cars or fake slides, etc...
I would rather see that they grow naturally. With that I meani is first see that whole the game works like a clock from single player to multiplayer. Introduce more realistic racing things like for example better AI, better penalty system ,safety car, better integrated series, marshalls by the side, something like crewchief but better, etc... If those things are implented well then you can look if you can see if you can integrate these things to create something more organic. Create championships that has drivers that are realistic. I agree that the career is bonedry and needs much much work.
I want them to stay wholy in the autosport side and don't want to insert fake things, like for example a formula race in the championship in the snow or in so much rain that you are faster with a boat, or you get drifting that is removed from reality or upgrading or that stuff. I would be pleased if they would learn drivers how to tune their car and with tests let them learn the difference between the settings of the car and give good feedback with Telemetry and such.
So like I allready said we have to wait and see but I don't trust it. But if they nail it I would buy it in an instant again.

BrunoB
02-01-2019, 19:21
They have to realize that the Forza players will be Forza players and GranTurismo players will be GranTurismo players. They will only come to Project Cars because Project Cars will give them something different and that is simulation at it's finest.
What is wrong with such kind of reasoning is (IMO) that your Forza and GranTurismo players are not much interested in simulations.:cool:

Bliman
02-01-2019, 20:45
What is wrong with such kind of reasoning is (IMO) that your Forza and GranTurismo players are not much interested in simulations.:cool:

Then in the same way I think that PC2 players are not Forza or GranTurismo players (I rather see those players evolve to Project Cars then vice versa). Therefore it is important to know who your customers are. If you start to alienate your core market in the hope to cater more for the casual player then you risk of catching none of the two.
Again it depends what Mr Bell's statements mean. So for that we have to wait till more comes clear.

DECATUR PLAYA
02-01-2019, 21:28
Sandbox usually refers to the freedom sims have traditionally had in that they present you with a variety of cars and tracks and you decide what you do with them. Even though pCARs2 has a career mode it is completely optional and even the career mode presents you with multiple paths and options. With Shift if I recall correctly you start with the basic cars and work your way up to the more difficult cars. You still had some choice but to progress in the game you had to take part in the career.

While career modes are typically disliked by traditional sim racers, that "king of sims" iRacing effectively has a compulsory career mode where you have to start with the easiest cars and earn points to move up to the more difficult cars.

The open sandbox did not work in multiplayer either. I love the open sandbox concept as a way to play but it just does not work well especially on console where guys are used to game modes.

One of the big reasons that GT3 gets played so much in PCars is because the experienced lobby host know that there has to be some common ground for players to play. One of the biggest drawbacks of PCars is that there are so many options (deep options) that you could have 20 GT3 rooms up in the browser all of which can play a different way because of the options at hand. I have had many days where I searched the browser and saw 30 rooms up none of which that I wanted to play in because I didnt like the car or race options. Some more structure in this way would be good. I dont want to lose the open sandbox but would like to see better structure maybe in the form of better presets or esports options.

I do not want grinding. Leave grinding for the other games. A form of achievement would be good for single player but not grinding.

Urban Chaos 2.0
02-01-2019, 21:49
Because of the way he's being "welcomed" sometimes over here.

Seriously, just ban the nutjobs. What the hell gives? A minority of nutjobs come here with their fake accounts bashing Project Cars (by pretending to have problems with the game), while low-key or blatantly advertising garbage like Assetto Corsa and iRacing. If you criticise AC or iRacing in the least on their forums or social media pages, THEY BAN YOU! Yet their nutjob shills have free reign on this forum and the facebook page. Ian can't start playing victim, and moderators like Konan can't start defending such victimhood. When the AC and iRacing trolls are told to shove their B.S. up that spot from which it came, moderators are the first to start telling folks to stop. Yet the consequence of letting such Asinine shills to deposit their faeces amongst decent folk, gives the mods a reason to start saying 'Ian isn't feeling welcomed'. Hah! IT'S HIS FORUM!!!!


Makes sense. Shame that the minority ruin it for everyone else.

It is a shame. Ban them.

hkraft300
02-01-2019, 22:03
The mods are gentlemen here. Too bloody nice about the ban hammer.
I understand their approach though.

Had a bloke the other day boast on a Facebook group about Iracing having dynamic weather for a couple years and recently adding Day/night transitions, therefore being superior to Project Cars 2. Like... How cute... :rolleyes:

DECATUR PLAYA
02-01-2019, 22:47
The mods are gentlemen here. Too bloody nice about the ban hammer.
I understand their approach though.

Had a bloke the other day boast on a Facebook group about Iracing having dynamic weather for a couple years and recently adding Day/night transitions, therefore being superior to Project Cars 2. Like... How cute... :rolleyes:

Not to get off subject but this post gives me chance to do something I have wanted to do for a long time.

I want to thank all the Mods here on our beautiful forum for the job that you guys do. Thanks guys.

I have been a member of other forums that devolved and got derailed and went to absolute hell. Although there have been some very heated battles and discussions on this forum I think the Mods have done a great job of being level headed and most of all consistent in the way that they have moderated this forum so that our discussions can continue. Without you guys diligent work this forum would blown up a long time ago. Its been 3+ years and were still rolling along.

Thanks guys.

Bliman
02-01-2019, 23:27
Not to get off subject but this post gives me chance to do something I have wanted to do for a long time.

I want to thank all the Mods here on our beautiful forum for the job that you guys do. Thanks guys.

I have been a member of other forums that devolved and got derailed and went to absolute hell. Although there have been some very heated battles and discussions on this forum I think the Mods have done a great job of being level headed and most of all consistent in the way that they have moderated this forum so that our discussions can continue. Without you guys diligent work this forum would blown up a long time ago. Its been 3+ years and were still rolling along.

Thanks guys.

I agree

blinkngone
03-01-2019, 01:18
Well, personally I feel this a very good place to call home. I tried out the AC forum and one of their most viewed posts was the PCars 1 and 2 bashing. So now I view/post mostly on here because on my disease forum there is too much sadness and I can't offer much positive because of my treatment issues but I do try. But, I swear at times on here there is more anguish and despair. Yes, I wish you guys could have your host kick back. But I also remember the threads demanding it be eliminated. I just don't see how "everything" can be ok. I don't know if that is even possible whenever you address how people feel about something.

I feel the game is still great, I check the Steam Charts and after the initial drop-off from the launch it has been relatively steady over the past year. The game is much better now then when it launched. With the patches and updates and all the contributions from the forum members that were submitted in Asturbo's thread that SMS addressed and made the game better. Yeah asking why it couldn't have been that way in the beginning is obvious and easy. And exasperatingly pointless because we are here now.

The game has evolved for the better and so have some of the participants. Bliman I suppose you can remember back in the early days when you couldn't get a handle on the Formula C? Well kovacs came along and we thought he was an alien and now his time is 3.990 off the WR.
Jussi, Casey and the rest gave us the tools necessary to improve ourselves, some have taken advantage of this. Yes it was fun when you succeeded with your GTR but most people haven't even scratched the surface of this cars potential leaving it mostly at Default settings.

Maybe I have an advantage over you because I am fortunate to interact more with the new or less experienced people and I get a lot more positive impressions of the game from them. I don't give a great deal of credence to the occasional C5Bs.

Konan
03-01-2019, 03:36
Ian can't start playing victim, and moderators like Konan can't start defending such victimhood.

Not getting into details but when someone threatened your kids i don't think you would be eager to visit that place too often, even if the person responsible was banned...
Speaking of that, those people will get banned immediately... Problem is there are usually plenty to take their place.
Anyway this happened on another forum where the guy didn't get a ban, in fact his posts weren't even removed.
What i was talking about earlier about the "welcoming" bit is how people start complaining about various things about the game in a mostly unnecessary rude way... These are not bannable matters because they are within forum rules and often are just reason for an infraction/warning.
Those people know exactly how far they can stretch the rules without being removed.
That's what makes it unpleasant for any SMS member to show up.
Us mods are here to enforce the rules... Not break them ourselves...

cpcdem
03-01-2019, 12:27
Well, personally I feel this a very good place to call home. I tried out the AC forum and one of their most viewed posts was the PCars 1 and 2 bashing. So now I view/post mostly on here because on my disease forum there is too much sadness and I can't offer much positive because of my treatment issues but I do try. But, I swear at times on here there is more anguish and despair. Yes, I wish you guys could have your host kick back. But I also remember the threads demanding it be eliminated. I just don't see how "everything" can be ok. I don't know if that is even possible whenever you address how people feel about something.

I feel the game is still great, I check the Steam Charts and after the initial drop-off from the launch it has been relatively steady over the past year. The game is much better now then when it launched. With the patches and updates and all the contributions from the forum members that were submitted in Asturbo's thread that SMS addressed and made the game better. Yeah asking why it couldn't have been that way in the beginning is obvious and easy. And exasperatingly pointless because we are here now.

The game has evolved for the better and so have some of the participants. Bliman I suppose you can remember back in the early days when you couldn't get a handle on the Formula C? Well kovacs came along and we thought he was an alien and now his time is 3.990 off the WR.
Jussi, Casey and the rest gave us the tools necessary to improve ourselves, some have taken advantage of this. Yes it was fun when you succeeded with your GTR but most people haven't even scratched the surface of this cars potential leaving it mostly at Default settings.

Maybe I have an advantage over you because I am fortunate to interact more with the new or less experienced people and I get a lot more positive impressions of the game from them. I don't give a great deal of credence to the occasional C5Bs.

Hey blink, yes, it's a nice place here, we've all learned a lot from this forum, helped others and being helped, got some frustrations as well but that's common in every "family".

About the game, I agree, it has improved a lot. Especially for hotlapping/time trial that both you and I had been using a lot, it is almost perfect now. Only problem is that sometimes the assists are going crazy when you switch from one car to another, but a game restart fixes it, so it's not a big deal. But when that happens to you online, it is a big deal, because it usually causes big crashes in turn one, when people expect their ABS/TC to work, but it doesn't. And there are a lot of other problems in multiplayer, a lot of disconnections, big stutters (while you are cornering with others...), pit strategy not working, steering ratio problems and many other similar ones than many times completely ruin races. Not to mention the track penalty system which IMO was getting worse and worse after every patch. Or the trolls that cannot be defended now...

So there really is reason for people to be complaining. I am not qualified to speak about offline/career racing, some people find it perfect now, some others have issues with inconsistent AI and behavior in dry conditions, but I have done too few real offline races to have an opinion on that.

blinkngone
03-01-2019, 13:31
Hey blink, yes, it's a nice place here, we've all learned a lot from this forum, helped others and being helped, got some frustrations as well but that's common in every "family".

