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Thread: Camber. What's the deal?

  1. #41
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    Slightly off-topic, but what is the optimal tire temp for GT3-class cars?

  2. #42
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    Thanks very much t0day for the link. The way I am reading this, all the work you friend did indicates that there was not the expected advantage you should be getting in "grip" with using camber, so therefore less camber in not a detriment to "grip" might as well as use less camber since there is no expected benefit to more camber. I have already gone to the lowest camber settings in any of my new set ups since this thread began, my initial post in this thread was about the Renault where I used -3.4 and was still able to post a respectable time. I was trying to show that increasing camber didn't automatically mean "slow" with a certain car on a certain track. There was a time on this forum when if you used 0.0 camber you were a cheater so I mostly left the camber alone even after the fix. For me, a lot of my set up problems come from not being able to properly use the brake. I have moved most of my brake bias to 51 to 49 range, this means I am on the verge and sometimes do lock up the rear depending on the car. In a hard corner I slide the rear, this is much better than locking the front which would take away any steering input I need to get through the corner, for me. The 2 most problematic cars for me with this driving technique are the Radical and the Ruf, I lose most of my front end feel due in part to all the suspension changes I have to make to drive like this. I wiggle the front wheels as I am going through the corner to try and help drag my sliding rear end through the corner. I haven't been able to eliminate camber using these 2 cars but I am working on it(I ran over 50 laps trying), it just isn't going to be my priority, I'll have to make do for a while using some camber until I figure out what else I am doing wrong. There are fast times being set with more camber by some people and some really slow times being set with minimum camber by some people, we are kind of a mixed bag with our abilities, camber is just 1 of the many things that make us/me fast and slow.
    The following user likes this Post: hkraft300


  3. #43
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    Moustace, I am not a GT 3 expert but I always try to get close to the tire temp. that is there when you start your TT run, around 210 degrees because supposedly the tire were in warming blankets. You still have to run laps and adjust to keep it there.
    The following user likes this Post: hkraft300


  4. #44
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    Thanks, that's what I thought as well. 210F converts to 99C. I try to keep the tires between 95-100C, I believe it's around 90-92C when you start a time trial.

    Edit: it's around 99-100C when you start a time trial.
    Last edited by moustace; 22-03-2017 at 09:12.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by blinkngone View Post
    I have moved most of my brake bias to 51 to 49 range, this means I am on the verge and sometimes do lock up the rear depending on the car.
    I've driven all the GT3 cars around Nords lately, and honestly, I can't feel any difference when I change camber settings nor does the affect laptimes. For brake balance I want it as much to the rear as possible without spinning when braking heavily. I ended up with all cars between 57 and 66 front (RUF the lowest at 57, most cars around 60 and the Ginetta G55 GT3 highest at 66).

  6. #46
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    I have gone as far as I am going to go with my own camber experiment. The track I picked for my experiment was Willow Springs Horse Thief Mile, it has the 3rd highest turn density of all the tracks, Silverstone Stowe has the highest but there are so many penalties I can't run consistent laps with any flow and there are too many curbs, similar reasons for not picking Oschersleben C. The Willow track has rough sections, elevation changes, hairpins with dips and weird camber turns. I picked the GT 3 class because there are a lot of cars and this class seems to the more popular on the board. I tried setting all my cars up with minimum camber with the goal of getting all in podium positions. I failed with the Ruf, I had to move camber from the minimum -0.9 to -1.5 in order to move up the Leaderboard. I had 2 cars where I set the fastest time on the Leaderboard, the Merc SLS and the McLaren, the rest were a mix of 2nd and 3rd. There are 13 cars in the GT 3 class, I am throwing out my 2 cars were I set the fastest time because in my opinion the B.O.P. of the GT 3 cars SMS has provided is really, really good and my times were not just quick enough (I believe that all the fast times for GT 3 cars at Willow would be around 48.5 to 48.9). Of the remaining 11 cars in the class 73%(8) of the fast times are using the default camber(I assume this is the case because they have the pink square with the "D"), you would have to assume that the remaining cars were using the minimum camber although you don't know for sure. Of the 11 fast times 10 were by Pro drivers. I ran a lot of laps, making adjustments, re running, adjusting but I didn't have unlimited time to do this and the returns were diminishing so I would move to the next car. In my opinion based on my runs for my cars I am at a disadvantage by running the lowest possible camber at this track. Could I have pushed my times faster? Sure, I made a new set up for the Audi this morning and took .4 seconds off my previous best with no camber (set up attached) and I would still be slow . Could a Pro driver running minimum camber go to this track and knock off the best the times of the higher camber GT 3 cars? I suppose, but then a higher camber driver might come along and beat that too. I have a few fast times at this with other cars(again a Pro driver with low camber could best me) at this track but maybe this track is one of those exceptions to the rule of low camber being an advantage. I am going to say that in my opinion if you are not a Pro driver, using camber at this track is easier. Lastly, I probably have around 2% of the fast times on this Leaderboard, not great and not where I wanted to be but it should be enough to modify the always camber claims.Click image for larger version. 

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    The following user likes this Post: moustace


  7. #47
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    Well people, I am more confused than ever. I am struggling to get my GT 3 cars back up and running (trying no camber). However, with 4 of my other cars I worked on, the Pagani Zonda R and Revolucion, the Radical SR8-RX and the Audi R8 I am easily faster than I was before, night and day. All I did was add front camber, not a lot just a wee little bit. The front end has come alive, particularly on the R8. I run at Silverstone National for my base line set up, the track is flat and a little bumpy in places but that's about it. I mean, I'll gratefully take being faster but why is this? GT 3 without camber slow and struggling and cars with camber faster than before? Most of the time I have invested in the camber cars set up was adjusting tire pressure, the set ups themselves were just SWAGS to get me running. Instead of a rule maybe it's more like TRY 0 CAMBER, YOUR RESULTS MAY VARY.
    Click image for larger version. 

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