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Thread: Old Man Noob Questions

  1. #1
    Kart Driver
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    Old Man Noob Questions

    Hello Folks,

    PC2 under the tree, many questions. Did some searching here, I don't generally need to be spoon-fed info but hopefully y'all can save me some time as I still have some questions. Not a heavy gamer at all, only racing stuff, all the gear is my son's. Most questions seem to be xbox related, here are a few to get it rollin.

    Done a bit of online, apparently I'm not too quick but I try to play fair and not mess with anyone's race. I've generally started with the SMS stable setup. TM Spyder wheel. Done a bit of real life race schools and such, I thought I'd have better results here than I am getting. Read some guides and watched some vids but I'm still off by about 5-15 seconds from race winners depending on the track.

    So the first question is (seriously) why am I so slow or you guys are so fast ? I realize there are a million answers to that but maybe there are some basic things that are commonly missed you could point out. For example last time out it struck me to lower the fuel load and change to soft tires for short races and qually. Anything else ?

    How do you move items in the HUD? When I go to that page the only thing I can seem to affect is toggling the 'gridlines" on and off, everything else seems dead.

    Are microphones used by online racers? There doesn't seem to be anywhere for me to plug in my headset on the wheel or console, can I plug it in to another controller if needed ? I'd assuming that might be sketchy with conflicts and such?

    I have a couple of nice FFB wheels and pedals sets stored away somewhere, can't remember the brand for sure but have momo wheels. Used with PC probably 15-20 years ago and I believe they had a something like a 9-pin "D" connector (if that's the right terminology?)(serial connector?). They are much more solid than the Spyder and have FFB but is there any adapters or something to have them work with XBOX1?

    If I have glitching, usually when someone joins or leaves, does everyone else in the session have it too?

    Is there a guide somewhere that explains some details about how driver ranking, reputation etc works? I see a lot of numbers and labels like "U100" or something but I have no idea what they mean.

    All I can think of atm but any tips would be much appreciated, I am aware it is going to take some work to get this all dialed in but anything that will shorten that journey would be appreciated!

    Happy New Year and Cheers! Maybe see you on track tonight!

  2. #2
    Superkart Pilot Twinz's Avatar
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    On the speed issue, I think Xbox has an issue with physics when there are a lot of cars in a race. So you may not be as slow as you think you are.

    Try some time trial with just you and a ghost. See if a given car drives any better for you. (Just to see if the xbox is straining with full grids)

    There are some cars that *need* to be setup for whatever track they are running. (Formula Rookie is a good example) but most cars are decent with default setups (I prefer loose most of the time) I have found most of the GT3 cars to be okay with default setups although about a second or so off of a good custom setup.
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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twinz View Post
    On the speed issue, I think Xbox has an issue with physics when there are a lot of cars in a race. So you may not be as slow as you think you are.

    Try some time trial with just you and a ghost. See if a given car drives any better for you. (Just to see if the xbox is straining with full grids)

    There are some cars that *need* to be setup for whatever track they are running. (Formula Rookie is a good example) but most cars are decent with default setups (I prefer loose most of the time) I have found most of the GT3 cars to be okay with default setups although about a second or so off of a good custom setup.
    Thanks. Yeah that sounds plausible I will check it out tonight. I already have as much graphics and stuff turned off as I can think of in hopes of lessening the load, I think it has helped some but not 100% sure. I am inclined to chase frame rate etc at the expense of "prettiness".

    Cheers

  4. #4
    Superkart Pilot PawelK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fastedddy View Post
    So the first question is (seriously) why am I so slow or you guys are so fast ? I realize there are a million answers to that but maybe there are some basic things that are commonly missed you could point out. For example last time out it struck me to lower the fuel load and change to soft tires for short races and qually. Anything else ?
    You probably know most of it from your racing schools. Kiss the apex, use the entire width of the track, slow in fast out, get as close to the edge of grip but not beyond it, trail-braking for weigh transfer and better turn in, all of that usually helps. Translating from real racing to the game may be hard because you lack G-forces and you have to re-learn how to perceive your car via wheel/FFB, vision, and sound only. There is a racing coach on youtube who also does sim-oriented videos, Driver61, maybe it will help. Tuning your FFB may help, there are many options in the game plus Custom FFB setups via a file, there are some popular posted here on the forums. But the custom option is PC only, I think.

    Then there are game-specific tricks. Knowing where the track limits for penalty purposes are allows to cut some corners safely. Start procedure: in many PC2 cars it's best to have auto-clutch off, stay in neutral, get the revs up and drop in the 1st on green light (EDIT: also TC must be off). But, with autoclutch off you will have to take care of rev-matching on downshift (unless your car does it), and taking foot of the throttle on upshift. Depends on the car though, some take it without problem, some get upset.

    View is a big thing. First, some people play in chase view or bonnet view, which may give them certain advantage when it comes to seeing cars around, apexes etc. I only use cockpit view because I like immersion and it's a sim ffs. If you race on a monitor, setting correct FOV is pretty crucial for better distance and speed perception. There are many tutorials and tools online. The disadvantage is that with a single monitor and correct FOV usually the view gets pretty restricted: you see well to the front but nothing to the sides, you don't see your mirrors etc. Use the virtual mirror and nearby car indicators to avoid hitting other cars. Tight corners will still be a challenge. VR helps most in this area in my opinion, but it's relatively costly, and there is a trade off of low resolution (unless you spend huge amounts of money on an 8K headset and a GPU that can run it). Sometimes watching replays of own races may help, on the monitor you may think you are using the entire width of the track, and only replay in chase view shows you how much space was between you and the curb.

    Setups are quite important, if you do not feel like working in them, in time trial mode you can use setups from other people, including those who are the fastest on the given track. And save those setups for future use in other races. Just be aware that some of these setups will be optimized for very short runs, like closed radiator, tires at high pressure when cold, if used over log race the tire will get to far too high pressure and the engine will die.

    You can also do time trial with ghost(s) of other people, including those superfast aliens, and try to learn the lines from them.


    Just to make it clear: I am 2-3 s off pace of really fast guys, so take into account when judging my advice ;-)


    Quote Originally Posted by fastedddy View Post
    Is there a guide somewhere that explains some details about how driver ranking, reputation etc works? I see a lot of numbers and labels like "U100" or something but I have no idea what they mean.
    There is guide on PC2 website https://www.projectcarsgame.com/comp...se/?lang=en-us but the guide is long while the idea is simple.

    The numeric part increases/decreases depending on whether you win or lose races, and what was the ranking of people who raced with. Everyone starts with 1500. Most drop to lower numbers. Someone around 1600 will normally be pretty good driver (usually, a person who recently joined and had a bunch of good races by luck or by being good in a specific car, may get to 1600 and still be slow in another car). 1700-1800 or more will be typically an alien.

    The letter part shows how safe (the game thinks) you are. Everyone starts at U (unclassified) and then if you race fairly cleanly, you should progress to F, E, D, C, B, A and ultimately S.

    Online races may be open to anyone, or limited to people above specific level. This should exclude people who don't know the racing rules, can't control the car, or are menaces engaging in wreck fests. Of course, as with any automated system, this can be occasionally gamed and you can see horrible behavior from people with good rating.

    Your rating (both numeric and letter) will NOT be affected in open races, it will only change after participating in limited races. This is why people set up U100 races, it affects rating of participants, but anyone can participate, as U100 is the lowest possible rating.


    Hope this helps a bit and Happy New Year.
    Last edited by PawelK; 31-12-2019 at 19:39.
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  5. #5
    Superkart Pilot PawelK's Avatar
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    About setups:

    I know little about setups in general, so I either start with other people's setups or with the default Loose setup, and change things which I think I understand... As a rough start, what I typically do to a default setup would be lower the ride height, stiffen the springs, soften the rear antiroll bar. I always reduce steering ratio to about 9.5 (except karts, which are 5 or 6 by default) because that's how I like it. I usually lower tire pressure from default. Especially important if you want to stick to soft slicks on a hot day, if they get to much pressure from heating up you will start sliding like crazy. Aero is adjusted per track, but I usually prefer high area, especially in the front.

    For same tracks it really helps to adjust gear ratios, if the car allows for that.

    Many people talk about fuel, try to put only enough fuel to finish the race, but IMO in most cars a few liters more will change little, while running out of fuel is not great. Happened to me once in a good race on the finish straight on the last lap. Road America, so long straight and uphill, I couldn't even coast to the finish line.

    P.S. that unrealistic starting procedure that I described above also requires turning TC off if the car has it. I have it mapped on a button wheel, so before start I set to TC off, but if I want to have it on during the race, I switch it on before T1.
    Frenzy Conducive "Benzine Wagons" Being "Tuned-Up" By Mechanicians

    A few simracing videos

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by PawelK View Post
    About setups:

    I know little about setups in general, so I either start with other people's setups or with the default Loose setup, and change things which I think I understand... As a rough start, what I typically do to a default setup would be lower the ride height, stiffen the springs, soften the rear antiroll bar. I always reduce steering ratio to about 9.5 (except karts, which are 5 or 6 by default) because that's how I like it. I usually lower tire pressure from default. Especially important if you want to stick to soft slicks on a hot day, if they get to much pressure from heating up you will start sliding like crazy. Aero is adjusted per track, but I usually prefer high area, especially in the front.

    For same tracks it really helps to adjust gear ratios, if the car allows for that.