About the game, I agree, it has improved a lot. Especially for hotlapping/time trial that both you and I had been using a lot, it is almost perfect now. Only problem is that sometimes the assists are going crazy when you switch from one car to another, but a game restart fixes it, so it's not a big deal. But when that happens to you online, it is a big deal, because it usually causes big crashes in turn one, when people expect their ABS/TC to work, but it doesn't. And there are a lot of other problems in multiplayer, a lot of disconnections, big stutters (while you are cornering with others...), pit strategy not working, steering ratio problems and many other similar ones than many times completely ruin races. Not to mention the track penalty system which IMO was getting worse and worse after every patch. Or the trolls that cannot be defended now...

So there really is reason for people to be complaining. I am not qualified to speak about offline/career racing, some people find it perfect now, some others have issues with inconsistent AI and behavior in dry conditions, but I have done too few real offline races to have an opinion on that.

Hi, yes I understand about Multiplayer issues, the ones you addressed are fine. I don't see anything happening in PCars 2 to help you out and SMS will fix these in their next iteration, I enough faith/trust in them. I just don't agree with the OP in that other thread as doing anything. I searched for myself and found some positive comments from Kunos about PCars in VR and others as well. I also thought the guys who purchased ACC and then worked to help each other out with issues in the ACC thread in Off Topic do a great job of working things constructively as usual(mostly) in these Forums. Working together without all the senseless vitriol.:D

hkraft300
03-01-2019, 14:29
... when people expect their ABS/TC to work, but it doesn't.
Never seen that happen. I suspect lobby and/or car setup settings.


, a lot of disconnections, big stutters (while you are cornering with others...),
I had bad Internet and this happened. I got better Internet and this happens less, although it can happen when I'm racing someone from US/EU.
My microwave knocks my WiFi out. If you're in an apartment using wireless and your neighbour uses their microwave, does that affect your WiFi performance? Or is that SMS' fault?


pit strategy not working

Pit strategy always works. When it doesn't its user error.


steering ratio problems

Never experienced it, except when a default setup is loaded. But I use the same ratio across all cars.



So there really is reason for people to be complaining.

Agree, but it's not as bad as some people make it out to be and its not always the game issues but other factors causing a failure.

cpcdem
03-01-2019, 14:50
-The assists problem happens often, when you change between different car classes (which have different assists) and/or switch to different online lobbies which have different assist settings.

-The disconnections are often Steam related, as discussed in another thread, why should Steam mishaps affect a running race? Of course there are also disconnects not Steam-related, but for those we cannot always be sure if it's a local internet or game problem.

-The huge stutters appear to happen mostly when some "event" is happening in the race, like an accident, crash, someone hitting a board etc and it usually happens to almost everybody in the lobby at the same time. Possibly it has to do with loading the sound to be played. Personally I don't get this problem anymore, or I get it very rarely, my internet connection is the same as before, but what might have made the difference is that I am on an SSD now. Others I race with (almost all UK based with good connections) still have this problem and get fed up with it. Obviously I can only talk about getting this in the PC platform, which I am using

- Yes the "bus like" steering ratio problem happens with default setups (although I rarely got it with not default setups as well). Many public lobbies or even leagues force default setups for various reasons, so this is causing big problems.

- It is very common for pit strategies to not work correctly, unless you have only one strategy saved. Almost always, the strategy you have selected before the race, is not the same as the one "active" when the race starts. Re-selecting it from the ICM while driving usually does the trick, but not always. Often you usually need to also adjust (with the ICM, while driving) the fuel amount you had already selected pre-race, damage etc. And that still does not always work...

- I only mentioned some of the common issues we're facing in multiplayer. There are plenty more. PCARS 2 is so amazing regarding graphics, content, variety, presentation, features, tools to adjust the races in what ways you prefer and so many other things, but still, after just a year so many clubs and league organizers are running away from it, going to sims with a lot less features and clearly a lot "lesser" in general. Why are they doing it, are they all masochists? IMO it's because of all the problems they/we are facing with PCARS2 for "serious" multiplayer almost daily...

beetes_juice
03-01-2019, 15:10
They are moving to other sims (rf2, Raceroom, iR, AC) as they have a track record - years - for just working as intended. Those other sims are also improving and not just left dead in the water after X years of support. There is a constant flow of new content and features. Many people will and have given up eye candy, the newest a greatest, etc just to have a stable racing experience. Don't blame them, its 100% worth it. Less headaches all around.

GrimeyDog
03-01-2019, 15:52
They are moving to other sims (rf2, Raceroom, iR, AC) as they have a track record - years - for just working as intended. Those other sims are also improving and not just left dead in the water after X years of support. There is a constant flow of new content and features. Many people will and have given up eye candy, the newest a greatest, etc just to have a stable racing experience. Don't blame them, its 100% worth it. Less headaches all around.

Agree 100% For Me I have moved on to RRE... Yes it is less eye candy but only because of the less animated back ground Ex: Time advance with Real Time Moving shadows, Moving Clouds in the Sky etc... Other than that RRE looks IMO every bit as good as Pcars2 in 4k... @ 4k with all settings Maxed out the 1080ti can Hold a Steady 60FPS with 50+ Cars on track!!! But the Most important thing is the Immersion that the FFB Gives is outstanding!!! You can feel every Bump, Curb, Rumble strip Clearly in the wheel and through the Buttkickers!!! RRE Sound Quality is top Notch every bump and thump Felt through the wheel and Buttkickers Lines up exactly with what you hear... Its Total Tactile and Audio immersion.

Pcars1 and 2 were great for their time but as it is in its current state its falling behind because RRE is constantly updated and Pcars2 has No more Fixes or updates that will be done.

IMO Pcars2 dropped the ball when a per car FFB multiplier was Not added in... That would have done alot to improve the tactile feel per car.... The General FFB is ok but some cars are Much better than others.

blinkngone
03-01-2019, 16:13
They are moving to other sims (rf2, Raceroom, iR, AC) as they have a track record - years - for just working as intended. Those other sims are also improving and not just left dead in the water after X years of support. There is a constant flow of new content and features. Many people will and have given up eye candy, the newest a greatest, etc just to have a stable racing experience. Don't blame them, its 100% worth it. Less headaches all around.

Yeah you are correct about some of it. 6,000 plus in Multiplayer for the first few weeks with all the issues then the drop to the 2,000 plus we have now. December 29th was one of the highest peak players in a while. With the steadiness in the participation as some of the frustrated players leave other new players are coming on board, at least this is the reason I am assuming the average daily and peak player numbers are so consistent This is only the Steam data I see, it may be worse with the information you can see. Unfortunate that the fix will come in the new game which is years away for you multiplayer people. Many issues were addressed and corrected in MP, just not enough for some. The peak players for AC and PCars 2 were about the same. The average for Assetto Corsa and PCars 2 show AC has almost double the average players. Still these numbers are tiny. Less than Russian Worm Farm 4.

Edit: ACC average on Steam Charts 167. RF2 422, Raceroom 353...

Be careful, if PCars 2 drops the ball it will crush those three titles put together.:rolleyes:

cpcdem
03-01-2019, 16:29
They are moving to other sims (rf2, Raceroom, iR, AC) as they have a track record - years - for just working as intended. Those other sims are also improving and not just left dead in the water after X years of support. There is a constant flow of new content and features. Many people will and have given up eye candy, the newest a greatest, etc just to have a stable racing experience. Don't blame them, its 100% worth it. Less headaches all around.

Not blaming them, I understand them! But I do not want to follow them, because I still like PCARS2 a lot and want to remain in it, unless I have no other choice (guys to play with) anymore. For this reason I still have some hope that SMS will eventually reconsider and will make another bugfix patch, at least for the multiplayer bugs, since at least for some of them I cannot imagine they need to put more than 2-3 people working on them for a few days...


Yeah you are correct about some of it. 6,000 plus in Multiplayer for the first few weeks with all the issues then the drop to the 2,000 plus we have now. December 29th was one of the highest peak players in a while. With the steadiness in the participation as some of the frustrated players leave other new players are coming on board, at least this is the reason I am assuming the average daily and peak player numbers are so consistent This is only the Steam data I see, it may be worse with the information you can see. Unfortunate that the fix will come in the new game which is years away for you multiplayer people. Many issues were addressed and corrected in MP, just not enough for some. The peak players for AC and PCars 2 were about the same. The average for Assetto Corsa and PCars 2 show AC has almost double the average players. Still these numbers are tiny. Less than Russian Worm Farm 4.

Blink, those are not the numbers for multiplayer, they are the total numbers (not sure how accurate though) of people playing the games concurrently in general, being it time trial, career, multiplayer or just having the game open and doing nothing :). If we had 2000 people playing PCARS2 online at some time of day, that would had been amazing! Usually the numbers for online players are from 20-30 players, upto 200-300, depending on the time of day. Although lately, after the winter sale, those numbers have suddenly been increased a lot, hope it stays like that (or t least they do not decrease too much) in the coming weeks as well.

blinkngone
03-01-2019, 16:37
Not blaming them, I understand them! But I do not want to follow them, because I still like PCARS2 a lot and want to remain in it, unless I have no other choice (guys to play with) anymore. For this reason I still have some hope that SMS will eventually reconsider and will make another bugfix patch, at least for the multiplayer bugs, since at least for some of them I cannot imagine they need to put more than 2-3 people working on them for a few days...



Blink, those are not the numbers for multiplayer, they are the total numbers (not sure how accurate though) of people playing the games concurrently in general, being it time trial, career, multiplayer or just having the game open and doing nothing :). If we had 2000 people playing PCARS2 online at some time of day, that would had been amazing! Usually the numbers for online players are from 20-30 players, upto 200-300, depending on the time of day. Although lately, after the winter sale, those numbers have suddenly been increased a lot, hope it stays like that (or t least they do not decrease too much) in the coming weeks as well.

Ok sorry. Even tinier then.:) What a bummer for ACC, RF2 and Raceroom then since they don't have consoles. I assume Steam is not Sony and Microsoft data.

From what I see TT is mostly dead, not even one run per hour so that's not really in the numbers. Must be Career and Practice then since you are hardly seeing 20-30.

cluck
03-01-2019, 16:45
They are moving to other sims (rf2, Raceroom, iR, AC) as they have a track record - years - for just working as intended. Those other sims are also improving and not just left dead in the water after X years of support. There is a constant flow of new content and features. Many people will and have given up eye candy, the newest a greatest, etc just to have a stable racing experience. Don't blame them, its 100% worth it. Less headaches all around.I'm not going to take issue with some people having switched to playing other sims as their primary means of racing enjoyment but I will take issue with a couple of points.

pCARS1 and 2 are not perfect, nobody can say that they are, but to suggest that other sims "just work" or "have a stable racing experience" or "less headaches all around" is, quite frankly, disingenuous. They all have their own set of problems, it's whether or not you can look past those problems that determines whether they are a better 'fit' for you than another driving game. I got far more value out of pCARS1 and 2 than any other racing game and that includes going back as far as Test Drive (in glorious 4-colour CGA!). The quirks, foibles and bugs of AC, rF2, RaceRoom and iRacing were ones I couldn't look past because they got in the way of me enjoying the experience of driving. To each their own.

