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Thread: Pimax Headsets and other VR headsets with no parallel projection support in PC2

  1. #1
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    Pimax Headsets and other VR headsets with no parallel projection support in PC2

    Hi.

    I'm planning to buy this game. I downloaded the demo from steam to check it out but it seems that I have double vision in my Pimax 5K+. I made some discoveries and it seems that I need to enable on Pimax compatibility switch named Parallel Projections but this also drastically reduce performance.

    Setting PP is a HMD feature. When you “set” for example Pimax to run in PP mode, it starts reporting having parallel panels, even when in reality it does not have them. This gives the application the geometry which the app knows how to process (before Pimax, all headsets used only parallel panels and therefore also parallel geometry).

    When you switch Pimax to the native mode, it starts reporting the native geometry (i.e. panels canted by 10 degree to sides).

    The problem is definitely on the application side (PC2 in this case), which should correctly handle non-parallel geometry and I'm asking if PC2 will have some patch for this kind of headsets that natively report non parallel geometry.

  2. #2
    Superkart Pilot Twinz's Avatar
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    The Rift S, came out after PC 2's final patches, has a single LCD screen, and it works fine in Project Cars 2. I don't think PC 2 has an issue running VR on a single screen.
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    Superkart Pilot DaWorstPlaya's Avatar
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    The full game supports the Pimax HMD, plenty of youtube videos out there showing it. Who knows when the demo was last updated, I wouldn't go by your experience on the demo.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ElwNsjcxI0w
    Last edited by DaWorstPlaya; 25-08-2019 at 15:51.
    What line?
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    Update for SMS developers:

    Take a look at this source material for more info here and particularly this one message and usage of method: IVRSystem::GetEyeToHeadTransform.

    From what I see all Youtubers and on all Pimax forum are suggesting that PP should be enabled in this game which indicate that full version of game does not support not parallel geometry at all.

    For more info about what is Parallel geometry here is good doc: https://github.com/risa2000/vr_docs/...calculation.md

    Quote Originally Posted by DaWorstPlaya View Post
    The full game supports the Pimax HMD, plenty of youtube videos out there showing it. Who know when the demo was last updated, I wouldn't go by your experience on the demo.
    The full game supports the Pimax HMD but this HMD must be working in compatibility mode with Parallel projections enabled. This enables enormous performance hit to the machine. The native geometry in this headset is not parallel. You're right that I should test it on Full Game but I was curios if some developer from SMS will answer me this question before I buy the game. On the Pimax forum everybody as I know are playing in this game with PP enabled.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twinz View Post
    The Rift S, came out after PC 2's final patches, has a single LCD screen, and it works fine in Project Cars 2. I don't think PC 2 has an issue running VR on a single screen.
    What about other VR HMDs? The Rift S even don't have IPD adjustment.

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    WMD Member satco1066's Avatar
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    the last patch is about 10 months old. As far as we know, there will be no further patch for pCars2.
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    Superkart Pilot Twinz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kapucha View Post
    ....before Pimax, all headsets used only parallel panels and therefore also parallel geometry....


    What about other VR HMDs? The Rift S even don't have IPD adjustment.
    The Rift S uses a single LCD and came out after PC2's last patch.

    The single-screen Rift S works.

    PC2 does NOT have an inherent issue running single-screen VR. Your "all screens used only parallel panels" statement would therefore seem to be irrelevant because we have a new, single screen HMD that works fine with PC2.
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    WMD Member satco1066's Avatar
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    it is irrelevant if the panel is single or doublescreen, as long they are on the same plane, its parallel projection.
    I would say our eyes work with parallel projection too, so its the natural way, like normal HMD devs implemented it.
    The special case in Pimax is, that it has not only 2 panels, that 2 are also attached with a little angle.
    Thats why there seems to be a little distortion in the view, and this has to be corrected by the HMD.
    IMHO, that is the problem of the HMD developer, not the app developer. If they define a new standard, not every dev can follow their theory and support it.
    Especially when this is their own standard, more or less a prototype thing
    Thats why i think its their problem to design special distorted lenses and/or a postprocessor chip to do what they intend.
    Every car could be a race car, as long as you have the balls to drive it like that !

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    Quote Originally Posted by satco1066 View Post
    it is irrelevant if the panel is single or doublescreen, as long they are on the same plane, its parallel projection.
    I would say our eyes work with parallel projection too, so its the natural way, like normal HMD devs implemented it.
    The special case in Pimax is, that it has not only 2 panels, that 2 are also attached with a little angle.
    The Valve Index has also 2 panels, attached with little angle but their headsets has automatically turned on parallel projection and user can't disable it. Using Oculus Home runtime the Pimax looks fine with Project Cars 2 without enabling Parallel Projection. There is only problem when working over OpenVR api on SteamVR runtime. If VR HMDs support large FOV then panels needs to be aligned under some angle and that why OpenVR are supporting this angle in the API but PC2 devs are not using this information at all. It works fine when panels are inline but it brings double vision when panels are under some angle to provide large fov. Large FOV is especially nice and useful for sim racing games.

    Quote Originally Posted by satco1066 View Post
    Thats why there seems to be a little distortion in the view, and this has to be corrected by the HMD.
    .

    You are wrong. The distortions are introduced by lenses at the edges in large fov mode only. I said that problem is with double vision not distortion. When You close one eye everything is all right. The problem is when You have both eyes open because of double vision not distortion.


    Quote Originally Posted by satco1066 View Post
    IMHO, that is the problem of the HMD developer, not the app developer. If they define a new standard, not every dev can follow their theory and support it. Especially when this is their own standard, more or less a prototype thing
    But this is normal feature supported in OpenVR Api. Headset is reporting projection matrix and angle between panels. Developers just assumed that there is no angle between panels but API clearly return projection matrix with angle. It seems that they correctly implemented it using OVR API (because when game is running over Oculus Home Runtime on Pimax 5K+ everything is all right with native mode without enabling parallel projections) but it is missing when using Open VR Api at all. What Pimax can do is to properly reporting projection matrix via IVRSystem::GetEyeToHeadTransform OpenVR Api method and they are doing it right. But the developers are not using angle column in matrixes at all.

  9. #9
    WMD Member satco1066's Avatar
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    you're right, but that will not change the fact, that pCars2 or any other "not in development anymore" will patch that.
    Sorry pal
    Every car could be a race car, as long as you have the balls to drive it like that !

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  10. #10
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    Thanks for the info. Better this info than no info at all.
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