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Thread: Physics of Spirit of Le Mans DLC

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by TexasTyme214 View Post
    From testing and racing, the Audi is not as strong on reliability, tire wear, or fuel consumption. A 919 driver I raced against, while I ran the Audi, lasted about 7 or 8 extra minutes on fuel at Spa. Over time, you eventually have extra fuel stops compared to the 8MJ cars.
    Audi actually has the best fuel consumption, but the smallest fuel tank.

    Audi has a 50L fuel tank. In order to hit the 12 lap stint lengths at Le Mans that they hit in real life you're fuel target is 4.16L of fuel a lap. You dont hit those numbers unless you are lifting and coasting. The Porsche and Toyota consume more fuel but have larger fuel tanks. They don't require as much lifting and coasting to hit their stint targets of 13 and 14 laps though. I cant remember their fuel tank sizes, but I do know that is what their stint lengths were IRL.

    Aside from race length I feel people are forgetting that stint lengths and lifting and coasting also play a major role in the balance of the class. If you drive the cars the way they were driven IRL their performance is spot on. If you drive them without any worry of having to hit fuel numbers than the balance gets thrown off.

    Now I dont know if the AI is programmed to hit stint targets (I'd assume no just for complexity sake), but the cars are absolutely spot on if everyone driving them in the race goes by the real world targets the cars had/have to hit to make hit their stint targets and fuel per lap used.
    Last edited by Tar Heel; 25-06-2018 at 18:45.
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  2. #62
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    Yes, the Audi does consume less fuel over a lap, but it's not as good as fuel because it uses a larger percentage of it's fuel tank per lap than other cars. In other words, its advantage in fuel efficiency is highly eclipsed by its small fuel tank size like you stated. In the end, the Audi is weaker in terms of fuel compared to the other two.

    It is not truly worth it to lift and coast every single lap, which is why people push them. The time lost from lifting and coasting for that extra lap if fuel is too great. It would be better if we had true, accurate restrictions in how much fuel and KERS we can use in a lap.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by TexasTyme214 View Post
    It is not truly worth it to lift and coast every single lap, which is why people push them. The time lost from lifting and coasting for that extra lap if fuel is too great. It would be better if we had true, accurate restrictions in how much fuel and KERS we can use in a lap.
    That is my point though that I feel people are missing. The cars are balanced off of how the performed IRL which includes their fuel restrictions. Yes anyone can drive them faster by not lifting and coasting, but people need to accept that if that's how they choose to drive then the cars will not be balanced because they were balanced around fuel usage/stint lengths.

    Would it be nice to have fuel restrictions in the game? Yeah that would be nice, but they aren't and to be honest it seems most people complaining about the balance know very little about the actual fuel restrictions seem IRL anyways.

    My main point is SMS have nailed the simulation of these cars and anyone saying they havent is probably not driving them as they were driven IRL and probably doesnt fully understand the fuel usage and stint length restrictions of each individual car
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  4. #64
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    That's a fair assessment. I understood your point. Even so, form restrictions alone would not automatically balance the cars. We'd also need the KERS restriction appropriately changing for each course. It's hard to have the Porsche and Toyota to use more KERS than the Audi in order to keep up.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sessionerror View Post
    Excellent read, as always Casey. Thank you!

    Regarding the hybrid system of the LMP1 (2016), I just discovered something odd, though: Pushing the KERS button without throttle input won't result in acceleration. However, the battery load is reducing while the KERS button is being pressed. Since the shift times of the Toyota TS050 seem to be significantly longer than the shift times of the TS040, this results in wasting quite an amount of electric energy: While I accelerate and push the KERS button, I do have to shift of course - during shifts though, the throttle is being cut. In this time, I still press the KERS button of course, but the energy is just being wasted.

    Is there a possibility to do something about that? Either by cutting the KERS input as well, or - even better - getting some acceleration from the electric drivetrain alone?
    I agree with Sessionerror there. The current situation is that the KERS button just deploys the energy. So if you just push the button you don't accelerate but waste some boost. The hybrid boost is controlled by accelerating. But not the remaining energy storage, it's rather like you have a limited amount of time to use the hybrid boost
    I think it would be better if the button is not a "deploy" button, but rather an "enable" button. So if you press the button you can use all the combined power from the ICE and the hybrid system.
    The difference would be that, like with the ICE, you control the percentage of the power used by pressing the throttle pedal. So you burn less hybrid boost if you only use like 10% of the throttle instead of 100%.
    I hope you could understand what I tried to explain. I also don't know how difficult this is to program so it's rather a note that if it's easy to change it could be changed

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monoq View Post
    I agree with Sessionerror there. The current situation is that the KERS button just deploys the energy. So if you just push the button you don't accelerate but waste some boost. The hybrid boost is controlled by accelerating. But not the remaining energy storage, it's rather like you have a limited amount of time to use the hybrid boost
    I think it would be better if the button is not a "deploy" button, but rather an "enable" button. So if you press the button you can use all the combined power from the ICE and the hybrid system.
    The difference would be that, like with the ICE, you control the percentage of the power used by pressing the throttle pedal. So you burn less hybrid boost if you only use like 10% of the throttle instead of 100%.
    I hope you could understand what I tried to explain. I also don't know how difficult this is to program so it's rather a note that if it's easy to change it could be changed
    Why would you use your hybrid power in a situation where you aren't pressing the throttle pedal 100%? Most of the time this would be just a waste of energy.
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  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bealdor View Post
    Why would you use your hybrid power in a situation where you aren't pressing the throttle pedal 100%? Most of the time this would be just a waste of energy.
    I also use the hybrid system to have better traction out of slow corners or at narrow places sometimes with elevation changes, like at Bathurst after the cutting. There you have AWD traction with the KERS but I don't always use full throttle, because of the narrowness. Without the hybrid boost you have to be more careful with only powering the rear wheels

  8. #68
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    Great write up and thanks for taking the time... However the employment of hybrid systems in this game is pathetic. You characterize the info given to you by Audi as far and away more complete than you have ever been able to get your hands on. Why didn't your dev team use this to employ a proper hybrid deployment and recovery system with options? The only possible use of the hybrid deployment is to push a KERS button, something LMP1-H cars don't have. Can you provide any info as to why this game doesn't do hybrid systems at least as accurately as Assetto Corsa?

    Putting out DLC like this with this poor of a hybrid system is inexcusable.

  9. #69
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    Yes, it had been explained..
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  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Netminder View Post
    Great write up and thanks for taking the time... However the employment of hybrid systems in this game is pathetic. You characterize the info given to you by Audi as far and away more complete than you have ever been able to get your hands on. Why didn't your dev team use this to employ a proper hybrid deployment and recovery system with options? The only possible use of the hybrid deployment is to push a KERS button, something LMP1-H cars don't have. Can you provide any info as to why this game doesn't do hybrid systems at least as accurately as Assetto Corsa?

    Putting out DLC like this with this poor of a hybrid system is inexcusable.
    You didn't read the full initial post. This was explained:

    Quote Originally Posted by Casey Ringley View Post
    LM P1H 2016 Hybrid use and strategy: One big difference for these 2016 cars is that we've changed the hybrid system to activate on button press rather than throttle input. Rules for the real car don't allow it to be on a button like this, but the real systems are becoming so complex that we can't really copy their action from throttle input alone; it worked fine for the simpler cars of 2014, but not now that everyone is in the high energy categories and working out better energy deployment strategies. Manually controlling the hybrid to match closer what we see done in the real thing has a significant effect on lap times. Avoiding any wasted energy on unimportant parts of the track and saving it for big burns made me about 4s per lap faster in the Porsche and 2s in the Audi; plus it gives a fun push-to-pass feature if you manage to save a little energy while racing closely with anyone.
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