I have also, it must be said, moved on, not from pCARS but driving sims in general, so I won't see any benefits from further development in other sims, or what ACC turns out to be, or even what SMS have up their sleeves. What I would say, though, is play whatever gives you the most enjoyment, whether that's pCARS, AC, rF2, iRacing, Raceroom or whatever. We're all gamers and the last thing any of us should do is play something that we're not enjoying and the key thing is that there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. If you're not enjoying pCARS1 or 2, play something else. If you are enjoying pCARS1 or 2, carry on enjoying it and blow a raspberry at anybody that dares tell you that you can't be having fun :)

Keena
03-01-2019, 17:16
Theres nothing wrong with owning all of them and playing them for different reasons. We dont have to pick sides (although you wouldnt know that sometimes..)

cpcdem
03-01-2019, 17:27
Ok sorry. Even tinier then.:) What a bummer for ACC, RF2 and Raceroom then since they don't have consoles. I assume Steam is not Sony and Microsoft data.

From what I see TT is mostly dead, not even one run per hour so that's not really in the numbers. Must be Career and Practice then since you are hardly seeing 20-30.

Now I am really wondering, how do you know how many runs are made per hour in TT?

About the 20-30 people, that's the absolute minimum, during late night/morning Europe hours, around 4-5am CET. Don't ask how I know :)
During Europe prime time it's way better, always more than 200 people in multiplayer.




I have also, it must be said, moved on, not from pCARS but driving sims in general, so I won't see any benefits from further development in other sims, or what ACC turns out to be, or even what SMS have up their sleeves. What I would say, though, is play whatever gives you the most enjoyment, whether that's pCARS, AC, rF2, iRacing, Raceroom or whatever. We're all gamers and the last thing any of us should do is play something that we're not enjoying and the key thing is that there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. If you're not enjoying pCARS1 or 2, play something else. If you are enjoying pCARS1 or 2, carry on enjoying it and blow a raspberry at anybody that dares tell you that you can't be having fun :)

Personally I enjoy playing PCARS2, but need other people to enjoy it with :). I can currently still find people to race with, but with the rate that online players are dropping it for other sims, I am very worried that a few months later I will not be finding many others to race against...

David Wright
03-01-2019, 17:44
Pcars1 and 2 were great for their time but as it is in its current state its falling behind because RRE is constantly updated and Pcars2 has No more Fixed or updates that will be done.


Fallling behind RRE? - sorry but that has to be a joke :D

What did they add since the last PC2 update? Multiclass racing in singleiplayer. You do know you can do that in pCARS2?

I appreciate you prefer the FFB and sounds in RRE, thats fine, but RRE is far far behind PC2 in terms of features and technology. Constantly updated? That explains the use of a DX9 graphics engine and physics based on 2005 ISI Motor2.

HockeyNick30
03-01-2019, 17:47
I've had PCARS 2 since release, and the simple fact that the Studio has patched the majority of the glaring issues in a year is enough to gain and keep my loyalty. Assuming they don't go NA$CAR on us with the next sim :chargrined:

morpwr
03-01-2019, 18:21
Agree 100% For Me I have moved on to RRE... Yes it is less eye candy but only because of the less animated back ground Ex: Time advance with Real Time Moving shadows, Moving Clouds in the Sky etc... Other than that RRE looks IMO every bit as good as Pcars2 in 4k... @ 4k with all settings Maxed out the 1080ti can Hold a Steady 60FPS with 50+ Cars on track!!! But the Most important thing is the Immersion that the FFB Gives is outstanding!!! You can feel every Bump, Curb, Rumble strip Clearly in the wheel and through the Buttkickers!!! RRE Sound Quality is top Notch every bump and thump Felt through the wheel and Buttkickers Lines up exactly with what you hear... Its Total Tactile and Audio immersion.

Pcars1 and 2 were great for their time but as it is in its current state its falling behind because RRE is constantly updated and Pcars2 has No more Fixes or updates that will be done.

IMO Pcars2 dropped the ball when a per car FFB multiplier was Not added in... That would have done alot to improve the tactile feel per car.... The General FFB is ok but some cars are Much better than others.


Don't you have the buttkickers hooked to the sub? If so that's why. Try buttkickers with simvibe and tell me if you still feel the same way. Your using sound cues not actual telemetry. R3E is good don't get me wrong but has the least road feel of any sim. Even the guys on their own forum admit that.

PostBox981
03-01-2019, 18:23
- It is very common for pit strategies to not work correctly, unless you have only one strategy saved. Almost always, the strategy you have selected before the race, is not the same as the one "active" when the race starts. Re-selecting it from the ICM while driving usually does the trick, but not always. Often you usually need to also adjust (with the ICM, while driving) the fuel amount you had already selected pre-race, damage etc. And that still does not always work...

In almost all my league races (about one per week) I have to do at last one pitstop. I usually choose a saved strategy during qualifying. Right before the race I check it once again. Not a single time in months now I had anything fishy happen. I always get the right tyres with the right pressure and the right fuel amount.

Not saying youīre a lier, just asking myself what might be different on my end as there are so many people complaining about it.

cpcdem
03-01-2019, 18:58
In almost all my league races (about one per week) I have to do at last one pitstop. I usually choose a saved strategy during qualifying. Right before the race I check it once again. Not a single time in months now I had anything fishy happen. I always get the right tyres with the right pressure and the right fuel amount.

Not saying youīre a lier, just asking myself what might be different on my end as there are so many people complaining about it.

Do you have many strategies saved? Not sure, but I think it has to do with having maximum or close to maximum (10) strategies saved. I do not need to save 10 strategies myself, but because every time you drive a different car the game seems to save a new strategy anyway (or is it only when you do a pitstop?), I very easily reach that number very soon.

GrimeyDog
03-01-2019, 20:22
Agree 100% For Me I have moved on to RRE... Yes it is less eye candy but only because of the less animated back ground Ex: Time advance with Real Time Moving shadows, Moving Clouds in the Sky etc... Other than that RRE looks IMO every bit as good as Pcars2 in 4k... @ 4k with all settings Maxed out the 1080ti can Hold a Steady 60FPS with 50+ Cars on track!!! But the Most important thing is the Immersion that the FFB Gives is outstanding!!! You can feel every Bump, Curb, Rumble strip Clearly in the wheel and through the Buttkickers!!! RRE Sound Quality is top Notch every bump and thump Felt through the wheel and Buttkickers Lines up exactly with what you hear... Its Total Tactile and Audio immersion.

Pcars1 and 2 were great for their time but as it is in its current state its falling behind because RRE is constantly updated and Pcars2 has No more Fixes or updates that will be done.

IMO Pcars2 dropped the ball when a per car FFB multiplier was Not added in... That would have done alot to improve the tactile feel per car.... The General FFB is ok but some cars are Much better than others.


Don't you have the buttkickers hooked to the sub? If so that's why. Try buttkickers with simvibe and tell me if you still feel the same way. Your using sound cues not actual telemetry. R3E is good don't get me wrong but has the least road feel of any sim. Even the guys on their own forum admit that.

I have to disagree with that statement...I haven't seen any 1 complain about RRE sound Quality its usually the opposite saying its very Good...but i don't do alot of forum surfing Now days so i'm sure there's alot i miss out on... For Me Canned FFB & Road Effects or Not RRE Gives the best Road, Curb, Rumble Strip feel out of all the Sims i have from the Wheel and Buttkickers... I don't use Sim Vibe and RRE tactile Feel from the Buttkickers is thunderous in comparison to Pcars2 and ACC.... I use 3x Buttkickers --> 2 under the seat ...1 plays Right other plays Left, the 1 under the pedals plays L & R... All 3 are set to ~50% volume... I set them and forget them and don't bother to readjust them per game...for Me Pcars2 gives more Engine Rumble, Gear Shift and some road feel through the Buttkickers... Rumble strips and Curbs are there but are just a tad above subtle kinda the same way they feel in the steering wheel --> I know they are there but would like to be able to dial them up a tad bit...

Don't get Me wrong I'm Not bashing Pcars2 it was Great for its time but for Me IMO in its current state its falling behind and is No longer My #1 Go to Sim Racing Game as i said in a post from another thread once the Pcars2 fever started wearing off i began to play and tweek other Sim racing games... Only by doing this Did I truly discover Pcars2 strengths -VS- its weaknesses... Quote Below

"From My own time playing Pcars1 and Pcars 2 i did enjoy them and both seemed to have what I thought to be Very Innovative features Changing Weather , Real Time advance w/ Moving Shadows according to time... These Features moved My attention away from other sims and i played Pcars only for almost 2 years! I was so caught up with Pcars when it came to other Sim Racing Games that I must admit that i did Not take a Fraction of the time to tweek wheel FFB and Game settings like i did with Pcars1 and 2... that was My Big Mistake:p... Now that I am over the Pcars Hype shock and Awe I have started played other Sims and finally taken time to properly understand and tweek the Wheel and FFB settings...RRE, ACC and I even signed up for 3 months of iRacing again... While the other Sims may Not be as Visually impressive as Pcars2 i find that the Racing experience provided by all 3 sims to have Good and Bad points.... IMO I find even without the time Shift and moving shadows that RRE provides a Considerably more immersive Racing experience than Pcars2 -> Mostly because of Better Sound, Bump and Curb Feel --> Every Bump and Jolt that I feel in the wheel lines up with what I Hear in My Headphones and Feel from the Buttkickers <---The Road and Curb feel felt in the Wheel and Buttkickers are thunderous in comparison to Pcars!!! IMO these Missing Tactile Feel Elements lesson/ limit the Immersion that Pcars2 provides...Ex: RRE i have done 45min online races and I stay totally immersed and focused from start to end -VS- PCars2 I often find Myself board or loosing focus some where between 10 laps or 15min.

I'm Not saying Pcars2 was or Is a Bad game... I have 1400 hours play time and over 800 hours on Pcars1!!! and I Really Enjoyed them all... But its time for Me to Expand My Sim Racing Choices.. I have discovered there are many really Good racing Sims out there!!! I saw a post that Big Dad Made about How Good AMS has gotten after updates so i fired it up and was Very surprised that infact it is Really Good once you get the settings dialed in <-- No real tweeking either its pretty much plug and play.

Sooo many Good Racing Sims to Choose from Sooo little time after work to enjoy them... Some times i dunno where to start:dejection:
I will definitely Get back to Pcars2 when the DD2 is delivered:victorious:


Fallling behind RRE? - sorry but that has to be a joke :D

What did they add since the last PC2 update? Multiclass racing in singleiplayer. You do know you can do that in pCARS2?