    Many people talk about fuel, try to put only enough fuel to finish the race, but IMO in most cars a few liters more will change little, while running out of fuel is not great. Happened to me once in a good race on the finish straight on the last lap. Road America, so long straight and uphill, I couldn't even coast to the finish line.

    P.S. that unrealistic starting procedure that I described above also requires turning TC off if the car has it. I have it mapped on a button wheel, so before start I set to TC off, but if I want to have it on during the race, I switch it on before T1.


    Thank you for your reply, I really appreciate you taking the time to do all that typing. You hit on a couple of things that got me thinking, for example I'm still using auto shifting right now. I feel busy enough searching for that tactile feel you mentioned. I think I saw a mention that auto would be slower so i will have to get on that.

    I must have seen that guide before and forgot, I thought I had read that whole site.

    FOV is something I've been working on since day one. Moving the seat around has been pretty effective too.

    I am also all about the realistic immersion so I always am in the cockpit. Still unsure if I like the helmet view and all the extra movements and effects that come with it. Truth be told I'm probably fastest using the front bumper cam but I want the realism.

    PS - no FFB on the Spyder wheel I'm currently using

    Happy New Year!

  7. #7
    Superkart Pilot PawelK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fastedddy View Post
    Thank you for your reply, I really appreciate you taking the time to do all that typing.
    No problem at all :-)

    Quote Originally Posted by fastedddy View Post
    I'm still using auto shifting right now. I feel busy enough searching for that tactile feel you mentioned. I think I saw a mention that auto would be slower so i will have to get on that.
    Yes, though I have never tried auto-shifting in simracing, I would expect to slow you down considerably, like in a real car. When you step on gas to exit a corner you should be in correct gear already, rather than lose time until your automatic system switches to the best gear in response to your accelerator input. Though I have not tested in PC2 really. Changing gears myself is a part of the fun :-).

    I also forgot to mention the display of "ideal racing line" - I have found it hardly ideal in any game where I tried it. Though, again, I have not tried it in PC2.


    Quote Originally Posted by fastedddy View Post
    no FFB on the Spyder wheel I'm currently using
    This may reduce your ability to get information from the car, now you are down to vision and sound only... Having said that, AFAIK there are very successful simracers who use gamepads or wheels with FFB disabled.

    One other thing I realized I should add: some setup parameters are coded using misleading conventions. For example, the number used for TC tells how much slip is allowed before TC kicks in. Thus, a small number means a high TC setting, and a large number means low to no TC. Engine braking is like that too, if I remember well. Pop-up descriptions for setup parameters are usually helpful in figuring it out.
    Frenzy Conducive "Benzine Wagons" Being "Tuned-Up" By Mechanicians

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  8. #8
    Superkart Pilot Maskmagog's Avatar
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    Yorkie065's youtube series "Insider's Guide To PC2" has a LOT of information. No need to watch them all now, or to watch them in sequence, but pick episodes as you like. An invaluable library, I keep going to back to them.

    https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...Q6O1rOrGfc2LNT

    There's a learning curve, but very rewarding in the end imo. I recommend starting with slower cars such as Ginetta GT5 etc. Have fun!
    Thrustmaster TX, Italia 458 wheel, T3PA-Pro, Firmware 54, Xbox One X, public OS, 28" 4K monitor
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maskmagog View Post
    Yorkie065's youtube series "Insider's Guide To PC2" has a LOT of information. No need to watch them all now, or to watch them in sequence, but pick episodes as you like. An invaluable library, I keep going to back to them.

    ...

    There's a learning curve, but very rewarding in the end imo. I recommend starting with slower cars such as Ginetta GT5 etc. Have fun!

    Thank you sir, that is in fact most of what I have watched so far, especially liked his take on the FOV.

    Yeah I started out with a low class BMW (GT3 ?). I am liking the GTE Corvette at the moment, very forgiving, doesn't want to get tail happy on me all the time. I like the R8 as well for similar reasons.

  10. #10
    Superkart Pilot
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    Quote Originally Posted by fastedddy View Post
    Hello Folks,

    Are microphones used by online racers? There doesn't seem to be anywhere for me to plug in my headset on the wheel or console, can I plug it in to another controller if needed ? I'd assuming that might be sketchy with conflicts and such?

    I have a couple of nice FFB wheels and pedals sets stored away somewhere, can't remember the brand for sure but have momo wheels. Used with PC probably 15-20 years ago and I believe they had a something like a 9-pin "D" connector (if that's the right terminology?)(serial connector?). They are much more solid than the Spyder and have FFB but is there any adapters or something to have them work with XBOX1?
    I imagine the Momo wheel was a Logitech. But I don't think it is gong to work with the Xbox its too old unfortunately.

    There are no wheels for Xbox that have a connector for headphones, which is a bit bizarre. So you can either use a game pad as you have already established or use a set of wireless headphones.

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