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Thread: Mid corner car behaviour

  1. #1
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    Mid corner car behaviour

    So, I admit, I've been away from PC2 for a while. Been enjoying AC a lot these days, also GTS to be honest.
    But I was back on PC2 last weekend and I immediately realized something I didn't really notice before.

    For whatever reason, I find now (after so much time in the other sims), that the cars I'm driving (mostly GT3... but not only) seem to have this strange behaviour where they feel like they are turning into the corner too much, right at mid-corner/apex.

    It's strange. I'm ok on turn in, and exit. I'm able to recognize the under/over steer on entry or exit, and adjust my setup or driving to deal with it.

    But I really find in PC2, that there's some sort of 'dive' to the inside at mid corner that catches me off guard all the time. I think I'm on a good entry line, and then all of a sudden I'm diving to the inside too fast and I need to counter steer to correct and continue through the corner.

    I never really noticed it before, but after lots of time in the other sims, it's almost the main thing I notice now in PC2.

    Any ideas or suggestions what to check in my setups for this? Is it something that other people notice about PC2 compared to other sims?

    Thanks for your comments.
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  2. #2
    Superkart Pilot Twinz's Avatar
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    The only time I experience something like this is when I clip the inside of a corner and "catch" what feels like sand in my wheel's FFB. -not like parent that has been light6 dusted with sand, but like soft sand on the side of the road or a sandbox where your foot would sink into it a bit if walked through it.

    Otherwise cars generally behave as expected for me. (And the pull from hitting a small sand trap with a tire , kind of makes sense too)
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  3. #3
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    Try stiffening the front ARB

  4. #4
    Moderator Sankyo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atak Kat View Post
    So, I admit, I've been away from PC2 for a while. Been enjoying AC a lot these days, also GTS to be honest.
    But I was back on PC2 last weekend and I immediately realized something I didn't really notice before.

    For whatever reason, I find now (after so much time in the other sims), that the cars I'm driving (mostly GT3... but not only) seem to have this strange behaviour where they feel like they are turning into the corner too much, right at mid-corner/apex.

    It's strange. I'm ok on turn in, and exit. I'm able to recognize the under/over steer on entry or exit, and adjust my setup or driving to deal with it.

    But I really find in PC2, that there's some sort of 'dive' to the inside at mid corner that catches me off guard all the time. I think I'm on a good entry line, and then all of a sudden I'm diving to the inside too fast and I need to counter steer to correct and continue through the corner.

    I never really noticed it before, but after lots of time in the other sims, it's almost the main thing I notice now in PC2.

    Any ideas or suggestions what to check in my setups for this? Is it something that other people notice about PC2 compared to other sims?

    Thanks for your comments.
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  5. #5
    Kart Driver
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    unless it's due to your force feedback clipping, that behaviour can depend from one or a combination of the following:

    - front anti roll bar too soft
    - coast ramp angle too high (if it happens off the throttle)
    - power ramp angle too high (if it happens on the throttle. High pramp angle means a locked diff, which can cause excessive internal wheel slip which causes snap oversteers like you described)
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  6. #6
    Moderator Bealdor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Voodoochild View Post
    - power ramp angle too high (if it happens on the throttle. High pramp angle means a locked diff, which can cause excessive internal wheel slip which causes snap oversteers like you described)
    No.
    High power ramp angle means LOW locking effect, which will cause the inner wheel to spin freely and reduce torque on the outside wheel. This will not cause snap oversteer.

    "Snap oversteer" happens with low power ramp angles which are causing a high locking effect.
    This locking effect PREVENTS your inside wheel from spinning and distributes more torque to the outside wheel.
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bealdor View Post
    "Snap oversteer" happens with low power ramp angles which are causing a high locking effect.
    This locking effect PREVENTS your inside wheel from spinning and distributes more torque to the outside wheel.
    aren't these 2 sentences contradicting one eachother?

    In the first you say that snap oversteer is induced by high locking effect, in the second you say that locking effect prevents your inside wheel from spinning excessively (which is what makes the car spin in the hairpins as soon as you go on the throttle)

    I think we're giving the same advice but we need to agree on the meaning on "snap oversteer" and probably i need to review my definition of open and locked diff:
    - locked diff: both wheels receive the same amount of torque
    - open diff: the outside wheel receives more torque than the inside wheel
    Is that correct?

    and then:
    - snap oversteer: rear loses grip suddenly, front seems to "dive" into the corner and you usually end up facing backwards in a cloud of smoke. Happens usually on corner apexes and is mitigated by lower power ramp angles
    - power oversteer: rear loses grip more gradually, rotation of the car is slower and you can more easily save it. Happens usually on corner exits and is mitigated by higher power ramp angles
    Is that correct?

  8. #8
    Moderator Bealdor's Avatar
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    Equal torque distribution is only achieved with an open diff.
    With zero lock the inside wheel can spin freely and the torque on the outside wheel is limited by what the inside one can handle.

    High locking effect means the inside wheel can't spin freely and when it wants to, more torque is distributed to the outside wheel, overloading it and causing the rear to spin out under hard acceleration.
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  9. #9
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    ok then i got my definitions of open and locked diff the wrong way around, but not the effect of higher or lower power ramp on the car's behaviour

  10. #10
    WMD Member Mahjik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atak Kat View Post
    But I really find in PC2, that there's some sort of 'dive' to the inside at mid corner that catches me off guard all the time. I think I'm on a good entry line, and then all of a sudden I'm diving to the inside too fast and I need to counter steer to correct and continue through the corner.
    One thing that PC2 does very well which most current titles don't support is scrubbing. What I mean is that there is a technique many real life drivers use where they come into a corner a little hot, allow the car to scrub off speed via friction of the tires, and then when the car is at the proper speed it will grip and settle into the corner. A lot of sims don't really have this scrubbing effect and it was one of the things the SMS physics team worked hard on based on the feedback from their racing drivers. This is likely what you are experiencing.

    Note, this can also cause some snap oversteer. If the car begins to understeer, depending on the steering angle you have eventually the car will scrub off enough speed that the front tires will grip. If you have a lot of steering already in the front wheels, when they grip it will suddenly grab that direction which can throw the rear around quickly.
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