I appreciate you prefer the FFB and sounds in RRE, thats fine, but RRE is far far behind PC2 in terms of features and technology. Constantly updated? That explains the use of a DX9 graphics engine and physics based on 2005 ISI Motor2.

I'm Very happy that you are still Enjoying Pcars2... Like I said its a Great Game.... RRE Dx9 or what ever RRE 4k & VR looks Really Good... For Me i don't Miss the time shift, moving shadows etc Who can watch that while racing any way... I cant:p ... like i said what really matters most is the Level of Immersion that the Sim racing experience provides... every 1 likes what they like.

morpwr
03-01-2019, 20:29
I have to disagree with that statement...I haven't seen any 1 complain about RRE sound Quality its usually the opposite saying its very Good...but i don't do alot of forum surfing Now days so i'm sure there's alot i miss out on... For Me Canned FFB & Road Effects or Not RRE Gives the best Road, Curb, Rumble Strip feel out of all the Sims i have from the Wheel and Buttkickers... I don't use Sim Vibe and RRE tactile Feel from the Buttkickers is thunderous in comparison to Pcars2 and ACC.... I use 3x Buttkickers --> 2 under the seat ...1 plays Right other plays Left, the 1 under the pedals plays L & R... All 3 are set to ~50% volume... I set them and forget them and don't bother to readjust them per game...for Me Pcars2 gives more Engine Rumble, Gear Shift and some road feel through the Buttkickers... Rumble strips and Curbs are there but are just a tad above subtle kinda the same way they feel in the steering wheel --> I know they are there but would like to be able to dial them up a tad bit...

Don't get Me wrong I'm Not bashing Pcars2 it was Great for its time but for Me IMO in its current state its falling behind and is No longer My #1 Go to Sim Racing Game as i said in a post from another thread once the Pcars2 fever started wearing off i began to play and tweek other Sim racing games... Only by doing this Did I truly discover Pcars2 strengths -VS- its weaknesses... Quote Below

"From My own time playing Pcars1 and Pcars 2 i did enjoy them and both seemed to have what I thought to be Very Innovative features Changing Weather , Real Time advance w/ Moving Shadows according to time... These Features moved My attention away from other sims and i played Pcars only for almost 2 years! I was so caught up with Pcars when it came to other Sim Racing Games that I must admit that i did Not take a Fraction of the time to tweek wheel FFB and Game settings like i did with Pcars1 and 2... that was My Big Mistake:p... Now that I am over the Pcars Hype shock and Awe I have started played other Sims and finally taken time to properly understand and tweek the Wheel and FFB settings...RRE, ACC and I even signed up for 3 months of iRacing again... While the other Sims may Not be as Visually impressive as Pcars2 i find that the Racing experience provided by all 3 sims to have Good and Bad points.... IMO I find even without the time Shift and moving shadows that RRE provides a Considerably more immersive Racing experience than Pcars2 -> Mostly because of Better Sound, Bump and Curb Feel --> Every Bump and Jolt that I feel in the wheel lines up with what I Hear in My Headphones and Feel from the Buttkickers <---The Road and Curb feel felt in the Wheel and Buttkickers are thunderous in comparison to Pcars!!! IMO these Missing Tactile Feel Elements lesson/ limit the Immersion that Pcars2 provides...Ex: RRE i have done 45min online races and I stay totally immersed and focused from start to end -VS- PCars2 I often find Myself board or loosing focus some where between 10 laps or 15min.

I'm Not saying Pcars2 was or Is a Bad game... I have 1400 hours play time and over 800 hours on Pcars1!!! and I Really Enjoyed them all... But its time for Me to Expand My Sim Racing Choices.. I have discovered there are many really Good racing Sims out there!!! I saw a post that Big Dad Made about How Good AMS has gotten after updates so i fired it up and was Very surprised that infact it is Really Good once you get the settings dialed in <-- No real tweeking either its pretty much plug and play.

Sooo many Good Racing Sims to Choose from Sooo little time after work to enjoy them... Some times i dunno where to start:dejection:
I will definitely Get back to Pcars2 when the DD2 is delivered:victorious:

You didn't read what I wrote. I never said anything about sound quality. R3E is awesome in that department. What I said was the reason for the way you feel about the buttkickers is because youre using sound not telemetry from the actual bump to control them. Thats why it lines up perfectly with what you hear. If you had simvibe youd realize there is almost no telemetry for bumps because of how the tracks are modeled. They are pretty much flat. Yes curbs and rumble strips work. Don't get me wrong I like r3e and have all the content but there is little to no road feel from the actual tracks. Its really my only complaint about it.

GrimeyDog
03-01-2019, 20:55
Ooooh Ok Now i get you... Your saying if i used Sim Vibe then i would lose Buttkicker feel...well then I guess its a Great thing I'm not using Sim Vibe because RRE the buttkicker feel just using regular audio is Thunderous but also other games I play Rise of the Tomb Raider, Dead Space 1, 2 & 3 the Buttkickers thump!!! Even just watching movies because they run from the TV optical Audio output connected to the Astro Mix Amp and play from the Mix Amp audio output line what ever I play/Watch on the TV plays through the buttkickers and they just thump No volume adjustment needed... other than the set up works well as it is another reason i have not been interested in Sim Vibe because when i want to watch Movies on TV with Buttkicker Action then i have to start changing things.

Have you tried RRE without Sim Vibe lately??? its Really Nice with v2.5 so its gotta be insane with a DD!!!


Does Sim Vibe would help out to get Pcars2 more Rumble strip,Curb and bump Feel? I will try it when the DD2 gets here hopefully Fanatec will have a Sim Vibe like solution in the Podium suite software.

morpwr
03-01-2019, 22:23
Ooooh Ok Now i get you... Your saying if i used Sim Vibe then i would lose Buttkicker feel...well then I guess its a Great thing I'm not using Sim Vibe because RRE the buttkicker feel just using regular audio is Thunderous but also other games I play Rise of the tomb Raider, Dead Space 1, 2 & 3 the Buttkickers thump!!! Even just watching movies because they run from the TV optical Audio output connected to the Astro Mix Amp and play from the Mix Amp audio output line what ever I play/Watch on the TV plays through the buttkickers and they just thump No volume adjustment needed... other than the set up works well as it is that's another reason i have not been interested in Sim Vibe because when i want to watch Movies on TV with Buttkicker Action then i have to start changing things.

Have you tried RRE without Sim Vibe lately??? its Really Nice with v2.5 so its gotta be insane with a DD!!!


Does Sim Vibe would help out to get Pcars2 more Rumble strip,Curb and bump Feel? I will try it when the DD2 gets here hopefully Fanatec will have a Sim Vibe like solution in the Podium suite software.



Yes exactly.lol But I get why you don't if you use it for other things like movies. But for sim racing only simvibe is the way to go. I had mine hooked up like you when I only had two bks. While it was good simvibe is a way better solution for simracing.

No I always use simvibe with the buttkickers. Yes its good with a dd. There are just a lot of things ffb wise lacking over ac,pcars and rf2. Lacking probably isn't the right term buts its definitely dated at this point. Again don't get me wrong R3E does a lot of things right too. Sound,AI and atmosphere is really good. The ffb is good but to me its just too simplified for lack of a better term. I still play it and like it a lot though.

I have more feel from those things then any other sim with my wheel. I honestly I have no idea what the guys that bash pcars ffb are talking about. lol But what simvibe does is help put those effects in the right spot(the rig not the wheel) and each one is tunable separately if you want to. I just use auto tune and it seems to work good but sometimes ill turn down the engine vibrations a little bit. They are a little strong sometimes with autotune. To the point it starts to beat you up.lol Simvibe at this point is kind of like crew chief. I cant play without it and immediately miss it when I forget to start it.


If the Fanatec wheel is anywheres near as good as I think it will be you are in for a shock. You wont be able to go back to a regular wheel because you just miss too much information and every sim will feel like you never played it before. Its that different.

cpcdem
04-01-2019, 03:11
Of course need to mention also the great things, not only the problems, because when PCARS2 works, it can be brilliant! Last night I coincidentally learned about a community that would take place a little later and which would have live commentary and took the opportunity to join. The commentator/director features the game provides for races are great, allowing people to do such things (please ignore the carnage at race start :)):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gh7zPPxBRh8&feature=youtu.be&t=2710

It's worth checking also the start of the stream, to see how the guy builds up the commentary, starting from a presentation of the car, track, talking with people etc. Amazing! Felt quite privileged to be part of this, even for one day.

There exist a lot of people who enjoy PCARS2 online a lot, do their best and put so much effort to organize events and leagues, I hope SMS takes notice and a) be proud of their creation and the features they've put in it and b) seeing how much potential there is, they decide to help us a little further, by fixing some of the long standing multiplayer problems, so we can enjoy it even more and give it the credit it deserves among all sims.

PostBox981
04-01-2019, 04:45
Do you have many strategies saved? Not sure, but I think it has to do with having maximum or close to maximum (10) strategies saved. I do not need to save 10 strategies myself, but because every time you drive a different car the game seems to save a new strategy anyway (or is it only when you do a pitstop?), I very easily reach that number very soon.
Yes, Usually I have between 5 and 8 I would say. Have already been on the limit (10?) as well. Sometimes I go and delete some of the ones I donīt need any longer. I never felt like something changed without me interfering. Honestly, zero issues. Maybe I was only lucky.

cpcdem
04-01-2019, 10:57
Yes, Usually I have between 5 and 8 I would say. Have already been on the limit (10?) as well. Sometimes I go and delete some of the ones I donīt need any longer. I never felt like something changed without me interfering. Honestly, zero issues. Maybe I was only lucky.

OK, thanks, that's weird. For me, in 90% or more of the cases, the strategy I select pre-race is not the default anymore during the race and I have to almost always reselect and reajust it with the ICM, have lost many races while doing that, if there's not a long straight in the track. And at least a large percentage of the people I race with do this as well, we always advice people to check their strategies during the race in discord.

If anything, I admit the fact that you've never seeing the problem shows that it is more difficult to reproduce it than I thought. If SMS gave us a hint that they might want to fix some issues like that, I would start spending some time trying to find when that's happening and when not. Possibly it has to do with a lot of saved data in general? I have dozens and dozens setups saved, and already the game takes a lot of time (multiple seconds) to save my new setups, even though I am on an SSD. Could be related...

Edit: Btw, coincidentally I just now read a very nice post in GTPlanet, about PCARS2 in a sim racing center, see how at the end of the post he talks about "the bugs where the pit crew won't put the right requested tyres on etc...". It really is a very common problem...

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/one-year-after-release-opinion.381736/page-13#post-12593755

beetes_juice
04-01-2019, 15:02
I'm not going to take issue with some people having switched to playing other sims as their primary means of racing enjoyment but I will take issue with a couple of points.

pCARS1 and 2 are not perfect, nobody can say that they are, but to suggest that other sims "just work" or "have a stable racing experience" or "less headaches all around" is, quite frankly, disingenuous. They all have their own set of problems, it's whether or not you can look past those problems that determines whether they are a better 'fit' for you than another driving game. I got far more value out of pCARS1 and 2 than any other racing game and that includes going back as far as Test Drive (in glorious 4-colour CGA!). The quirks, foibles and bugs of AC, rF2, RaceRoom and iRacing were ones I couldn't look past because they got in the way of me enjoying the experience of driving. To each their own.

I have also, it must be said, moved on, not from pCARS but driving sims in general, so I won't see any benefits from further development in other sims, or what ACC turns out to be, or even what SMS have up their sleeves. What I would say, though, is play whatever gives you the most enjoyment, whether that's pCARS, AC, rF2, iRacing, Raceroom or whatever. We're all gamers and the last thing any of us should do is play something that we're not enjoying and the key thing is that there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. If you're not enjoying pCARS1 or 2, play something else. If you are enjoying pCARS1 or 2, carry on enjoying it and blow a raspberry at anybody that dares tell you that you can't be having fun :)

Compared to my Project Cars experience - both 1 and 2 - yes those sims are 100% more stable both online and off. I think others can attest to that statement wholeheartedly that have spent significant time in those mentioned. Yes, there are still disconnects and bugs in those sims but the frequency at which they occur is so small that the statement "They just work" is allowed to be used. 2 years of league racing during WMD2 in AC - not 1 single server crash or driver disconnect out of 35 drivers - it just works. Past 6 months of team endurance racing in iRacing - close to 48 hours of total driving - 1 pit stall bug and 1 disconnect - I'll take that as it just works. Player count on iR last night was 5.5K when I jumped online last night. There is a reason why sims from over 10 years ago are still be used and developed.

I get the entire play what makes you happy but also wish people could see past the blinders. PCars2 can be amazing in the right circumstances and can also be one of the most "What in the F*" experiences out there. Can't beat a VR hot-lap in the 917K at Classic Lemans. But once your throw the AI out there...good luck. When the Live Track bug was fixed for online, weather racing was great - until the puddles at Lemans would never drain. The patience needed to run a league in pcars is unheard of.

Better is all subjective of course. Better could be a hot-lap/screenshot simulator if that's your fancy. Better could be an all-around stable racing experience. To each there own but my thinking is people play racing simulators for the racing. If something is not fun or is frustrating as hell - its all over the place in these forums - go try something else. My bet is you won't be disappointed.

David Wright
04-01-2019, 16:04
I'm not really an on-line racer but have done 32 online races with one disconnect. Not perfect but not really spoiling the fun either. Almost all these races were peer to peer (GamerMuscle hosted streams). Is the peer to peer more reliable than the dedicated server? I've not raced with GM on AC but the server he uses on streams regularly crashes. Is this likely to be an issue with the server host?

PostBox981
04-01-2019, 16:16
OK, thanks, that's weird. For me, in 90% or more of the cases, the strategy I select pre-race is not the default anymore during the race and I have to almost always reselect and reajust it with the ICM, have lost many races while doing that, if there's not a long straight in the track. And at least a large percentage of the people I race with do this as well, we always advice people to check their strategies during the race in discord.

If anything, I admit the fact that you've never seeing the problem shows that it is more difficult to reproduce it than I thought. If SMS gave us a hint that they might want to fix some issues like that, I would start spending some time trying to find when that's happening and when not. Possibly it has to do with a lot of saved data in general? I have dozens and dozens setups saved, and already the game takes a lot of time (multiple seconds) to save my new setups, even though I am on an SSD. Could be related...

Edit: Btw, coincidentally I just now read a very nice post in GTPlanet, about PCARS2 in a sim racing center, see how at the end of the post he talks about "the bugs where the pit crew won't put the right requested tyres on etc...". It really is a very common problem...

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/one-year-after-release-opinion.381736/page-13#post-12593755

Donīt know, on some cars that I use for championships, I have plenty of setups as well. Maybe itīs got to do with the fact that usually we are only 6-10 people? All we recommended was reloading the race setup and ticking the strategy once again within those two minutes before the race.

cpcdem
04-01-2019, 16:48
I'm not really an on-line racer but have done 32 online races with one disconnect. Not perfect but not really spoiling the fun either. Almost all these races were peer to peer (GamerMuscle hosted streams). Is the peer to peer more reliable than the dedicated server? I've not raced with GM on AC but the server he uses on streams regularly crashes. Is this likely to be an issue with the server host?

Dedi is supposed to be more stable, but we've also got big disconnections (more than one racer at once) also with dedi servers indeed. Really do not know what is best, it probably depends on too many factors. Generally, I think the best advice is to avoid having any other apps in the PC or devices in the home network that are using the internet, always use LAN instead of WiFi if possible, standard things like that which generally (hopefully) make disconnects less likely to happen. I assume that running a stream while racing generally puts more strain...


Donīt know, on some cars that I use for championships, I have plenty of setups as well. Maybe itīs got to do with the fact that usually we are only 6-10 people? All we recommended was reloading the race setup and ticking the strategy once again within those two minutes before the race.

Yeah, we do that, too. Really do not know what the problem is related to, it's been happening to me almost always so I though it is a common problem for everybody. Apparently not for everybody, but just for many people instead. Unfortunately it's very time consuming trying to reproduce this in a reliable way, trying to find exactly under which circumstances it's happening and which not, because if it's only an online bug, we need to be creating several online lobbies, testing, closing them, creating another etc...But I am sure SMS would have the infrastructure to debug this problem in a much more efficient way...

cluck
04-01-2019, 17:42
Better is all subjective of course. Better could be a hot-lap/screenshot simulator if that's your fancy. Better could be an all-around stable racing experience. To each there own but my thinking is people play racing simulators for the racing. If something is not fun or is frustrating as hell - its all over the place in these forums - go try something else. My bet is you won't be disappointed.In my case, I have tried iRacing, AC, ACC, Raceroom and rFactor2 and the only one that gave me any semblance of pleasure driving was rF2 - unfortunately, pretty much everything else about it annoyed me (including the VR implementation making me nearly vomit, something that hasn't occurred in any other game, racing or otherwise, since I got my DK2). iRacing was great for the team camaraderie in the 24-hour Le Mans race I took part in but it was only the team spirit that got me through 2 disconnects caused by "memory errors" - a known fault with the Le Mans circuit at the time - with one of those crashes occurring literally 20 seconds after leaving the pits. iRacing, in common with AC, ACC and Raceroom, had a driving experience that I can only describe as soulless and uninvolving, leaving me no desire to spend any more time than necessary actually driving. I want to feel like I'm actually driving the car and it is responding to my inputs, then I can enjoy racing itself. I am acutely aware that iRacing has apparently improved in the last couple of years but I tried AC and ACC just 2-3 months ago and Raceroom about 9 months ago. Aside from ACC, none of these titles are "new", they've all been around for a good long while so, to me, they should have sorted out how to 'feel right' well before I tried them.

And no, pCARS2, is not perfect as I mentioned, so it really comes down to "pick your poison". I personally favoured the poison that gave me the greatest pleasure in actually driving, whether that was for hotlapping or racing, because I did actually do quite a bit of racing. You see, apart from taking screenshots, making league banners, doing time-trials and being a thoroughly nice chap, I was also a very fair racer. An expert at any of those things? No, far from it, but I preferred that variety of roles. It's only the racing/driving I've stopped, I have no plans to cease being a thoroughly nice chap :D

Charger
04-01-2019, 18:30
In my case, I have tried iRacing, AC, ACC, Raceroom and rFactor2 and the only one that gave me any semblance of pleasure driving was rF2 - unfortunately, pretty much everything else about it annoyed me (including the VR implementation making me nearly vomit, something that hasn't occurred in any other game, racing or otherwise, since I got my DK2). iRacing was great for the team camaraderie in the 24-hour Le Mans race I took part in but it was only the team spirit that got me through 2 disconnects caused by "memory errors" - a known fault with the Le Mans circuit at the time - with one of those crashes occurring literally 20 seconds after leaving the pits. iRacing, in common with AC, ACC and Raceroom, had a driving experience that I can only describe as soulless and uninvolving, leaving me no desire to spend any more time than necessary actually driving. I want to feel like I'm actually driving the car and it is responding to my inputs, then I can enjoy racing itself. I am acutely aware that iRacing has apparently improved in the last couple of years but I tried AC and ACC just 2-3 months ago and Raceroom about 9 months ago. Aside from ACC, none of these titles are "new", they've all been around for a good long while so, to me, they should have sorted out how to 'feel right' well before I tried them.

And no, pCARS2, is not perfect as I mentioned, so it really comes down to "pick your poison". I personally favoured the poison that gave me the greatest pleasure in actually driving, whether that was for hotlapping or racing, because I did actually do quite a bit of racing. You see, apart from taking screenshots, making league banners, doing time-trials and being a thoroughly nice chap, I was also a very fair racer. An expert at any of those things? No, far from it, but I preferred that variety of roles. It's only the racing/driving I've stopped, I have no plans to cease being a thoroughly nice chap :D

I have over 1000 hours in Pcars2 and enjoyed about 90% of it but purely as an online racer myself the frustrations of running a league and having to restart, do rolling starts and get back in formation, people not seeing the server, game crashes, disconnects, spurious impacts that on replay never actually had any contact, I could go on but you get the idea, the multiplayer side of things is bad when you put that many hours in, I seemed to spend more time in the lobby getting everyone in and ready to race and then restart etc etc it just got too much and a lot of us were getting angry.

I won't even mention the track limits and penalties.

I tried Raceroom about 12 months ago and gave it a couple of hours and thought it wasn't for me but recently we have tried it again and it has become a great 'online' experience, now I can't talk for offline here so this is just based on my experience, the sounds (enough said), the FFB and physics on my DD wheel are spot on and being able to dial in the FFB multiplier per car just makes it feel right and so immersive, I can catch slides as I feel them happening which is something I struggled with on PC2, the graphics are good enough but the main thing is the dedicated servers are rock solid which is the main thing for us, even if Steam goes down you don't get booted and if there is any impact on crashes you watch it back and it definitely happened, even deals with higher ping players quite well with no warping.

If I could have PCars 2 graphics and goodies with RRE FFB and online experience that would be a perfect sim, not saying I'll never play PC2 again but at the moment I seem to be spending my racing time actually doing a lot of racing back to back instead of having to organise people around PC2 online issues, I strongly recommend giving it a go as it has had a lot of updates in the last few months.

I also own all the other sims (not iracing) but out of them all at the moment I am enjoying RRE the most.

I don't feel robbed by PC2 though, for the amount of hours I have had out of it and enjoyed it I can't complain.

morpwr
04-01-2019, 18:31
In my case, I have tried iRacing, AC, ACC, Raceroom and rFactor2 and the only one that gave me any semblance of pleasure driving was rF2 - unfortunately, pretty much everything else about it annoyed me (including the VR implementation making me nearly vomit, something that hasn't occurred in any other game, racing or otherwise, since I got my DK2). iRacing was great for the team camaraderie in the 24-hour Le Mans race I took part in but it was only the team spirit that got me through 2 disconnects caused by "memory errors" - a known fault with the Le Mans circuit at the time - with one of those crashes occurring literally 20 seconds after leaving the pits. iRacing, in common with AC, ACC and Raceroom, had a driving experience that I can only describe as soulless and uninvolving, leaving me no desire to spend any more time than necessary actually driving. I want to feel like I'm actually driving the car and it is responding to my inputs, then I can enjoy racing itself. I am acutely aware that iRacing has apparently improved in the last couple of years but I tried AC and ACC just 2-3 months ago and Raceroom about 9 months ago. Aside from ACC, none of these titles are "new", they've all been around for a good long while so, to me, they should have sorted out how to 'feel right' well before I tried them.

And no, pCARS2, is not perfect as I mentioned, so it really comes down to "pick your poison". I personally favoured the poison that gave me the greatest pleasure in actually driving, whether that was for hotlapping or racing, because I did actually do quite a bit of racing. You see, apart from taking screenshots, making league banners, doing time-trials and being a thoroughly nice chap, I was also a very fair racer. An expert at any of those things? No, far from it, but I preferred that variety of roles. It's only the racing/driving I've stopped, I have no plans to cease being a thoroughly nice chap :D


How come you gave up sim racing? Youre damn fast.

cluck
04-01-2019, 18:46
How come you gave up sim racing? Youre damn fast.Personal reasons, nothing to do with the games themselves :)

cpcdem
04-01-2019, 19:25
I have over 1000 hours in Pcars2 and enjoyed about 90% of it but purely as an online racer myself the frustrations of running a league and having to restart, do rolling starts and get back in formation, people not seeing the server, game crashes, disconnects, spurious impacts that on replay never actually had any contact, I could go on but you get the idea, the multiplayer side of things is bad when you put that many hours in, I seemed to spend more time in the lobby getting everyone in and ready to race and then restart etc etc it just got too much and a lot of us were getting angry.

I won't even mention the track limits and penalties.

I tried Raceroom about 12 months ago and gave it a couple of hours and thought it wasn't for me but recently we have tried it again and it has become a great 'online' experience, now I can't talk for offline here so this is just based on my experience, the sounds (enough said), the FFB and physics on my DD wheel are spot on and being able to dial in the FFB multiplier per car just makes it feel right and so immersive, I can catch slides as I feel them happening which is something I struggled with on PC2, the graphics are good enough but the main thing is the dedicated servers are rock solid which is the main thing for us, even if Steam goes down you don't get booted and if there is any impact on crashes you watch it back and it definitely happened, even deals with higher ping players quite well with no warping.

If I could have PCars 2 graphics and goodies with RRE FFB and online experience that would be a perfect sim, not saying I'll never play PC2 again but at the moment I seem to be spending my racing time actually doing a lot of racing back to back instead of having to organise people around PC2 online issues, I strongly recommend giving it a go as it has had a lot of updates in the last few months.

I also own all the other sims (not iracing) but out of them all at the moment I am enjoying RRE the most.

I don't feel robbed by PC2 though, for the amount of hours I have had out of it and enjoyed it I can't complain.

Well said. I only disagree about car warping, I do see that a lot also in RRE and there's as much car jerkyness as in PCARS2 in online, when the connection is not perfect (> 200-300ms lag). Also FFB does not make a big difference to me from one sim to another, with my G29.

But about the rest, game stability, online stability, bugs, track limits system, I completely agree, RRE and AC seem totally stable to me and almost bug free, I don't think I've ever got a crash in the 250 hours I played those games. Never tried iRacing so have no idea about it.

But despite their stability, I still feel I am missing a lot when playing those sims. And they have been around for too long time for not having implemented already years ago some features, even as simple as a proper results screen after a race...Anyway, for myself I will try to stay with PC2 as much as possible, unless the RRE guys do further improve it much more. Maybe next year or so...

Charger
04-01-2019, 19:43
Well said. I only disagree about car warping, I do see that a lot also in RRE and there's as much car jerkyness as in PCARS2 in online, when the connection is not perfect (> 200-300ms lag). Also FFB does not make a big difference to me from one sim to another, with my G29.

But about the rest, game stability, online stability, bugs, track limits system, I completely agree, RRE and AC seem totally stable to me and almost bug free, I don't think I've ever got a crash in the 250 hours I played those games. Never tried iRacing so have no idea about it.

But despite their stability, I still feel I am missing a lot when playing those sims. And they have been around for too long time for not having implemented already years ago some features, even as simple as a proper results screen after a race...Anyway, for myself I will try to stay with PC2 as much as possible, unless the RRE guys do further improve it much more. Maybe next year or so...

I agree, the lack of results screen is annoying but I use an app for that but the spectator mode for streaming is very good on that side.

I don't really see the warping the cars just disappear and come back but in the same place when there is someone who lags but because you can set a ping limit on the DS it gets rid of the players that have issues, I don't like kicking players for their ping but if it starts impacting the majorities racing experience then it needs to be done, we set it at 300 anyway and to be honest if it goes over that then there is a problem client side, we have people racing in New Zealand and the US and their pings are 150-200 and stable.

I do miss some of the things in PCars2 also but for our club it needs to be a stable online set up for league races as we do them 3 times a week and the stability just wasn't there, if it was we would still be racing it.

GrimeyDog
04-01-2019, 19:51
Well said. I only disagree about car warping, I do see that a lot also in RRE and there's as much car jerkyness as in PCARS2 in online, when the connection is not perfect (> 200-300ms lag). Also FFB does not make a big difference to me from one sim to another, with my G29.

But about the rest, game stability, online stability, bugs, track limits system, I completely agree, RRE and AC seem totally stable to me and almost bug free, I don't think I've ever got a crash in the 250 hours I played those games. Never tried iRacing so have no idea about it.

But despite their stability, I still feel I am missing a lot when playing those sims. And they have been around for too long time for not having implemented already years ago some features, even as simple as a proper results screen after a race...Anyway, for myself I will try to stay with PC2 as much as possible, unless the RRE guys do further improve it much more. Maybe next year or so...

Agree with Charger 100%

I dunno cpcdem Even though I'm mostly Gt3 i like Racing Touring cars also... the Touring Cars are insane Fun!!! There's a Group that Runs Only Touring Cars every time i join their room... Too Fast for Me but I'm working on it :hopelessness:

I still like Pcars2... I had Many Great Hours playing it over 1400!!! but RRE has My Full attention ATM... For Me the FFB, Curb, Rumble Strip, Sound and Buttkicker Feel just provide a more Immersive experience...also after 1400+ hours play time once the Online Lobbys went stale and became Wreck fest I probably went into Pcars2 Burn out.

I'm a Lucky the wife fully supports My sim Racing Habbit probably because it keeps Me in the House and Off Her Back:o LOL

beetes_juice
04-01-2019, 19:52
Again all subjective and to each their own. FWIW, I don't feel robbed from my pcars time. It will have a spot on the hard drive - RDR2 on PC might make me boot it though - but the headaches and frustration it has caused overpower the awesome times I've had. The promise was there but never reached the levels it should have. And that is frustrating as hell to me as I'm sure it is to others. Plain and simple its just not worth it anymore IMO. We will see if that changes in the future with pcars3 but I don't hold high hopes. Add in a conosle announcment...talk about not bitting off more than we can chew.

cpcdem
04-01-2019, 20:13
Agree with Charger 100%

I dunno cpcdem Even though I'm mostly Gt3 i like Racing Touring cars also... the Touring Cars are insane Fun!!! There's a Group that Runs Only Touring Cars every time i join their room... Too Fast for Me but I'm working on it :hopelessness:

I still like Pcars2... I had Many Great Hour playing it over 1400!!! but RRE has My Full attention ATM... For Me the FFB, Curb, Rumble Strip, Sound and Buttkicker Feel just provide a more Immersive experience...also after 1400+ hours play time once the Online Lobbys became went stale and became Wrck fest I probably went into Pcars2 Burn out.

I'm a Lucky the wife fully supports My sim Racing Habbit probably because it keeps Me in the House and Off Her Back:o LOL

Yeah, never said the actual racing itself is not good in RRE, I like it in both games, each one with its advantages and disadvantages. Which is the group that does touring cars and what days/time do they run their races? I love touring cars, liked them also in REE, so would be nice to join a few times.

GrimeyDog
04-01-2019, 20:49
Again all subjective and to each their own. FWIW, I don't feel robbed from my pcars time. It will have a spot on the hard drive - RDR2 on PC might make me boot it though - but the headaches and frustration it has caused overpower the awesome times I've had. The promise was there but never reached the levels it should have. And that is frustrating as hell to me as I'm sure it is to others. Plain and simple its just not worth it anymore IMO. We will see if that changes in the future with pcars3 but I don't hold high hopes. Add in a conosle announcment...talk about not bitting off more than we can chew.

The Reason I bought a Gaming PC was 99.9% just to play PCars:dejection:....To be 100% Honest I very much respect the Effort SMS put into fixing the issues with Pcars1 and Pcars2.... Neither Game Lost points with Me because of Bugs or Issues... Most of them I Never experienced or probably learned to just over look them.... but as they are left in their Current state Very Good But Not Polished I really Don't think i will Buy a SMS Console until it proves its self to be Stable and Generally Bug Free.... I will Just stay with PC.

I still think that a Major Ball was Dropped when they did Not include a per Car FFB Multiplier.... That would have done alot to even further improve the already Good FFB... But it just Varies too Much from Car to Car and Pretty Much Limits car choices.... But after 1400+ Hrs I don't Feel Robbed Either it was a Great Game.

GrimeyDog
04-01-2019, 20:50
Yeah, never said the actual racing itself is not good in RRE, I like it in both games, each one with its advantages and disadvantages. Which is the group that does touring cars and what days/time do they run their races? I love touring cars, liked them also in REE, so would be nice to join a few times.

When i get on i will inbox you the group info.

morpwr
04-01-2019, 21:26
The Reason I bought a Gaming PC was 99.9% just to play PCars:dejection:....To be 100% Honest I very much respect the Effort SMS put into fixing the issues with Pcars1 and Pcars2.... Neither Game Lost points with Me because of Bugs or Issues... Most of them I Never experienced or probably learned to just look them.... but as they are left in their Current state Very Good But Not Polished I really Don't think i will Buy a SMS Console until it proves its self to be Stable and Generally Bug Free.... I will Just stay with PC.

I still think that a Major Ball was Dropped when they did Not include a per Car FFB Multiplier.... That would have done alot to even further improve the already Good FFB... But it just Varies too Much from Car to Car and Pretty Much Limits car choices.... But after 1400+ Hrs I don't Feel Robbed Either it was a Great Game.



I think youll find when you get a dd wheel that will change. I haven't touched settings pretty much since I got mine. The cars id expect to have heavier steering do and road cars for example are usually lighter like youd expect but the ffb is still good. But I agree having all ffb adjustments at least mappable would have helped along with a per car volume/gain with consumer wheels. After getting a DD and having had consumer wheels even the higher end ones I think the issue lies with the limited range of them. You just don't have as many issues getting good ffb with a dd. Its a lot less trying to balance things so the wheel can handle it as opposed to just letting the wheel do what it does without clipping which is immediately noticeable. You don't need a graph to show you.

REXPITVIPER1
05-01-2019, 10:35
I still play Project Cars2 and I really love it. I have been away for a little while (didn't play other games also), but now I am still playing it because a friend of mine is challenging me in Time Trial. And boy this game is good.
Now I know there are a lot of bugs in the game, and that's the point of my post.
Project Cars is a young series and has accomplished a lot in little time. Now for the first game, the sales were very good.
But gamers were left with a bitter taste by the bugs in the game. Then Project Cars 2 came out and I don't think it sells as good as the first one (I don't know for sure).
Now I know the studio is not a big one, my question is if SMS can survive this (I know they will bring PC3 but are they ok)?
To me, it is sad that Gran Turismo and Forza sell so well and Project Cars not. I really really hope that they don't make the simulator simpler, I want them to really focus on the simulator side and push it.
The problem to me is that the more complex something is the more chance for bugs, but if you don't push enough you get the oh it is basically Project Cars 2.5 without the bugs.
So my question is how do you minimize the bugs and still continue to be on the edge, and if there is something we gamers can do? How can they minimize the bugs so that the only one that pops up is a small one?
When I look at for example DCS flight simulator they keep bringing out amazing stuff after amazing stuff (I still don't own it). With something that is also highly complex. Is there something you guys can learn from them?
My question also is why some of these bugs aren't noticed in the testing, some of these things are noticed by gamers in the first hour.
This is a post because I hold Project Cars deep in my heart (basically the only thing I play, and my backlog of games keep growing) and I want these simulator series go in an upward curve, so they get the attention they deserve from the sim community which in itself is already pretty small.

2 factors here:
1. Gran Turismo and Forza are racing genre giants. so expecting a game trying to compete in 2 markets of gameplay is highly unlikely to gain a ton of media/player traction
2. Project CARS 2 is limited on tracks and vehicles (what I meant by content and not combination)
3.Project CARS 2 is also limited in features

let me explain 2. in a simple and easy to digest way, Project CARS 2 doesn't age when you talk about vehicles and tracks, while Forza and GTSPORT are constantly releasing new vehicles and actually has car culture support (something PC2 does not have) from Liberty Walk, Pandem/Rocket Bunny, RTR, RAUG-Welt Briff, etc, so with that expecting Project CARS 2 to also sell in vehicle and track/car culture markets is very low, when you take into account other games too, the only selling point Project CARS 2 has is LiveTrack 3.0, as that is what everyone was the most interested in, but I guess majority got burnt out on it and left, but reasoning for leaving Project CARS 2 differs per person.

Stewy32
05-01-2019, 10:38
2 factors here:
1. Gran Turismo and Forza are racing genre giants. so expecting a game trying to compete in 2 markets of gameplay is highly unlikely to gain a ton of media/player traction
2. Project CARS 2 is limited on content after a while of playing

let me explain 2. in a simple and easy to digest way, Project CARS 2 doesn't age well content-wise.

Project CARS 2 has more replay able content than Forza or GT Sport, for me at least.

REXPITVIPER1
05-01-2019, 11:47
Project CARS 2 has more replayable content than Forza or GT Sport, for me at least.

well for me I find other games better for the replayability, Project CARS 2 doesn't seem fun anymore, prolly because I did everything in-game.

cpcdem
05-01-2019, 11:50
well for me I find other games better for the replayability, Project CARS 2 doesn't seem fun anymore, prolly because I did everything in-game.

You've raced already with more than 10,000 car/track combinations?

cluck
05-01-2019, 11:53
You've raced already with more than 10,000 car/track combinations?If you will allow me to be pedantic, it's approx. 30,000, before you throw in weather, date, time of day and different car classes to race against. Or do free practice, race weekends, time-trial, multiplayer or career. So, yeah, content is something that pCARS2 is definitely not short of.

cpcdem
05-01-2019, 12:47
If you will allow me to be pedantic, it's approx. 30,000, before you throw in weather, date, time of day and different car classes to race against. Or do free practice, race weekends, time-trial, multiplayer or career. So, yeah, content is something that pCARS2 is definitely not short of.

Yeah, I was trying to keep it conservative for starters, so did not include the track variations in the total, was keeping the extra ammunition for a subsequent post if needed :)

..and also you can include mandatory pitstops yes/no, accelerated wear, different duration of races etc etc. Ah, and track limit penalties on/off, it's like playing another different game if you change that setting! :) (light-hearted comment!)

morpwr
05-01-2019, 14:02
Yeah, I was trying to keep it conservative for starters, so did not include the track variations in the total, was keeping the extra ammunition for a subsequent post if needed :)

..and also you can include mandatory pitstops yes/no, accelerated wear, different duration of races etc etc. Ah, and track limit penalties on/off, it's like playing another different game if you change that setting! :) (light-hearted comment!)


Don't forget actual real weather if you are on pc. Not sure if they have that on consoles.

hkraft300
05-01-2019, 14:32
Don't forget actual real weather if you are on pc. Not sure if they have that on consoles.

Not on console.
But with the slots and weather progression you can pretty much make it unpredictable / consistent/ flooded. Each one, in different classes, is another challenge again.

morpwr
05-01-2019, 14:47
Not on console.
But with the slots and weather progression you can pretty much make it unpredictable / consistent/ flooded. Each one, in different classes, is another challenge again.


That's too bad it doesn't work like pc with an actual link to real weather at the location. But I love the unpredictable part every race is a different experience. It really comes into play if you do longer races. Every race I did last night was in the rain and it was amazing.

Stewy32
05-01-2019, 17:44
Don't forget actual real weather if you are on pc. Not sure if they have that on consoles.

You can't but if you really want real weather you open your favourite search engine and put in [Insert Track/City nearest Track] Weather Forecast

morpwr
05-01-2019, 18:54
You can't but if you really want real weather you open your favourite search engine and put in [Insert Track/City nearest Track] Weather Forecast

Problem with that is how many do it? But its nice you guys can. I really like the part about not knowing when I pick a track or what may happen during the race.

REXPITVIPER1
05-01-2019, 19:44
You've raced already with more than 10,000 car/track combinations?

not sure what the track/car combination has to do with enjoyment/fun, but I see where you trying to get at 10,000 combinations, unrealistic for someone to have done 10,000 combinations, but I never really counted how many combinations I have done, only one I know is, Le Mans and GT3/GT4 cars was actually pretty fun(before I burnt myself out on that), and one I just started recently Vintage Multi-Class on the Nordschleife, I think I've already burnt my self out on Le Mans as I did almost every single "realistic" combination on it, GT3/LMP3, GTE/LMP2/LMP1/LMP1H, then I tried to move onto unrealistic combinations with Formula X, Indycar, GT4/GT3/LMP3/LMP2, Touring Cars, Road Cars, One-Make vehicles.

but I do only play the good tracks, Like Daytona, Nordschleife, Le Mans, Laguna etc, I did try to move onto more difficult combinations, like Rouen Le Essarts and VF1A or Rouen Le Essarts (am I writing that correctly?) with LMP2/GT3/GT4, before I posted my comment I just did a Formula A race on Laguna, and before that I can't remember.

Touge Combinations for me:
California Highway:
All classes of road cars
Track Day
Prototypes
Rally cars
GT cars
(I did everything on Cali tbh, every single class in game I did it on Cali)

Azure Coast is boring and bland for me so I don't race it much, but when I do I usually race road cars on there.



but over-all: not equalling 10,000 combinations more like 400 or 500 at the lowest - highest will be like 800 maybe 900 to 2,000+ if I count in weather combinations, but this is like a guess as I never actually counted the combinations... because who counts each combination of track/vehicle/class/weather/time/restrictions/qualifying/practice.


but by the time a person reaches 10,000 combinations within Project CARS 2 pretty sure they'll be burnt out beyond belief, it's more predictable for a person to get burnt out on the game after doing 100+ combinations in 1 day.

REXPITVIPER1
05-01-2019, 19:47
If you will allow me to be pedantic, it's approx. 30,000, before you throw in weather, date, time of day and different car classes to race against. Or do free practice, race weekends, time-trial, multiplayer or career. So, yeah, content is something that pCARS2 is definitely not short of.

that is a massive commitment. 30,000 combinations! did not know that, so let me rewrite my original post to be updated with the new information I have gained.

hkraft300
05-01-2019, 22:21
So... You've driven like 5 classes and "only the good tracks" of which you named le mans, nordschleife, daytona and cali... :glee:

And because you drove the 5 cars and Tracks to death, pc2 content doesn't age well? Doesn't have good replay ability?
Wow. What honest, deep, truthful, meaningful wisdom...

REXPITVIPER1
06-01-2019, 01:48
So... You've driven like 5 classes and "only the good tracks" of which you named le mans, Nordschleife, Daytona and Cali... :glee:

And because you drove the 5 cars and Tracks to death, pc2 content doesn't age well? Doesn't have good replayability?
Wow. What honest, deep, truthful, meaningful wisdom...

no I've driven every single class is game, and I've driven on waay more tracks than the ones I listed I give off that impression with the sentence right here:
but I do only play the good tracks, Like Daytona, Nordschleife, Le Mans, Laguna ETC, I did try to move onto more difficult combinations, like Rouen Le Essarts and VF1A or Rouen Le Essarts (am I writing that correctly?) with LMP2/GT3/GT4, before I posted my comment I just did a Formula A race on Laguna, and before that I can't remember. if you read the comment, you'd find out shockingly that I did not list California Highway as a good track.

and the point you made about me only driving five cars on five tracks is clearly ignorant because I said this in my OP:
I think I've already burnt my self out on Le Mans as I did almost every single "realistic" combination on it, GT3/LMP3, GTE/LMP2/LMP1/LMP1H, then I tried to move onto unrealistic combinations with Formula X, Indycar, GT4/GT3/LMP3/LMP2, Touring Cars, Road Cars, One-Make vehicles.


I just started on the Nordschleife, so I didn't drive it to death, if you read my comment you would have seen the sentence right here:
and one I just started recently Vintage Multi-Class on the NordschleifeI said I burnt myself out on Le Mans, as I have enough miles on it for a 48+ hour race, I just recently got back into the game from taking a month-long break, what made me take the break was what I explained in the OP as I have now edited.

did you even read the comment? like, how the hell do you get the impression I did only 5 cars on 5 tracks, I have over 5k+ hours in PCARS2.

Over-All your comment doesn't make that much sense as the replayability differs from person to person, for me, it's all about the cars, I don't care for tracks as much, I limit myself to tracks I know, and I don't go out of my comfort zone, but the cars are a different story, I've raced every-single class in game more than 2 times already and I'm not getting much enjoyment out of the vehicles anymore.

we need more tracks that have stuff happening in the background like in GTSPORT, with possibly the most famous of the tracks in that game being Blue Moon Bay Speedway having aircraft landing just off the track on an airfield, and when the race starts jets come down flying the American flag, wished Project CARS 2 had something that stuck out like that.

E_Luckow
06-01-2019, 02:44
we need more tacks that have stuff happening in the background like in GTSPORT, with possibly the most famous of the tracks in that game being Blue Moon Bay Speedway having aircraft landing just off the track on an airfield, and when the race starts jets come down flying the American flag, wished Project CARS 2 had something that stuck out like that.

Jets? Flags? (what else? Birds, trains, chicks in bikinis) Thats what you're looking for in a racing game? And it's PCars's fault?

Really?

Oh boy...:rolleyes:

cpcdem
06-01-2019, 03:00
Over-All your comment doesn't make that much sense as the replayability differs from person to person, for me, it's all about the cars, I don't care for tracks as much, I limit myself to tracks I know, and I don't go out of my comfort zone, but the cars are a different story, I've raced every-single class in game at more than 2 times already and I'm not getting much enjoyment out of the vehicles. we need more tacks that have stuff happening in the background like in GTSPORT, with possibly the most famous of the tracks in that game being Blue Moon Bay Speedway having aircraft landing just off the track on an airfield, and when the race starts jets come down flying the American flag, wished Project CARS 2 had something that stuck out like that.

Obviously each to his own, if you like jets with flags flying and GTS has that, then indeed this is a better game for you and it's absolutely fine, we all prefer what we enjoy more. But you previously said about PCARS2 "because I did everything in-game", that's what I replied too...

Btw, I like your new signature text :)

REXPITVIPER1
06-01-2019, 04:45
Obviously each to his own, if you like jets with flags flying and GTS has that, then indeed this is a better game for you and it's absolutely fine, we all prefer what we enjoy more. But you previously said about PCARS2 "because I did everything in-game", that's what I replied too...

Btw, I like your new signature text :)

yeah sorry, I should've explained way better what I meant, everyone is entitled to their own opinion as most of this thread is running off opinions.


"Btw, I like your new signature text :)"
Thanks man.

REXPITVIPER1
06-01-2019, 04:52
Jets? Flags? (what else? Birds, trains, chicks in bikinis) That's what you're looking for in a racing game? And it's PCars's fault?

Really?

Oh boy...:rolleyes:

Thanks for your comment I actually saw a spelling error, but onto the comment itself, so why does it matter if I'm more interested in the background of said tracks? it adds to detail, it makes the track you're racing at feel alive, GTSPORT NAILS this to a tee with having you guessed it, Trains flying past you on Tokyo Highway, Flag being flown on all of the tracks, The crowd cheering as you pass them going over 130 down the straight, and the Pits being lined with the crews ~ this is detail more racing games need to dwell into as they boost the immersion way up. Project CARS 3 needs a cover track~ if it's gonna go down the NFS Shift route IT needs a cover track.

hkraft300
06-01-2019, 09:00
:glee:

Fair enough. Project cars is not your type of game that's obvious. Gts sounds amazing. For its scenery.

Sentry87
07-01-2019, 03:49
If only GTS had more real tracks and realistic classes it'd be truly immersive instead of cinematic pit stops. Get those basics down first then add the other stuff (flags, fireworks, jets fly etc.)

REXPITVIPER1
07-01-2019, 05:00
If only GTS had more real tracks and realistic classes it'd be truly immersive instead of cinematic pit stops. Get those basics down first then add the other stuff (flags, fireworks, jets fly etc.)


wait, you actually went into GTSPORT knowing they didn't have realistic classes, and you came here to complain about that?!? you bought the game, you should have known that from the start, so complaining about it here doesn't serve you no good, and on the track thing, dude, no GT fan really cares about real tracks when the most famous tracks in the GT franchise are fantasy tracks they created based around real-life areas, unless you say Spa then a GT fan would be on your side, how could they forget that track?? hoping it get added in this Months update.

but no, realistic classes and real tracks are not the basics of a racing game, as Project CARS 2 does not have 100% realistic tracks and 100% realistic classes. because it doesn't matter in the long term, it secondary tbh, so I sorta found that hypocritical.

balderz002
07-01-2019, 09:20
If only GTS had more real tracks and realistic classes it'd be truly immersive instead of cinematic pit stops. Get those basics down first then add the other stuff (flags, fireworks, jets fly etc.)


wait, you actually went into GTSPORT knowing they didn't have realistic classes, and you came here to complain about that?!?

Doesn't sound like complaining to me, just Sentry87's opinion.

TorTorden
07-01-2019, 17:06
Jets? Flags? (what else? Birds, trains, chicks in bikinis) Thats what you're looking for in a racing game? And it's PCars's fault?

Really?

Oh boy...:rolleyes:

We should turn Heathrow into a race track and we can dodge jumbo's landing and taking off on the straights.

And each corner could feature wet t-shirt contests, fireworks shows or we can have the circus making a pyramid of elephants with trapese artists and tumblers performing on the finish line.
[/sarcasm]

satco1066
07-01-2019, 17:42
i start the game with -skipcrowds options. All that matters are the cars of my competitors while driving, the rest is gimmiks.
Nice once, nice twice, bugging after that.

Stewy32
07-01-2019, 18:14
If only GTS had more real tracks and realistic classes it'd be truly immersive instead of cinematic pit stops. Get those basics down first then add the other stuff (flags, fireworks, jets fly etc.)

Yeah I would agree with this.

Stewy32
07-01-2019, 18:17
wait, you actually went into GTSPORT knowing they didn't have realistic classes, and you came here to complain about that?!? you bought the game, you should have known that from the start, so complaining about it here doesn't serve you no good, and on the track thing, dude, no GT fan really cares about real tracks when the most famous tracks in the GT franchise are fantasy tracks they created based around real-life areas, unless you say Spa then a GT fan would be on your side, how could they forget that track?? hoping it get added in this Months update.

but no, realistic classes and real tracks are not the basics of a racing game, as Project CARS 2 does not have 100% realistic tracks and 100% realistic classes. because it doesn't matter in the long term, it secondary tbh, so I sorta found that hypocritical.


Personally for me, realistic car, tracks, classes etc. are very important. I want to drive the cars that read about in [A popular Motorsport magazine in the UK that has been going since 1950, which runs a Racing Car Show at the NEC in Birmingham every January] I see on the TV or in-person(or in this modern generation on smartphone or tablet as well).

For me I have almost completely stayed away from fictional cars in racing games, the exceptions being the RWD and Marek in PC1(and a tiny bit in PC2 for the RWDs) and the SMS Formula cars. Apart from that I don't think I have done any, ever.

REXPITVIPER1
07-01-2019, 18:21
Noted: everyone has their own opinion on what they want in racing games.

Konan
07-01-2019, 19:29
Noted: everyone has their own opinion on what they want in racing games.

LOL...You only just now figured that out? :p

REXPITVIPER1
08-01-2019, 09:45
I love to play project cars.

we all do.

blinkngone
08-01-2019, 17:22
Personal reasons, nothing to do with the games themselves :)

It's too bad you had to retire. The Community Event at Bathurst with the BAC Mono is in progress, only a few quicker than your 2017 run ATM.

blinkngone
08-01-2019, 23:27
Yellow feather meaning. Yellow is the color of the sun, full of happiness, optimism, confidence and feeling good about yourself. A yellow feather may be a reminder to you to stay light-hearted, to keep a positive outlook and to know that you are enough, perfect just as you are.

Carry on Cluck, a good man.
263362

blinkngone
09-01-2019, 00:05
Ok, so I obviously don't have much to do. So, for the past 24 hours I have been checking on what people are viewing in the Stickies in the Garage. 300 people viewed Jussi's Suspension Calculator. I can't tell how many people downloaded it, or will use it but I assume some have/will. I take this as an indication people are interested in learning how to make adjustments which means for some the game is a challenge. Nightigers Step by Step Guide has over a hundred views. I know that some of the people I interact with are using Zeratal's PCTuner.
There is the Discord for PCars 2 and now there are mods starting up. To me all these things point to a possible bridge to the long wait for the next iteration of the game. I don't believe we had any of these for PCars1 so to me the interest would be more sustainable this time around.

hkraft300
09-01-2019, 00:36
Jussi's calculator started from pc1.
PC2 tuner came along obviously with the next iteration.
Both are excellent tools and zeratal's discord and that community is active and strong.
There are also smaller dedicated groups and consistent-is numbers on PS4.
The titles may fall off the public eye with the next big thing that comes along but it'll be around.
I mean if Rf2 can last this long...

morpwr
09-01-2019, 01:31
Ok, so I obviously don't have much to do. So, for the past 24 hours I have been checking on what people are viewing in the Stickies in the Garage. 300 people viewed Jussi's Suspension Calculator. I can't tell how many people downloaded it, or will use it but I assume some have/will. I take this as an indication people are interested in learning how to make adjustments which means for some the game is a challenge. Nightigers Step by Step Guide has over a hundred views. I know that some of the people I interact with are using Zeratal's PCTuner.
There is the Discord for PCars 2 and now there are mods starting up. To me all these things point to a possible bridge to the long wait for the next iteration of the game. I don't believe we had any of these for PCars1 so to me the interest would be more sustainable this time around.

I have to say some of the mods are really good too. The guys are doing a great job.

cluck
09-01-2019, 07:58
...Bathurst with the BAC Mono is in progress, only a few quicker than your 2017 run ATM.I'm sure there will be, I spent less than 10 minutes with that combo ;) - as with all the Bathurst laps I did in that self-set challenge, as soon as my default lap was faster than the previous fastest time I moved on to the next car, no matter how much room there was for improvement :)

PostBox981
09-01-2019, 10:19
I'm sure there will be, I spent less than 10 minutes with that combo ;) - as with all the Bathurst laps I did in that self-set challenge, as soon as my default lap was faster than the previous fastest time I moved on to the next car, no matter how much room there was for improvement :)
I found your TT list by coincidence between Christmas and New Years Eve 2017, when you were running that self-made challenge. Refreshing the list every now and then was as exciting as watching a race on TV. Very impressive, my honest respect. :eagerness: