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Thread: How to develop more confidence?

  1. #21
    Moderator Mahjik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cluck View Post
    Depends on the driver. I use that 1st crash / off-track to ascertain the limits of the car and adjust my driving accordingly. It's rare that I will continue to crash or run wide over and over again, especially not at the same point.
    Although that 1500 hours may have something to do with that...
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  2. #22
    WMD Member cluck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mahjik View Post
    Although that 1500 hours may have something to do with that...



    EDIT : I should also add, in the interests of fairness, my original reply in this thread was written under the influence of "some" alcohol! I haven't even read it back to see if it made sense to be honest but I stand by the technique I use. Invariably, if I'm in time-trial, my goal is to go as quickly as possible in as short a time as possible, so I have to find the limits of the car very quickly. Some cars I can adapt to instantly and not crash, because their limits are higher than I was anticipating. Some cars I have to 'dial back' my driving to adapt to them but, in those cases, it's almost always true that within just a few corners I am pretty much in tune with what the car can do. From there, it's a matter of seeing how it behaves across a full lap and then whittling down the tenths and the hundredths until I am close to my own limit. Or I get bored and move on to another combo.
    Last edited by cluck; 13-11-2018 at 00:21.
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  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by cluck View Post
    Depends on the driver. I use that 1st crash / off-track to ascertain the limits of the car and adjust my driving accordingly. It's rare that I will continue to crash or run wide over and over again, especially not at the same point. It's simply the style I've employed in driving games my whole life as it's the one that works for me and as such, I offered it up as an option for the OP
    Works for me, too. Go as much all in as I can in T1 until I find the (my) limit with that car. Once this is found, for most of the rest of the corners I have already found the limit or am close to it and from then on it's practice got get closer and closer to it everywhere.
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  4. #24
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    It might be helpful for the OP to get a feel for "cause and effect" with a slower car and low grip tires.

    IRL, I learned car control as a teen driving RWD cars on old dirt roads. The "sugar sand" (as we called it) allowed drivers to experience driving dynamics in slow motion. Heck, just crossing an intersection in a straight line after a stop required throttle modulation to avoid getting stuck sometimes.

    The GT-86 has some of the lowest-grip tires IRL and the game does a pretty good job of simulating those crappy stock tires. The car is low-powered, but thanks to those tires, you can still get throttle oversteer at-will...and do so in a predictable, progressive manner.

    I'm sure there are better cars for this task, but I haven't driven all that many. Any way, instead of trying to "go fast" just try to get the car on the edge of traction through turns and get a feel for how it responds to small changes in throttle, brake and steering inputs. The goal is to get to a point where you have a reasonably accurate expectation of what is about to happen before you make an input and be able to make tiny adjustments to reconcile your expectation with what is actually happening. Generally speaking, the difference between the two will get smaller and smaller over time.

    Once you get confident in slower, more predictable cars, the skillset will transfer to faster cars and allow you to adapt to twitchy, hard-to-drive vehicles in shorter periods of time.
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  5. #25
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    Thanks all, again.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by cluck View Post
    Depends on the driver. I use that 1st crash / off-track to ascertain the limits of the car and adjust my driving accordingly. It's rare that I will continue to crash or run wide over and over again, especially not at the same point. It's simply the style I've employed in driving games my whole life as it's the one that works for me and as such, I offered it up as an option for the OP
    Yes, it's true it depends. You are actually doing all the same things I mentioned, but you have relatively many hours of experience that gives you more insight on how to adjust. Drawing on your experience, you more easily grasp "what just happened" and how not to do it again. Probably by changing a few things all at once.

    Somebody else mentioned driving the downforce cars with very little wing until you fully understand their mechanical behavior. I'm really interested in trying that technique.
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  7. #27
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    I noticed something with my own driving in the game that mirrored my driving IRL and it might also help the OP; I drive better when I pay attention to the car and the course.

    It sounds silly that something so obvious needs to be pointed out, but it's easy to fall back on muscle-memory for the fundamentals of driving when you are otherwise distracted. (By competition, a specific turn, target time or any number of things)

    IRL some of my best driving has happened in other people's cars or my own car after a significant change to the setup....because I'm now acutely interested in how the car is responding to my inputs rather than just running on auto-pilot.

    Developing good muscle memory is important and frees up mental resources, it's virtually impossible to go fast without it. -But it's important to be mindful of leaning too-heavily on it.

    In the game, I have picked up time by something as small as a PSI adjustment just one "click" different than before. While tire pressure makes some difference, I suspect that such small changes merely bring my attention back to my interaction with the car and get me to re-focus. I get back to the point where I am "asking nicely" (and listening the the responses the car gives me) rather than just "demanding" that the car does x and y, then fighting it when it doesn't do what I want.

    Basically, if driving fast around a track starts to feel really difficult, I am usually trying too hard. (Overdriving)
    If I am 100% certain that everything I do is going to work, and it works every time, I am usually not pushing myself enough. (Under-driving...I don't have *this* problem often lol)
    When I find every turn just a *little* difficult, it's usually the "sweet spot".

    The cool thing about this mindset is that it seems to apply to all skill and experience levels.

    And to be clear, both overdriving and underdriving cost time. I actually think under-drivers have a better shot at improving a bad lap than over-drivers.

    When you go too slow you have one problem to fix. When you go too fast in general, you tend to make a mental mess of things and the path to a faster lap is less clear.
    Last edited by Twinz; 13-11-2018 at 19:00.
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  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twinz View Post
    I noticed something with my own driving in the game that mirrored my driving IRL and it might also help the OP; I drive better when I pay attention to the car and the course.

    It sounds silly that something so obvious needs to be pointed out, but it's easy to fall back on muscle-memory for the fundamentals of driving when you are otherwise distracted. (By competition, a specific turn, target time or any number of things)

    IRL some of my best driving has happened in other people's cars or my own car after a significant change to the setup....because I'm now acutely interested in how the car is responding to my inputs rather than just running on auto-pilot.

    Developing good muscle memory is important and frees up mental resources, it's virtually impossible to go fast without it. -But it's important to be mindful of leaning too-heavily on it.

    In the game, I have picked up time by something as small as a PSI adjustment just one "click" different than before. While tire pressure makes some difference, I suspect that such small changes merely bring my attention back to my interaction with the car and get me to re-focus. I get back to the point where I am "asking nicely" (and listening the the responses the car gives me) rather than just "demanding" that the car does x and y, then fighting it when it doesn't do what I want.

    Basically, if driving fast around a track starts to feel really difficult, I am usually trying too hard. (Overdriving)
    If I am 100% certain that everything I do is going to work, and it works every time, I am usually not pushing myself enough. (Under-driving...I don't have *this* problem often lol)
    When I find every turn just a *little* difficult, it's usually the "sweet spot".

    The cool thing about this mindset is that it seems to apply to all skill and experience levels.

    And to be clear, both overdriving and underdriving cost time. I actually think under-drivers have a better shot at improving a bad lap than overd-rivers.

    When you go too slow you have one problem to fix. When you go too fast you tend to make a mental mess of things and the path to a faster lap is less clear.
    Man I thank you for that. I mentioned it in another thread. I sometimes start daydreaming during a race on tracks I know very well (nordschleife f.e.)...so like you said...I rely on pure brain/muscle memory and have to fight against my brain to actually race instead of "just come home". I mean, I know nordschleife as good as my daily way to work or home and instead of attacking every.corner I just "drive home"...

    Funny thing is, on nordschleife my "daydreamingdriving"is still faster then 90% of the casual drivers....

    Edit: my alcohol and weed abuse is for sure a very big part of that "automated robotic daydreamin driving situation"...
    Last edited by beatrunner; 13-11-2018 at 20:27.
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  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by beatrunner View Post
    Man I thank you for that. I mentioned it in another thread. I sometimes start daydreaming during a race on tracks I know very well (nordschleife f.e.)...so like you said...I rely on pure brain/muscle memory and have to fight against my brain to actually race instead of "just come home". I mean, I know nordschleife as good as my daily way to work or home and instead of attacking every.corner I just "drive home"...

    Funny thing is, on nordschleife my "daydreamingdriving"is still faster then 90% of the casual drivers....

    Edit: my alcohol and weed abuse is for sure a very big part of that "automated robotic day driving situation"...
    I don't know my way round the Nordshliefe full stop. I get stuck on muscle memory after a couple of corners.

  10. #30
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    To answer this ^ and be on topic at the same time: confidence in your abilities and "the daydreaming mode" comes with/after lots of practise....

    I drove nordschleife for over 40 000 kilometers...in the first project cars game alone
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