Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 19

Thread: AI needs work on PC3

  1. #1
    Rookie
    Join Date
    Oct 2020
    Posts
    3
    Platform
    PC

    AI needs work on PC3

    I will start saying that I loved PC3 at first, It was everything I wanted, I know a lot of people wanted it to be a 100% simulator but a lot of people also were starving for a game like old Gran Turismo in which you could progress, earn money buy cars etc. Even if it is more simple than the old GT series it is still a decent take on it and it was fun.

    What stopped me from playing? The AI.

    I tried to do an oval race to "farm" exp to get credits for a D card that I needed to be able to enter some of the races.

    I found out that the AI cheats badly, I had a conversation about this with staff on the discord and they are nice people but got angry at me for saying that the AI "cheated" and we got into a long discussion about gaming design etc. they claimed that most games do this and it isn't new, when asked to give me examples they told me to "stop challenging them", in reality I have never noticed AI outright cheating like this in games (except RE2 Remake where Zombes start to tank headshots if you are good at landing headshots, a game that I refundend immediately after finding this out) maybe it is harder for racing games to make a fair AI.

    On that discussion I found out:

    • The AI is slower on the first lap and then gets faster after that
    • The AI runs on a different physics system than the player (meaning they don't suffer stuff like raining conditions etc.)
    • The AI is always faster than the player and this can be corroborated by anyone in an Oval race, when they don't have to slow down they are impossible to catch and they get to accel at top speed and do the turns on ovals without losing speed.
    • The top speed of the AI isn't affected by the difficulty settings, it will always run at the fastest speed possible no matter the difficulty settings.
    • There IS rubber banding and anyone that plays the game can corroborate it.


    I did some test in ovals in all the difficulty settings in Daytona and it was impossible for me to win on this cars:

    1. Class E Mitsubishi upped to class D
    2. Class E Mustang upped to class D


    The only car in which I could get first place (barely) was on:

    1. Class D Ferrari and ONLY when the AI was set to have IDENTICAL cars as me. I won to them in Easy to the hardest difficulty on this car and this conditions.


    If you put the AI in identical you will still notice how they pass you and it is impossible to catch them, also increasing the difficulty of the AI will make them do turns PERFECTLY, meaning they not only will have the speed advantage but also will turn perfectly.

    There is also reports of people saying that the AI is not affected by the grass, which can be corroborated by the fact thtat the AI runs on a different physics system than the player.

    The race line of the AI on almost straights. Lets say AI is after left turn and now they are close to the right edge of the road. There is almost straight road to the next roggt turn. At one point every AI car jumps rapidly from roggt side of the road to the left side. The speed of this line change is not even close to possible on a gamepad - simply game doesn't allow gamepad players to turn wheels so quickly. Moreover AI has no problem to keep traction after such maneuver which I am sure would in normal case end with a spin. This issue is best seen when there are many cars in front of me and all of them, racing one after another, change their race line at the exactly the same point. If I as a player have bad luck and am next to the AI car in jump point, they will throw me out of the road making me crash and invalidating my laptime. This already happened to me many times and is really annoying. (Thanks to Zinnsash for pointing this out)

    When there is an exactly straight straight, there is no issue, this only happens on almost straight.

    The game is GOOD but the AI needs a LOT of work, it is all over the place to be honest, needs fine tunning and adjustments, I will now list a few threads of people discussing the same issues:


    • steamcommunity.com/app/958400/discussions/0/3935537639868254120/
    • steamcommunity.com/app/958400/discussions/0/2952628008351972560/
    • steamcommunity.com/app/958400/discussions/0/2952628008351037371/
    • steamcommunity.com/app/958400/discussions/0/2952629277999870890/
    • steamcommunity.com/app/958400/discussions/0/2952628008353176007/
    • steamcommunity.com/app/958400/discussions/0/5297878338980456300/
    • steamcommunity.com/app/958400/discussions/0/2923353981925971562/
    • steamcommunity.com/app/958400/discussions/0/2923353981923739520/
    • steamcommunity.com/app/958400/discussions/0/2952628008354716507/


    There are more threads that discuss the poor AI you just need to do a little search, the purpose of this post is not to trash the game but rather hope they improve the AI because otherwise I think the game is fantastic, it just needs the AI to be more fair towards the player.
    Last edited by zherot; 14-10-2020 at 13:54.
    The following 2 users likes this Post: Awong124, machmin333


  2. #2
    WMD Member John Hargreaves's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Yorkshire
    Posts
    3,089
    Platform
    PC
    Quote Originally Posted by zherot View Post

    There is also reports of people saying that the AI is not affected by the grass, which can be corroborated by the fact that the AI runs on a different physics system than the player.
    I had my own suspicions about this, so I forced the AI to run on the grass all the way down a few straights on various tracks. They could keep up with me quite easily, so I'm inclined to agree with this point.
    i7-7700K/MSI RTX 3080/Win10 64bit/64Gb RAM/Asus Xonar DX+Beyer Dynamic DT990 Pro headphones/LG 34" UM65 @2560x1080/HP Reverb G2/Fanatec CSL wheel + Clubsport V3 pedals/DSD P2 button box

    WMD1 + WMD2 Member
    The following user likes this Post: Awong124


  3. #3
    Superkart Pilot m355y's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    Durham
    Posts
    738
    Platform
    XBOX1 X
    Yeah. I’m the same. I started to quite enjoy it briefly but the more I got into it, the more I was getting disappointed because the AI is just.....look, I don’t mind that pc3 is ‘less of a sim’, that’s fine. I’d rather they made it more realistic but they didn’t, and I respect the direction they’ve taken even if it’s not what I’d hoped for. It handles better on a gamepad, it has a great selection of tracks and cars and it’s a great experience just picking it up and hot-lapping. I like all that.

    But the AI is just immersion breaking. It’s so arcade. There’s no space between them, they’re constantly battling side by side, they never space out, they’re getting away with clattering past you on the grass, they don’t change gear so they’re virtually impossible to race against on ovals, you get into a race and the nice feeling you get from hot-lapping just vanishes because you can’t concentrate on getting your head down and going quick because there’s always some idiotic AI driver barging past you on their own little joyride using their own exclusive little physics engine.

    Sadly, this is the thing that has made me give up on the game.
    The following 3 users likes this Post: Awong124, John Hargreaves, machmin333


  4. #4
    Rookie
    Join Date
    Oct 2020
    Posts
    3
    Platform
    PC
    Quote Originally Posted by m355y View Post
    Yeah. I’m the same. I started to quite enjoy it briefly but the more I got into it, the more I was getting disappointed because the AI is just.....look, I don’t mind that pc3 is ‘less of a sim’, that’s fine. I’d rather they made it more realistic but they didn’t, and I respect the direction they’ve taken even if it’s not what I’d hoped for. It handles better on a gamepad, it has a great selection of tracks and cars and it’s a great experience just picking it up and hot-lapping. I like all that.

    But the AI is just immersion breaking. It’s so arcade. There’s no space between them, they’re constantly battling side by side, they never space out, they’re getting away with clattering past you on the grass, they don’t change gear so they’re virtually impossible to race against on ovals, you get into a race and the nice feeling you get from hot-lapping just vanishes because you can’t concentrate on getting your head down and going quick because there’s always some idiotic AI driver barging past you on their own little joyride using their own exclusive little physics engine.

    Sadly, this is the thing that has made me give up on the game.
    Yeah, had to put the game down, I was having a blast with it until I tried ovals and everything fell appart. When the AI needs to slow down it is "fair" but even when the track involves turns etc, the moment it starts raining and they don't even care is really not only unfair but immersion breaking.

    Right now I am playing GT4 on an emulator and damn... the game is really good for such an old game and it looks great, it has more in depth options than even PC3, the thing that PC3 has ahead of GT4 is the graphics and the ability to customize your cars more and that's it, otherwise GT4 is just better.

  5. #5
    Kart Driver
    Join Date
    Jun 2020
    Location
    Liberec
    Posts
    5
    Platform
    PC
    I absolutely agree. Driving against AI is no fun. You described the problems exactly. Btw, AI was excellent in PC2. I had to carefully prepare an overtaking maneuver, AI is really intelligent there, real challenge (except rain). There can be no talk about this in PC3.
    There remain just time trials and multiplayer in PC3, where is unfortunately few people.
    The following 2 users likes this Post: John Hargreaves, zherot


  6. #6
    Superkart Pilot
    Join Date
    Sep 2020
    Posts
    268
    Platform
    PS4 Pro
    You haven't mentioned the race line of the AI on almost straights. Lets say AI is after left turn and now they are close to the right edge of the road. There is almost straight road to the next roggt turn. At one point every AI car jumps rapidly from roggt side of the road to the left side. The speed of this line change is not even close to possible on a gamepad - simply game doesn't allow gamepad players to turn wheels so quickly. Moreover AI has no problem to keep traction after such maneuver which I am sure would in normal case end with a spin. This issue is best seen when there are many cars in front of me and all of them, racing one after another, change their race line at the exactly the same point. If I as a player have bad luck and am next to the AI car in jump point, they will throw me out of the road making me crash and invalidating my laptime. This already happened to me many times and is really annoying.

    When there is an exactly straight straight, there is no issue, this only happens on almost straight.
    The following user likes this Post: zherot


  7. #7
    Kart Driver
    Join Date
    Jun 2020
    Location
    Liberec
    Posts
    5
    Platform
    PC
    As I wrote somewhere after release PC3, AIs are like grasshoppers...

  8. #8
    Rookie
    Join Date
    Oct 2020
    Posts
    3
    Platform
    PC
    I'll edit my post and add your complain too, maybe I didn't specifically mention this because this AI is a whole lot of problems and we know 100% at all times this thing is cheating that you don't even know when it is not.

  9. #9
    Kart Driver cat power 85's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Location
    Solihull
    Posts
    13
    Platform
    PS4
    Totally agree with everything. The AI is terrible !
    I enjoyed the game at first but now playing more seriously it's just not realistic.
    Bring back an updated PC2 please

  10. #10
    WMD Member John Hargreaves's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Yorkshire
    Posts
    3,089
    Platform
    PC
    I understand how the AI might be tuned for three lap sprints, but unfortunately once they get into a 20-30min custom race, there isn't much sense of immersion and believability I'm finding. Given that a large part of the game can involve custom races vs AI, one might imagine that they would be up to it. The gamepad handling is absolutely superb in my mind, but the unrealistic AI behaviour (followed closely by all the cars having unrealistic braking distances) has unfortunately made it just, well, not much fun.

    I hope PC3 is starting to find its new audience now, but I don't think it's going to be something I'll keep playing long term.
    i7-7700K/MSI RTX 3080/Win10 64bit/64Gb RAM/Asus Xonar DX+Beyer Dynamic DT990 Pro headphones/LG 34" UM65 @2560x1080/HP Reverb G2/Fanatec CSL wheel + Clubsport V3 pedals/DSD P2 button box

    WMD1 + WMD2 Member

Similar Threads

  1. PC Patch 2.0 Pit Request Button Still Doesn't Work [It does work]
    By slider916 in forum Technical Help & Support (PC)
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 12-10-2017, 23:12
  2. g29 does it work on pc2
    By jrbwd6 in forum Project CARS 2 on Playstation 4
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 04-10-2017, 17:31
  3. will this work
    By ian2726 in forum XB1 - Technical Help & Support
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 01-12-2015, 17:18
  4. G29 won't work
    By Pfeifer in forum PS4 - Technical Help & Support
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 10-11-2015, 23:20
  5. UI definitely needs work, imo
    By Luke Taaffe in forum General Discussion
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 20-08-2015, 00:25

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •